If Marvel Studios ever gets ahold of Spider-Man, X-Men, Fantastic Four, etc...

[WeaponXProject]

I disagree but can undersatnd why you'd like him the best.



Why?

What don't you see relatable about them? How much have you seen of them?



Darkness isn't the only path a character has to take to be interesting.

Did you find The Incredibles uninteresting? They were what you'd get with a good version of FF.



Human Torch can turn his entire body into fire, he can create a super-nova which can destroy all life on Earth, he can fly, in the comics he's an expert at using in it various ways like defeating forest fires or cooking toast.

Mr.Fantastic's power might seem silly but it can be incredibly useful in battle or making inventions. He has limited shape-shifting abilities, he can give himself Thing level strength when he needs it, he can attack several enemies at once in complex attacks simultaneously if they far away from the others, can use his stretching in battles to throw, pummel, strike, lock, strangle and more.

Invisible Woman is basically a Green Lantern. The most powerful member of the team. In the comics she's demolished the other FF members easily in a fight. She can allow herself or the team to be unseen by enemies which is really good for going behind enemy lines or escaping prisons.

The Thing is permanently stuck as a rock monster with enough strength to give Hulk tough brawls.

Sometimes you have to look at the characters from outside their fanbase. Consider this, the 15 or plus friends I know that saw those two movies and care about none of the characters except for Doom and the Thing. A movie audience who loves action movies, like my and probably your generation, will go see an action movie with knowing little or nothing of the characters. I will say that all of my friends that saw it disliked Mr. Fantastic extremely. They laughed at his powers bc they compared his flexibility and stretch to other great super heroes. Comparatively, his powers do not seem as interesting to most against characters with other powers, gadgets and looks. Compare him to any other big super hero and people that aren't good fans, like you and me, they don't like it.

The darkness quality is something Hollywood has pushed in all soon to come super hero movies, outside of Iron Man and I believe we will see Tony struggle more with his bad habits in the next movie. WB has expressed approaching all their lead characters with a darker side. X-Men characters will probably have darker spin-offs. By dark, I think the studios are looking into showing more conviction, as if they feel an overwhelming obligation to use their powers or skills, in their characters. A reason for doing outlandish and dangerous things.

Perhaps Marvel could fix that by getting the properties back but I don't think FF fits in with characters like the X-Men, Iron Man, Hulk, Cap, Batman, Blade... and those are the properties that my friends, who aren't comic book fans, respect. Hollywood is loving the anti-hero right now and so are the audiences.

Sorry but I did find the Incredibles uninteresting. It was a little kids film to me and was only visually spectacular due to the fact that it wasn't live action.

I would love to see FF get restarted but I don't know if the average audience really likes them.

 

[Rich Santoro]

Hollywood is loving the anti-hero right now and so are the audiences.

I don't really think that it is the "anti-hero" thing, so much as people like authentic characters. Authentic in that they have real personalities and real character traits... The hands-on-the-hips Superman of the 50s will not fly today... at all... The sullen, conflicted Batman on TDK was great... not because he is an anti-hero, but because he is a person, and those emotions are real and believable. If a hero gets mad and goes off on the villian, that is not "anti-heroism"... that is human. People like that... and Hollywood is connecting with that.

We saw the transformation of Tony Stark after his eyes were openned to the ills caused by his weapons (the scene when he raises his tone to Pepper was the crucial moment... "There is only the next mission, and nothing else")... Peter Parker struggles with all kinds of tough decisions and complicated realities resulting from his role as Spiderman (With great power comes great responsibility, his friend hates him, his loved ones are always in danger should his identity become revealed)... It is the expression of real emotion, and conflict that is winning with these films.

 

[WeaponXProject]

I don't really think that it is the "anti-hero" thing, so much as people like authentic characters. Authentic in that they have real personalities and real character traits... The hands-on-the-hips Superman of the 50s will not fly today... at all... The sullen, conflicted Batman on TDK was great... not because he is an anti-hero, but because he is a person, and those emotions are real and believable. If a hero gets mad and goes off on the villian, that is not "anti-heroism"... that is human. People like that... and Hollywood is connecting with that.

We saw the transformation of Tony Stark after his eyes were openned to the ills caused by his weapons (the scene when he raises his tone to Pepper was the crucial moment... "There is only the next mission, and nothing else")... Peter Parker struggles with all kinds of tough decisions and complicated realities resulting from his role as Spiderman (With great power comes great responsibility, his friend hates him, his loved ones are always in danger should his identity become revealed)... It is the expression of real emotion, and conflict that is winning with these films.

I definitely can see what you mean and agree with you. Kinda like what I said about having conviction. Humanizing the heroes is a certain way to look at it.

 

[Rich Santoro]

Yessir... We agree.

I just wanted to be sure that we are not saying that the "anti-hero" mold as I understand it to be (Punisher, Wolverine, Lobo) is what we need to make a movie and a character work. It certainly works for those characters, and there is a place for it. I just don't want us to get carried away (Like Image comics when they first hit the scene, making every other character look like either Wolverine or Cable... with a Psylocke knock-off thrown in here and there).

 

[Metamorpho1977]

If Marvel gets the movie rights back, I want my Infinity Gauntlet Trilogy.

 

[WeaponXProject]

Yessir... We agree.

I just wanted to be sure that we are not saying that the "anti-hero" mold as I understand it to be (Punisher, Wolverine, Lobo) is what we need to make a movie and a character work. It certainly works for those characters, and there is a place for it. I just don't want us to get carried away (Like Image comics when they first hit the scene, making every other character look like either Wolverine or Cable... with a Psylocke knock-off thrown in here and there).

I agree that Wolverine is the anti-hero of the X-Men comics but I am dissappointed to see that he hasn't been that yet in the movies. I would have rather Wolverine be the loner and uncertain hero of the movies then him be the star. But FOX wanted to sell and sell so....

 

[The Major]

Sometimes you have to look at the characters from outside their fanbase.

I am.

Consider this, the 15 or plus friends I know that saw those two movies and care about none of the characters except for Doom and the Thing.

They did a decent job with Thing even though he still needed improvements.

Why did you like Doom?

A movie audience who loves action movies, like my and probably your generation, will go see an action movie with knowing little or nothing of the characters. I will say that all of my friends that saw it disliked Mr. Fantastic extremely. They laughed at his powers bc they compared his flexibility and stretch to other great super heroes. Comparatively, his powers do not seem as interesting to most against characters with other powers, gadgets and looks. Compare him to any other big super hero and people that aren't good fans, like you and me, they don't like it.

Which could be dealt with if your friends and you had actually seen him use them to their potential in a film. Mr.Fantastic has not done this yet.

You should understand that's not what makes him extremely dangerous, though. It's his inventive mind.

In the Story films Mr.Fantastic was poorly done entirely. From his powers down to his personality. Of course you didn't like him. I didn't like him either and I'm a fan of the character.

He got off light compared to what they did Invisible Woman.

All of them were terrible versions, actually.

The best was Human Torch IMO.

You're not really saying anything that can't be fixed or the potential isn't there.

The darkness quality is something Hollywood has pushed in all soon to come super hero movies, outside of Iron Man and I believe we will see Tony struggle more with his bad habits in the next movie. WB has expressed approaching all their lead characters with a darker side.

I didn't say FF couldn't be dark at times. They can.

They can be relatable, too. The FF are a family which have regular family troubles. The Story films showed a tiny bit of that but usually played it for laughs when it can be more serious and complex then that.

Especially their villains. You should be terrified of these people.

X-Men characters will probably have darker spin-offs.

X-men was always darker but they could do other things with FF. Take the Skrulls for instance. They could use them to show government corruption and paranoia so no-one knows who to trust.

By dark, I think the studios are looking into showing more conviction, as if they feel an overwhelming obligation to use their powers or skills, in their characters.

Which FF can do if they're written correctly.

A reason for doing outlandish and dangerous things.

Which could be done with FF.

Perhaps Marvel could fix that by getting the properties back but I don't think FF fits in with characters like the X-Men, Iron Man, Hulk, Cap, Batman, Blade... and those are the properties that my friends, who aren't comic book fans, respect.

They respect them since they've seen them live up to their potential in good movies. They haven't seen that with FF.

Hollywood is loving the anti-hero right now and so are the audiences.

They only love the since plenty of good films have been made of them recently.

Not that less dark films can't be successful in today's climate.

Sorry but I did find the Incredibles uninteresting. It was a little kids film to me and was only visually spectacular due to the fact that it wasn't live action.

I disagree.

I would love to see FF get restarted

Agreed.

but I don't know if the average audience really likes them.

They never will if their film versions are always bad.

 

[Rich Santoro]

WeaponXProject
I agree that Wolverine is the anti-hero of the X-Men comics but I am dissappointed to see that he hasn't been that yet in the movies. I would have rather Wolverine be the loner and uncertain hero of the movies then him be the star. But FOX wanted to sell and sell so....

I agree... I am disappointed with the writing for Wolverine. In general, I did enjoy the X-Men movies, but I am disappointed overall.

 

[WeaponXProject]

Major, I guess we will have to wait and see what the studio does with the property but I think they will let it die so Marvel gets it back and remakes it.

 

[GhostPoet]

IF Marvel ever got their hands on these properties...they would like completely ignore the previous films and instead do reboots so they can create the heroes in THEIR vision.

 

[TheVileOne]

I think Spider-man shows that more than just dark, anti-hero movies will sell.

Look at the Punisher movies .

I would love if Marvel could get everything back under their banner. But Fox is still doing X-men. And now they are saying they want to reboot Daredevil. So it doesn't look like we can see the perfectly cohesive Marvel movie-verse anytime soon. But it's still good that Marvel has all these remaining properties under their banner.

 

[FaT_tONle]

I don't see Marvel ever rebooting ANY of these franchises like a Batman Begins for example... excluding remakes/updated versions 20-30 years down the line. I guess Fantastic Four could use a redo though so I wouldn't rule it out completely there, although I think the next FF film would be a loose sequel... but from the five films or more we are getting about Spiderman... from the X-Men trilogy to all the prequels/spinoffs we may get in the near future... why would you rehash that just to re-envision/reimagine the characters? I can see Marvel doing an X-Men trilogy once they get it back but I don't think they will rehash the same characters/plots. The new trilogy would be a loose sequel to the originals IMO. Same with Spiderman. For example Marvel may go right to the clone saga and Ben Reiley before doing yet another Peter Parker/Spiderman movie. And I have to say I think we are more likely to see FF, Spiderman, or X-men characters in crossovers before seeing them in more solo films. Something along the lines of New Avengers or something. That's just how I see it.

 

[WeaponXProject]

I think Spider-man shows that more than just dark, anti-hero movies will sell.quote]

Yeah but even Raimi tried it in the 3rd movie and he failed miserably with Symbiote Spidey. Truthfully it wasn't dark enough, still too campy to take seriously.

 

[TheVileOne]

Umm, Spider-man 1 and 2 say hello.

One could argue they tried going too dark with Spider-man 3 and it messed up the balance established in the previous two movies.

 

[WeaponXProject]

Umm, Spider-man 1 and 2 say hello.

One could argue they tried going too dark with Spider-man 3 and it messed up the balance established in the previous two movies.

I know I understand that Spidey one and two are light and all but I was just stating that even the lighter characters get their dark movies because of what Hollywood wants to make the characters real. If you humanize them they become easier to relate too. Which is a cool aspect but with Raimi's series he creates a world for Spidey that is ideal and it didn't work. I like the style Raimi brings to the table. I was just stating that the darker side of characters have been more frequent lately which would make me think that maybe Hollywood is pushing that for sales.

As a sales aspect, it worked for Spidey 3, TDK, and the whole X series (even though I thought it was too light-hearted).

 

[The Major]

Yeah but even Raimi tried it in the 3rd movie and he failed miserably with Symbiote Spidey. Truthfully it wasn't dark enough, still too campy to take seriously.

That was a bad execution. They could have made it a much darker Spider-man movie just facing Venom.

 

[The Major]

I know I understand that Spidey one and two are light and all but I was just stating that even the lighter characters get their dark movies because of what Hollywood wants to make the characters real.

Darkness is in because Nolan made it a trend with his Batman films.

It isn't the only way to make comic super-heroes interesting or relatable, either.

If you humanize them they become easier to relate too.

Which they can do with the lighter characters without turning them into psychotic anti-heroes.

Which is a cool aspect but with Raimi's series he creates a world for Spidey that is ideal and it didn't work.

It's to bad FF lacked has their own Riami to show their full potential in film.

I like the style Raimi brings to the table.

So do I but he has made mistakes with the franchise, especially with 3.

I was just stating that the darker side of characters have been more frequent lately which would make me think that maybe Hollywood is pushing that for sales.

I agree, but darkness or light movies don't mean **** if they are terribly made.

As a sales aspect, it worked for Spidey 3, TDK, and the whole X series (even though I thought it was too light-hearted).

Spider-man 3 and TDK were sequels to good movies. It wasn't just that they were darker which made them interesting. Nolan's Batman films have incredible quality, too.

 

[WeaponXProject]

Darkness is in because Nolan made it a trend with his Batman films.

It isn't the only way to make comic super-heroes interesting or relatable, either.



Which they can do with the lighter characters without turning them into psychotic anti-heroes.



It's to bad FF lacked has their own Riami to show their full potential in film.



So do I but he has made mistakes with the franchise, especially with 3.



I agree, but darkness or light movies don't mean **** if they are terribly made.



Spider-man 3 and TDK were sequels to good movies. It wasn't just that they were darker which made them interesting. Nolan's Batman films have incredible quality, too.

I never said that was the only way to do a character. I said Hollywood likes it that way right now.

I don't think any of the main characters in any movie that has had an anti-hero has been portrayed as a psychopath. That's not what I meant. I think humanizing them with flaws can make them more like me or you which is easy to relate to. Except for maybe the new Punisher which didn't come out yet, he seems to be a little lost since the death of his son and wife, atleast more so in this one than the last. I think he is going to have a craziness side we haven't seen yet, seemingly to be sadistic.

I agree with you on the darkness and lightness aspect, I know if they are made terribly it doesn't make a difference.

On the sales aspect, TDK and Spidey were sequels of good movies so of course they are going to get great box office results but that doesn't take away from what I said of Hollywood making characters darker.

 

[The Major]

I never said that was the only way to do a character. I said Hollywood likes it that way right now.

True.

I don't think any of the main characters in any movie that has had an anti-hero has been portrayed as a psychopath. That's not what I meant. I think humanizing them with flaws can make them more like me or you which is easy to relate to. Except for maybe the new Punisher which didn't come out yet, he seems to be a little lost since the death of his son and wife, atleast more so in this one than the last. I think he is going to have a craziness side we haven't seen yet, seemingly to be sadistic.

I agree with you on the darkness and lightness aspect, I know if they are made terribly it doesn't make a difference.

On the sales aspect, TDK and Spidey were sequels of good movies so of course they are going to get great box office results but that doesn't take away from what I said of Hollywood making characters darker.

Agreed.

 

[RAMORE]

NOTE: I'm not asking when will the studio get control of these franchises from Sony and Twentieth Century Fox, so dont go on and on about all those details. Please.

What I am asking is, if Marvel Studios ever gets ahold of Spider-Man, X-Men, Fantastic Four, Daredevil, etc. do you think that they would have to make changes to them (aka reboot) to fit them into the Marvel Film universe with Iron Man, TIH, The Avengers, etc. or leave them as is?

Personally, I think X-Men and Spider-Man can be left as is (btw, I can totally see RDJ and Tobey sharing a scene together in their respective characters), and F4 and Daredevil can/should be rebooted.

Strangely I think FF is fine but I would redo all the others especially spiderman which after seeing Iron man could have been soooooooo much better and I would recast naming adam brody the lead

 

[Sawyer]

Strangely I think FF is fine but I would redo all the others especially spiderman which after seeing Iron man could have been soooooooo much better and I would recast naming adam brody the lead

Just about all of what you just said made not a goddam lick of sense.

FF is fine, but the rest arent? What? Of all of them, FF is the one that needs to be rebooted the most, even more than Daredevil. Most especially, Doctor Doom needs to be done right.

However, I agree that Adam Brody would be a good choice for Spidey. Not that I'm saying the Spider-Man series should be rebooted, though. Maybe the third can just be ignored...

 

[Donnie Darko]

well, Iron Man and Spider-Man were already in Satan's Alley together...

 

[Darthkush]

First of all, I don't think most of these will get back to Marvel studios anytime soon. We're talking maybe 10 or even 20 years before they're let go, as even when they "flop" they make an little coin.

That being said, if we ignore that and say Marvel gets them back all at once or within the next 2-3 years, here's how I see it shaking out...

X-men: With the right director, you can just make an 4th x-men(won't need an half-assed Young x-men spinoff). Talk up the cast properly, get the right writers, good script, and you can simply fix it. No need for another Phoenix anything, just continue the story and use Sinister or Apocalypse or some other major x-men threat. I would definitely find an way to bring Xavier and Cyclops back too.

Daredevil: It almost has to be an reboot, as the cast from the first film, I doubt, will want in but at least with this reboot, it'll be done with great care in every way.

Elektra:I don't think needs an movie at this point. Sorry, Natchio fans.

The Punisher: BRING BACK THOMAS JANE. I think Jane has just enough geek cred that if you throw him in an balls to the wall awesomely written/directed Punisher flick and get the buzz out there and market it correctly, it'll just work.

Blade: We don't need anymore blade films really. The first 2 are good, third wasn't. Not really anything that needs to be fixed.

Fantastic Four: Needs an great director. You may even be able to get away with keeping the same cast if it's made clear to the fans that they're getting somebody who gives an damn and who knows what they're doing. It'd have to be an biggie on the level of an Robert Rodriguiez though for it to work which is ultimately why it might be an lost cause for some time.

Ghost Rider: Same as Punisher.

Spider-man: To me, doesn't need to be fixed. I think it should just end after Raimi does maybe 1 or 2 more of them. Spidey3 wasn't very good but I have faith Raimi can fix it.

 

[Mercurius]

Spidey: he needs to stop crying and whining, and start making his jokes while fighting; he needs to stop being unmasked all the time, and ravaged; get rid of lame Mary Jane, a bore.

X-Men: agreed. Make a four installment upgrading everything.

Fantastic Four: reboot totally. New actors, new conceptions (please, based along the lines of John Byrne and Alan Davis); we need Doom as he is, both in the visual sense, and in the text; new director, new writer; Thing made with actor with several CGI enhancings in order to make it rocky, big and believable.

Punisher: agreed, again. Thomas Jane.

Daredevil: yeah, reboot. Make it a movie along the lines of Miller's books. Serious, intense, well-written. That's a character they can bring to the Dark Knight level easily.

Blade: agreed. Leave him alone. It was good enough for two times.

Elektra: they can make it a very bizarre, author-movie, based on Elektra: Assassin. I think it wold be real good.

 

[Sawyer]

Keep Punisher away from the rest of the Marvel universe stuff. IMO, he works better on his own. And I think the new one looks pretty good. Leave that as it is.

And Ghost Rider can whither up and die.