Discussion: Racism - Part 3

[Dr. Evil]

trumps not a scapegoat...he's the dog whistle cheerleader and that started with his birther rallies..

I never understood the birther controversy since Obama was born in Hawaii....to a white woman from Kansas who's parents were also white and also from Kansas.

 

[Sithborg]

See, but his father is black.

 

[Hypestyle]

The Reprobate-In-Chief needs to take ownership of this. He wanted this. He campaigned on it. Don't run away from it now. Stop with the equivocating. Stop with the quasi-diplomatic statements. You encouraged these kind of attitudes at your rallies. You promised to pay the legal fees for folks who "went off". Well, here you go, 45. "Mission accomplished." It's the new normal, which is really an old normal made new again. Thanks.

Trump deserves a catastrophically horrible end to his political career and his "main" career. Bankruptcy. Prison. I don't care anymore and I'm sick to death about all the statements that want to scold progressives into being "highminded" about all of this.

 

[squeekness]

See, but his father is black.

Worse. He was a Muslim as well. (Though I can't recall if he was practicing or not).

 

[Ms. Marvel]

So Obama's mother decided to randomly go to Kenya just to give birth to him and then came back to Hawaii to raise him?

 

[Sithborg]

Man, this panel on CNN is getting heated. So the message from the right will most likely be "both sides", as this Trumper kept on going on about antifa.

Which reminds me, there is one poster who has remained rather silent over this.

 

[DeadPresident]

For as long as one of the radical groups exists the other will as well using their opposite number as the reason.

 

[Sithborg]

Nazis don't exist because of antifa. Nazis exist because minorities exist.

 

[DeadPresident]

Nazis don't exist because of antifa. Nazis exist because minorities exist.

As a fringe group of extremists I'd agree with you, but what we're seeing seems to be a much more public and normalized approach to a group that was shunned not too long ago. I think certain people who would've hidden their affections for right wing ideology feel comfortable with it now because they see themselves as a necessary foil to Antifa.

 

[Sithborg]

No. Trump is what has emboldened them. They have dropped all pretenses, and were in full Nazi regalia yesterday. Of course, never forgetting the torch wielding from Fri night, which is a very, very American imagery with the KKK.

 

[HKpowerup]

As a fringe group of extremists I'd agree with you, but what we're seeing seems to be a much more public and normalized approach to a group that was shunned not too long ago. I think certain people who would've hidden their affections for right wing ideology feel comfortable with it now because they see themselves as a necessary foil to Antifa.

Yes. You will see a lot of people who are sympathetic with KKK or neo-Nazi ideology (and not necessarily members of any KKK or neo-Nazi organizations) migrating to the alt-right base, and the alt-right movement now has an established foothold inside the Federal Government thanks to the appointments of Bannon, Stephen Miller and others.

I can only imagine how many subscribers extremist sites like Breitbart gain every month now that they have been normalized thanks to Trump.

 

[Raiden]

No. Trump is what has emboldened them. They have dropped all pretenses, and were in full Nazi regalia yesterday. Of course, never forgetting the torch wielding from Fri night, which is a very, very American imagery with the KKK.

I won't be surprised if there's enough Trump supporters in the governmental and police hierarchy to make those people feel like they won't be prosecuted and can go ham with their Nazi rallies in broad daylight.

 

[DeadPresident]

Trump has definitely emboldened them, but this isn't a scenario that develops because of a single factor, it's a convergence of a few. Antifa popped up right after Trump's election and became extremely vocal and prevalent in a short space of time, combining having an opposing force to "fight" (in the minds of the far right radicals, anyways) with having a president that tacitly endorses their ideology is why it's got so out of control so fast.

I get that everyone wants to make every single ailment of US society exclusively the fault of Trump, but not only is it inaccurate it also makes people that do that look like simpletons. Understand that things don't have a single causal factor but generally have a number of them. The American Nazis needed both Trump and a perceived enemy to galvanize the way they have.

 

[Wylie Times]

Very public and large White Supremacist rallies aren't even remotely a new thing. These groups have had a continual presence throughout the country for some time, so much so that they're constantly under investigation by the FBI.

In the south in particular it's not uncommon for teachers, police officers, and elected officials to have ties to white supremacist groups. These groups also have a much larger presence in supposed "Blue states" than people realize.

As I said before the election of Barack Obama caused a huge surge in activity among those groups. Another thing that has allowed these groups to thrive over the past decade have been the idea that they're fringe groups that aren't a threat to anyone or worth paying attention to...The Charleston shooter told LOTS of people what he was planning and nobody took him seriously or they acted as if it was just a phase he was going through.

The FBI had been warning people for years that right wing extremism was becoming a problem, but not only did nobody listen they were reprimanded for speaking out and investigating these things.

 

[Sithborg]

Yeah, Barack Obama energized them (not antifa), Trump emboldened them to drop the hoods.

 

[ouroboros]

1. system and subsystem is ridiculous semantics..the people suffering from it couldn't care less about the distinction. Thats serves to bring you psychological comfort not them.

2. the whole point is to put hurdles in front of non whites whereever they are in the country the benefit to you would be those are hurdles you never have to deal with...put it this way.. a poor black person has to deal with class and race issues..a poor white person only has to deal with class issues. Under segregation even a well to do black person still couldn't get served coffee and pie at a five and dime store even if they had the money to buy the store itself meanwhile a poor white person doesn't have to suffer that indignity. The benefit for you as a white person in general in this case isn't whats happening for you its whats not happening to you. Having one LESS hurdle to jump is certainly more beneficial than having one MORE to jump.

but you know this already and I'm beginning to think your trolling.

And I think you already understand the counter-argument I've made re: benefit, but you're just digging your heels in and refusing to acknowledge my points, as well as trying to take refuge in imputing insincerity to me.

If you can't refute my points and have to resort to using the "troll" dodge, then any insincerity is yours.

 

[hellified]

And I think you already understand the counter-argument I've made re: benefit, but you're just digging your heels in and refusing to acknowledge my points, as well as trying to take refuge in imputing insincerity to me.

If you can't refute my points and have to resort to using the "troll" dodge, then any insincerity is yours.

your counter argument is I don't accept the definition of systemic racism then you go on to say that subsystems of racism exist. as if that makes a difference to the people who have to deal with it. I also explained there isn't one thing or way that constitutes a benefit.

 

[KRYPTON INC.]

I don't agree with the idea that FAR Left groups (and to pretend they have the numbers or dispersal through the USA that White Nationalists groups is far from reality as you can get) like Antifa bear some kind of decisive factor in the rise of the White Identity movement.

But looking at Seattle right now (and it's always Seattle with these dumb Leftist instigators) I think it's obvious that those that oppose this spread of the Alt-Reich need to be smarter, more controlled and understand that these issues are not an excuse to be confrontational for the sake of it (and looking at the usual make up of those groups it's always youthful fools with no sense of how to usefully channel their views and outrage with likely a nice slice of extremists that have nothing practical to offer other than "tearing the system down"), which will not damage the arguments they are trying to make. Let the Alt-Reich live up to the stereotypes about them. Everyone else needs to take a cue from the Women's march on Washington. Be heard. Network. Get involved in the election process. Understand the limits of outrage though. Understand that as much as you hate the bigoted language and posture of these paranoid racists that they have rights. Getting violent with them is no answer in the long run and just provides an easy excuse for these citizens to paint their opposition in a bad light that can resonate with huge chunks of the electorate. To quote a great Duck: "Work smarter, not harder."

 

[Sithborg]

Usually its Barclay.

 

[djsunyc]

Yeah, Barack Obama energized them (not antifa), Trump emboldened them to drop the hoods.

how dare obama run for president when he's black.

 

[SV Fan]

So Obama's mother decided to randomly go to Kenya just to give birth to him and then came back to Hawaii to raise him?

You forgot the part where she had the foresight to put an ad in the local Hawain paper about Obama's birth so he could one day be President

 

[Raiden]

how dare obama run for president when he's black.

He's only Half Black who was born in Hawaii and a Christian. Clearly he offended the Far Right even though he has had no scandals in his 8 years in office.

 

[Docker2.0]

Yeah, Barack Obama energized them (not antifa), Trump emboldened them to drop the hoods.

That's probably the best way to put it.

how dare obama run for president when he's black.

I don't think Obama did anything wrong. I think it was ok as long as he "knew his place." But as soon as he became President, it's like fear came over some white people about losing the country which is why some are so strong against brown immigration. You don't hear them saying anything about illegal Europeans or Asians, it's all about building that wall to Mexico, which includes DR, Brazil, Argentina, Cuba, and "everyone who speaks Mexican" who I didn't include. I honestly think Trump saw the frustration that a lot of racist felt and ran with. Not blatant racist but enough to win. If he doesn't get impeached, I would not be surprised if he won for four more years.

 

[squeekness]

I couldn't take 8 years of Trump.

 

[RockSP]

trumps not a scapegoat...

Exactly. You can't have Steve Bannon, Stephen Miller, and Sebastian Gorka in your inner cirlce and be a "scapegoat".