FF2 = Star Trek II?

[Spider - Man]

I remember the summer I got my drivers license was the summer that Wrath of Khan came out. It was one of the first movies I drove to see. I was never a really hard-core Trekkie but had been bored to sleep by what little I had seen of ST:TMP. I remember how stoked I was when Trek 2 turned out to be so much better than I had thought it would be. Not saying that FF1 was as bad as TMP but who thinks FF2 will be as much of an improvement over the first one as Trek 2 was over TMP?
We've yet to get our first look but for some reason I have a good feeling about this one...

 

[deathshead2]

If FF2 is like the star trek movies then its going to suck hard. IMO the star trek movies never improved just stayed crappy the whole time.

 

[Malus]

If FF2 is like the star trek movies then its going to suck hard. IMO the star trek movies never improved just stayed crappy the whole time.

Yeah, that Wrath of Khan is a real stinker. It's down there with Blade Runner and Alien.

 

[Spider - Man]

If FF2 is like the star trek movies then its going to suck hard. IMO the star trek movies never improved just stayed crappy the whole time.

I agree some of the later ones weren't as great but WOK was pure entertainment, just a great, fun film to watch even with Spock bitin it at the end (hey, he came right back next movie!).

But different tastes for different people.

 

[Fantastic-Boy]

Let's wait!

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

Interesting. Wrath of Khan is a good example of a film that surpassed the original in my opinion . . . but in a different way than I am hoping for this film.

The first Star Trek had a grand scale and gave the viewer a certain sense of awe that I found interesting . . . but it suffered from a slow, plodding pace and the lack of any good story (it tried, but failed, to be 2001 A Space Odyssey).

The second film was simpler, more fun, less pretentious and more entertaining.

I think the first FF had a good pace (if anything, it was a little too quick), but lacked a sense of grandness and scale.

Yes, I'd like the next film to be a better film, but since the first films flaws were very different from Star Trek's flaws, I'm not sure that this particular analogy works for me on more than a very superficial level.

 

[CombatRock319]

I'm sorry, how can this be bad? i mean just look at the title "Fantastic Four 2: the Rise of the SILVER SURFER" how can this be bad?! anywho i think anything with the cosmic cruiser will be good. plus there are expected appearences from namor, doom, galactus and references to the one and only ANNIHILUS...it should be good unless its like X3 and they offer all these new characters who end up in the end just being ruthlessly butchered(like juggernaut and callisto)...

 

[Malus]

I'm sorry, how can this be bad? i mean just look at the title "Fantastic Four 2: the Rise of the SILVER SURFER" how can this be bad?! anywho i think anything with the cosmic cruiser will be good. plus there are expected appearences from namor, doom, galactus and references to the one and only ANNIHILUS...

Source?

 

[Excel]

doubt it, sorry. superman will have this sort of effect like xmen had it, but ff will not. not with tim story directing.

 

[Lightning Strykez!]

doubt it, sorry. superman will have this sort of effect like xmen had it, but ff will not. not with tim story directing.

Pssh! You mean the sequel to Superman Returns?

Right.

Yeah, Bryan Singer couldn't make the film he wanted with SR because he had the same budget constraints and lack of time to film--just like he suffered with the first X-Men! And he had so much studio intervention, bad editing, and lack of action-packed film precedents that it prevented him from making the epic Superman film fans expected! But he'll get it right next time when Warner Brothers loosens their vice-grip around his neck for the sequel and finally give him the $200m budget he deserves to let his dream breathe!

Yeah. That's the reason.

:sarcasm:

doubt it, sorry.

Yeah, I doubt it too.

 

[Malus]

doubt it, sorry. superman will have this sort of effect like xmen had it, but ff will not. not with tim story directing.

And June 15th will tell us whether your opinion is right on the nose...or dead wrong.
I think the smart money is on somewhere in between.

 

[Lightning Strykez!]

In response to the thread's question: Not sure this analogy is most appropriate, but I kinda see your point--ST:TWOK is generally considered an improvement over ST:TMP. It excelled both critically and financially in all areas.

FF2 has the chance to do the same--but there are many variables to take into account first. It has a shot. We'll see.

 

[deathshead2]

Yeah, that Wrath of Khan is a real stinker. It's down there with Blade Runner and Alien.

Comparing a bad star trek movie to blade runner is like comparing backstreet boys with Rob zombie there not int the same league.

 

[Malus]

Comparing a bad star trek movie to blade runner is like comparing backstreet boys with Rob zombie there not int the same league.

Backstreet Boys & Rob Zombie? Hahaha- What's the difference? They both suck! t: Just my opinion, of course...and to be fair, I'd guess Rob Zombie probably sucks less...though to be honest, I've never listened to either of them... so I guess that makes me just like all the other know-it-alls that infest these boards to hike their back leg on anything that even resembles positive news on this movie.

Wrath of Khan a bad Star Trek movie? Dude, you won't find many sci-fi fans..or moviegoers...or critics for that matter who would agree with you on that one.
You are out there in the wilderness on this one.

 

[Speedball]

Backstreet Boys & Rob Zombie? Hahaha- What's the difference? They both suck! t: Just my opinion, of course...and to be fair, I'd guess Rob Zombie probably sucks less...though to be honest, I've never listened to either of them... so I guess that makes me just like all the other know-it-alls that infest these boards to hike their back leg on anything that even resembles positive news on this movie.

Wrath of Khan a bad Star Trek movie? Dude, you won't find many sci-fi fans..or moviegoers...or critics for that matter who would agree with you on that one.
You are out there in the wilderness on this one.

He's WAY out in the wilderness. He's so far out, he's on arctic tundra.

 

[Tony Stark]

The Wrath of Khan was not only better than ST:TMP, it was the best Star Trek film ever. The only other one that came close was First Contact.

The film is perfect because the movie is not dated at all. You can watch it in it's original format and the effects still look good, and it's still exciting.

 

[Neto Magnus]

hmm, I would love to see Reed yelling "DOOOOOOOOM!" up into the camera as it pans up.

 

[GoblinScrier]

hmm, I would love to see Reed yelling "DOOOOOOOOM!" up into the camera as it pans up.

Actually in this case, it would make more sense to have Doom yell "RICHARDS!!!!!" as he does that in the comics all the time....

 

[Lightning Strykez!]

He's WAY out in the wilderness. He's so far out, he's on arctic tundra.

Yeah. North Pole definitely.

The Wrath of Khan was not only better than ST:TMP, it was the best Star Trek film ever. The only other one that came close was First Contact..

Agreed on all accounts. Although I'd also rank The Undiscovered Country up there too.

 

[Spider - Man]

Interesting. Wrath of Khan is a good example of a film that surpassed the original in my opinion . . . but in a different way than I am hoping for this film.

The first Star Trek had a grand scale and gave the viewer a certain sense of awe that I found interesting . . . but it suffered from a slow, plodding pace and the lack of any good story (it tried, but failed, to be 2001 A Space Odyssey).

The second film was simpler, more fun, less pretentious and more entertaining.

I think the first FF had a good pace (if anything, it was a little too quick), but lacked a sense of grandness and scale.

Yes, I'd like the next film to be a better film, but since the first films flaws were very different from Star Trek's flaws, I'm not sure that this particular analogy works for me on more than a very superficial level.

I didn't exactly mean better in the same way, just better. What I meant was that trek 2 was like a comeback film when most people probably thought it would suck based on the first one. Not saying FF sucks but it didn't live up to a lot of people's expectations and they are probably afraid the same will be true of FF2. I am just hoping FF2 is surprisingly great in light of the first as Trek 2 was in light of the first Trek.

 

[Spider - Man]

Yeah. North Pole definitely.




Agreed on all accounts. Although I'd also rank The Undiscovered Country up there too.

Ugh, we are DEFINITELY in disagreement on this one! I loved WOK, and thought the next 2 were pretty good, #4 being, I thought, a decent directoral effort by Nimoy (thought the whole 'Spock cussing' thing was hilarious). And then I went to see TUC at the theater and felt completely let down as I left the theater. I remember thinking "I wish Nimoy instead of Shatner had directed this one." It's been so long since I've seen it I don't even remember what it was about it that I thought made it so bad, just that that's what I thought leaving the theater.

Anyway, as I said, different tastes for different people, I don't think there's any disagreement that WOk was the superior movie amongst them all!

 

[Lightning Strykez!]

Ugh, we are DEFINITELY in disagreement on this one! I loved WOK, and thought the next 2 were pretty good, #4 being, I thought, a decent directoral effort by Nimoy (thought the whole 'Spock cussing' thing was hilarious). And then I went to see TUC at the theater and felt completely let down as I left the theater. I remember thinking "I wish Nimoy instead of Shatner had directed this one." It's been so long since I've seen it I don't even remember what it was about it that I thought made it so bad, just that that's what I thought leaving the theater.

Anyway, as I said, different tastes for different people, I don't think there's any disagreement that WOk was the superior movie amongst them all!

Are you sure you're talking about Undiscovered Country? That's the one where the Enterprise and Excelsior (lead by Captain Sulu) teamed up to destroy a Klingon Bird Of Prey (which could fire while cloaked) at Camp Kitimer. It was the whole Conspiracy thing which framed Kirk and McCoy for the death of Chancellor Gorkon. I thought it was great.

The only Star Trek film I can think of that Bill Shatner directed was The Final Frontier where they went looking for God. It...sucked.

 

[Malus]

Yeah, V was the only one Denny Crane er, William Shatner directed. It had potential but just didn't measure up. The effects were alarmingly sub-par and the whole thing had an almost tv movie feel. As I recall, ILM (was it ILM?) wasn't available for V, thus the poor effects, and the studio cut the budget during production. I know Shatner getting to direct was kind of a quid pro quo since Nimoy had directed III & IV, but I always wondered if "Shat" didn't get a bit of a raw deal.
And I can understand the "even numbered ones are best" superstition that's evolved over the years...II,IV and VI were all well-done, but personally I also liked III (Search for Spock) as well. And while I was a big fan of the middle seasons of Next Generation, none of the Trek films after VI has satisfied me. To me, the Borg were much scarier in the episodes "Q Who" and "Best of Both Worlds" than they were in First Contact.
I think it really sucks that they sacrificed characterization for action so damn much in the Next Gen films, particularly Troi and Dr.Crusher. That was a good cast, and they deserved movies that were truer to the spirit of the series. Now who knows what JJ Abrams is gonna do with the franchise.
Too bad Kirk was killed off (poorly, in my opinion) in Generations. I think it would be terrific to see Nimoy and Shatner playing Kirk & Spock as older characters. Just look at the Emmys Shatner's won for Boston Legal. He and Nimoy are still good for a lot more than tv commercials and game shows. There's no reason they couldn't still be utilized, along with some younger characters for some of the action...

 

[Spider - Man]

Are you sure you're talking about Undiscovered Country? That's the one where the Enterprise and Excelsior (lead by Captain Sulu) teamed up to destroy a Klingon Bird Of Prey (which could fire while cloaked) at Camp Kitimer. It was the whole Conspiracy thing which framed Kirk and McCoy for the death of Chancellor Gorkon. I thought it was great.

The only Star Trek film I can think of that Bill Shatner directed was The Final Frontier where they went looking for God. It...sucked.

Yeah, it was number 5, my bad! LOL! Yeah, it was horrible! I guess the one with the original crew and TNG crew proved the whole "I always knew i'd die alone" thing wrong, huh? Yeah, that's the one. I TOLD you I'm not REALLY a trekkie, but I do have a special place in my heart for the original series and movies 2-4. Yeah, TUC was pretty good. I wasn't crazy about the scenes on the ice planet with Iman(?) but the rest was good. I remember that was one of the first to use CGI for the Klingon blood floating around!
Thanks for setting me straight!

 

[Spider - Man]

Yeah, V was the only one Denny Crane er, William Shatner directed. It had potential but just didn't measure up. The effects were alarmingly sub-par and the whole thing had an almost tv movie feel. As I recall, ILM (was it ILM?) wasn't available for V, thus the poor effects, and the studio cut the budget during production. I know Shatner getting to direct was kind of a quid pro quo since Nimoy had directed III & IV, but I always wondered if "Shat" didn't get a bit of a raw deal.
And I can understand the "even numbered ones are best" superstition that's evolved over the years...II,IV and VI were all well-done, but personally I also liked III (Search for Spock) as well. And while I was a big fan of the middle seasons of Next Generation, none of the Trek films after VI has satisfied me. To me, the Borg were much scarier in the episodes "Q Who" and "Best of Both Worlds" than they were in First Contact.
I think it really sucks that they sacrificed characterization for action so damn much in the Next Gen films, particularly Troi and Dr.Crusher. That was a good cast, and they deserved movies that were truer to the spirit of the series. Now who knows what JJ Abrams is gonna do with the franchise.
Too bad Kirk was killed off (poorly, in my opinion) in Generations. I think it would be terrific to see Nimoy and Shatner playing Kirk & Spock as older characters. Just look at the Emmys Shatner's won for Boston Legal. He and Nimoy are still good for a lot more than tv commercials and game shows. There's no reason they couldn't still be utilized, along with some younger characters for some of the action...

THAT'S RIGHT! I remember now! I was thinking how it was like a longer version of one of those not-so-memorable tv episodes (not one in particular, just any one of those that wasn't so good)! Yup, it's all coming back to me now! (with sarcasm): thanks. t: