religion in society

[FunBobPants]

I was just reading an article about a preacher-turned-christian-popstar the other day and noticed something. The singer was recalling her childhood when she told her parents that she wasn't into religion.

Then one day she encountered a personal crisis. Her Christian friends gathered around her and helped a lot. From then, she attended church, and met her husband, who was a preacher. One thing led to another and she is now the star the she is.

I think many non-religious folks underestimate the human need for personal support and empowerment. I emphasize personal because I believe this is one reason why this social phenomena has such longevity and expansion potential. A highlight of the supermeme.

Do I think people convert into organized religion because of their first-principle doctrines, or holy books or whatever? To an outsider, this must appear absurd - many of those religious ideas are not merely obscure, they are so blatantly wrong and nonsensical that it boggles the mind. In fact, I'm beginning to suspect that most of these folks never actually read or understood any of that stuff.

Yet people are willing part with their money, their time, their lives or take other people's lives for their religious principles? Why? WHY? WHY?

Is it because the belief system provides actual support for believers through extensive social networks optimized over a few thousand years of cultural evolution?

Is it because the belief system organizes people into large factions of real accumulated wealth and military power that can further expand their interests in a "us vs them" game of false diametric opposites?

Is it because the belief system discourages critical thought and incessant doubt, encouraging a false "good-evil" dicotomy, thus removing obstacles that restricts its growth and propagation? Even if you don't understand what makes you good (and you can't since everything is mystical, mind you) how can you not rally to fight evil together (who is conveniently always your opponent)?

Perhaps religion and society is inextricable. When organized religion was displaced during state-enforced atheism in the Soviet Union and China, people turned to personality cult worship instead, elevating Stalin and Mao into Gods. Many of the old guard still worship these dictators to this day.

I find this a discouraging thought. What do you think?

 

[Abaddon]

Religion is telling people that end everything will be okay.

 

[Kelly]

Religion is needed....and so is "separation of church and state" as long as both are there....I'm cool.

 

[Carter]

I'm guessing 7 pages

 

[Slipknot]

I'm guessing 7 pages

I'll go with 17 if "celldog" sees this thread... and about 7 if he doesn't.

 

[Abaddon]

I'll go with 17 if "celldog" sees this thread... and about 9 if he doesn't.

Also depends on how much information from conservative websites he fills his posts with.

 

[Carter]

I don't know.
For people to say that they know one way or another if or isn't there a god seems silly to me.

Religion gets out of hand sometimes, but it also prevents people from acting like animals in some cases.
Maybe some people aren't afraid of jail, but they're afraid of hell

 

[blind_fury]

We don't need religion.

Society would be fine without it. All religion brings is shame, guilt, and paranioa regarding the afterlife.

 

[Abaddon]

without religion,something would be needed to fill the void.

 

[X-Punisher]

I like religion but I am kind of against it being organized because when it becomes big all they want is control over the people who are following it. If they don't want you to have sex until your married then they will tell you it's evil and you won't do it. I choose what I believe in, I believe Jesus was the son of God, but I will go by what I think is right not some guys who wrote a book that constantly controdicts itself and says it's okay to sell your daughter into slavery.

 

[Ongie]

Of course religion should be a part of society.
Freedom should be a part of society, obviously... and religious freedom along with it.
It's an important part of the human experience.

 

[Kelly]

We don't need religion.

Society would be fine without it. All religion brings is shame, guilt, and paranioa regarding the afterlife.

I don't think anyone can say society would be fine without it. I'm not a big "organized" religion fan....not at all in fact.....but as someone just said....Freedom is the key...not religion.......we should have the freedom to believe or not to believe....thats the important thing. But to sweeplingly say that society would be ok without it...is totally something that will never be proven, and therefore kind of ignorant to say. (BTW, not ignorant in an "unintelligent" way, but ignorant in "lack of knowledge" way)

 

[Ongie]

I don't think anyone can say society would be fine without it. I'm not a big "organized" religion fan....not at all in fact.....but as someone just said....Freedom is the key...not religion.......we should have the freedom to believe or not to believe....thats the important thing. But to sweeplingly say that society would be ok without it...is totally something that will never be proven, and therefore kind of ignorant to say. (BTW, not ignorant in an "unintelligent" way, but ignorant in "lack of knowledge" way)

Great post.

 

[Symbiote Hulk]

All hail to the cockroaches!

 

[November Rain]

as long as people have a belief in something that is unexplainable, there will always be religion.

it helps fill (or try to fill) in the gaps to questions it doesn't have answers to.

at its very basis it gives people a moral guide to the way they live their lives and attempts to provide positive reactions to all the bad that happens in life giving people hope that if it doesn't get better now, then it will in the ever hopeful afterlife.

no matter how many permutations and combinations of life/humans were created, these values of religious traits will always be eventually when we have evolved to a reasonable level of understanding.

the problems aren't the religions themselves rather the people who have different opinions on the subject. This human trait to agree and disagree with others will also always be around and this is what causes the problems in society which start with religious conflict and has now become political ones (while religious ones still remain) and many others.

such is the eternal fate of the homo sapien

 

[black_dust]

Religion kills inocent people

 

[Kelly]

Religion kills inocent people

People kill people...for several reasons...it can be religion, nationalism, politics, economics, or traditionalism vs. modernism....these are the 5 main conflicts between nations.....and in most of these cases a combination of 2 or more is the usual cause. But religion is only one, and in most cases is not the only cause, though it is in many cases part of the combination.

 

[souloffire]

We don't need religion.

Society would be fine without it. All religion brings is shame, guilt, and paranioa regarding the afterlife.

It also brings hope and inspiration to people as well.

 

[sinewave]

without religion,something would be needed to fill the void.

that's where hardcore drugs come into play.

 

[Isildur´s Heir]

There will always be religion.
It´s part of the human nature to need something to believe in.
Society might crumble one day, religion never

 

[JLBats]

that's where hardcore drugs come into play.

So you suggest that without religion, rather than any sort of turn towards philosophy and rational political involvement, they would turn directly to drugs?

Perhaps accurate, but it paints a fairly bleak picture of humanity, doesn't it?

I always like to think of a George Meyer quote when thinking about religion in our culture and society:

Absolutely. But I also want to be tolerant of other people’s beliefs. I have wonderful friends who are religious, and I don’t want to say that they’re dimwits. They should certainly be able to pursue what works for them. I’m just saying that it doesn’t work for me and I don’t want to pretend that it does.

 

[black_dust]

People kill people...for several reasons...it can be religion, nationalism, politics, economics, or traditionalism vs. modernism....these are the 5 main conflicts between nations.....and in most of these cases a combination of 2 or more is the usual cause. But religion is only one, and in most cases is not the only cause, though it is in many cases part of the combination.

Did i say "Religion is the reson for eveyone dying"? ummmm no! I said it kills inocent people. Take that out and it would lower the percentage of deaths over the world and throughout history

 

[Darthphere]

I don't know.
For people to say that they know one way or another if or isn't there a god seems silly to me.

Religion gets out of hand sometimes, but it also prevents people from acting like animals in some cases.
Maybe some people aren't afraid of jail, but they're afraid of hell

Yeah, it seems like on here atheists call christians stupid, and christians call atheiest evil and the muslims and jews get away with it all.

 

[Carter]

It's so ****ing stupid, man

 

[Darthphere]

It's so ****ing stupid, man

I say believe what you want to believe and let everyone else believe what they want. Which my reply from an atheist response would be why should I respect something I think is stupid and then the christian response is its my duty to offer everyone salvation and the muslims and jews get away with it all.