Fant4stic Michael B Jordan is "Flame On!" The Human Torch - Part 2

[Paladin-Hoss]

Alba was never what you would call a bad actress though.

She may never win an Oscar, but she's good enough actrice.

 

[Ant-manic]

And much like with Hamlet and Claudius. Making Ben, Reed, and Johnny the same age fundamentally changes who they are. No superhero film since Catwoman (not even Green Lantern), has made so significant a change to its main characters.

no it doesn't.

 

[Ant-manic]

*sigh*

Here. Let me help you (and The Guard).

Not every aesthetic departure is considered "sacrilege", especially when there is source material precedence (i.e. Ultimate Nick Fury). But when you change iconic characters' races, backgrounds or powers like Catwoman (Halle Berry) or Human Torch (Jordan) that's when things get ugly.

You want to know what the barometer is for determining if you're f***ing around with something iconic? It's quite simple: The fans' reaction. Their level of passion (or lack thereof) will tell you if a change is "sacrilege" or not.

See, the problem here is that Trank, Jordan, FOX and casual fans here don't respect those fans' reactions. They belittle and underestimate them. And that dismissive attitude makes for dangerously stupid--and costly--business decisions.

Idris Elba as Heimdall got the same reaction. and, in that case, it turned out that fans really barked more than they bit.

 

[Paradox1]

How articulate.

I LOVE Idris Elba. Truly an excellent actor and played Heimdall convincingly. None of that makes him NORDIC though.

He's not Nordic he's an Asgardian there is a difference

 

[Human Torch]

Idris Elba as Heimdall got the same reaction. and, in that case, it turned out that fans really barked more than they bit.

I don't remember widespread cases of people vowing to boycott the film over Heimdall.

At the end of the day,he's a glorified doorman. Not really a big issue,except maybe to the die-hards that wanted him to be Sif's brother.

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

Idris Elba as Heimdall got the same reaction. and, in that case, it turned out that fans really barked more than they bit.

No, he didn't. Nobody but a small handful cared.

Nobody cares about Heimdal. They go to see Thor, not Heimdal.

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

no it doesn't.

Yes, it does. Reed and Ben are like the father and uncle of the family. That's impossible if they are from the same generation as Johnny. It completely changes who they are.

Like I said elsewhere it is like making Batman the same age as Robin or Xavier the same age as Cyclops.

 

[VICTORVONDOOMX]

Yes, it does. Reed and Ben are like the father and uncle of the family. That's impossible if they are from the same generation as Johnny. It completely changes who they are.

Like I said elsewhere it is like making Batman the same age as Robin or Xavier the same age as Cyclops.

Exactly. And *gasp* you actually used logic to back up your opinion. The entire friggin' internet may crash.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

I'd be okay with a 27 year old Johnny - as Long as Reed and Ben were 40.

I'd be okay with Reed and Ben being 27 - as long as Johnny was a teenager.

Johnny being the same age as Reed and Ben is the worst flaw in a highly flawed cast.

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

I'd be okay with a 27 year old Johnny - as Long as Reed and Ben were 40.

I'd be okay with Reed and Ben being 27 - as long as Johnny was a teenager.

Johnny being the same age as Reed and Ben is the worst flaw in a highly flawed cast.

Agreed.

Age isn't as important for Sue (as long as she's older than Johnny and not considerably older than Reed/Ben) as she always acted older than her age anyways.

A lot of defenders of this film claim they are basing it off of the Ultimate Fantastic Four, but Johnny is much younger than the others there too.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

A lot of defenders of this film claim they are basing it off of the Ultimate Fantastic Four, but Johnny is much younger than the others there too.

And even if it did match, I don't consider UFF to be FF just because they use the name.

West Side Story was 'inspired by' Romeo and Juliette. Imagine if somebody remade West Side Story and called it Romeo an Juliette.

That's the same kind of BS as making a UFF film and calling it Fantastic Four IMO.

 

[VICTORVONDOOMX]

And even if it did match, I don't consider UFF to be FF just because they use the name.

West Side Story was 'inspired by' Romeo and Juliette. Imagine if somebody remade West Side Story and called it Romeo an Juliette.

That's the same kind of BS as making a UFF film and calling it Fantastic Four IMO.

Amen

 

[Shikamaru]

Ultimate Fantastic Four was the most critically panned book out of the main four Ultimate titles (Ultimate Spider-Man, Ultimate X-Men, Ultimates, Ultimate Fantastic Four). Just pointing that out.

 

[C. Lee]

There are all kinds of people who post regularly here at the Hype. Anyone who has read my posts for the past 11 and a half years knows that I almost never come out with bad things to say about a movie before it is released. I have always been a wait and see kind of guy. I don't get upset about a bad picture from the production being released....an actor being announced for a movie gets a "cool" or "we'll see when the movie comes out" response from me.....I am not an excitable shrieker about things. The news so far for this production.....boggles my mind....and not in a good way what so ever.

There were a couple of movies that I spoke of as abominations before they came out (as I said...that kind of behavior is extremely rare and unusual for me)....and I believe that the majority of movie goers agreed with me on them. When I heard what they were planning on doing with Eisner's THE SPIRIT...I face palmed myself, because I had been a fan of the character for 40 some years, and the news of what was planned was very upsetting. Then the movie arrived....and proved worse than what any of us had imagined. Then I heard what they planned for the GREEN HORNET....and I again I was greatly apprehensive and expressed distaste at what I heard they were planning....and the movie came out, and I was again heartbroken at what they had done to a character I had loved for 50 years. And while there are some people who like those movies...they were not successful and there is a general feeling of failure associated with them.

This new FF movie gives me the same vibe. I have not posted in this forum for a couple of weeks. I expressed my displeasure when the four actors were announced, and expressed my reasons. I see people are still saying the same things over and over and over.....................

I just wanted to let everyone know.....I still feel the same way. So do not take my non screaming to the skies on an hourly basis as any sort of acceptance of the way this movie is proceeding. I'm just not going to waste any more of my time or effort in here on a personal basis, and will only be in here to moderate when called upon.

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

And even if it did match, I don't consider UFF to be FF just because they use the name.

West Side Story was 'inspired by' Romeo and Juliette. Imagine if somebody remade West Side Story and called it Romeo an Juliette.

That's the same kind of BS as making a UFF film and calling it Fantastic Four IMO.

I agree. I'm just pointing out that even if it was acceptable, their defense still doesn't hold up to basic fact checking.

Basically, they are making two arguments.

A. That Trank is following the approach of Ultimate Fantastic Four.
B. That the Ultimate Fantastic Four approach has merit.

We don't have to waste time arguing about B, because A is clearly wrong rendering Argument B moot.

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

I can vouch that C. Lee is one of the most open-minded people on this forum.

 

[Shikamaru]

I agree. I'm just pointing out that even if it was acceptable, their defense still doesn't hold up to basic fact checking.

Basically, they are making two arguments.

A. That Trank is following the approach of Ultimate Fantastic Four.
B. That the Ultimate Fantastic Four approach has merit.

We don't have to waste time arguing about B, because A is clearly wrong rendering Argument B moot.

But even if A is right though, didn't B bomb critically? Thus I don't understand that argument either way.

 

[Ant-manic]

Yes, it does. Reed and Ben are like the father and uncle of the family. That's impossible if they are from the same generation as Johnny. It completely changes who they are.

no. it really doesn't. you can be "fatherly" with someone your own age; if you're protective by nature. every dynamic that you listed can exist within a group of similarly aged people. it all comes down to personality and maturity-level.

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

But even if A is right though, didn't B bomb critically? Thus I don't understand that argument either way.

If A was right, then we could discuss B which is more subjective. I would agree that following Ultimate FF would be a mistake. But it isn't really relevant to this film because they aren't following Ultimate FF anyways. It would just result in a long debate that has nothing to do with the movie actually being made.

 

[Zarex]

no. it really doesn't. you can be "fatherly" with someone your own age; if you're protective by nature. every dynamic that you listed can exist within a group of similarly aged people. it all comes down to personality and maturity-level.

The sequence in which twenty-something year old Reed puts his arm around his white girlfriend's twenty-something year old black brother and calls him "son" is going to be the most cringe-worthy scene in the history of American cinema.

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

no. it really doesn't. you can be "fatherly" with someone your own age; if you're protective by nature. every dynamic that you listed can exist within a group of similarly aged people. it all comes down to personality and maturity-level.

Sorry. I don't buy it.

 

[Ant-manic]

Sorry. I don't buy it.

i'm shocked. shocked!

 

[Ant-manic]

The sequence in which twenty-something year old Reed puts his arm around his white girlfriend's twenty-something year old black brother and calls him "son" is going to be the most cringe-worthy scene in the history of American cinema.

Reed Richards should never be calling a black person "son."

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

Reed Richards should never be calling a black person "son."

So now you are admitting that their relationship IS different.

 

[Donut]

Fake Johnny - You people are crazy
Little Reed - What do you mean you people
Little Ben - What do you mean you people