No Shared Universe for DC Films

[TheVileOne]

His attitude is about making good films.

So is Marvel Studios' .

 

[ЯɘvlveR]

i hated the zod choice, but the more i think about it, the more it seems like a good choice. i think most of supes villains are better off jl villains, whether luthor, braniac, doomsday or darkseid, his villains are too powerful to go to waste in a solo film. the one thing that bothers me is that the suit michael shannon has been seen in looks something like black adam's attire, and I'd like to see him on screen.

 

[Thundercrack85]

At least it's not Lex Luthor again.

 

[Nemesis Prime]

JL movie can only succeed with a man in charge of the vision and the implimentation of such vision. A bunch of Supe/Bat movies won't do the trick. WB/DC will have to decide which members they want on the team, then go about introducing them to the GA. If they want to go directly to a JL movie, they still have to hammer out the cast and a script that can flesh out each individual member's backstory while maintaining a brisk pace so the audience won't get bored. It's a lot easier said than done actually. Just because Joss was able to get it right with TA doesn't mean whoever's in charge of JL movie will be able to pull it off. That's why WB/DC will have to pick the right guy to do it, or it may be a more collossal mistake than even GL.

 

[Thundercrack85]

Can we please stop using the acronym "GA"? We have enough damn acronyms as it is.

Considering DC can't even make the solo movies work, I'm skeptical that they could make a Justice League movie. On the other hand, at this rate, it will take years before they can even attempt to make a bunch of solo films that could lead up to a Justice League movie.

So, I'm starting to come around to the idea of just doing a standalone Justice League movie.

 

[jmc]

Why not just have the seperate universes be the reasoning for the movies coming together in a JLA?


Use the Flash franchise to introduce the crossing worlds aspect then just set up a quasi Crisis storyline. They could even show glimpses of a 60s Batman universe, Reeves' Superman universe, Carter's Wonder Woman, Smallville, and then have them seperate back into seperate ones at the end.

Or collapse them and have the shared universe exist as a result of a JLA movie.

Nolan's universe remains intact for continuity as a Pre-Crisis trilogy.

I believe that works the best, it frees the characters to roam in their own movies unabated yet gives us a JL film with the same actors. Downside? Only one JL film.

 

[The Guard]

Its a little preemptive to determine that WB can't make superhero movies work. I'll agree that WB is having issues making solo films work when I see a recent superhero movie other than GREEN LANTERN fall short. Let's see how MAN OF STEEL does, shall we?

 

[DaveMoral]

I believe that works the best, it frees the characters to roam in their own movies unabated yet gives us a JL film with the same actors. Downside? Only one JL film.

Not if the Crisis ends up with a merged continuity. So the individual films can stand on their own, self-contained, it makes room for films after JL: Crisis that share the universe. So you can have all these characters co-exist, with solo films in a shared universe or in separate universes, but then you have a JL with a shared universe.

 

[spider-neil]

I don't despite Nolan, but IMHO his attitudes about this are becoming slightly annoying.

But that's why DCE is always behind the curve.

Like Loki, they "lack conviction." They lack true visionaries like the Marvel team who made everything come together.

what is annoying about nolan is he is dictating the path of DC and he is buggering off after TDKR. once TDKR is out all bets should be off and anything nolan says ignored. if nolan wants to suggest policy he should be around to enforce it, otherwise be quiet

 

[jmc]

Not if the Crisis ends up with a merged continuity. So the individual films can stand on their own, self-contained, it makes room for films after JL: Crisis that share the universe. So you can have all these characters co-exist, with solo films in a shared universe or in separate universes, but then you have a JL with a shared universe.

The whole point of that type of movie would be to restore things back to the way they were.

 

[thegameq]

Throwing a bunch of characters together on the big screen and expecting the GA to automatically "know" these characters and their "reasons" is asking for trouble.

Granted I do understand the logic behind it--thinking that Bats and Supes could carry the movie by themselves, and that the other characters are recognizable enough and need very little to no exposition.....together with sound writing....

But I'm telling you, it sounds like a potential disaster. Comicbooks and films are two totally different creatures. Expecting the GA to "get it" because we do is courting disaster IMO.

Marvel has discovered what they can get away with and what they can't. It's a fine line that must be respected or else.

 

[Thundercrack85]

Why not just build a Justice League universe from the ground up?

 

[jmc]

Throwing a bunch of characters together on the big screen and expecting the GA to automatically "know" these characters and their "reasons" is asking for trouble.

Granted I do understand the logic behind it--thinking that Bats and Supes could carry the movie by themselves, and that the other characters are recognizable enough and need very little to no exposition.....together with sound writing....

But I'm telling you, it sounds like a potential disaster. Comicbooks and films are two totally different creatures. Expecting the GA to "get it" because we do is courting disaster IMO.

Marvel has discovered what they can get away with and what they can't. It's a fine line that must be respected or else.

What you're forgetting though is that not everyone who saw Avengers saw every Marvel film. Avengers very much stands on it's own without the need to have watched the previous movies, if you're going to do a JL film you can easily do the same.

 

[metaphysician]

Why not just have the seperate universes be the reasoning for the movies coming together in a JLA?


Use the Flash franchise to introduce the crossing worlds aspect then just set up a quasi Crisis storyline. They could even show glimpses of a 60s Batman universe, Reeves' Superman universe, Carter's Wonder Woman, Smallville, and then have them seperate back into seperate ones at the end.

Or collapse them and have the shared universe exist as a result of a JLA movie.

Nolan's universe remains intact for continuity as a Pre-Crisis trilogy.

I really don't see it working. Not in a movie context. The problem would be, when you use such a giant conceit to bring everyone together, it makes the movie about that conceit ( the divergent universes ). Perfectly fine if your telling a sci-fi where the plot is focused on that, extremely distracting if your trying to use it as an excuse to bring together a super team.

 

[thegameq]

What you're forgetting though is that not everyone who saw Avengers saw every Marvel film. Avengers very much stands on it's own without the need to have watched the previous movies, if you're going to do a JL film you can easily do the same.

Could be done, but the experience is made richer knowing the "hows and whys" of the characters. It's all but a guarantee that the bulk of the audience has seen at least one or more of the solo movies. For them--like us life long fans-- it's like being on the inside or being "in" on the story.

Also, the characters deserve it. Wonder Woman's origin and character deserves to come before JL as it sets up her dynamic within the group and deepens the audiences understanding of the character.

Same with the Flash and others. It just makes sense.

Again, it could be done. But for me, it would do the characters and audience a disservice.

A note about Hawkeye and Black Widow: it was well enough established in IM2 and Thor that these two characters were high level shield employees much like Coulson. In fact it was obvious they were S.H.I.E.L.D. specialists of some sorts.

 

[AvengeME]

How about doing or continuing solo movies with Barry Allen and Hal Jordan, and then use other characters like Wally West and John Stewart in the Justice League movie. That way the solo movies do not have to directly connect to a JL movie. Just retain the actress for Wonder Woman. That wouldn't conflict with the solo movies except for Batman and Superman franchises. If they use Cavill for a JL movie then everything may as well connect.

 

[Thundercrack85]

That would just confuse people.

 

[MadVillainy]

Why not just have the seperate universes be the reasoning for the movies coming together in a JLA?


Use the Flash franchise to introduce the crossing worlds aspect then just set up a quasi Crisis storyline. They could even show glimpses of a 60s Batman universe, Reeves' Superman universe, Carter's Wonder Woman, Smallville, and then have them seperate back into seperate ones at the end.

Or collapse them and have the shared universe exist as a result of a JLA movie.

Nolan's universe remains intact for continuity as a Pre-Crisis trilogy.

Big no to that idea. Just unneccessary and I think will just be too much for a film. If they do do alternate universes in a JL film just do the Crime Syndicate

It's really quite simple. You can go about it several ways. But the easiest is to have them face a major threat. The various heroes trying to stop it, and while doing so, they run into each other, and eventually they realize they have to work together.

This. That's what a JL film, at the basic level, needs. A main threat that takes more than just one hero to defeat

I don't despite Nolan, but IMHO his attitudes about this are becoming slightly annoying.

But that's why DCE is always behind the curve.

Like Loki, they "lack conviction." They lack true visionaries like the Marvel team who made everything come together.

Im not sure if it's a lack of conviction. I just think their (WB and DCE's) minds are elsewhere.

 

[TheComicbookKid]

The whole point of that type of movie would be to restore things back to the way they were.

Doesn't mean they can't succeed. They manage to salvage enough of each universe to collapse into the singular one. It' s just not a perfect victory.

I really don't see it working. Not in a movie context. The problem would be, when you use such a giant conceit to bring everyone together, it makes the movie about that conceit ( the divergent universes ). Perfectly fine if your telling a sci-fi where the plot is focused on that, extremely distracting if your trying to use it as an excuse to bring together a super team.

How is it distracting? As long as the individual franchises are set up, then bringing the super team together would be simple.



The clash of individuals trying to save their own worlds versus some kind of cosmic threat engulfing them all is totally cool. I don't think it's any worse than Terminator being a time travel movie that's about that conceit but still has character.

Big no to that idea. Just unneccessary and I think will just be too much for a film. If they do do alternate universes in a JL film just do the Crime Syndicate

Evil dopplegangers are way too "Star Treky" ala tv territory.

I don't mean do the actual Crisis story.

Like I said in the Flash thread. Fringe is the template I'm using. The way they have the Alternate and Main universe wrestling against each other being manipulated by another person(Zoom maybe?)

 

[metaphysician]

Fringe has just two universes, one of them initially serving as the "villains," and has an entire multi season TV series to work with it. What's more, its specifically focused on exactly that conflict.

For a 2 hour JLA movie, it would instead act as a huge time sink using up screen time with a thematically irrelevant distraction, versus the actual teaming up of super heroes.

 

[MadVillainy]

i dont think they should do it for the first JL film, but if they're lucky enough to have sequels I think it could work

 

[Micromind]

I was not going to post anything in this thread as it is meaningless to studios plans.

But,

Why not just have the seperate universes be the reasoning for the movies coming together in a JLA?


Use the Flash franchise to introduce the crossing worlds aspect then just set up a quasi Crisis storyline. They could even show glimpses of a 60s Batman universe, Reeves' Superman universe, Carter's Wonder Woman, Smallville, and then have them seperate back into seperate ones at the end.

Or collapse them and have the shared universe exist as a result of a JLA movie.

Nolan's universe remains intact for continuity as a Pre-Crisis trilogy.

This is definitely Not a good idea. Why ?

* It would feel forced and not natural as Avengers feels, the movie Critics and Comic book fans are already critical enough of DC movies so far, this just provides them more fuel, A flood of negative reviews and bad word of mouth scares away general audience, apart form making the story line unnecessarily complicated. Just imagine critics reviews such as - " WB tires to create Avengers magic but ends up generating Crisis in the form of Justice League".

* This idea ensures that we get a team of superheroes for this movie, what about the sequels ? If the movie is successful it needs to continue as a franchise, not just a one off event. Long term planning is needed.

 

[MadVillainy]

the idea of introducing the multiple universes kind of like in Turtles Forever just seems so pointless to me.

 

[CConn]

Could be done, but the experience is made richer knowing the "hows and whys" of the characters. It's all but a guarantee that the bulk of the audience has seen at least one or more of the solo movies. For them--like us life long fans-- it's like being on the inside or being "in" on the story.

Also, the characters deserve it. Wonder Woman's origin and character deserves to come before JL as it sets up her dynamic within the group and deepens the audiences understanding of the character.

Same with the Flash and others. It just makes sense.

Again, it could be done. But for me, it would do the characters and audience a disservice.

A note about Hawkeye and Black Widow: it was well enough established in IM2 and Thor that these two characters were high level shield employees much like Coulson. In fact it was obvious they were S.H.I.E.L.D. specialists of some sorts.

Youre ignoring the fact that a lot of times having characters with histories and pasts that are left in the shadows actually enhances the film and the characters themselves.

Would Blade Runner be made any better if Decker's younger years were detailed? Would A New Hope have been better if the Prequels came first? Would A Fistfull of Dollars be better if we knew more about the man with no name? Or what about Taken? Or Man on Fire? Or The Girl with the Drason Tattoo. All of those movies feature amazing characters who have pasts and personal histories that are not delved into much at all at first.

That's how you approach a Justice League film; you utilize a few scenes that show each character in their element, establishing who they are, what they do, and what they stand for, but leave an air of mystery about what drives them, what's happened to them to make turn them into these extraordinary people.

Then - much like Star Wars - you can always go back and tell their origins later on. It's not a big deal, it's not a disservice to anyone. If anything, I think it'd give characters like Flash and Wonder Woman a bit more dimension.

 

[Micromind]

I feel that WB should try the following approach -

* Keep Nolan produced Batman Reboot / Restart as a separate entity.

* Make Man of Steel as a part of larger DC Universe (but just drop a small hint in the MOS movie, nothing too obvious.)

* Make a Justice League movie featuring Cavill as Superman, new Batman (who will just appear in JL franchise movies.), Wonder Woman and Flash (who can get their solo prequel movies later.) and Green Lantern (either Ryan Reynolds as Hal Jordan or a new actor as Hal / John Stewart.)

* Justice League should include just Five heroes in the first movie, more than that would become difficult to handle.