Heavenly Sword showcased in London - Click this-

I suppose so. But even then, some of these companies try to keep the game running at such a high FPS that it's one of the reasons they have to keep these things out. Who cares about 60 FPS? If you can fit some more **** in and have it run at 30, I'd be peachy.
 
Pretty interesting article.
I decided to just post in on the threads about the 2 games it's talking about, instead of creating a new thread.

Why PS3's latest blockbusters failed to impress the gaming massive.

September 4, 2007

So the results are in. With two of PlayStation 3's biggest titles now being reviewed around the world, it has to be said they haven't been as impressive as their initial promise suggested. We're talking scores as low as 40 for Lair and 6/10 for Heavenly Sword. How could such massive releases be so disappointing?

Didn't someone look at Lair somewhere along the line and say "Er... this really isn't working"? And why does Heavenly Sword feel so disappointing despite its beauty? We take a look at concensus opinion across the games review media and condense it into four main issues that can be learned from by all software houses.

1) Unfinished business
We know it's important to meet deadlines and that spiralling development costs can sometimes put developers out of business. But when it comes to a possible 'killer app' for a system, surely it makes sense to wait until it really is finished, optimised and ready.

Take Grand Theft Auto IV as an example - seriously, how long ago did you last hear someone complain about the delay? Exactly. It was devastating, of course, but people do get over it and can rest assured the end result will be worth the wait. Heavenly Sword and Lair both have frame-rate issues and tearing, which isn't really what we expect from next-gen machines.

What the critics said:
"As polished as the game is 90 per cent of the time, there's a lingering feeling the game was deemed 'good enough' rather than fully honed in all areas." - Eurogamer on Heavenly Sword

"It's obvious that all the development effort went into Lair's production values, rather than into making it fun to play." - Gamespot on Lair

2) Controls
The motion-sensitive debate. When it works, it works really well. Just look at Wii Sports to see how motion-sensing control can add greatly to the gameplay experience. Even WarHawk's Sixaxis controls are ok, but - crucially - they're optional. Thing is, when motion control is done badly, it's terrible. And sadly, both Lair and, to a lesser extent, Heavenly Sword both incorporate dubious SixAxis control. But there's an option to switch them off and revert to the tried and tested analogue sticks, right? Not so for Lair. The game's message would appear to be: 'Having trouble flying a dragon? Deal with it.'

What the critics said:
"Buy it if you want to justify all the thousands you spent on your PS3 and that 1080p HDTV you can see from the International Space Station. Don't buy it if you want a dragon that does what it's damn well told." - 1Up on Lair

"Although it feels rather fantastic when you wobble your pad to your target, it's horribly imprecise. After a few hours of struggling with it, we couldn't quite believe how much easier it was to control the direction with the analogue stick in comparison. Nice try, but no thanks." Eurogamer on Heavenly Sword

"A quick jerk vertically is supposed to make your dragon do a 180-degree turn, but that only seemed to work about three-quarters of the time. Either the controller did not read the motion or the game’s AI decided to ignore the command." - Gamezone

"You shouldn't play Lair. Not unless you have some morbid interest in experiencing what is quite possibly one of the worst control schemes ever devised." - Gamespot on Lair

"The people behind the solid reinvention of Warhawk chose - in their kindness, and in their wisdom - to let the player decide if they want to wrangle their flight gameplay via Sixaxis or the analog sticks, a move that'll prove prescient." - Penny-arcade on Lair

3) Combat
When a game's main point is to engane in combat, it has to work perfectly. Both Heavenly Sword and Lair have variety in their combat scenes, but sadly neither is enough to go the full distance. The lesson? Give the player varied enemies and fun ways to kill them. Not chance kills and cookie-cutter clones.

What the critics said:
"Combat mechanic is 1/3 broken" GamingTrend on Heavenly Sword

"A number of the skirmishes are essentially arena battles where you wind up trapped in a room and need to fend off swarm after swarm of enemies. This just makes it feel like you're trudging through that section of the game and that the designers are keeping you put for a while to rack up the overall game time." - IGN on Heavenly Sword

"In theory, you can lock on to other flying enemies and spew flames at them or dive into them from a fair distance. But the targeting system is a tragedy. You can't choose what to lock on to, so all you can do is keep an eye out for the fuzzy white circle to appear on an enemy dragon." - Gamespot on Lair

"There are some who derive a kind of perverse superiority from their mastery of the game's ambiguous mechanics. For my part, I don't give a good Goddamn if someone has trained themselves to eat **** and like it. The game is not challenging, it's difficult to play, and it's taken many years but I'm ready to begin making this distinction." - Penny-Arcade on Lair

4) Hype
The final lesson is simple. If you've got a promising game, be careful what you say about it. There's a lot to be said for releasing a carefully-managed drip-feed of new screens and videos instead of shouting 'AAA TITLE!' from the rooftops. If the games hadn't been hyped up so much in the first place, we wouldn't have been so disappointed. But as it is, everyone's feeling dejected. Especially this guy:

"There have even been positive impressions at several game conferences for this beast and yet the final release is one of the largest steaming piles I’ve ever had to endure. After failing many of the missions an insane amount of times I headed to the bathroom for some relief only to realize that my latest bowel movement was more fun than the 'game' I had been playing." - Gamebrink on Lair.

Conclusion:
So what have we learned? Be careful what you say, take your time and make sure gameplay is the primary element of any game. And if you really must incorporate Sixaxis controls...

...make sure there's an option to switch them off.
 
Kinda cool, but I still don't see it being better than Sigma, or GoW3.
 
What did you think of God of War 2? I was kind of dissapointed to be honest.
 
It was just as good as the first from what I played.
 
I never actually played it at all. I only play games that are on the Xbox :(
 
And beat up 6 year old girls in Wii Boxing. :csad:
 
Look, she only won because the Wii clearly favors children, I so would have kicked her ass if it weren't for that :o
 
Once and for all: For all of those people who said this was originally an Xbox game and Microsoft turned them down

deepbrown said:
"Forward to GDC 2003 again. After hearing the sales figures for Kung Foo Chaos we know that a sequel isn't going to happen even though MS is saying otherwise. Our options are looking grim. With no sequel in sight, we have two choices: create a brand new IP or do a work-for-hire gig. Our Kung Fu Chaos engine was really only suited for Kung Fu Chaos and the cost of re-engineering it for a license would mean that we wouldn't be able to compete with those who specialise in low-cost licenses.

Creating a new IP is looking grim too: our market research shows that sequels and licenses dominate the end of a console cycle. Even if we pull off a new IP, the investment we would have to make on an updated engine would probably only last the one game in the current console lifecycle.

What our research does show is that 3rd person action adventures are big but the first generation games in this genre are always ****. Nina, Mike and I originally came from Sony Cambridge, a studio that specialised in 3rd person action games and so we would be treading familiar ground. If we start now, a full year or two before most developers even think about next-gen development, we would have the time to craft a great game and release it early in the next-gen console cycle.

As expected, several weeks after our presentation to MS, they say no to Kung Fu Story but we are already busy designing a next generation original IP codenamed Heavenly Sword. And so begins this diary of the dreams and nightmares that define next-gen development..."

http://www.ninjatheory.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=24&Itemid=52

"I’d like to think that the next-gen game experience should not be about any single gameplay, rendering or hardware gimmick. Nor should it be about pigeonhole genres. I believe that the next-gen will kick-start the rise of games as a sophisticated entertainment medium as powerful as film, music and literature: the 10th art. There I said it."

http://www.ninjatheory.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=23&Itemid=52

"So what better time than at the start of an exciting new console generation to position yourself with a statement of style and beauty? And to start early enough to craft an amazing gaming experience that truly could not exist on current gen hardware?"

"For the first time in over 2 years, Nina, Mike and I hit the road armed with a full design, a business plan, and a nice little trailer to pitch our Heavenly Sword concept to a few choice publishers.

“We are Just Add Monsters and our last game was Kung Fu Chaos”

So far so good.

“We are here to present our next gen game concept”

“Next gen? Do you mean PSP?”

Oh boy.


Despite all that, by the end of our presentations, particularly when we showed them our trailer and our early-bird strategy, the response was uncanny. By uncanny I mean good. By good I mean unbelievably amazing. No game any of us had ever pitched before had been met with the enthusiasm we witnessed in those dull, audio-visually-challenged meeting rooms.

As we followed up with meetings and worked our way up the publishing chain, we started hitting dead ends:

“We think that starting with a team of 23 is too small for a NEXT-GEN game”

Summer of 2003 is fading and it looks like we’ll have to self-fund our prototype and aggressively pitch it to the big boys for this to work. It will need to be an amazing playable demo for platforms that don't exist; yet one that looks, sounds and feels better than any game currently out there.

Next month I want to tell you about the true cost of transitioning to next-generation development and it has nothing to do with money, technology, art pipelines or any of the other usual suspects and it very nearly ripped our team apart."

http://www.ninjatheory.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=43&Itemid=52

All dated 2003-2004. It goes on and on and on...i could quote more.

Deepbrown isn't half right, deep is full right - The only game after Kung Foo Chaos which was to be on the Xbox, was Kung Foo Story, which Microsoft turned down.


And finally the nail in the coffin from DeanoC - Ninja Theory dev, posting on B3D, 3rd Aug 2007

"HS was never meant to go to XBOX, it was designed for NEXT GEN from the start"

Next gen, next gen, next gen....which is now current gen, but used to be next gen, but all in all not XBOX - unless they were making this game after the PS1...:D

Sorry about the whispers - my family is Singaporean :) ...so I'm not being racist - it's just a common saying over here in the UK. (it being a common saying is of course no defense, I was unaware it was offensive)


Sorry, WHF, but the dust has settled and the game will be out very soon, and Heavenly Sword will be a pretty good game that's an incredible cinimatic experience. Have fun with Ninety Nine Nights.
 
I can't believe you're still on that. N3 wasn't that bad you know.
 
The only reason I'm on it is because he trolled any Heavenly Sword stuff with a vengance and made stupid comparisons to Ninety Nine Nights, a terrible game.

It can't even clone Dynasty Warriors right. Dynasty Warriors. The series he habitually called crap when it was on the PS2; somehow a half baked clone of Dynasty Warriors was worthy of his attention over a much more promising title like Heavenly Sword simply why? Because it was on the 360, reminds me of Blue Dragon. :dry:
 
I think it was me who bought N3 and defended it, not him. And really, Blue Dragon wasn't hyped through the roof or anything, all either of us did was make a thread for it and said that it might be interesting. I think you're overreacting just a tad :o
 
I think you're forgetting

"Ninety Nine Nights crushes Heavenly Sword technically."

Over-reacting? i think you guys are forgetting the endless amount of crap you piled on this game. :o
And it's absurd for him to have been interesting it it since Sakaguchi said that the combat system would be different, but still that of a traditional JRPG, and it's entirely modeled after being an inferior clone of Dragon Warriors. I mean that was apparent from the start, but suddenly he's interested and had high hopes. :rolleyes:

Screw you old man :cmad:
 
Oh come on, all we ever did was point out that it wasn't as technically impressive as some wanted to say it was, and that the gameplay didn't look that good compared to a God of War or a Ninja Gaiden, it's not like we treated it like Resistance.
 
You guys crapped on it before there was ever a single gameplay video. :dry:

And Resistance! That's another game you trolling to hell that ended up being pretty good. :cmad:

YOu do not want me to do a search on the old Heavenly Sword threads... :dry:
 
Of course we did, it's coming from the makers of Kung Fu Chaos. And then when we had gameplay videos, we crapped on it because of those instead. We didn't do anything wrong.

And Resistance can't possibly be pretty good unless PDZ was pretty good as well. That game had mediocrity coded right into it.
 
Do you honestly believe what you said in the first paragraph. :csad:
 
Yes I do. I know that none of our crew ever wrongfully bashed this or any other game. And we never wrongfully propped another one up either. We had legitimate reasons to bash this game, and legitimate reasons to hype Blue Dragon and Lost Odyssey after having spent years hating on JRPGs. That is the absolute, indisputable truth. :dry:
 
Alright, maybe I might have possibly hyped Blue Dragon and Lost Odyssey and Eternal Sonata and Enchanted Arm and theoretically a few other games under false pretenses, I'll give you that. But I really have never seen anything special about this game, at all. Not in the graphics, not in the story, not in the talent behind it, not in the gameplay, not anywhere. Maybe THWIP hated this game for it's console, I don't know, but I didn't, and I doubt WHF did either.
 

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