Discussion: The Second Amendment

[Humphrey Bogart]

911 Operator listens as woman kills intruder

Posted: Dec 10, 2009 12:29 PM CST Thursday, December 10, 2009 1:29 PM EST Updated: Dec 10, 2009 12:29 PM CST Thursday, December 10, 2009 1:29 PM EST


LINCOLN COUNTY, OK (NBC) - For Lincoln County, Oklahoma resident Donna Jackson it was a life or death situation when a stranger tried to break into her rural home last Thursday night.
"She confronted the man from inside the house immediately called 911, told him that she was armed and that she had called the police and he needed to leave," said Sheriff Chuck Mangion. The alleged suspect, Billy D. Riley, has an extensive criminal history involving drugs and alcohol. According to investigators Riley approached Jackson's home after he wrecked his truck out front.
"Once he smashed the glass out he stepped into the residence, and she used the shotgun to fire one shot which hit the intruder center of the chest and he fell back out of the house," said Mangion. Riley's sister was also in the truck with him during the accident, but she was not involved in the attempted break in. Jackson won't be charged in the shooting.

Wow...

 

[BMM]

Wow...

I read about this the other day. Here is the recording.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e4Z_2oU9B2o

 

[Paradyme]

Wait, so the guy was trying to break into her house? I'm confused by this story.

 

[SuBe]

Yes, the intruder was trying to break into her house. She killed him. He was known by Local Police to have a record of Drug abuse and theft. She did the world a favor.

 

[Paradyme]

Yes, the intruder was trying to break into her house. She killed him. He was known by Local Police to have a record of Drug abuse and theft. She did the world a favor.

That's the way I see it as well.

 

[Turtles]

So, I'm assuming that everyone here knows that the right to bear arms gives us, the American people, the ability to prevent tyranny by the Federal Government and it makes us impossible to invade? This might sound sick and cold hearted, but the needs justify the ends, and if the ability to prevent tyranny and invasion results in tragedy every now in the form of some ghetto drive by or gas station hold up, so be it. Man has killed man since the dawn of time, before guns and after guns, and nothing will change that.

That's an exaggeration if I ever heard one.

Do you seriously think it's the NRA crowd with their automatic rifles and the hunters with their shotguns that keep this county safe? Do you seriously think that, somewhere out there, there is an evil world leader going "oh, no, we can't invade the United States, the NRA will stop us!" No, the United States is safe from invasion because we have a powerful military and allies who also have a powerful military, and a hell of a lot of pull in the UN.

At best civilians with guns can be a thorn in the enemy's side. They can't defeat an invading enemy army--you need a real army with real army resources to do that. You need look no further than Afghanistan and Iraq, where the insurgents (civilians with guns) are able to hinder American forces, but have no real chance of ever defeating them. In such situations you just have to wait patiently and hope the invading force leaves before you're all dead, or that a military comes along and helps your side. And don't try to bring up the American Revolution. In that war the Americans had French assistance. I also believe they indirectly had the assistance of one or two other countries. Also, it probably took the British one or two months to get troops, supplies, and info to the States at that time, and that was a major disadvantage then that no military would have today.

Guns don't prevent tyranny by the federal government, either. If the federal government really wanted to do bad things, it would do them. And if the people rose up with their guns and such, well, they'd last only until the federal government said "the hell with it" and started calling in the army to squash the uprisings. If that failed, they'd call in air strikes. What can people with rifles and pistols do against an air strike other than run and hide and hope they're not all dead when the bombs stop falling? And then there are the tanks......

Now, I'm not saying that we should just ban all guns because they're no help at all in these hypothetical situations, I'm just saying that guns aren't the ultimate deterrent that you're making them out to be. People will still invade a country if that country has guns, the invaders will just make sure to bring bigger and badder guns, and more of them. Same thing with the federal government. The government would just make sure it had the military on it's side to keep the people (gun carrying or not) in line before it took any step in the tyranny direction.

 

[BlackLantern]

the Soviets had tanks and jets and airstrikes and the Afghans managed to hold them off for years

 

[Franklin Richards]

 

[Nivek]

the Soviets had tanks and jets and airstrikes and the Afghans managed to hold them off for years

"WOLVERINES!!!!"

In all seriousness, any "Americans" who think they can go guerrilla warfare against our government and go head to head with the civilian authorities & military are in for a quick death. The majority of these Militia types know they don't have the manpower, training, and popular support to hold any real warfare against the government.

Foreign nations that would invade, however, are in for a different story. This country is populated and bred with the craziest mix of people north of Australia. Good luck occuping this country, we would make Iraq and Afghanistan occupations look like a 2 day trip to the Disney Parks.

 

[BlackLantern]

"WOLVERINES!!!!"

In all seriousness, any "Americans" who think they can go guerrilla warfare against our government and go head to head with the civilian authorities & military are in for a quick death. The majority of these Militia types know they don't have the manpower, training, and popular support to hold any real warfare against the government.

Foreign nations that would invade, however, are in for a different story. This country is populated and bred with the craziest mix of people north of Australia. Good luck occuping this country, we would make Iraq and Afghanistan occupations look like a 2 day trip to the Disney Parks.

I agree completely....part of what makes America hard to invade is that we are fairly isolated in terms of geographic location....we'd see you coming

 

[Kelly]

the Soviets had tanks and jets and airstrikes and the Afghans managed to hold them off for years

With our help.....

 

[SuBe]

"WOLVERINES!!!!"

In all seriousness, any "Americans" who think they can go guerrilla warfare against our government and go head to head with the civilian authorities & military are in for a quick death. The majority of these Militia types know they don't have the manpower, training, and popular support to hold any real warfare against the government.

Foreign nations that would invade, however, are in for a different story. This country is populated and bred with the craziest mix of people north of Australia. Good luck occuping this country, we would make Iraq and Afghanistan occupations look like a 2 day trip to the Disney Parks.

Sure, against a few people. But, do you really think if there is a Revolution in terms of the War for Independence, that 1/3rd of the Nation wouldn't fight at some capacity and the people would lose? The Military might have all the fire power in the world, but the military is still only 1% of the population. 1/3 of the population would be 100,000,000 people.

 

[Hobodeluxe]

So what do you guys think about these people?

 

[Schlosser85]

I question why this group didn't form until Obama was President, when Bush's Patriot Act was the biggest expansion of federal power in American history.

 

[MessiahDecoy123]

I'm pretty sure the founding fathers would find these people to be paranoid extremists and fools.

If buying guns and spouting extreme right-wing rhetoric makes you feel safe fine but when you avoid a court date and end up in police stand off don't blame the government, it's your own fault.

 

[StorminNorman]

Hamilton would find them to be paranoid extremists. Jefferson would love them.

As to this group, I am completely indifferent. I mean, I have the obvious concerns about any group that is willing to take on the government - but then again, I understand where they are coming from.

If they end up hurting innocent people, they should be punished - but until they do, I am glad they have the ability to exist.

 

[MessiahDecoy123]

Just because you don't like the president doesn't mean you should start recruiting people for armed revolution in case an "unconstitutional" order is passed down.

The constitution is open to interpretation. One misinterpretation can end up in a stand off or shoot out. That's not justifiable.

 

[Franklin Richards]

Where are the citizens with pitchforks banding together to fight Big Corporations?

 

[Kelly]

We have had groups of this nature for decades, this isn't new.

 

[Kelly]

Where are the citizens with pitchforks banding together to fight Big Corporations?

I'll be happy to stick a pitchfork into the asses of anyone at FanandFred.

 

[StorminNorman]

Where are the citizens with pitchforks banding together to fight Big Corporations?

Big Government is exponentially more evil.

 

[MessiahDecoy123]

Hamilton would find them to be paranoid extremists. Jefferson would love them.

Jefferson was a man of his time. If he was brought back from the dead I'm certain he would consider the times we were living in when evaluating the value of a fringe militia group.

I think he was too intellectual to go for the childish rhetoric of these extremist. He believed in the teachings of John Locke whose contemporary is not Glen Beck or Lou Dobbs.

 

[StorminNorman]

Jefferson would defend till his death the right for this militia group to exist - no matter how much value he may have placed on them.

 

[MessiahDecoy123]

Big Government is exponentially more evil.

At least a big government is controlled by a big democracy.

Corporations are motivated by greed. Good luck living in a society with little democracy and big corporations.

 

[StorminNorman]

At least a big government is controlled by a big democracy.

Corporations are motivated by greed. Good luck living in a society with little democracy and big corporations.

When my vote counts as much as Paris Hilton's vote, I have to question the benefits of Democracy.

Corporations are motivated by self-interest. That I can understand, predict and prepare for. I will take that every day over the illogical BS the government seems to be guided by.