Lounge of Justice - Part 90

[flickchick85]

We ain't going to talk about this?

This has been online for two whole weeks and I'm just seeing it now? You all have failed me.

 

[chintai80]

Something that just popped into my head and I figured here was the best place to get an answer. Why were people so surprised that the Batman killed in BvS when the teaser trailer clearly shows him doing so?

Also why were people so up in arms about this Batman but ok with Keaton (who has a higher body count), Kilmer (who killed Two-Face, and Bale's Batman (who has just as high a body count as Snyder's Batman)?

i feel a big part of it is because this is the first live action movie where batman and superman are finally in a movie together, so people wanted the most iconic, definitive versions of them.

but we didn't get that. we got this elseworld's take on it instead.
that turned a lot of people off.

 

[Calvin Ellis]

i feel a big part of it is because this is the first live action movie where batman and superman are finally in a movie together, so people wanted the most iconic, definitive versions of them.

but we didn't get that. we got this elseworld's take on it instead.
that turned a lot of people off.

Then my next question is show me where Batman and Superman start off as friends right off the back. I mean even their pre-crisis forma disagreed with each others methods at first. Even Timms World's Finest has Batman throwing Superman across a room and cuckolding him.

 

[chintai80]

Then my next question is show me where Batman and Superman start off as friends right off the back. I mean even their pre-crisis forma disagreed with each others methods at first. Even Timms World's Finest has Batman throwing Superman across a room and cuckolding him.

batman the ultimate cuckhold!

i think it's not so much that superman and batman are at odds, but with how it was written.

that was my problem with the tc at first, their conflict did not fleshed out enough.
the ultimate edition fixed most of that for me though. still feels a bit forced, but how they built up to it made more sense.

but snyder's style just isn't very conventional.
i'm sure if they gave bvs to a more vanilla director, it probably would be less crapped on.

 

[Iceman]

Then my next question is show me where Batman and Superman start off as friends right off the back. I mean even their pre-crisis forma disagreed with each others methods at first. Even Timms World's Finest has Batman throwing Superman across a room and cuckolding him.

Disagreements or initial clashes have happened quite a bit now in superhero films. It's about how far can that disagreement be allowed to go before these ultra-smart superheroes start coming off as either dumb, unheroic or way too reckless. Also the resolution of how they end up agreeing needs to be handled well.

 

[Detective Conan]

He’s back!

 

[Arachnerd]

In talks.

Not getting my hopes up just yet.

 

[MbJ]

God I'm crossing my fingers!

 

[Gee]

We ain't going to talk about this?

Seen her playing when the Hans Zimmer Tour passed by here.

 

[Da-Scribe]

In talks.

Not getting my hopes up just yet.

Trades don’t typically cover this sorta thing unless it’s near finalized from what I’ve seen.

 

[heatvision38]

These riots are scary.

 

[Wheels]

I don't mean to disrespect Greg Berlanti, but "Quality fair"....

l do have appreciation the Arrowverse for all the issues that can be brought up. That stuff filled a void for me while I wasn't happy with things going on elsewhere with DC. Riverdale is pretty fun for what is, it's certainly something that shouldn't work as well as it does, Doom Patrol is well received by people who have seen it, and Sabrina ls flat out great and not enough people talk about it.

I guess l have some fondness for Berlanti,

Something that just popped into my head and I figured here was the best place to get an answer. Why were people so surprised that the Batman killed in BvS when the teaser trailer clearly shows him doing so?

Also why were people so up in arms about this Batman but ok with Keaton (who has a higher body count), Kilmer (who killed Two-Face, and Bale's Batman (who has just as high a body count as Snyder's Batman)?

For me it's intent. Batman straight up wants people to die clearly from my perspective. The branding indicates this.

Keaton intentionally murdered that clown thug.

I'm not saying Batman never killed or took joy in the death of criminals, but he mostly hasn't.

It's not "OMG not the comics!" It's "Oh this guy again. Yay...."

 

[herolee10]

We ain't going to talk about this?

I can't tell if she's playing the violin or if the violin is playing her.

 

[Da-Scribe]

Sabrina is just solid to me. Sabrina the character is by far the worst part though.

 

[Aurakles]

Something that just popped into my head and I figured here was the best place to get an answer. Why were people so surprised that the Batman killed in BvS when the teaser trailer clearly shows him doing so?

Also why were people so up in arms about this Batman but ok with Keaton (who has a higher body count), Kilmer (who killed Two-Face, and Bale's Batman (who has just as high a body count as Snyder's Batman)?

I think there were a number of factors.

The Nolan films pulled an interesting trick of having Batman clearly kill a number of people, yet continuously claim that he would never kill. They make such a big point out of it that it sticks in peoples mind to the degree that the audience is left with a kind of double-think phenomenon.
Bruce is willing to die to uphold his principle of not becoming an executioner, then immediately blows up the League of Shadows headquarters.
I think obvious contradictions like this cause people to unconsciously correct the film: "no one could survive that, but Batman says he doesn't kill, so I guess those people aren't dead"
I love the Nolan films, but when it come to the kill rule, his Batman is a hypocrite and that hypocrisy buys him a little immunity.

Regarding the Burton/Schumaker films, I think they were protected by time. Existing before internet fandom was properly developed, there weren't subjected to the same kind of scrutiny. By the time the internet fully ramped up these films had been wrapped in a cocoon of nostalgia. These films get a free pass from a lot of people because they were kids when they saw them, and the rose tinted glasses make the transgressions seem less offensive or are forgotten entirely.

BVS didn't try the Nolan route of just pretending he isn't killing people, it dispensed with the charade. By having Bruce actively seeking to murder Superman, there was no question that this Batman doesn't have a no kill rule, so there is no double-think effect to excuse any other casualties.

And possibly the biggest factor, a lot of people didn't like the film. If someones overall impression of a movie is positive, they'll be willing to overlook things that they otherwise would not. If it's negative, they'll be more likely to scrutinise and criticise.
There's an all or nothing mentality that sometimes crops up, especially when people are arguing. X is bad, therefore all the component parts of X are bad too. In the heat of debate we will reach for any tool that helps our argument, everything becomes weaponised.

 

[SupermanFan]

I always said that Batman’s “I won’t kill you but I don’t have to save you” line in a Batman Begins would not hold up in court haha.

 

[Calvin Ellis]

I think there were a number of factors.

The Nolan films pulled an interesting trick of having Batman clearly kill a number of people, yet continuously claim that he would never kill. They make such a big point out of it that it sticks in peoples mind to the degree that the audience is left with a kind of double-think phenomenon.
Bruce is willing to die to uphold his principle of not becoming an executioner, then immediately blows up the League of Shadows headquarters.
I think obvious contradictions like this cause people to unconsciously correct the film: "no one could survive that, but Batman says he doesn't kill, so I guess those people aren't dead"
I love the Nolan films, but when it come to the kill rule, his Batman is a hypocrite and that hypocrisy buys him a little immunity.

Regarding the Burton/Schumaker films, I think they were protected by time. Existing before internet fandom was properly developed, there weren't subjected to the same kind of scrutiny. By the time the internet fully ramped up these films had been wrapped in a cocoon of nostalgia. These films get a free pass from a lot of people because they were kids when they saw them, and the rose tinted glasses make the transgressions seem less offensive or are forgotten entirely.

BVS didn't try the Nolan route of just pretending he isn't killing people, it dispensed with the charade. By having Bruce actively seeking to murder Superman, there was no question that this Batman doesn't have a no kill rule, so there is no double-think effect to excuse any other casualties.

And possibly the biggest factor, a lot of people didn't like the film. If someones overall impression of a movie is positive, they'll be willing to overlook things that they otherwise would not. If it's negative, they'll be more likely to scrutinise and criticise.
There's an all or nothing mentality that sometimes crops up, especially when people are arguing. X is bad, therefore all the component parts of X are bad too. In the heat of debate we will reach for any tool that helps our argument, everything becomes weaponised.

Agreed. Nolan's Batman also did kill Harvey Dent right after the speech he gave to the Joker.

 

[Detective Conan]

 

[Kane52630]

 

[chintai80]

 

[Da-Scribe]

Man, I really hope Will comes back as Deadshot.

 

[Spider-Aziz]

Man, I really hope Will comes back as Deadshot.

YES.

 

[Greenlite]

From Jeremy Conrad, legit?

 

[Spider-jedi]

I think there were a number of factors.

The Nolan films pulled an interesting trick of having Batman clearly kill a number of people, yet continuously claim that he would never kill. They make such a big point out of it that it sticks in peoples mind to the degree that the audience is left with a kind of double-think phenomenon.
Bruce is willing to die to uphold his principle of not becoming an executioner, then immediately blows up the League of Shadows headquarters.
I think obvious contradictions like this cause people to unconsciously correct the film: "no one could survive that, but Batman says he doesn't kill, so I guess those people aren't dead"
I love the Nolan films, but when it come to the kill rule, his Batman is a hypocrite and that hypocrisy buys him a little immunity.

Regarding the Burton/Schumaker films, I think they were protected by time. Existing before internet fandom was properly developed, there weren't subjected to the same kind of scrutiny. By the time the internet fully ramped up these films had been wrapped in a cocoon of nostalgia. These films get a free pass from a lot of people because they were kids when they saw them, and the rose tinted glasses make the transgressions seem less offensive or are forgotten entirely.

BVS didn't try the Nolan route of just pretending he isn't killing people, it dispensed with the charade. By having Bruce actively seeking to murder Superman, there was no question that this Batman doesn't have a no kill rule, so there is no double-think effect to excuse any other casualties.

And possibly the biggest factor, a lot of people didn't like the film. If someones overall impression of a movie is positive, they'll be willing to overlook things that they otherwise would not. If it's negative, they'll be more likely to scrutinise and criticise.
There's an all or nothing mentality that sometimes crops up, especially when people are arguing. X is bad, therefore all the component parts of X are bad too. In the heat of debate we will reach for any tool that helps our argument, everything becomes weaponised.

I believe the part in bold is the best answer. If you take any movie even those considered the best of all time, still have plot holes and some bad things about them. but if the view is coming from a place of positivity all those holes will be over looked.

 

[Da-Scribe]

From Jeremy Conrad, legit?

I hope it's legit. I honestly didn't get the hype for Margot in SS, but she really locked me in with BoP. That flick was so stylish and well crafted. It just suffered from poor marketing and an unnecessary R-rating imo. Hope the actual BoP get an HBO Max series.