Discussion: All Things Union

[chaseter]

Matt gave an excellent answer to that question. You must have overlooked it.

Matt echoed the exact same argument that it seems is the only argument. Well what if my boss doesn't like me or wants to fire me? And? What if your boss wants to fire you because you are lazy and don't do your job? What if your boss wants someone better qualified? People really think that public unions need to exist to enforce job security? How on Earth is the private sector even running? It should be in shambles!

So the great public union achievement in the past 30 years is job security? That is laughable.

 

[Anita18]

And on a side note, I never thought that there really was enthusiasm for the GOP to begin with. Just like how there was no enthusiasm for Democrats except for Obama after the 2008 elections. Democrats won big in 2008 and Republicans won big in 2010 for one reason and for one reason only, the other side goofed up big time.

I only hope that people's memories are not so bad that they'll forget about this next year. I do think that at least in WI, the Republicans/Tea Partiers just committed political suicide with that vote.

Matt echoed the exact same argument that it seems is the only argument. Well what if my boss doesn't like me or wants to fire me? And? What if your boss wants to fire you because you are lazy and don't do your job? What if your boss wants someone better qualified? People really think that public unions need to exist to enforce job security? How on Earth is the private sector even running? It should be in shambles!

So the great public union achievement in the past 30 years is job security? That is laughable.

The job security thing is a little sketchy I admit, but that and the sweet benefits are probably the only reason why people go into the public sector at all. Otherwise why would you bother make chump change as a teacher when you could make sweet money producing nothing of note on Wall Street?

 

[chaseter]

Now you can work for the government and get better pay than comparable private sector workers, get better benefits than private sector workers, and get job security. Why doesn't the government just take over everything so we can all work for Uncle Sam and cash in on those sweet benefits?

Why did FDR oppose public unions?

"The process of collective bargaining, as usually understood, cannot be transplanted into the public service," Roosevelt wrote in 1937 to the National Federation of Federal Employees. Yes, public workers may demand fair treatment, wrote Roosevelt. But, he wrote, "I want to emphasize my conviction that militant tactics have no place" in the public sector. "A strike of public employees manifests nothing less than an intent on their part to prevent or obstruct the operations of Government."

 

[Handsome Rob]

$150,000 Correctional Officers


Correctional Officer collective bargaining agreements allow officers a practice known as “sick leave stacking.” Officers can call in sick for a shift, receiving 8 hours of sick pay, and then are allowed to work the very next shift, earning time-and-a-half for overtime. This results in the officer receiving 2.5 times his or her rate of pay, while still only working 8 hours.
In part because of these practices, 13 correctional officers made more than $100,000 in 2009, despite earning base wages of less than $60,000 per year. The officers received an average of $66,000 in overtime pay for an average annual salary of more than $123,000 with the highest paid receiving $151,181.
Source: Department of Corrections

I particularly liked this one, Kel. Just the fact that it was written into their collective bargaining agreement really lets you know that the this public-sector union is truly looking out for the middle class taxpayers' interests.

 

[chaseter]

Guess who gets to pay for that?

 

[StorminNorman]

The job security thing is a little sketchy I admit, but that and the sweet benefits are probably the only reason why people go into the public sector at all. Otherwise why would you bother make chump change as a teacher when you could make sweet money producing nothing of note on Wall Street?

It's a lot easier to get a job as a teacher than it is to get one on Wall Street.

That was easy.

 

[Kelly]

The fact remains that the larger majority of americans oppose these union busting measures. This does nothing to help the image of the GOP.

The perception is definitely going to hurt the GOP, unless what they are doing works...NOW, when will that be seen IF it will be seen, is the big question.

Most probably don't understand how collective bargaining is being abused. Hopefully the GOP will do a better job of explaining that, and learned something from the poor job that the Democrats did in explaining the Health Care bill....HOPEFULLY the GOP understands collective bargaining better than the Dems knew their Health Care plan....

If they simply read from talking points like the dems did, it will spell disaster, almost definitely.

 

[DACrowe]

Random thought but, what's the point of think tanks anyways?

They brainstorm policies that are politically feasible and allow politicians (oh who are we kidding, politicians' staff) to sift through them, so as to "borrow" them for new laws. They also are the birthplace of many a talking point for said politicians. And they pay better than staffing.

 

[Paradoxium]

The perception is definitely going to hurt the GOP, unless what they are doing works...NOW, when will that be seen IF it will be seen, is the big question.

Most probably don't understand how collective bargaining is being abused. Hopefully the GOP will do a better job of explaining that, and learned something from the poor job that the Democrats did in explaining the Health Care bill....HOPEFULLY the GOP understands collective bargaining better than the Dems knew their Health Care plan....

If they simply read from talking points like the dems did, it will spell disaster, almost definitely.

I wouldn't hold your breath for this.

 

[DACrowe]

PALIN CALLS UNIONS "THUGS," SAYS THEY NEED TO "TONE IT DOWN"
http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2011/03/11/palin-wisconsin-union-bosses-acting-like-thugs/

Looks like the GOP has picked it's next target to vilify instead of trying to create jobs or help the economy. As Palin only goes after the low hanging fruit, this showcases who the next Fox News target is.

Meanwhile I hear the GOP is about to drop a bill that cuts into medicare for a year long fight. Oh well.

 

[Matt]

Oh brother.

 

[Kelly]

She's not the first to use that term.....its been used by pundits since the Wisconsin unions bussed SEIU members in....

 

[DACrowe]

JON STEWART AND SHOW EXPOSES EXCESSES AND LAVISH LIFESTYLES (FOX'S WORDS) OF LAZY TEACHERS IN CRIBS: TEACHER EDITION
http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/thu-march-10-2011/crisis-in-dairyland---apocalypse-cow

Way to bring this decadence to life.

 

[Marx]

PALIN CALLS UNIONS "THUGS," SAYS THEY NEED TO "TONE IT DOWN"
http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2011/03/11/palin-wisconsin-union-bosses-acting-like-thugs/

Looks like the GOP has picked it's next target to vilify instead of trying to create jobs or help the economy. As Palin only goes after the low hanging fruit, this showcases who the next Fox News target is.

Meanwhile I hear the GOP is about to drop a bill that cuts into medicare for a year long fight. Oh well.

And again I say...

Things like this DO NOTHING to help the GOP's image.

 

[Denny67]

They can care less about their image. They were directly responsible for driving this country into a ditch and handing absolute power over to any corporation or individuals who can afford the price of membership.

This is nothing short of a hostile takeover.

 

[Marx]

They can care less about their image. They were directly responsible for driving this country into a ditch and handing absolute power over to any corporation or individuals who can afford the price of membership.

This is nothing short of a hostile takeover.

That is partly why I have become to cynical when it comes to politics. The same party that was responsible for driving us into the ditch turned around and tried to ride their own 'wave of change' back into office in 2010...and it somehow worked.

For the GOP to have years of time running this country into the ground to then turn around and condemn the Democrats for not being able to FIX all of that damage in two years was sickening.

 

[Denny67]

I have a hard time differentiating between the two parties. Considering those who were counted among Obama’s largest campaign contributors were:

• Goldman Sachs - $994,795
• Citigroup Inc - $701,290
• JPMorgan Chase & Co - $695,132
• Morgan Stanley - $514,881

I have a hard time buying that either side is committed to offering any real reform. Especially since a deal with the devil is necessary to even get elected in the first place. If he was serious about fixing this country every effort of reforming election practices and getting special interest money out of the process would be at the top of the list.

It is because of this that these corporate plants are occupying office in so many of our cities and states. Simply, they are taking us over from within and replacing US law with their own corporate policy. In order to do this, they need unions out of their way.

 

[chaseter]

Democrats had the majorities in Congress and the Senate in 2006 when we were driven into the ditch. They then had super majorities in 2008 and we somehow went further into the ditch.


They don't care denny, either side. All they care about is their job. One operates under the guise of business and the other operates under the guise of the working man.

 

[Denny67]

Which is why I am and will always be an Independent. I refuse to follow a party. I vote for people and what they show me. Not what they tell me. Unfortunately as of now, we are set up in a heads you win, tails I lose system.

 

[chaseter]

I completely agree.

 

[StorminNorman]

That is partly why I have become to cynical when it comes to politics. The same party that was responsible for driving us into the ditch turned around and tried to ride their own 'wave of change' back into office in 2010...and it somehow worked.

For the GOP to have years of time running this country into the ground to then turn around and condemn the Democrats for not being able to FIX all of that damage in two years was sickening.

The problem is that the Democrats did everything the GOP did wrong, just on a bigger scale.

 

[BlackLantern]

yup

 

[Kelly]

IMO, we put too much emphasis on the party of the person with the title of President. I certainly understand that the buck has to stop somewhere...Bush said that himself.....but the reality is, when it comes to the budget...IMO, the majority of the blame goes to the Party in control of the House. That is what I look at when I feel the need to point fingers. Right now, the Republicans have control of the House, so I will hold their feet to the fire, just as I have done to the Democrats when they had control.

 

[Franklin Richards]

A bunch of farmers drove their tractors to Madison today.

Nice!

 

[Marx]

Oh my...