Iron Man 3 Official Iron Man 3 rate/review thread. - Part 1

[kedrell]

it is not bad,if you compare to iron man 2

Actually I rate IM2 slightly above this movie. Not sure if that'll stand, gotta see IM3 more times.

 

[-JKR-]

[blackout]
Where are the rings? They're his thing. Why is the Mandarin some white guy? It took me long enough to begin to accept Kingsley in the role. He's not called Mandarin for nothing. His ethnicity happens to be and actual important part of his character. Basically I liked Mandarin as he was and Shane Black obviously didn't. It's the Raimi/Venom thing all over again, just with more competent film making. But that doesn't lessen the sting.
[/blackout]

[blackout]Kingsley had magic rings? Kingsley is asian? REALLY? People are really incoherent re. this whole situation.[/blackout]

 

[kedrell]

If Ang Lee's Hulk was the worst movie you ever saw, then you've got lots of homework to do.

Well it was the first time I went to a movie based on something I was a fan of where the movie basically took a dump on what I had loved. I left the theater wanting to punch someone. Never had that reaction to a film before or since.

And the fact that you're going to reevaluate the movie based on what future, non-existing movies will do, is just plain ridiculous, and says much about people are judging these movies: Not on their own merits!
And please, for humanity's sake, just bring the hammer down on the pic. xD

On it's own merits, if it stands as is, this movie is bull****. It's like Shane Black just flippin' me the bird and I'm supposed to enjoy it. But the great thing about the MCU is that there's room for hope.

 

[kedrell]

[blackout]Kingsley had magic rings? Kingsley is asian? REALLY? People are really incoherent re. this whole situation.[/blackout]

[BLACKOUT]Kingsley is not Chinese, nor able to remotely pass as such. His rings were for nothing. Just props. [/BLACKOUT] Ugh, you obviously just don't get it and I'm tired of arguing with someone who doesn't care about the property.

 

[-JKR-]

[BLACKOUT]Kingsley is not Chinese, nor able to remotely pass as such. His rings were for nothing. Just props. [/BLACKOUT]

That's exactly what I'm saying, dude.
And I DO care about the property; I just thought the adaptation was clever, and worked fine in context.

And if the movie on its own merits is ********, then just leave it at that, as the movie won't change. THIS. IS. NOT. A. FREAKING. SOAP. OPERA. WE'RE. TALKING. ABOUT. CINEMA. Has the Marvel Universe really caused such thinking? Dammit, it's worse than I thought.

 

[kedrell]

That's exactly what I'm saying, dude.
And I DO care about the property; I just thought the adaptation was clever, and worked fine in context.

I said in and of itself the twist worked and I'd be fine with it if I didn't give a **** about faithfulness to source material. But I do and at one point, so did they.

 

[-JKR-]

Dude, you're being incoherent. Either it worked, or it didn't. Either you liked or you didn't like the movie.
I miss the old days when you could discuss these movies as what they are, movies, and not in how they work as jack-off material for fanboys.

 

[kedrell]

There's nothing incoherent about what I am saying. As an action movie it's good but not great. As an Iron Man movie adaption it's crap if nothing changes. But if things do change then I can easily chalk this one up to a random adventure Iron Man had and I have no problem with that.

 

[-JKR-]

Incoherent AND silly. We're talking about ONE movie here. "Iron Man 3". And you're already daydreaming about what may (or probably may not) come, and how it would change you opinion? Meh... I guess I just don't understand this kind of thinking. I guess I'm more of a "great movie, good movie, so-so movie, meh movie, bad movie" guy.

 

[Marvel]

Well, it's good to see Richard Roeper get it and say that RDJ deserves award consideration for Iron Man 3. He also calls it one of the best ever. It seems if you leave an overattachment to the Mandarin at home and judge this as a film most will be happy with it.

http://www.suntimes.com/19815697-761/a-marvel-of-a-sequel-iron-man-3.html

"A Marvel of a sequel - we get Robert Downey Jr. delivering a performance that should earn awards consideration... Downey is great in this film. Not great with the caveat he’s acting in a giant summer action movie destined to gross a billion dollars, but just plain great. Every second he’s onscreen, whether he’s wearing one of his magical metal suits or walking armed with only his wit into a tavern, he commands the moment."

"Filled with breathtakingly brilliant special effects, bolstered by excellent supporting performances from a half-dozen other top-tier actors, crackling with sharp humor and working as a story that stands alone while often acknowledging the larger Marvel(ous) universe, 'Iron Man 3' is one of the best entries in this modern golden age of superhero movies."

 

[ThePowerCosmic]

lmao, I died at "fanboy Jack off material".

 

[spider-neil]

Would have loved to hear Ebert's opinion of IM3

 

[weezerspider]

I very much enjoyed the film. Its not as great as some people make it out to be, but its a very well made blockbuster film.

A few things:

Spoiler

1.The action was pretty damn good.
2. It was funny when it needed to be and serious when it needed be, similar to The Avengers.
3. There could have been a little more screen time with Tony in the suit/using the suit.
4. It was a tad slow in the middle.
5. Pepper's extremis cure and Tony's magical surgery at the end was terribly written and is very "oh yeah... we fixed this! Don't ask how!"
6. The Mandarin was great. Killian was The Mandarin, and a solid interpretatio of him, though in a very unique way. Killian wrote the scripts for Kingsley's character, so all of that was still the REAL Mandarin's thoughts. Other than the rings, Killian pretty much represented everything the modern comic Mandarin represents.
7. Kingsely's performance was WAY WAY better AFTER the reveal.
8. The whole cast was great.
9. The banter between Rhodey and Tony was great.
10. Rhodey needed some more action.

Overall, it was very good. I was at a private screening that was supposed to be at 12 and ended up starting at 2 AM and our 3D didn't work so the film was blurry(yes it was 100% free and an early screening in the States, so I can't really complain).I feel this hurt my experience, so I won't give an official rating before I see it again, but its in the 8-9/10 range.

 

[Norek]

The thing is, they don't need to make The Mandarin a caricature of something, or a wizard with magical rings to make him a compelling villain.

Spoiler

I liked the idea of having Tony Stark with a PTSD and being "stripped" from the armor, but that's exactly why I felt a character like the Mandarin as he was presented to be (Ben Kingsley pre-twist) could've worked - he looked and sounded intriguing, there was a hint at a complicated story behind the character, and an interesting ideology that makes him more than a terrorist (just like the Joker's ideology makes him more than a gangster, for example), and even as a man with no powers he could've been a great villain.

They could've brought a great contrast to the first film with Obadiah's line "Technology. That's always been your Achilles heel in this part of the world". They could've played with that by making Iron Man's greatest and deadliest foe yet be someone who doesn't rely on wearing a rip-off suit of his, or being an enhanced super-soldier with fire-breathing abilities, but instead someone who's seen as a technologically inferior in comparison to Iron Man, but being methodical, calculative and extremely intelligent, takes on Iron Man, who clearly has the upper hand, and not only defeats him and strips everything off him in a way, but now is the one that has the advantage of being a terrorist with power and resources, over a guy who has nothing left except his own intelligence. Having Tony Stark defeat the Mandarin without the advantage of his suit could've made the stakes much higher, and the resolution of the conflict and the victory much more satisfying. You still integrate Stark's malfunctioning suits, him battling EXTREMIS soldiers and Killian in his armor, but have his personal conflict against the Mandarin as Tony Stark in his flesh. Have all the thematic elements present and all the points made, without wasting a villain for the sake of a joke.

I don't see why something like that couldn't have worked.

 

[Tony Stark]

Would have loved to hear Ebert's opinion of IM3

I would as well. He gave a good review to IM2, so I would think that he would have liked it. Seems like most of the critics who have reviewed all 3 of the movies and Avengers have been very positive. A lot of the negative reviews are from people who didn't review all of the previous films, not sure why that is.

 

[thestartrekker]

I was looking forward to Ben Kingsley as Mandarin.

Spoiler

, and when the showdown came it was just deflating. Other parts of the movie, I got the humour and found funny, but that was just a let down for me. I don't have any real sentimental attachment to the Marvel universe, but meh, suppose they still got the price of my ticket off me.
Thing is he is portrayed as killing the oil tycoon hostage when the President is on the phone, albeit off-screen, so you could say he didn't but it is clearly implied, and what happened to the tycoon if he wasn't killed, I don't know. Even the actor imprisoned on a set should know there's more going on than a bit of mere role play, so I'm I missing some subtle clue that he really is the Mandarin, posing as an actor posing as the Mandarin?
I know, Aldrich Killian is the Mandarin, but, meh,

I didn't hang around for the usual after credits came thing...

 

[-JKR-]

The thing is, they don't need to make The Mandarin a caricature of something, or a wizard with magical rings to make him a compelling villain.

Spoiler

I liked the idea of having Tony Stark with a PTSD and being "stripped" from the armor, but that's exactly why I felt a character like the Mandarin as he was presented to be (Ben Kingsley pre-twist) could've worked - he looked and sounded intriguing, there was a hint at a complicated story behind the character, and an interesting ideology that makes him more than a terrorist (just like the Joker's ideology makes him more than a gangster, for example), and even as a man with no powers he could've been a great villain.

They could've brought a great contrast to the first film with Obadiah's line "Technology. That's always been your Achilles heel in this part of the world". They could've played with that by making Iron Man's greatest and deadliest foe yet be someone who doesn't rely on wearing a rip-off suit of his, or being an enhanced super-soldier with fire-breathing abilities, but instead someone who's seen as a technologically inferior in comparison to Iron Man, but being methodical, calculative and extremely intelligent, takes on Iron Man, who clearly has the upper hand, and not only defeats him and strips everything off him in a way, but now is the one that has the advantage of being a terrorist with power and resources, over a guy who has nothing left except his own intelligence. Having Tony Stark defeat the Mandarin without the advantage of his suit could've made the stakes much higher, and the resolution of the conflict and the victory much more satisfying. You still integrate Stark's malfunctioning suits, him battling EXTREMIS soldiers and Killian in his armor, but have his personal conflict against the Mandarin as Tony Stark in his flesh. Have all the thematic elements present and all the points made, without wasting a villain for the sake of a joke.

I don't see why something like that couldn't have worked.

You wannna know why they didn't go that direction? It's simple: because that's not the story they wanted to tell. See, in the end it's all up to "why didn't they tell they story the way I wanted to see it?"

 

[Norek]

You wannna know why they didn't go that direction? It's simple: because that's not the story they wanted to tell. See, in the end it's all up to "why didn't they tell they story the way I wanted to see it?"

Or more like "the way they presented it to be by false advertisement, just to "get" people with a twist for ****s and giggles."

 

[darkslayer101]

I very much enjoyed the film. Its not as great as some people make it out to be, but its a very well made blockbuster film.

A few things:

Spoiler

1.The action was pretty damn good.
2. It was funny when it needed to be and serious when it needed be, similar to The Avengers.
3. There could have been a little more screen time with Tony in the suit/using the suit.
4. It was a tad slow in the middle.
5. Pepper's extremis cure and Tony's magical surgery at the end was terribly written and is very "oh yeah... we fixed this! Don't ask how!"
6. The Mandarin was great. Killian was The Mandarin, and a solid interpretatio of him, though in a very unique way. Killian wrote the scripts for Kingsley's character, so all of that was still the REAL Mandarin's thoughts. Other than the rings, Killian pretty much represented everything the modern comic Mandarin represents.
7. Kingsely's performance was WAY WAY better AFTER the reveal.
8. The whole cast was great.
9. The banter between Rhodey and Tony was great.
10. Rhodey needed some more action.

Overall, it was very good. I was at a private screening that was supposed to be at 12 and ended up starting at 2 AM and our 3D didn't work so the film was blurry(yes it was 100% free and an early screening in the States, so I can't really complain).I feel this hurt my experience, so I won't give an official rating before I see it again, but its in the 8-9/10 range.

Exact same thoughts here.

 

[weezerspider]

The thing is, they don't need to make The Mandarin a caricature of something, or a wizard with magical rings to make him a compelling villain.

Spoiler

I liked the idea of having Tony Stark with a PTSD and being "stripped" from the armor, but that's exactly why I felt a character like the Mandarin as he was presented to be (Ben Kingsley pre-twist) could've worked - he looked and sounded intriguing, there was a hint at a complicated story behind the character, and an interesting ideology that makes him more than a terrorist (just like the Joker's ideology makes him more than a gangster, for example), and even as a man with no powers he could've been a great villain.

They could've brought a great contrast to the first film with Obadiah's line "Technology. That's always been your Achilles heel in this part of the world". They could've played with that by making Iron Man's greatest and deadliest foe yet be someone who doesn't rely on wearing a rip-off suit of his, or being an enhanced super-soldier with fire-breathing abilities, but instead someone who's seen as a technologically inferior in comparison to Iron Man, but being methodical, calculative and extremely intelligent, takes on Iron Man, who clearly has the upper hand, and not only defeats him and strips everything off him in a way, but now is the one that has the advantage of being a terrorist with power and resources, over a guy who has nothing left except his own intelligence. Having Tony Stark defeat the Mandarin without the advantage of his suit could've made the stakes much higher, and the resolution of the conflict and the victory much more satisfying. You still integrate Stark's malfunctioning suits, him battling EXTREMIS soldiers and Killian in his armor, but have his personal conflict against the Mandarin as Tony Stark in his flesh. Have all the thematic elements present and all the points made, without wasting a villain for the sake of a joke.

I don't see why something like that couldn't have worked.

What you have just described is less like The Mandarin then what is actually in the film.

Spoiler

The REAL Mandarin, Killian, was a great man of science, who showed desire to control the world's greatest powers, hence the line 'I'll have the two biggest weapons in each hand and own the War On Terror'(or something like that). We see at the beginning of the film he was a nobody, but through his knowledge (and probably his powers), he built himself up. He showed great hand-to-hand combat talents. Notice the other Extremis soldiers were not nearly as good at hand to hand combat, so he must have some training.
Now the COMIC Mandarin, was born in a rich family who spent all their wealth teaching him science and training him in the martial arts. By the time he was an adult, he was dirt poor, but extremely brilliant, like Killian at the beginning of Iron Man 3. Also like Killian, The Mandarin's strength is his knowledge of SCIENCE. This is what enabled him to study Axon-Karr and tap into the powers of the ten rings. He used his powers and knowledge to build himself up and desired world domination, often using Countries own weapons against them, like Killian's plan with Extremis, Iron Patriot and Iron Man. The Mandarin also is extremely talented in martial arts and hand-to-hand combat.

Killian as The Mandarin is very much a Nolan villain interpretation. Similar to how Joker isn't permawhite and Bane isn't a venom-out wrestler, Killian isn't a Chinese ruler with powerful rings. However, similar to how Ledger's Joker and Hardy's Bane represent all the major aspects of the characters themselves, Killian has just about everything from a characterization stand point that The Mandarin has and is. If Killian returned in a sequel with 10 Rings, he'd be a damn near perfect live adaption interpretation of the character.
The twist wasn't just a plot twist, and it wouldn't work for every villain. It was used with The Mandarin for a reason and it was to acknowledge the character's past in the comics and to critique the original, racist stereotype that the original character was. IM3 showed us the VISUAL aspects of The Mandarin character and turned it into a joke because thats what it is, a racist, stupid joke of a character. However, the character himself, which is a great villain, they showed respect to and made him the primary villain with Killian.

Also, this COMIC BOOK Mandarin looks almost exactly like Mandarin/Killian in the climax of Iron Man 3:

 

[Tony Stark]

What you have just described is less like The Mandarin then what is actually in the film.

Spoiler

The REAL Mandarin, Killian, was a great man of science, who showed desire to control the world's greatest powers, hence the line 'I'll have the two biggest weapons in each hand and own the War On Terror'(or something like that). We see at the beginning of the film he was a nobody, but through his knowledge (and probably his powers), he built himself up. He showed great hand-to-hand combat talents. Notice the other Extremis soldiers were not nearly as good at hand to hand combat, so he must have some training.
Now the COMIC Mandarin, was born in a rich family who spent all their wealth teaching him science and training him in the martial arts. By the time he was an adult, he was dirt poor, but extremely brilliant, like Killian at the beginning of Iron Man 3. Also like Killian, The Mandarin's strength is his knowledge of SCIENCE. This is what enabled him to study Axon-Karr and tap into the powers of the ten rings. He used his powers and knowledge to build himself up and desired world domination, often using Countries own weapons against them, like Killian's plan with Extremis, Iron Patriot and Iron Man. The Mandarin also is extremely talented in martial arts and hand-to-hand combat.

Killian as The Mandarin is very much a Nolan villain interpretation. Similar to how Joker isn't permawhite and Bane isn't a venom-out wrestler, Killian isn't a Chinese ruler with powerful rings. However, similar to how Ledger's Joker and Hardy's Bane represent all the major aspects of the characters themselves, Killian has just about everything from a characterization stand point that The Mandarin has and is. If Killian returned in a sequel with 10 Rings, he'd be a damn near perfect live adaption interpretation of the character.
The twist wasn't just a plot twist, and it wouldn't work for every villain. It was used with The Mandarin for a reason and it was to acknowledge the character's past in the comics and to critique the original, racist stereotype that the original character was. IM3 showed us the VISUAL aspects of The Mandarin character and turned it into a joke because thats what it is, a racist, stupid joke of a character. However, the character himself, which is a great villain, they showed respect to and made him the primary villain with Killian.

Also, this COMIC BOOK Mandarin looks almost exactly like Mandarin/Killian in the climax of Iron Man 3:

Wile I haven't seen the film yet, this is the thing that has got me the most confused. I have read every issue of Tales of Suspense that Iron Man was in, plus Invincible up to some where in the 300's, plus multiple Avengers and crossover comics, and Mandarin has always been more about scheming and plotting than he's been about his magic rings and such. Black told us way back when that the rings were just rings, so no one should be surprised about that. That's no spoiler info either.

Having said that, let me just say that people always argue about interpretation of characters. There is no single interpretation of a character. While people love Ledger's Joker, and it may be the definitive model, that doesn't make Jack Nicholson's or Cesar Romero's Jokers invalid. All of those interpretations fit for the film they were in, and cannot be substituted among one another.

There are going to be some that like IM3 and some that hate it. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but what I don't like to see is either side telling the other that their own opinion is invalid.

 

[-JKR-]

Or more like "the way they presented it to be by false advertisement, just to "get" people with a twist for ****s and giggles."

What does that even mean? False advertisement? [blackout]It's a damn plot twist. Did you really expect them to reveal the plot twist in TV spots and trailers!?! Of course they're making you think he's the Mandarin. THAT'S THE POINT!

"IntheatersMay3rd - RatedPG13BenKingsleyisnotTheMandarin"[/blackout]

 

[Norek]

What you have just described is less like The Mandarin then what is actually in the film.

Did you read my post? I just described the way [BLACKOUT]Kingsley was before he was revealed to be a drunken actor[/BLACKOUT]. I liked how he looked, sounded and appeared like, and that's what I was interested to see in this character. I can't see how it's less than [BLACKOUT]he being Trevor.[/BLACKOUT]

Killian is [BLACKOUT]Killian. The fact that he called himself that doesn't make him any less different than he is. I understand that this was their version of the character Mandarin, but other than the name he's still a different character than the one that appeared to be Ben Kingsley. And that was my point - I'm saying that HIS Mandarin was what I was interested in, not a comicbook carbon-copy, and not Killian. [/BLACKOUT]

The situation is different with this movie than others, and that's why you can't say "that's what YOU wanted to see" and call it a day, because [BLACKOUT]Ben's Mandarin was made the central point of most of the trailers, promo stuff, and interviews[/BLACKOUT] and it was obviously Marvel's elaborate plan to get people by their pants. If they gamble like that, some people might get disappointed, and that's exactly what happened.

 

[thestartrekker]

What you have just described is less like The Mandarin then what is actually in the film.

Spoiler

The REAL Mandarin, Killian, was a great man of science, who showed desire to control the world's greatest powers, hence the line 'I'll have the two biggest weapons in each hand and own the War On Terror'(or something like that). We see at the beginning of the film he was a nobody, but through his knowledge (and probably his powers), he built himself up. He showed great hand-to-hand combat talents. Notice the other Extremis soldiers were not nearly as good at hand to hand combat, so he must have some training.
Now the COMIC Mandarin, was born in a rich family who spent all their wealth teaching him science and training him in the martial arts. By the time he was an adult, he was dirt poor, but extremely brilliant, like Killian at the beginning of Iron Man 3. Also like Killian, The Mandarin's strength is his knowledge of SCIENCE. This is what enabled him to study Axon-Karr and tap into the powers of the ten rings. He used his powers and knowledge to build himself up and desired world domination, often using Countries own weapons against them, like Killian's plan with Extremis, Iron Patriot and Iron Man. The Mandarin also is extremely talented in martial arts and hand-to-hand combat.

Killian as The Mandarin is very much a Nolan villain interpretation. Similar to how Joker isn't permawhite and Bane isn't a venom-out wrestler, Killian isn't a Chinese ruler with powerful rings. However, similar to how Ledger's Joker and Hardy's Bane represent all the major aspects of the characters themselves, Killian has just about everything from a characterization stand point that The Mandarin has and is. If Killian returned in a sequel with 10 Rings, he'd be a damn near perfect live adaption interpretation of the character.
The twist wasn't just a plot twist, and it wouldn't work for every villain. It was used with The Mandarin for a reason and it was to acknowledge the character's past in the comics and to critique the original, racist stereotype that the original character was. IM3 showed us the VISUAL aspects of The Mandarin character and turned it into a joke because thats what it is, a racist, stupid joke of a character. However, the character himself, which is a great villain, they showed respect to and made him the primary villain with Killian.

Also, this COMIC BOOK Mandarin looks almost exactly like Mandarin/Killian in the climax of Iron Man 3:

I think your post is excellent, but I got to admit, I can understand how some people, real fans of the comics, which I'm not, not really, would feel a bit disappointed because I'm kind of in that camp myself.
I think the most interesting things in the movie were the issues affecting Stark/Ironman. It was a good movie, better I think than the second overall.
Though I think his stint in the Avengers has been his strongest outing so far, and would love to see him in any Avengers sequel. RDJ nails the part I think.

 

[Norek]

There are going to be some that like IM3 and some that hate it. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but what I don't like to see is either side telling the other that their own opinion is invalid.

Me neither, but as it stands, more people like the movie than those who dislike it, and the ones liking it are the ones who more often call the others' opinion invalid.