Sequels In retrospect - I'm disgusted with the series.

[FaT_tONle]

It didn't fail, some people didn't like it, some people loved it. I don't think that really means a film failed completely.

True... but I would compare it more so to how few people disliked SM2 while everyone else loved it... only with SM3... as many people who liked SM2... there is probably an equal number that hates SM3... while as few people disliked SM2... there are probably as many people who liked SM3... yourself included. I am just trying to quantify it fairly... but I think that would be a general perception and a more accurate one.

I'm not playing the Batman troll card for that reason. I follow this forum despite not posting in it much til the last few days, and this is the 3rd thread Ninja specifically has done this with. See his Get a Hint Sony! Watch TDK thread from months ago where he went on a similar rant. We have threads already related to Raimi and co coming back, plus a thread about if Spider-Man can surpass TDK. I have no problem with this discussion in those threads, but I'm tired of people thinking they have the right to voice their non-unique opinion in completely new threads when they can do the same elsewhere and still be heard.

What's stopping fans from making Raimi/Tobey appreciation threads?

The version of Batman Bale is playing is not the same as previous takes on Batman - it's fresh. Same with John Connor - we've only seen him as a kid - not as an adult trying to lead a rebellion against machines. It's something new.

The guy is playing Bruce Wayne and John Connor... nuff said...

 

[Spider-ManHero12]

You mean A LOT of people didn't like it. .

True, but it didn't get the worst response for a third film ever though.

 

[Spider-ManHero12]

True... but I would compare it more so to how few people disliked SM2 while everyone else loved it... only with SM3... as many people who liked SM2... there is probably an equal number that hates SM3... while as few people disliked SM2... there are probably as many people who liked SM3... yourself included. I am just trying to quantify it fairly... but I think that would be a general perception and a more accurate one.

Tbh, you make a good point.

 

[Daredevil_2003]

Even though Venom didn't have a extremely perfect screen time, I think he served what he was supposed to even though he was in the film for a few minutes. I love Venom, but he's not the most in depth character, which is another reason I'm not really all that dissapointed with his screen time.

He is kinda of a one-note character, but it's an extremely good one note! t:

The whole symbiote saga and first appearance of Venom is one of the best arcs of Spidey in all it's incarnations except this one. They completely wasted the opportunity. Which is really nothing new for this franchise, IMO. The Saturday morning kids cartoon 'Spectacular Spider-Man' handled that whole spiel better than SM3, which is just sad...not that I have anything against the cartoons, it's just that a live-action film should be able to at least match it, not get blown out of the water by it.

 

[Spider-ManHero12]

He is kinda of a one-note character, but it's an extremely good one note! t:

The whole symbiote saga and first appearance of Venom is one of the best arcs of Spidey in all it's incarnations except this one. They completely wasted the opportunity. Which is really nothing new for this franchise, IMO. The Saturday morning kids cartoon 'Spectacular Spider-Man' handled that whole spiel better than SM3, which is just sad...not that I have anything against the cartoons, it's just that a live-action film should be able to at least match it, not get blown out of the water by it.

Well, the Symbiote storyline in the comics is one of my favorites, but IMO, it would be too long of a film to put alot of those stories in there.

 

[pjspider1C]

[/quote}The guy is playing Bruce Wayne and John Connor... nuff said...[/quote]

Yes, they're iconic characters. But fresh, new interpretations that haven't been done before. Regardless, I fail to see your point... moving on...

 

[Spider-Fan]

What's stopping fans from making Raimi/Tobey appreciation threads?

I'm not going to make threads about things that can be covered in other threads. Whether it be my praise for something or dismay. Unless my thought is unique or not covered by another thread. This could easily have been covered elsewhere in many threads. As could a "Raimi is TEH BESTEST LOLZ!!!" thought be covered in an existing thread. The fact this thread is starting discussion is moot to me, because polarizing threads like this always will. That doesn't make it right to start new threads everytime you have "bad/good thoughts" that can be covered elsewhere.

 

[Daredevil_2003]

Well, the Symbiote storyline in the comics is one of my favorites, but IMO, it would be too long of a film to put alot of those stories in there.

Check out the game Ultimate Spider-Man and the issues 33-39. That is probably the best version of the Symbiote I've seen and could be easily compressed into a movie. It even brings in and deals with Carnage in a quality, expeditious manner!

Make a few cuts here and there and you've got yourself a frickin epic!

 

[Spider-Fan]

I'd also like to note that if I started a retaliation In Retrospect, This Series Rocks! thread, it would in all likelihood get closed. Just like my retaliation Get a Hint Sony! Watch Batman & Robin thread got closed when Ninja started similar threads for TDK and TMNT in a span of days, which were allowed to go on for longer than mine. While mine was a joke, I find that unfair.

 

[Visionary]

The whole symbiote saga and first appearance of Venom is one of the best arcs of Spidey in all it's incarnations except this one. They completely wasted the opportunity. Which is really nothing new for this franchise, IMO. The Saturday morning kids cartoon 'Spectacular Spider-Man' handled that whole spiel better than SM3, which is just sad...not that I have anything against the cartoons, it's just that a live-action film should be able to at least match it, not get blown out of the water by it.

True, but the director hated Venom and the symbiote motif. And like the tool that he has become, was forced (like rape) by Marvel/Sony to use it to make more money. The people behind the cartoons (Spectacular and the 90s series) loved the story and the character Venom. Venom/symbiote is die-hard sci-fi stuff, you really have to know your sci-fi filmmaking to pull it off in live action.

 

[Ace of Knaves]

Bale has sold out with Terminator... I can't put him up there with Hollywood elite for that reason. The guy will never be heard from again once the Batman/John Conner gig is over IMO...

I just look at that crew... McG and all... the producers... I have no respect for those people as film makers. And now we are talking about a trilogy??? Bale signed to 3 pictures??? That's selling out IMO. I hope they kill the character off... but I doubt that will happen. Why does Daniel Craig turn down Thor? Because "I can't be both Bond AND Thor". Why Bale signs on to another commercial flick like this is beyond me... and he isn't getting any younger. I just look at guys like Leo, Damon, Pitt... these guys don't do these commercial films in MULTIPLE franchises... and I think Bale is more talented than all of them. I just don't think he knows what he wants to accomplish at this point in his career. He better be careful.

At this stage I would say Bale is in the top 5 leading men in Hollywood. Public Enemies and Terminator should cement this. I wouldn't say he is selling out, it's not as though the role of John Connar is a throw-a-way trash role.

And Jon Nolan is a writer on Terminator: Salvation, i'm sure it won't be crap.

 

[pjspider1C]

How about this? If you don't like the movies... stick to the comics... or Spectacular Spider-Man... or the 90's Animated series... or Spider-Man & His Amazing Friends... or the 60's Spider-Man cartoon... or the 70's Live Action Series... whatever floats your boat.

In my opinion, the movies are good. Yes, each one of them has their flaws, but so do all other variations Spider-Man. There's never going to be "perfect" Spider-Man movie that pleases everybody. If they do something new or re-invent something, fans of the older comics will be upset. If they stick the older comics to please those people, younger fans will be upset. In my opinion, the Spider-Man films are a well-rounded interpretation that have aspects that are appealing to everyone. Maybe they didn't get every single little detail right, but so what? The films are good, and did a very good job capturing the spirit and feel of the comics.

 

[Visionary]

Let's do better than just good or below it. Spidey deserves it.

 

[Daredevil_2003]

Let's do better than just good or below it. Spidey deserves it.

 

[the_joker]

Again with the elitism and the idea of kids liking Spider-man being so horrible.

Exactly! I don't know if it's just greediness or if it's some kind of inferiority complex where they are so worried that one or two people might think comic-related = for babies/kids, that they want to make it as dark and for adults as possible.

I couldn't give a flying duck if certain comic characters (which let's face it, Spider-man is one of them) appeals to kids as well as adults. I'm just looking for a good film that utilises the said character well and I think SM1 and SM2 offered that. SM3 wasn't so good, but that shouldn't affect your judgement of the first two. And it certainly doesn't mean a rebooting the entire series and having a more serious/darker SM.

Having said all that, I do think that Raimi should have stopped with the third film. There are other marvel heroes that could be made into films. But who knows, maybe SM4 and SM5 will be good.

 

[I Am The Knight]

The guy is playing Bruce Wayne and John Connor... nuff said...

You still haven't explained why that equals sell out.

 

[pjspider1C]

When Bale starts endorsing Hanes underwear... then I'll think of him as a sell-out.

 

[Visionary]

Exactly! I don't know if it's just greediness or if it's some kind of inferiority complex where they are so worried that one or two people might think comic-related = for babies/kids, that they want to make it as dark and for adults as possible.

I couldn't give a flying duck if certain comic characters (which let's face it, Spider-man is one of them) appeals to kids as well as adults. I'm just looking for a good film that utilises the said character well and I think SM1 and SM2 offered that. SM3 wasn't so good, but that shouldn't affect your judgement of the first two. And it certainly doesn't mean a rebooting the entire series and having a more serious/darker SM.

Having said all that, I do think that Raimi should have stopped with the third film. There are other marvel heroes that could be made into films. But who knows, maybe SM4 and SM5 will be good.

Personally, I don't think they should write the movie for children. As we saw with TDK, kids will flock to a film written for an older audience in record numbers. Spider-Man villains and story arcs are suffering, because they're trying to make the story and characters easy to understand (with cute juvenile antics)...like it's being told by Mr. Rogers or Elmo.

 

[FaT_tONle]

You still haven't explained why that equals sell out.

You are jumping for an easy pay check... simple as that. You give him a pass for one franchise... but two? I mean that is over exposure... and this isn't a Stallone or Ahnuld we are talking about.... you don't think Craig could sandwich a Bond film in between Thor/Avengers had he taken Thor? I am not saying you can't do it... I am just saying don't jump for the pay check. If he stops doing things like the Machinist or I'm Not There or Rescue Dawn... that's going to raise an alarm in my eyes. Public Enemies and Killing Pablo are star studded features so those really don't count as going "outside the box" IMO... but those are certainly better than doing a hapassed Terminator flick. I'll reserve judgement until I see the film but I have no faith... sorry to get off topic.

 

[Immortalfire]

Enough with the "Spidey should be more like teh Batman!!!!" threads.