Yeah, that's what Spidey is out of comic land. In the real world. That's what he's looked at as by me, you, and everyone else. But in comics, has he ever gotten that kind of respect from other heroes? Has he ever been looked at as the greatest superhero in the world? Not that I've ever seen, or heard. Now, I'm not saying he's disrespected by other heroes, but he's never been like Cap where everyone sucks up to him, and he's certainly never been the type of guy who's anything but humble in his own opinion of himself.
Y'see, to me, this all looks like you fans love Spider-Man so much, that you want everyone else to love him just as much. In the 616 universe. ...that's not how it works. What Spider-Man is to us, and what Spider-Man is to the average Joe in the 616 universe are two totally different things.
And, personally, I like Spider-Man being that guy. The humble guy. The everyman. Again, I'm not saying he should be everyone's *****, but to remove that sense of "he's the little guy" is to remove a key part of what Spider-Man is as a character, to me. Is to remove exactly what Stan Lee intended the character to be; human. He's not a Superhero God like Cap or Superman, he's just like you or me. And I don't know about you, but I'm not particularly pompous when I'm talking to people. Especially if that person's Captain America.
you are right that Spider-man to us and the Marvel company isn't the same as SM within the MU. I wasn't implying that he was. But to answer your question as to whether he's gotten that kind of respect the answer is yes. You have to keep in mind that except until recently, or except for a very very few within the MU, heroes did NOT treat each other with reverance. They treated each other with a mutual respect.
Only Thor and hulk sometimes got that "WOW" factor.
Captain America got it to some degree, but the reason I didn't include him is because he also got the opposite. You see, Captain America was treated with great reverance in the MU by non superheroes. Stan and subsequent writers, made it clear that to the average American Captain America was extra special. BUT, to his fellow superheroes, there wasn't that reverance. don't get me wrong, there was a respect, even much respect as he was the field Captain that the other heroes often followed, but there was hardly this I worship the ground you walk on attitude.
This is evident in several instances. The many previous meetings between SM and CA did not have the reverance. Second, within the Avengers, the other heroes treated CA like another great hero. Think about the company he kept, Black Panther, Hank Pym, Iron man, Thor, etc. those guys respected him for sure, but they demanded as much respect from him. You have to remember how he and Hawkeye butted heads with each other because Hawkeye treated him with so little respect.
I say all this NOT to say that CA doesn't deserve or doesn't get respect. I say this to say That the "can I carry your lunch for the rest of my life", "joke" is an extreme. That attitude, or THAT kind of statement is NOT the norm.
But it would be fine. CA deserves that kind of reverance. The question becomes from whom? It makes perfect sense for a new kid on the block or even an established hero who never met Cap, to have that kind of attidue, BUT, Would it make sense for Thor, to act like that? For Reed Richards to act like that?
I hope we can all agree that the answer is no.
so the question becomes does it make sense for SM to act like that?
Let me agree that SM is and has been a humble guy who would be quick to put himself down rather than act like the big man on campus. But, it is also true that SM had a quick temper and was quick to put other heroes in their place too. When he first met Thor, even though he could recognize Thor's stature, he didn't act impress. When he first met the Avengers, with Thor, Cap, Iron man, and the others present he got into a fight with them because of his temper. To him they weren't anymore important or significant then he was. He wasn't impressed. When he first met the FF same thing, his temper got the better of him. When he was asked to tackle the HULK, his response was "is that all?". So if we are going to stay true to the character of SM we have to understand that this deference is out of character for him.
You also have to remember that within the MU SM IS in fact regarded as extra special. He is not nor has he ever been the guy that acts like the big man,..but all the big men know how special he is. there was a comic which established Sm as the most important and greatest superhero of the MU. He has stepped up and saved the day while in the company of all the other heroes many times in the past. He has teamed up with practically everyone and has saved them or helped them or fought along side them. He has even fought and defeated most of them,..all this is WITHIN the MU. so we're not talking about some newbie, rookie, kid here. there IS in fact a tremendous amount of respect for SM within the MU.
So to answer the question as to would SM act like that towards CA, his past history and character says NO.
To make him do so is to disregard his past accomplishments, relationships, and experience. It is to lessen him.
but Ccon that's not the only problem. You have to understand that WE are not here complaining because of this SINGLE issue where SM shows love to CA. If that was the only incident it would be fine.
The problem is that for the past 10 years or so, there has been a concerted effort to lessen, and minimize SM in the MU. In the pages of Avengers, Falcon says "what are YOU even doing here?" in response to SM's annoying banter. In the pages of MTU he is told "all the other superheroes hate you", to which Captain America says "well I don't hate you (confirming the others do) I just think you're annoying" or something like that.
In the New Avengers book, he is treated as not only an annoyance but a liability as well. He becomes the weak link that needs to be rescued. SPIDER-WOMAN is treated with more respect and with more weight than him. LUKE CAGE (who was nothing but a rank amateur to SM when they first met), becomes legit, while SM becomes the sidekick joke of the team. Then he is made to follow Tony around like a wet puppy, something which once again is the complete opposite of his character, THEN, after having been burned by Tony,.....they make him turn around and act like a school girl with a crush on the Captain of the football team. THAT is what we're comnplaing about. The overall treatment of the character.
it's like wait a second, what are you doing to this guy.
imagine for a second if they started making Wolverine act scared and intimidated around other heroes.
You're wrong when you say we fans want everyone else to love him the way we do. I'm not asking for CA to treat SM with reverance either. That would be just as wrong as what they are doing to SM. I'm not asking that he takes over Cap's place as the leader of the avengers. I'm only asking that the character be treated fairly. That he get the SAME respect as Torch, Falcon, Luke Cage, etc. Having everyone else be legitimate, strong and important, while making SM a joke simply isn't right.
And this is where we step outside of the MU and look at it from the outside as a company and as readers. Basically, though it would be a mistake to treat SM as more powerful than Thor, and more commanding than CA, or smarter than RR,...it is equally wrong to take your flagship character and treat him as an inconsequential joke. what they are doing is wrong, stupid, inaccurate, makes no sense, and will ONLY lessen the character.
