RoboCop’ Returns

Are we sure he was still alive? I figured he just wasn't legally declared dead yet.

And yeah the blood in the factory was from him gouging out Boddicker's throat.

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He was/is still alive but for legal purposes they "killed him" to turn him into a cyborg I think.
 
Are we sure he was still alive? I figured he just wasn't legally declared dead yet.

And yeah the blood in the factory was from him gouging out Boddicker's throat.

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Well, his time of death is announced when they stop trying to save him on the operating table.
 
Well, his time of death is announced when they stop trying to save him on the operating table.
Yes because I assume that's the process of legally declaring someone as dead. They attempt to revive them, fail, and then they give him a legal declaration of death.
 
Yes because I assume that's the process of legally declaring someone as dead. They attempt to revive them, fail, and then they give him a legal declaration of death.

Possibly, I am not an expert, but would they not have declared him dead at the scene? Also, he was having flashbacks while on the table.

It’s been a while since I watched it, but isn’t there also a heartbeat when he is on the operating table?
 
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Yeah, Marvel, like AVEIT said I don't think his chest was like completely torn to shreds or anything. Bullets obviously got through the vest, it was obviously more than just the arm. From memory doesn't Boddicker finish him off with one to the head too? But he still seemed "in once piece" as such, arm aside. His heart must have still been working at least partially by the time he got to hospital, even if he was a total vegetable in a neurological sense.

About the death thing, guess I always just assumed he's like...braindead but heart's still faintly beating kind of thing. Aren't there a couple of different ways doctors determine the legal-death thing? And clearly the hospital's trying to save him before OCP gets him, so he's not just totally done-for before they even got him in an ambulance.

Still sort of figure there has to be some "original" Murphy in there brain-function wise (as opposed to a "mind upload" into digital form like, say, Zola in The Winter Soldier), and wouldn't you need a heartbeat and certain amount of human blood flowing around to sustain that? Guess theoretically the baby food could just be supporting a brain/facial muscles and that alone, but it never came off that way to me. More like the food is supporting some remnants of organ systems and nerves and stuff. Always liked that "Frankenstein" element to the character, where he's...sure, more than 50% mechanical of course, but it seems like inside that chest cavity there's probably some messed-up organ activity of some kind going on. Just buried beneath layers of metal and pistons/gear-work and armor.


EDIT: Actually, just googled the reboot out of curiosity. There's a little rudimentary chest stuff left there too, misremembered the scene. Not that that confirms one way or another for the '87 film, but you'd figure it stands to reason it's the same idea. Neumeier & Miner were involved in writing the '14 flick too, though I don't know if other writers took a pass at it afterward.


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Nobody ever got this straight. Nobody.

RoboCop 1987 is not Alexander J. Murphy. Not at all.

RoboCop 1987 is a cybernetical organism using SOME portions (half?) of Alex Murphy's brain (not everything, since Clarence obliterated the entire right side) and his (Alex's) biological face grafted into the mechanical skull.

End of the story.

Maybe RoboCop's torso contains a simple digestive tract (synthetic?) to make him digest the baby food and thus sustain THE PORTIONS (half?) of HUMAN BRAIN and HUMAN FACE. That's it.

RoboCop 1987 is like Alan Moore's Swamp Thing. A machine which convinces itself to be ALEX MURPHY, but "he" isn't Alex Murphy. That's the whole point of the movie, its magic.
The machine manages to be more human than the humans. Poetry.
 
If it thinks he’s Alex murphy, then he’s Alex Murphy. Or that’s has always been the debate about what a soul is within cybernetic beings, no? What makes them human. From Blade Runner and way before.
 
Yeah, Marvel, like AVEIT said I don't think his chest was like completely torn to shreds or anything. Bullets obviously got through the vest, it was obviously more than just the arm. From memory doesn't Boddicker finish him off with one to the head too? But he still seemed "in once piece" as such, arm aside. His heart must have still been working at least partially by the time he got to hospital, even if he was a total vegetable in a neurological sense.

About the death thing, guess I always just assumed he's like...braindead but heart's still faintly beating kind of thing. Aren't there a couple of different ways doctors determine the legal-death thing? And clearly the hospital's trying to save him before OCP gets him, so he's not just totally done-for before they even got him in an ambulance.

Still sort of figure there has to be some "original" Murphy in there brain-function wise (as opposed to a "mind upload" into digital form like, say, Zola in The Winter Soldier), and wouldn't you need a heartbeat and certain amount of human blood flowing around to sustain that? Guess theoretically the baby food could just be supporting a brain/facial muscles and that alone, but it never came off that way to me. More like the food is supporting some remnants of organ systems and nerves and stuff. Always liked that "Frankenstein" element to the character, where he's...sure, more than 50% mechanical of course, but it seems like inside that chest cavity there's probably some messed-up organ activity of some kind going on. Just buried beneath layers of metal and pistons/gear-work and armor.


EDIT: Actually, just googled the reboot out of curiosity. There's a little rudimentary chest stuff left there too, misremembered the scene. Not that that confirms one way or another for the '87 film, but you'd figure it stands to reason it's the same idea. Neumeier & Miner were involved in writing the '14 flick too, though I don't know if other writers took a pass at it afterward.


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Yep, there is definitely some Murphy still in there, more than just the brain, in both the original and the reboot.

If it thinks he’s Alex murphy, then he’s Alex Murphy. Or that’s has always been the debate about what a soul is within cybernetic beings, no? What makes them human. From Blade Runner and way before.

The whole theme of the movie, from the mouth of Verhoeven himself, is the indestructibilty of the human soul. It’s about the human parts of Murphy overcoming the robotic parts. That’s literally from the mouth of the director.
 
I think Supperhero's view is interesting, but I literally never saw it that way. I always saw it as what's left of Murphy, his humanity his soul whatever, fighting back against his OCP programming.

I think RoboCop considering Murphy as another person and talking in the third person is just sort of Murphy's way of trying to cope with his new existence and try to keep his sanity intact.

I think the Joi thing in Blade Runner 2049 can be seen in multiple ways. But basically, I don't see Joi as developing self-awareness. Literally everything Joi does is exactly what she was programmed to do, to offer K perfect companionship. Essentially, Joi acted as his conscious and was basically saying what he was feeling most of the time. Those are the things he wanted to believe. Joi was not more than what she was.

But some people see it differently with Joi and that's fine.
 
Supperhero, good job missing the entire point of the damn movie. :oldrazz: Of course there's some original Alex Murphy in there. It's a "ghost in the machine" story, the soul/mind/whatever you want to call it surviving all that trauma. He's intended to be an obedient digital machine, product, a friggin' appliance, only he's not because feelings well up to the surface.
 
Im interested in hearing how people think the themes of the first film can be expanded upon in this new film.



Personally Robocop is a great self contained film that's main theme is the ghost in the machine idea. The film says exactly what it needed to say and Robocop figures his **** out so what I want to know is how to do you make a sequel that further develops those themes while keeping the movie updated and relevant without essentially remaking the first one.
 
Mad Max RoboCop

No way Blomkamp would let go of his shanty town sets.
 
I always liked that scene in R2 when they just rebuilt Robo and are about to put in his new 'extra' directives and he is laying on the table saying he has to go and the female exec says and I am paraphrasing "what are you? you take away the metal and the plastic and the wires and your just chunks of flesh on a coroners table, your not even a corpse".
 
I welcome the idea of this film.

I am also in what I suppose a smaller minority of people that really enjoyed the remake/reboot film as well with Kinnaman and Keaton. It wasn't everything I wanted but really enjoyed the film. Was hoping for a follow up.

But if this film is the "true" Robocop 3 or 4 depending on how you look at it I welcome it.
 

Seems like trolling to me.

The question asked was who should be Robocop. Not who will be. That's what stood out to me.

It would be cool to see Weller return, sure. But this isn't going to be a cheap production and obviously the goal is for follow-ups (in the event this revival works). Weller is 71. Do the math. Plus the whole matter of the studio signing off on his casting.

All for it, mind you. But I never considered it a possibility and until proven otherwise, I'll believe it when I see it. Happy to be wrong though.
 
Ridley Scott will come in and make an OCP prequel first.
 
Funny you mention Sir Ridley. When I first heard the news, my immediate thought for filling the cybernetic shoes was his boy Fassbender.
 
The question asked was who should be Robocop. Not who will be. That's what stood out to me.

It would be cool to see Weller return, sure. But this isn't going to be a cheap production and obviously the goal is for follow-ups (in the event this revival works). Weller is 71. Do the math. Plus the whole matter of the studio signing off on his casting.

All for it, mind you. But I never considered it a possibility and until proven otherwise, I'll believe it when I see it. Happy to be wrong though.

I agree I wouldn't normally pick Weller but maybe it ties into the story some how. I imagine that the organics on Robocop would decay and would need to be regrown/replaced. You could have a new actor playing Robocop/Murphy and still keep Weller on board to voice the character.
 
Would Weller even be interested in doing something like that?
 

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