No more R-rated superhero/tentpole films for WB

[Super Fly]

Perhaps if Watchmen was actually good it would of made money? I don't really understand the mentality at WB, they made a cheesy niche film running 2 hours and 40 minutes and expected it to do well? When last year they released a fast-paced, entertaining hour and a half movie that made tons of money. It does not take a rocket scientist to figure out why.

For the most part though most superhero properties should be pg-13 because its for kids. Now let me explain, kids aren't stupid so that doesn't mean they should be dumbed down like Fantastic Four, etc as I'm sure many kids enjoyed Dark Knight, but in the end ultimately it is for kids so this isn't a particularly big deal.

There are of course a few properties that should be R like Terminator, Bad Boys, if they ever make Preacher, etc but I doubt those will be effected because they only get made every couple of years to begin with.

 

[CFE]

Wait...just because they involved 'super heroes,' you think "The Dark Knight" and "Watchmen" were (or should've been) for kids?

 

[Mrs. Sawyer]

Perhaps if Watchmen was actually good it would of made money? I don't really understand the mentality at WB, they made a cheesy niche film running 2 hours and 40 minutes and expected it to do well? When last year they released a fast-paced, entertaining hour and a half movie that made tons of money. It does not take a rocket scientist to figure out why.

For the most part though most superhero properties should be pg-13 because its for kids. Now let me explain, kids aren't stupid so that doesn't mean they should be dumbed down like Fantastic Four, etc as I'm sure many kids enjoyed Dark Knight, but in the end ultimately it is for kids so this isn't a particularly big deal.

There are of course a few properties that should be R like Terminator, Bad Boys, if they ever make Preacher, etc but I doubt those will be effected because they only get made every couple of years to begin with.

I believe the Dark Knight last year proved that superhero films don't always have to be for kids.

There's a reason for the Watchmen drop off. The length of the film; the lack of some people understanding the film without reading the book; and the lack of notable superheroes since its the characters' only film. It is the greatest graphic novel of all time, but didn't mean that it was more famous and well known (outside or inside of the comic book world) than Batman, Spiderman, Superman, Captain America, Flash, X-men, Hulk, or even the Fantastic Four.

Watchmen was a film that just wasn't for everyone and did create a legitimate division between people who loved and hated the film.

Meanwhile, Terminator is a very famous film series that has been successful, even though Terminator 3 was disappointing. People will see it, regardless of rating.

However I do agree that mainstream heroes like the Aforementioned superheroes should be rated R because I don't see the case for it.

 

[Super Fly]

Wait...just because they involved 'super heroes,' you think "The Dark Knight" and "Watchmen" were (or should've been) for kids?

No offense, but did you read my post? Watchmen isn't for kids, but Dark Knight most certainly is. Let me reiterate this, just because its for kids does not mean it has to light or dumb, kids aren't stupid. One could argue Batman (1989) was darker than the Dark Knight, he killed people in that film, both films are still most definitely for kids.

I believe the Dark Knight last year proved that superhero films don't always have to be for kids.

Explain to me how Dark Knight isn't for kids?

Go to a toy store and go see how many dark knight action figures there are. There is no way in hell WB will ever make a batman film that isn't for kids, do you know why? Most of their profits come from action figures.

There's a reason for the Watchmen drop off. The length of the film; the lack of some people understanding the film without reading the book; and the lack of notable superheroes since its the characters' only film. It is the greatest graphic novel of all time, but didn't mean that it was more famous and well known (outside or inside of the comic book world) than Batman, Spiderman, Superman, Captain America, Flash, X-men, Hulk, or even the Fantastic Four.

The reason is it wasn't a very good film, pure and simple. People can make all the excuses they want but Watchmen was not a good film, half the people who saw it will tell you they thought it was AWFUL.

Watchmen was a film that just wasn't for everyone and did create a legitimate division between people who loved and hated the film.

Meanwhile, Terminator is a very famous film series that has been successful, even though Terminator 3 was disappointing. People will see it, regardless of rating.

However I do agree that mainstream heroes like the Aforementioned superheroes should be rated R because I don't see the case for it.

I think you have a very skewed look at the way the industry works and how people respond to it. People are going see Terminator 4 because it looks good, just like people went and saw Watchmen because it looked good(but when it turned out not to be very good, there was ridiculous drops). Incredible Hulk is a well known character and didn't make that much money, why? Because the film wasn't that good. Most likely the reason why most films don't do well is either because of poor advertisements(i.e. misrepresented) or because it not very good.

 

[Movies205]

I am inclined to agree with Super Fly that we really do not need rated R superhero films The only sad part about the whole watchmen debacle is that we may not be able to get another sprawling epic type movie for a while, but I would blame this more on Sndyer and his team for delivering a mediocre movie than on WB.

 

[CFE]

No offense, but did you read my post? Watchmen isn't for kids, but Dark Knight most certainly is.

Well you claimed that the involvement of super heroes immediately means we're dealing with kid's material...yet the "Watchmen" property has NEVER been for kids.

And you're contradicting yourself with "The Dark Knight."

You say "TDK" is for kids because they aren't stupid...

If a kid get's into "TDK" it's more likely because of the action and spectacle, which are things you DON'T have to be smart about to enjoy...on the other hand it takes a bit more to see the psychological underpinnings and significance of what's going on...and when you do that, you realize that the true material underneath isn't for kids.

 

[Super Fly]

Well you claimed that the involvement of super heroes immediately means we're dealing with kid's material...yet the "Watchmen" property has NEVER been for kids.

And you're contradicting yourself with "The Dark Knight."

You say "TDK" is for kids because they aren't stupid...

If a kid get's into "TDK" it's more likely because of the action and spectacle, which are things you DON'T have to be smart about to enjoy...on the other hand it takes a bit more to see the psychological underpinnings and significance of what's going on...and when you do that, you realize that the true material underneath isn't for kids.

Dark Knight isn't that hard to understand, its not like Watchmen which is dealing with the medium as a whole. Sure, kids aren't going understand all the philosophical ******** that nolan and co throw in, but again that's just script-frosting anyway so the fans can go ga-ga and feel smart and really isn't that important. The core story is pretty straightforward and easy to understand. I think you really underestimate a kid's intelligence, I'm talking 10-13 year olds, I'm almost positive they can understanbd most of the Dark Knight.

Again if you really think Dark Knight is that intelligent, you should see more film. I'm not trying to be a dick, but I'm just saying there's no reason most super-hero films should be rated R, I mean of course there's a few that warrant it, but for the most part, its stuff for kids to enjoy, and when we watch it as adults, its the kid side of us all that enjoys it.

Watchmen is great because it ACTUALLY is deep, the comic explores the realities of superheros as well as the ironies of Silver Age comics that's why the movie is mediocre because Moore is right you can't translate that.

 

[The Shadow]

I don't know, I think they could pull Jonah Hex off as pg-13, I mean pg-13 not quite as strict as it used to be. I think nowaday pg-13 is early 90s and before's R.

 

[Super Fly]

I don't know, I think they could pull Jonah Hex off as pg-13, I mean pg-13 not quite as strict as it used to be. I think nowaday pg-13 is early 90s and before's R.

Most Vertigo titles should be R or more approriately shouldn't be hamstrung by trying to shoot for a rating since most of the time, there not superheros. Constantine which was a butchery of the comic is not a super-hero, he does fantastic things on occasion(more approriately he witnesses or manipulates fantastic things), but he operates in a far darker and bleaker world than Dark Knight. Because at the end of the day, the Dark Knight still has very solid and rigid rules of what is good and what is bad and all is righted in the end, the joker is tied up, the city of gotham is saved, etc that is why it is ulitimately is for kids because it teaches them "Good always triumphs and that you should always do the right thing"

Vertigo titles don't do that and in fact most of the time are completely ****ed up.

 

[The Major]

I am inclined to agree with Super Fly that we really do not need rated R superhero films

Why not? The genre isn't only PG or G rated material. I can understand WB using it as a last resort if they can't make them reach PG but they shouldn't take the option completely off the table permanently.

The only sad part about the whole watchmen debacle is that we may not be able to get another sprawling epic type movie for a while, but I would blame this more on Sndyer and his team for delivering a mediocre movie than on WB.

True.

 

[D-Man22]

I for one am glad that WB have decided to not do any more R rated comic book movies. Most of their recent R rated movies aren't really that interesting.

 

[bunk]

There will always be room for R rated comic book movies. They just aren't likely to have huge budgets. I would expect more Blade type movies if DC has any properties that fit the bill.

 

[xisaacx]

Like keeping your kid out of PG 13 movies is going to stop them from being corrupted. They have the internet, the news, and shows like For the love of Ray J to do that.. gimme a break

 

[ross2287]

I'm seriously sick and tired of TDK being compared to Watchmen.
They're completely different and expectations should be too.

 

[Lobo]

I can see Suicide Squad being done with a hard pg13 rating. The MPAA really has no problem with violence, it's sex that makes them go OMG Oh Noes!

 

[thejon93]

I wouldn't be surprised, but I wouldn't say that'd be the end of it. They'll probably come back in a few years time. But, I will go on record saying that 'Punisher: War Zone' will in fact be the last 'Punisher' film we'll see(we may see more after 'Lionsgate' loses the rights, but), I'm expecting that we'll be seeing 'The Punisher' on television from now on. Until they find more viewers tuning in, then they'll make another.

 

[thejon93]

I can see Suicide Squad being done with a hard pg13 rating. The MPAA really has no problem with violence, it's sex that makes them go OMG Oh Noes!

Which is unfortunate. I love how gracious they were with 'Titanic' on that one, by the way, proving that they obviously know what's best for us. What would you rather your children see: violence(possibly let them grow up into being cold-blooded killers) or sex(something that the parents can explain to their kids at a much earlier age, and having them understand).

 

[Heretic]

Watchmen should not have been anything but R rated. I keep hearing people say "I was expecting it to be like Spider-Man". Do these same people go into Hogans Heroes expecting Schindlers list? They are both about WW2 prison camps!!! Do they go into James Bond expecting a romance? He's wearing a tuxedo...the movie should be about romance and dancing, maybe some champagne!!

No...superheroes are the ONLY genre that is held to this stupid standard...because there is no respect for the medium it comes from.

And YES Sandman could be a tentpole. You put the right actor in the role and watch the money flow. What actors are the first to come to mind regarding Sandman? Johnny Depp? He's had a few hits... What directors come to mind? Burton? Del Toro? They've done pretty well. Of course, if you put the wrong actors and the wrong director in it would bomb...but you can say that about most tentpole films.

 

[Heretic]

Double post...must have been doubly right.

 

[dude stannis]

Well you claimed that the involvement of super heroes immediately means we're dealing with kid's material...yet the "Watchmen" property has NEVER been for kids.

And you're contradicting yourself with "The Dark Knight."

You say "TDK" is for kids because they aren't stupid...

If a kid get's into "TDK" it's more likely because of the action and spectacle, which are things you DON'T have to be smart about to enjoy...on the other hand it takes a bit more to see the psychological underpinnings and significance of what's going on...and when you do that, you realize that the true material underneath isn't for kids.

Bollocks to that, every comic book movie has adult oriented underpinnings, do you think kids will understand the religious undertones of Superman? The gay/racial minority activism of X-Men? The commetary on the arms race in Iron Man?

TDK isn't that unique. It's got a hero chasing a villain until he catches him, kids love that crap and so do we. All the undertones are just icing on the cake that comes with every cake.

 

[AnorexicBatman]

I don't think the ratings conflict should heard the adaptations because unless it's graphic novel with specific amounts of violence and sex, the same amount need not be on film
A film can be PG-13 without a single drop of blood and still be good as long as characters are true to the core and the story is engaging....

Let kids have their fun and the adults would also get something more out of it.
The problem I see is that many people want things that were once for children turned into adult only stuff

Something like WATCHMEN had to be R. Superman/Batman does not.
There is a lot of stigma attached to the R/NC-17 ratings and average (dumb) people just don't feel like taking entire families for those films. It's better you take then to a PG-13 film which is like DARK KNIGHT that leaves your kids crying....

 

[The Major]

I can see Suicide Squad being done with a hard pg13 rating. The MPAA really has no problem with violence, it's sex that makes them go OMG Oh Noes!

True. But they should make it as close to R as possible IMO. They shouldn't take the edge off like Daredevil and Ghost Rider.

 

[Lobo]

No, they shouldn't. I think a talented director showing the brutality in creative ways can work, Joker did a lot of violent things in TDK which was pg13.

P.S I ordered Suicide Squad: From the Ashes.

 

[The Major]

No, they shouldn't. I think a talented director showing the brutality in creative ways can work, Joker did a lot of violent things in TDK which was pg13.

Exactly. That would be fine.

P.S I ordered Suicide Squad: From the Ashes.

 

[Lobo]

Can you recommend any other SS trades, Major? I'm semi new to them, but have been reading everything I can about the team online, and love what I've read and seen.