Godzilla (2014) - - - Part 12

[kaijunexus]

Look...about all of the complaints regarding ATJ's acting in this film...

We're talking about a character that grew up with an adoring mother, but a father who obviously payed less attention to his son than he should have. Then he watches a nuclear reactor collapse on his mother and he's left with a father who is now even further removed from caring for his son because he's developed an unhealthy obsession about the circumstances of his wife's death.

Add on top of that that this guy's been disarming bombs in the military (easily one of the most stressful jobs on the planet) and has probably spent more time away from his wife and son than with them up to this point.

Don't you think the guy would be slightly psychologically damaged and a bit emotionally vacant?

Granted, I understand that playing a character as "emotionally vacant" typically doesn't win awards. But looking at Ford's past history...it's fairly easy to imagine him putting on a tough exterior, even in the most horrible of situations.

In fact, I'd say that Ford was almost groomed to deal with the crisis of these monster attacks. He's been forced to learn to handle the most terrible of situations (mom's death, dad's obsession, disarming bombs), that he's hardened enough to do what has to be done when the time calls for it rather than freak out and get everybody killed.

 

[Spamtron]

I enjoyed ASM2 actually... even my woman is still being affected by the ending a couple weeks after the one viewing, that's how much she was invested in the Gwen character. And I told her the original storyline where Gwen dies during Peter's attempt to save her right after we watched ASM in the theater. It was a fun movie that I was generally pleased with even after reading all the disappointment from fans.

But this is about Godzilla... I can actually agree on points from both sides on this. There were problems with the movie, some very rudimentary, like Godzilla's motivation.WTF? He is the alpha predator of these types of animals, he is hunting the MUTOs that just spawned because that's nature's way of balance...ok, that's fine and dandy, but if he's hunting them let him get a meal outta them or something! If he feeds off their their own absorbed radiation then show that. His hunting is shown as just killing them and walking/swimming off. Kinda like the kid cartoon Godzilla helping out the people cause he's good natured for no reason, but it sells the sugar coated crack to kids' parents for breakfast in the 80's.
And don't even get me started on the detonation of a nuclear device a couple miles off-shore keeping people safe crap(made the main purpose of Kick-Ass's skills kinda worthless). Didn't work for me in DarkKnightRises, and the only reason I could see it working out in this one was due to Godzilla napping in the city, sucking up the radiation and recharging to wake up and roll out the next morning being the only reason San-Fran didn't end up in a nuclear fallout winter.
I did feel like Cranston's usefulness was cut short, same with the Dr.S... really thought there would be a bit more to him, but am fine that he wasn't the creator of Godzilla's demise as in the first movie I grew up on. Let that one keep it's own legacy. Godzilla became a campy money machine pretty quickly that was far separated from the great original and even re-dubbed/edited Americanized version right afterward.

I enjoyed the MUTOs designs... saying they aren't better than the not-so-awesome use of a spiked up ankylosaurus called Anguirus is just not recalling your youth accurately.

Even as a child I kept wanting to see more and more Godzilla similar to the level of the first one, but they just kept turning up as dudes in rubber suits... there was always something lacking in realism in the sequels that the first film just had right. Even 1984 couldn't bring it back to the original level for me.

Even with all the issues, I still saw this movie twice in one weekend, taking a bunch of family to see it both times...which I never spend on going out to the movies, but I did this time.
Frankly with this Godzilla reboot I feel they actually captured the essence of Godzilla very well(the thing 1998 missed altogether), and instilled the same enthusiasm as I had for him from the original of my youth. When he powered up for his first radioactive breath shot on a 70 foot screen with full IMAX level surround I got chills and cheered with everyone else in the theater. The both end kills were awesome to see... visually this was Godzilla for me through and through, finally. I believed the level of destruction was happening, and he's never looked more real!
Apparently almost $200mil since opening makes it pretty clear most are loving a finally decent attempt at a great movie character that hasn't been seen for decades.

 

[spider-neil]

Comparing Jaws to the master of suspense Hitchcock would make sense, but comparing Godzilla to superhero movies makes no sense.

Meh, doesn't bother me. The poster obviously enjoyed Godzilla more than ASM2.

From my own personal point of view I thought this was a dreadful movie. Characters were tedious, wasn't engaged by their plight in the slightest.
Okay, characters aren't working for me let's get to the action, so I waited and waited and waited, by the time the action came (for what felt like a solid hour) I was completely checked out of the movie and didn't care.
I was bored for the entire 2 hours with the one notable exception of when Godzilla uses his flame breath for the first time. Pacific Rim was a better than this, at least the characters (cliché as they were) were interesting.

Whoever enjoyed the movie more power to you, it just wasn't for me.

 

[NewYorkSpider]

Just got backed from seeing this. Loved it. It starts out a little bit slow in the beginning, then it picks up when the first MUTO attacks. Bryan Cranston was absolutely brilliant. I only wished that [BLACKOUT]he wasn't killed and had a minor role for the rest of the film. [/BLACKOUT]

The fight scenes were done very well. Almost too good. There were a few times when they cut away from Godzilla to a completely different scene, but it wasn't too bad.

Oh and by the way....

Spoiler

Atomic Breath! The slow build up to that gave me chills. Just seeing his tail light up and then seeing it go up his body gave me chills.

I had a few nit-picks here and there, but overall I enjoyed the movie.

8/10

 

[Rock Sexton]

Look...about all of the complaints regarding ATJ's acting in this film...

We're talking about a character that grew up with an adoring mother, but a father who obviously payed less attention to his son than he should have. Then he watches a nuclear reactor collapse on his mother and he's left with a father who is now even further removed from caring for his son because he's developed an unhealthy obsession about the circumstances of his wife's death.

Add on top of that that this guy's been disarming bombs in the military (easily one of the most stressful jobs on the planet) and has probably spent more time away from his wife and son than with them up to this point.

Don't you think the guy would be slightly psychologically damaged and a bit emotionally vacant?

Granted, I understand that playing a character as "emotionally vacant" typically doesn't win awards. But looking at Ford's past history...it's fairly easy to imagine him putting on a tough exterior, even in the most horrible of situations.

In fact, I'd say that Ford was almost groomed to deal with the crisis of these monster attacks. He's been forced to learn to handle the most terrible of situations (mom's death, dad's obsession, disarming bombs), that he's hardened enough to do what has to be done when the time calls for it rather than freak out and get everybody killed.

He wasn't emotionally vacant though. The scene after he bails Cranston out of jail and they have that discussion about moving on with life he was plenty emotionally-accessible.

The rest was just bad writing and conveniently moving him around the globe. That first act ended up being such a tease from a quality standpoint.

 

[Marvolo]

A film can be objectively bad. That doesnt mean a person cant subjectively enjoy it. Never understood why this is a difficult concept to grasp.

Uwe Bowl makes objectively bad films, but someone out there enjoys them. Doesnt make them any less objectively bad.

My own example, I enjoy Battlefield Earth as a guilty pleasure. Its objectively bad and I know it. Everyone should be able to realize this fact. That however doesnt mean I cant enjoy that horribleness. Ill never buy into the BS that film and art cant be considered objectively bad. Things can be and are objectively bad. No use arguing with me. I just wanted to post my thoughts on the matter.

And some more food for thought, this thread is on its way to being closed. And some memebers here are on their way to infractures. Thats just some friendly words. Tread carefully fellow hypsters.

 

[ares834]

A film can be objectively bad. That doesnt mean a person cant subjectively enjoy it. Never understood why this is a difficult concept to grasp.

How? Sure, there are things certain aspects that can be objectively analyzed but many of the major aspects such as plot, characterization, and even acting are almost entirely subjective.

 

[spider-neil]

I wouldn't go all techincal like Arach Knight. When you go to watch a summer Hollywood blockbuster you have to give the movie a lot of slack and pretty much 'go with it' give the movie its premise. But for me in a movie regardless of genre the characters have to be engaging, there has to be a reason I should care when the **** hits the fan.

With a movie like T2 (for example) if I had to describe each of the lead actors (without talking about how they looked) I could do it, they all had destinct personalities and a soul but with Godzilla I could not. All the characters in Godzilla blured into each other and no one was distinct from anyone else (sorry but that how I saw it). So because I didn't care about the characters, I didn't care about the city they lived in so when the city they lived in was being destroyed I didn't care. Contrast that with the climax of T2 where I was on the edge of my seat.

As I said, that is only how 'I' saw it and anyone who was engaged by the characters and was wowed by the action (which I personally thought was muddy and unclear) then more power to you. Opinions is what makes SHH fun

 

[Hulk1968]

I was wondering.... could we all move on and start a new thread about the sequel?

You know... just an idea and all that

 

[Arach Knight]

Rodger Ebert, you know that one little film critic, disagrees with you.


http://reelfanatics.com/2010/02/10/interview-with-roger-ebert/

"It has to be first person subjective. It’s not a science, it’s an art."

"The critic’s job is to be subjective, not to be objective, because it’s an opinion, and the critic should give that opinion in such a way that you want to read it, you enjoy reading it."

So yeah, I'm going to go with the guy who is an expert on film critiscm rather than some random dude on the Internet trying to pawn his opinions off as fact.

First, you made an appeal to authority. That is a logical fallacy. You could cite fifteen different people that agree with the late Mr. Ebert and it wouldn't do much to validate your rebuttal, especially because you haven't formed a full argument of your own. When arguing, one uses sources and authorities to reinforce their own argument, not to present those authorities as the sole argument.

As it stands, my collegiate background is largely rooted in the analysis of a text (text being any medium by which a message or narrative is being conveyed). I have a M.A.. Not quite a PhD, but I am educated enough to be informed.

With that said, Ebert is a pop culture critic, not an academic critic, so his perspective is skewed by that position. Ebert's academic background is in journalism, not in any field that revolves around analysis and criticism. He spent a brief stint as an English major, which would perhaps make him a more informed individual, but he is not a critic by trade. He is merely a person whom had sufficient interest and ability to successfully present pop culture criticism of film.

And while Mr. Ebert is looked up to even in the realm of academic criticism, he is by no means the sole lens through which one seeks to learn and understand the analysis of a film.

I am not loathing of Godzilla because there was not enough monster vs. monster destruction. It certainly wouldn't have harmed this film, but the lack of it is not a problem. The lack of it is an issue because of a narrative structure that begins a sequence of introduction, then cuts away. And while smash cuts are a brilliant cinematic technique, the Gareth Edwards employs the technique in an amateur manner rather than with any judiciousness. Had it been done well, then it would have developed tension rather than complaints about frustration.

When prehistoric beasts have the power to emit an EMP, and we are told that these creatures evolved this way millions of years ago, that makes no sense. Evolution selects only traits that improve the odds for survival. Why would nature select a trait that even five hundred years ago would have still be useless, let alone millions of years ago?

The film is riddled with poor film technique, poor writing, convoluted plot elements, acting that is too subdued or too over the top or merely dialed in. So yes, objectively speaking, when considering the proper way to act, write and direct, this film objectively does not measure up. This isn't a matter of what critics think or what the general audience thinks. This is a matter of how film and writing techniques are properly employed, or in this case, not properly employed.

 

[Terminator]

I read enough reviews to know what to expect from the human characters. They aren't hugely developed but I never found them annoying. And I like that Aaron Taylor Johnson's character acts as a guide to both the monsters and the audience. I'm hoping Ken Watanabe returns and is bat**** crazy, to the point that he thinks Godzilla is his pet. The Godzilla vs MUTO fight is great, I kind of wanted to jump out of my seat and start cheering. Yes, the cutting from fights is a bit annoying but the final fight is worth the wait.

I'm going to say it's a fact that the movie is good because I have the power to do so. Who gave me that power? I did and I believe in it so you can't take it away from me. Thank you and goodnight.

 

[Marvolo]

How? Sure, there are things certain aspects that can be objectively analyzed but many of the major aspects such as plot, characterization, and even acting are almost entirely subjective.

We have 100 years of film. Thats enough of a library to begin comparing and evaluating what is and isnt good and to begin setting standards. Literature has never been afraid to declare something objectively bad. Film seems to be hung up on this tho. Almost like if you call a film objectively bad that youve sinned.

Bad plotting is bad plotting. Bad acting is bad acting. There are factual quality assessments in art. Are you going to stand, sit, whatever there and tell me that a film like The Room isnt an objectively bad film? It is and anyone saying otherwise is just being argumenative and stubborn. Or possibly suffering from a disconnect with reality.

 

[C. Lee]

As it stands, my collegiate background is largely rooted in the analysis of a text (text being any medium by which a message or narrative is being conveyed). I have a M.A.. Not quite a PhD, but I am educated enough to be informed.

Very good for you. Are you informed to the fact that I have access to a ban button and ain't afraid to use it?

You can discuss argue and debate without the condescending attitude. Try it....it'll make your heart sing.

 

[Sithborg]

I am not loathing of Godzilla because there was not enough monster vs. monster destruction. It certainly wouldn't have harmed this film, but the lack of it is not a problem. The lack of it is an issue because of a narrative structure that begins a sequence of introduction, then cuts away. And while smash cuts are a brilliant cinematic technique, the Gareth Edwards employs the technique in an amateur manner rather than with any judiciousness. Had it been done well, then it would have developed tension rather than complaints about frustration.

When prehistoric beasts have the power to emit an EMP, and we are told that these creatures evolved this way millions of years ago, that makes no sense. Evolution selects only traits that improve the odds for survival. Why would nature select a trait that even five hundred years ago would have still be useless, let alone millions of years ago?

The film is riddled with poor film technique, poor writing, convoluted plot elements, acting that is too subdued or too over the top or merely dialed in. So yes, objectively speaking, when considering the proper way to act, write and direct, this film objectively does not measure up. This isn't a matter of what critics think or what the general audience thinks. This is a matter of how film and writing techniques are properly employed, or in this case, not properly employed.

Dude, it's a giant monster movie. What you are describing is 90% of the Godzilla franchise. I don't see why it has to ascend to a higher plain of art.

You are perfectly fine to dislike the movie. There are flaws, I acknowledge that. For some, that will prevent them from liking the movie. Others, all that stuff you are pointing out (though I would disagree with some of them), still did not take away from the full enjoyment of the movie. I have seen enough truly, truly bad movies (thank you MST3K) to have a tough time putting Godzilla anywhere near those.

 

[C. Lee]

Comparing Jaws to the master of suspense Hitchcock would make sense, but comparing Godzilla to superhero movies makes no sense.

One movie is always compared against some other movie. It is the life blood of the internet. Judge them on how well they compare them not on the act of comparing.

 

[Arach Knight]

Very good for you. Are you informed to the fact that I have access to a ban button and ain't afraid to use it?

You can discuss argue and debate without the condescending attitude. Try it....it'll make your heart sing.

Ban me if you wish. I don't fear threats. If you are here to issue ultimatums, then do so fairly. There are users directly insulting me even though I am commenting on their argument and not their person. So if you wish to single me out and make threats, then I have no need to be here in the first place. If you are here to enforce the rules, then do so in an impartial manner. Otherwise, I am indifferent. I enjoy conversing with people here and I generally get along with many of them, including you. But I won't stand for being bullied, even by you C. Lee. And yes, threatening me with a ban and making sarcastic remarks about my life accomplishments, constitutes bullying. Especially since there are other users being condescending and insulting me, yet you have no words for them. Why is that? I expect better in general, and specifically of you in particular. I suppose I'll see my fate in the next few seconds after making this post. Good day.

 

[Lunar_Wolf]

One movie is always compared against some other movie. It is the life blood of the internet. Judge them on how well they compare them not on the act of comparing.

I like to merge movie ideas like 'Yes Man' and 'Liar Lair'. Jim Carey says ''yes'' to everything, but he's really lying.

 

[ares834]

First, you made an appeal to authority. That is a logical fallacy.

Incorrect, it is not a logical fallacy. It is only a logical fallacy if the authority is not an expert in his field.

With that said, Ebert is a pop culture critic, not an academic critic, so his perspective is skewed by that position. Ebert's academic background is in journalism, not in any field that revolves around analysis and criticism. He spent a brief stint as an English major, which would perhaps make him a more informed individual, but he is not a critic by trade. He is merely a person whom had sufficient interest and ability to successfully present pop culture criticism of film.

This is far more relevant. Of course, you are incorrect as he is a "critic by trade" as film criticism ended up being his "trade".

The film is riddled with poor film technique, poor writing, convoluted plot elements, acting that is too subdued or too over the top or merely dialed in.

And this is true because you say so? You haven't backed up any of these claims other than by presenting your own opinion.

 

[Leenie]

Arach Knight, you are putting yourself up on a pedestal, and using your degree as leverage in your arguments against this movie (even over one of the most respected critics to have ever lived, Roger Ebert). That is elitism at its finest.

People aren't insulting you for your opinions, they're insulting you because you're making passive aggressive claims that your opinion is fact because you're "smarter" than everyone else.

 

[redhawk23]

I love the MUTO's. I think the film would have been ultimately better off had it just been committed to being an original film just about dealing with the MUTO's and just leave Godzilla out of it. Godzilla's great when he finally, finally does something, but ultimately the film does a lot more to make the MUTOs interesting and it succeeds in that regard.

What really came through in the theater that really hasn't been visible in any of the trailers and things are the male muto's markings and stripes. There has been a lot of comparison to the Cloverfield monster for obvious reasons but the male MUTO is actually a lot closer to a giant version of the bugs from Starship Troopers, which I dig.

 

[C. Lee]

Ban me if you wish. I don't fear threats. If you are here to issue ultimatums, then do so fairly. There are users directly insulting me even though I am commenting on their argument and not their person. So if you wish to single me out and make threats, then I have no need to be here in the first place. If you are here to enforce the rules, then do so in an impartial manner. Otherwise, I am indifferent. I enjoy conversing with people here and I generally get along with many of them, including you. But I won't stand for being bullied, even by you C. Lee. And yes, threatening me with a ban and making sarcastic remarks about my life accomplishments, constitutes bullying. Especially since there are other users being condescending and insulting me, yet you have no words for them. Why is that? I expect better in general, and specifically of you in particular. I suppose I'll see my fate in the next few seconds after making this post. Good day.

I am doing them fairly....several people have got warnings, infractions, even probation...sorry I don't have magical powers and was able to do all of this at the same time...we can only deal with one poster at a time.

If you want cop an attitude and insult others posters...then yes, perhaps you don't belong here.

Not bullying...just stating a fact. I am here to stop the childish fighting...if that includes banning people, so be it.

Think about this.....You are the one bringing up your college degrees while arguing about a GODZILLA movie.....let's say that again....on a comic book website, you are, while arguing about Godzilla, bringing up all of the college degrees you have. And you wonder why I said you were being condescending.




LOOK EVERYONE....YOU CAN ARGUE DEBATE AND DISCUSS THIS OR ANY OTHER MOVIE WITHOUT THE RUDENESS, CONDESCENDING ATTITUDES, AND NAME CALLING.

 

[Leenie]

What really came through in the theater that really hasn't been visible in any of the trailers and things are the male muto's markings and stripes. There has been a lot of comparison to the Cloverfield monster for obvious reasons but the male MUTO is actually a lot closer to a giant version of the bugs from Starship Troopers, which I dig.

I can totally see the Starship Troopers bugs in the MUTOs. Wow. Nice catch!

I can also see how many have been reminded of the Cloverfield monster, but I think the MUTOs looked a lot more interesting than the Cloverfield one. Just my two cents.

The MUTOs' legs reminded me a little bit of Orga's (from Godzilla 2000) fingers, their heads reminded me of Gyaos' head (from the Gamera movies), and the female MUTO's, umm, "pregant belly," reminded me of Biollante's lit up belly.

I guess there was a lot of influence from several monsters when it came to creating the MUTOs.

 

[Arach Knight]

Arach Knight, you are putting yourself up on a pedestal, and using your degree as leverage in your arguments against this movie (even over one of the most respected critics to have ever lived, Roger Ebert). That is elitism at its finest.

People aren't insulting you for your opinions, they're insulting you because you're making passive aggressive claims that your opinion is fact because you're "smarter" than everyone else.

No. I presented my argument. People pulled many of the typical rebuttal cards that are rarely ever acceptable rebuttals;

- "you can't argue opinions", which assumes that personal preference negates all objectivity and therefore makes criticism inapplicable.

- "who made you God", which assumes that if someone provides facts that you disagree with, then you argue that the person themselves are not qualified to declare something a fact. This usually tends to involve people demoting a given fact as merely being the speaker's opinion and therefore not valid (which is ironic given that such a response usually follows the previously listed rebuttal).

- "all aspects of art are only subjective," which assumes that proper technique and methodology are invalid.

So in the face of these rebuttals, yes, I explain why my claims are objective, and yes, I explain that I am not declaring myself an unassailable authority or that I am better than anyone. In fact, I dare you to find a single sentence in my posts in which I claim that my words matter because I am smarter.

I addressed one poster as having shown that they are not intelligent, and that is only because their rebuttal to my argument was that I am an idiot. Otherwise, I haven't down talked anyone.

I have confidently given my position, but I haven't insulted anyone, said I was better, or said anyone was inferior. If you inferred that, then you are more than welcome to. But don't accuse me of that which I have not done or said.

 

[Arach Knight]

I am doing them fairly....several people have got warnings, infractions, even probation...sorry I don't have magical powers and was able to do all of this at the same time...we can only deal with one poster at a time.

If you want cop an attitude and insult others posters...then yes, perhaps you don't belong here.

Not bullying...just stating a fact. I am here to stop the childish fighting...if that includes banning people, so be it.

Think about this.....You are the one bringing up your college degrees while arguing about a GODZILLA movie.....let's say that again....on a comic book website, you are, while arguing about Godzilla, bringing up all of the college degrees you have. And you wonder why I said you were being condescending.




LOOK EVERYONE....YOU CAN ARGUE DEBATE AND DISCUSS THIS OR ANY OTHER MOVIE WITHOUT THE RUDENESS, CONDESCENDING ATTITUDES, AND NAME CALLING.

Thank you for addressing the situation. I accept the correction. I did not consider that you may have been doing behind the scenes moderation. So I apologize for being impatient. But since you quoted my post and only addressed me, I inferred that I was being singled out.

Admittedly, it is an unnecessary extreme to bring up one's education in a debate about a film. And yes, this venue is among the least appropriate for getting into academic style debates. But I find little recourse when people dismiss my claims, not because they have an opposing argument or a differing perspective that yields a different conclusion, but because they are telling me that I am a nobody and don't know what I am talking about, and wish to parade Roger Ebert in my face as a means to prove that I have no ground to stand on. It is frustrating to say the least. But perhaps I will learn to ignore people in the future and merely allow a difference of opinion to remain just that.

 

[redhawk23]

How did you guys like the different fighting styles? I really liked how the MUTO's made use of their arm hooks.