Is anyone else sick of "reality" in super hero movies?

[The Kid]

Couldn't I twist that and say whether the movie "wiz all over the characters" is subjective too?

 

[Ronny Shade]

They kinda DID go out & shoot a regular city; mine in fact.
And I think they wanted more than anything to distance it from Schumacher's Gotham, & Burton's as well.

I know they did, and I know why they did, and I respect the reboot distancing itself from the previous franchise. It's just not my ideal vision.

 

[Chris Wallace]

Couldn't I twist that and say whether the movie "wiz all over the characters" is subjective too?

You absolutely could. I think the only universal absolute is "Catwoman".

 

[Chris Wallace]

I know they did, and I know why they did, and I respect the reboot distancing itself from the previous franchise. It's just not my ideal vision.

Okay. I can live with that. So what's your "ideal" vision? I'm betting neither as dreary as Burton's nor as flashy as Schumacher's, but somewhere in-between.

 

[The PhantaZm]

I don't mind realism. It depends on the movie.

I expect some realism in a batman/daredevil/punisher, etc movie. I don't expect much realism in a Fantastic Four movie which is why I enjoyed that film so much. The creators went the complete opposite direction of the comic book trends and made a campy, unrealistic and fun superhero movie and that was like a breath of fresh air in 2005.

Sometimes realism works. It worked in the first two X-men movies, it didn't work (atleast not for me) in batman begins or the hulk. Those films just seemed to be trying way to hard. For goddsakes gotham looked even more dull than REAL cities.

 

[The PhantaZm]

Robin's not a realism issue, but rather a seriousness issue.
W/Freeze & Ivy, the last attempt to bring them to the screen left a bad taste in everyone's mouths. So if they are in fact omitted from the rebooted franchise I think it would be for that reason.
As for Croc, Man-Bat & the Demon, I think you're right. But I personally don't WANT to see them. I think when you start delving into superpowers you kinda drift away from what Batman is all about. He wages psychological warfare against criminals. A mutated lizard is a bit out of his league & more befitting Spider-Man's rogue gallery. And I don't even think Etrigan is a Batman villain. Nor do I think Bats should be tackling supernatural matters in his movies.

Croc isn't a lizard hes a human with a birth defect that makes him look like a crocodile. There are actually real people with similar diseases, just not that extreme. But thats one of the great things about batman comics, its hyper realism. Everthing is exxaggerated and when you take that away you take away the spirit of the comic books.

Chris Nolan simply doesn't have the skill or the vision to pull off that kind of thing, thats the only reason hes not doing it. Its not easy to make that work on the big screen but it can be done. Nolan just hasn't figured out how to do it.

 

[I SEE SPIDEY]

There always has to be a certain amount of reality in comicbook movies because you need to on some level believe that a guy lets say can get superpowers by being bitten by a radioactive spider....BUT, I don't want ultra realism that takes the fun away from something that couldn't possibly happen in real life anyway. That's why in spite of myself I like the F4 movie, it wasn't a great or good movie, hell it might technically be a bad film but it was a hell of alot of fun. I don't have any probably with treating a superhero movie mostly seriously but it can and has gotten out hand when you can't discribe or even have fun watching a freakin Superman movie.

Batman should be treated mostly seriously and with far more realism than say Supes or Spidey but that doesn't mean he can't be a fun character either. I rather liked Batman Begins but one thing that concerns me about the franchise now is the willingness of the fans of the Bat to act as if Nolan created him and his story and that ClayFace or any other fantasy based villain should never make an apperance because Nolan says so. I like almost all of Batman's villains and don't think that they harm the core realism in his universe just by being there. Not saying that ScareFace should show up but I would love to see ClayFace, watching the 90's animated series clearly shows that you could make a grounded character out of even the most outrageous villian.

There is a balance, I don't want Batman & Robin or Hulk (and to some extent) Superman Returns, though it wasn't a bad film it was far to serious for Big Blue, he isn't Batman you know.

Balance= awsome

 

[Ronny Shade]

Okay. I can live with that. So what's your "ideal" vision? I'm betting neither as dreary as Burton's nor as flashy as Schumacher's, but somewhere in-between.

pretty much. Basically Burton did too much of the gothicness and contrived poses. Schumacher went too fantasical and campy and Nolan made it too dirty and grounded. I like to have it semi-believable ala Nolan's Batman, but with a little more style, a little more adventure and a little more iconography. I'd make Gotham look like it was some combo of Nolan's Gotham, Singer's Metropolis and 40's New York. I'd make Batman as close as possible to Conroy's TAS characteriztion. I'd explore themes of Protection versus punishment, "escalation," "freaks" vs normal people. Morality and functionality of the police, and above all obsession and dread.

 

[Dangerous]

Because I know I am. It's such a lame excuse for the directors and producers to use to make a "legitimate" film. It dosen't work in Batman Begins et all because the "reality" is in the charecters. Thats why Spider-Man,1+2, x-men 1+2, and the first 2 supermans work.
Whatever happened to fantasy in movies?

It doesn’t work in Batman Begins, Right.

That's why Batman Begins is universally recognised as the greatest Superhero film EVER.
It craps on all those films you mentioned from a great height except for Superman.

Not that your post made any sense anyway.
You should learn how to spell also.

 

[Ronny Shade]

Batman Begins had all kinds of holes in it.

 

[The PhantaZm]

It doesn’t work in Batman Begins, Right.

That's why Batman Begins is universally recognised as the greatest Superhero film EVER.
It craps on all those films you mentioned from a great height except for Superman.

Not that your post made any sense anyway.
You should learn how to spell also.

If by "universally" you mean Internet geeks then... then your still wrong. Batman Begins was crap and future installments will only get worse as long as Nolan is at the helm.

Only reason BB gets so much praise is because of its film geek appeal (Nolan, Bale, Freeman, etc). The actual movie was weak.

Until Paul Dini makes a live action batman movie the greatest batman movie will always be Mask of the Phantasm.

 

[Chris Wallace]

Croc isn't a lizard hes a human with a birth defect that makes him look like a crocodile. There are actually real people with similar diseases, just not that extreme. But thats one of the great things about batman comics, its hyper realism. Everthing is exxaggerated and when you take that away you take away the spirit of the comic books.

I know what he is. But he's got claws & fangs and EATS PEOPLE. That's way beyond exaggerating. Joker is an exaggeration. Croc is just out there.
See, to me, the best rogues are reflections of the hero. Spider-Man is the product of science gone wrong. As are many of his foes, such as Doc Ock, Lizard, Sandman & Green Goblin. The X-Men are genetic mutants who've faced countless injustices from a paranoid public. As are their main foes.
Batman is an emotionally scarred person taking out his traumas on the world. As are Joker, Riddler, Two-Face, etc. Yes you have your occasional misfit who shakes things up & pushes the hero to a new level & that's great. I just don't think the likes of Killer Croc or Clayface really belong in a Batman movie.

 

[The Kid]

You absolutely could. I think the only universal absolute is "Catwoman".

Fair enough. And the universal absolute for outright sillyness is Superdickery.

 

[Chris Wallace]

If by "universally" you mean Internet geeks then... then your still wrong. Batman Begins was crap and future installments will only get worse as long as Nolan is at the helm.

Only reason BB gets so much praise is because of its film geek appeal (Nolan, Bale, Freeman, etc). The actual movie was weak.

Until Paul Dini makes a live action batman movie the greatest batman movie will always be Mask of the Phantasm.

Stating opinions as fact.

 

[Chris Wallace]

It doesn’t work in Batman Begins, Right.

That's why Batman Begins is universally recognised as the greatest Superhero film EVER.
It craps on all those films you mentioned from a great height except for Superman.

Not that your post made any sense anyway.
You should learn how to spell also.

"Universally"? That's a pretty big leap. I don't think it's the best ever. Am I a part of this universe?

 

[Chris Wallace]

Fair enough. And the universal absolute for outright sillyness is Superdickery.

I thought it was "Batman & Robin".

 

[Hades]

I'm pretty much just sick of reality all together.

I want to fly and live on the moon.

I was lied to

 

[Chris Wallace]

I'm pretty much just sick of reality all together.

I want to fly and live on the moon.

I was lied to

Is that why my chicken dinner is drying out in the oven? Because you were lied to? They lie to everybody. They lie to the fish!

 

[The PhantaZm]

Stating opinions as fact.

I'm too lazy to preface every statement with IMO. Just pretend its there.

 

[Chris Wallace]

I'm too lazy to preface every statement with IMO. Just pretend its there.

Well, ok. While I enjoyed Batman Begins immensely, I think a great deal of its praise stems from the tragic misstep which preceded it.
That said, I loved "Mask Of the Phantasm" & it is arguably better than any of the live-action efforts we've seen thus far.

 

[Herr Logan]

Now this is a thread I can get behind.

I'm absolutely sick of filmmakers dumbing down and sucking the flavor out of classic characters and stories while using the dishonest excuse of "realism," or even "seriousness," as excuses. If you have talent, resources and some God damn balls, you can make a movie that faithfully and entertainingly presents these characters that were so popular and marketable in the comics so as to warrant a feature film in the first place. If there are serious socio-psychological themes to explore, then you can still explore them without removing all color and panache from the characters.

I've got a series of threads that are dedicated to brainstorming, individually or in collaboration, ideas for faithful and quality superhero adaptations (which covers all non-comics media, including moves, TV series, video games, etc.). The rules are posted in the first post of each thread, have been approved by moderators, and will be followed. Anyone who breaks the rules will be reported for trolling. These are threads where people are expressly prohibited from crapping all over your ideas because they aren't "realistic." Again, read the rules carefully, because I'm not messing around with this.

Safe Haven for Those Who Demand More

This is the original thread, and after the rules is the list of links to the specific franchise threads for Batman, X-Men, Spider-Man, Fantastic Four and Superman. This thread itself is for every other superhero property not mentioned. Anyone who wants to talk about a movie that gives us real superheroes without interference from people who can't handle actual superhero costumes, actual supervillain names and actual Joker weapons, etc., stop on by and check it out.

 

[Herr Logan]

pretty much. Basically Burton did too much of the gothicness and contrived poses. Schumacher went too fantasical and campy and Nolan made it too dirty and grounded. I like to have it semi-believable ala Nolan's Batman, but with a little more style, a little more adventure and a little more iconography. I'd make Gotham look like it was some combo of Nolan's Gotham, Singer's Metropolis and 40's New York. I'd make Batman as close as possible to Conroy's TAS characteriztion. I'd explore themes of Protection versus punishment, "escalation," "freaks" vs normal people. Morality and functionality of the police, and above all obsession and dread.

Sounds sweet.

 

[terry78]

Sounds like if they chose to go ahead with that Plastic Man movie, they'd only give his limbs the ability to stretch a few feet, and change that red skintight ensemble. Actually, the latter would probably be a good idea.

 

[Max J Power]

Does anyone else think Burton's Batman (while good) was too campy?

 

[Majik1387]

^Actually no. I thought the first one was more campy only cuz of Nicholson's Joker, but it worked for me.