🇺🇸 Discussion: The DEMOCRATIC P - Part 3

[KRYPTON INC.]

I would say that due to a bunch of varying factors even the Gov. and Mayors hands are tied when it comes to police. The drumbeat of "getting tough on crime" is as much cultural/societal as it is a persuasive argument from pols.

De Blasio is not handling this situation well on a lot of fronts... But the police literally arrested his daughter and outed her personal info online. That alone should tell you that in terms of the cops his hand is weak AF. And this can't just be thrown at the foot of the mayor. The public, outside of messages from those with power, unbidden by either media or demagoguery, often want to "get tough". We, the public, lionize LEO to the point we are where we are.


If one thinks that for the last 40 years anyone with hopes for many other Left of center policy goals could campaign and win on some platform that would have been ripped to shreds as "anti-cop" is reacting within a bubble of their own making.

 

[Axl Van Sixx]

Much as people will make excuses for the cops when they brutalize the population, well-meaning liberals will make excuses for the Democrats because they see no alternative. But look at what concretely has been the response of Democratic mayors and governors since the George Floyd protests started.

The Democratic mayor of New York defended police who drove their car into a crowd. The Democratic mayor of LA cut testing for COVID-19 explicitly to punish people because of the protests. People will die because of that decision. The Democratic mayor of Philadelphia proposed a $20 million increase in the police budget while these protests were happening.

Whatever appeal "tough-on-crime" policies had for voters in the past, I think we're witnessing a sea change in public attitudes towards the police right now that will make such policies wildly unpopular. This isn't the 1990s anymore.

 

[KRYPTON INC.]

 

[KRYPTON INC.]

 

[Axl Van Sixx]

David Dinkins was intimidated by the police? Now Bill de Blasio, a white mayor, is also being intimidated by the police?

Sorry, that doesn't cut it. If you're too weak to take action against the police when you're the mayor, you're useless. Show me a mayor who's strong enough to challenge the police and to take real action on that front.

 

[Marvolo]

David Dinkins was intimidated by the police? Now Bill de Blasio, a white mayor, is also being intimidated by the police?

Sorry, that doesn't cut it. If you're too weak to take action against the police when you're the mayor, you're useless. Show me a mayor who's strong enough to challenge the police and to take real action on that front.

What's the mayor supposed to do against 38,000 cops that have decided they are the supreme authority?

 

[MaceB]

IMO, we need to de power the police unions if we’re going to get anything done. This is a personnel problem. The cops on the force right now shouldn’t be there. We have to get them out and we have to be able to fire bad cops immoderately when they show themselves as bad. Since there’s no way of knowing which cops are bad and which aren’t... we basically need to clean house and start over.

but no politician is going to have the guts to make that kind of choice.

 

[Teelie]

The police unions are never going to let power go.

 

[OtherwiseKnownAs]

Hillary Clinton 'absolutely' stands by criticisms of Bernie Sanders

 

[Lily Adler]

She needs to let it go and that response about how she stayed with one pedophile and lost to a dumb one is one of those moments where you're like yeah this **** may have actually happened.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

She needs to let it go and that response about how she stayed with one pedophile and lost to a dumb one is one of those moments where you're like yeah this **** may have actually happened.

Someone needs to send her a late valentine:

 

[Axl Van Sixx]

What's the mayor supposed to do against 38,000 cops that have decided they are the supreme authority?

Well, if you're a Democratic Party mayor like Bill de Blasio, the answer is: nothing. Capitalist politicians like de Blasio might be afraid of the police, but they're even more afraid of the organized working class. That's why they generally capitulate to police.

Imagine if instead of the Democrats, we had a mass labor party backed up by the power of organized labor. New York has 38,000 cops? It also has 1,732,000 unionized workers. If those workers led a general strike with concrete demands such as the replacement of police with democratically accountable citizens' patrols, there aren't enough cops in the country that could stop them.

 

[KRYPTON INC.]

Well, if you're a Democratic Party mayor like Bill de Blasio, the answer is: nothing. Capitalist politicians like de Blasio might be afraid of the police, but they're even more afraid of the organized working class. That's why they generally capitulate to police.

Imagine if instead of the Democrats, we had a mass labor party backed up by the power of organized labor. New York has 38,000 cops? It also has 1,732,000 unionized workers. If those workers led a general strike with concrete demands such as the replacement of police with democratically accountable citizens' patrols, there aren't enough cops in the country that could stop them.

These are not answers.

These are wishes.

 

[Sithborg]

You misinterpret where the power of the police comes from, and why politicians tend to support them. Even ignoring them as a legalized gang, you misinterpret how the majority has viewed the police for a long time. You cannot blame long time politicians for a sudden seismic shift to be a bit caught off guard. There is a reasons defense attorneys are not elected to attorney generals. The NYPD itself has had a lot of popular support due to 9/11, though that is clearly washed away.

 

[Axl Van Sixx]

These are not answers.

These are wishes.

You're assuming that because something has not been done yet, it is impossible. But who would have predicted a couple of months ago that America would be rocked by a nation-wide uprising?

The labor movement has incredible power if it chooses to act. The only reason these are "wishes" is because the largest labor organizations are in the hands of pathetic bureaucrats like Richard Trumka. What would happen if the workers were to adopt a more militant attitude and program? We're already seeing that in the form of workers who refuse to work in the absence of sufficient PPE and safety precautions.

 

[Marvolo]

You're assuming that because something has not been done yet, it is impossible. But who would have predicted a couple of months ago that America would be rocked by a nation-wide uprising?

The labor movement has incredible power if it chooses to act. The only reason these are "wishes" is because the largest labor organizations are in the hands of pathetic bureaucrats like Richard Trumka. What would happen if the workers were to adopt a more militant attitude and program? We're already seeing that in the form of workers who refuse to work in the absence of sufficient PPE and safety precautions.

Those are dreams that cant become reality right now. So I ask again, what exactly is the mayor supposed to do to stop 38,000 cops? What is his leverage right now?

 

[moviedoors]

You're assuming that because something has not been done yet, it is impossible. But who would have predicted a couple of months ago that America would be rocked by a nation-wide uprising?

A nation-wide uprising during a pandemic. Imagine what would be happening if people weren't afraid to go outside.

It's ironic that a Dollop tweet is being used to make this argument that mayors are literally helpless to do anything. That tweet was written by host Dave Anthony, who is extraordinarily left wing and is 100% on the side of organizing a mass labor movement that tears down the system.

 

[MagnarTheGreat]

NBC News - Pelosi, top Democrats unveil police reform bill

 

[Schlosser85]

 

[Lily Adler]

View attachment 35010

Heavens what is the nasty little creature on the bottom doing there!

 

[kvz5]

Bernie Sanders Is Not Done Fighting

 

[MagnarTheGreat]

The Hill - House Democrats set to introduce proposed ban on chemical weapons

 

[MagnarTheGreat]

 

[MagnarTheGreat]

 

[Teelie]

Wow. At least they were quick to distance themselves from him unlike some other party with a person or two with a history of even more inappropriate behavior.