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Season 1, Episode 5 "The Axe Forgets" (Spoiler Thread)

Discussion in 'Andor' started by DarthSkywalker, Oct 4, 2022.

  1. DarthSkywalker Regular As Clockwork (he/him)

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    Last week, on CLEM...

    Ring Theory,
    [​IMG]

    Coruscant got a glow up,
    [​IMG]

    and it was as if millions of voices suddenly cried out in terror and were suddenly silenced, when my bro found out Mon Mothma was married.
    [​IMG]


    And now, Episode V...


    [​IMG]
     
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  2. Sithborg Gundam Utena

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    Your bro should have been relieved, as that is a marriage clearly going into divorce.
     
  3. DarthSkywalker Regular As Clockwork (he/him)

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    You mean he didn't have to hire this guy?

    [​IMG]
     
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  4. DarthSkywalker Regular As Clockwork (he/him)

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    She has a grown ass daughter! :eek:
     
  5. OtherwiseKnownAs We live inside a dream (P)(he/him/his)

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    This man is going to kill his mother.
     
  6. Snow Queen Maybe Someday (she/her)

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    I love whenever Star Wars treats TIE Fighters as intimidating. Always a treat.
     
  7. DarthSkywalker Regular As Clockwork (he/him)

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    This episode was basically the scene where they sit around the camp fire in Solo, for 45 mins. I like the show, but this is slooooooowwwwwww, with a ton of philosophizing, without a lot of reason so far. My favorite moment of the episode is when twice, members of the group said they were going to keep their explanations short for why they are there, after they all spent so much time talking during the episode already. :funny:
     
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  8. GREEN =w= DAY Registered

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    Slow buildup of an episode but it seems we will finally get the payoff next week

    Surprising to see that Mon Mothma has a husband in the last episode, even more surprising to see she has a daughter as well in today’s episode
     
  9. DarthSkywalker Regular As Clockwork (he/him)

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    How this show is playing out, I can see why it went from 4 seasons to 2. Disney were probably spooked.
     
  10. Iceman Daffy Duck Vs The Joker

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    I love watching buildup, there's just so much of it lol. One episode so far where things have started moving. It's like the first 5 episodes of Rings of Power in that respect. Still enjoying it for now.
     
  11. antsman41 Unseen Arkham Prisoner

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    ...no point to have a huge set piece in every episode. Look how that turned out for Boba Fett.

    Give me more of this day-in-the-life of Empirical society.
     
  12. Iceman Daffy Duck Vs The Joker

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    I don't think they need set piece episodes, but this style of extended slow buildup without too much happening won't appeal to everyone. I'm fine with it myself, just want the show to be a success overall.
     
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  13. Kane52630 BATMOBILE USER

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    Another stellar episode of tv where you actually get to know every one of these Star Wars characters for once.

    Like I said before, this show is probably too good for Star Wars.
     
  14. TheVileOne Registered

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    Five episodes in, the cracks in the series are starting to show. I'm a bit mixed on it right now. Some of my scattered thoughts:

    * I think from a visual, production standpoint, this show is really unparalleled as far as any other live-action Star Wars TV series and many other live-action streaming series period. Halo looked like garbage compared to this. Lucasfilm spent a possible $180-$200 million if not more on this season, and it you can see it on screen.

    * By this episode, I'm already over the Syril subplot. It's becoming a sci-fi Woody Allen film at this point. I didn't need the scenes with Syril's overbearing mother to understand his obsession and how he's obsessed with getting Andor. But where are we going with this?

    * Not to mention, we have like a dozen other subplots going on that this is starting to feel like an over-written soap opera. Man, Mon Mothma's family life sucks. Her daughter is a total brat and has no respect for her. Her husband is an ******* who takes glee in their daughter verbally insulting his wife. At first, I was kind of excited to learn more about Mon Mothma because she's been this important background character for years, and now this is just starting to feel rather extraneous and superfluous. I'm getting that her husband is suspicious of her extracurricular activities and could in fact turn out to be an Empire loyalist or just doesn't want his wife involved for their own protection, but whatever.

    * I think the best thing is Andor's interaction with the other rebel guerrilla fighters. Andor hasn't been fully indoctrinated into the cause yet, so the show is his journey toward that. I think the dynamic with the rebel group and gradually earning their trust and coming clean worked, especially with Skeen. I got the sense that Vel and Cinta were in a romantic relationship. That felt like the subtle impression. The kid Nemik is a bit of a dreamer, but I imagine his information will help the Rebel Alliance become a more organized group. I'm assuming that Vel and Luthen have some sort of relationship or indirect familial connection.

    * The stuff with Blevin and his toadie felt extraneous to me. Like it doesn't take a genius to figure out the Empire is moving into Andor's old town and setting up shop. But it just seems to be adding in a lot of unnecessary drama.

    * And then we have ISB agents Dedra Meero and her toadie. Dedra is clearly onto something and realizes that this is the start of the Rebel Alliance. So...end game is what? ISB realizes there's a Rebel Alliance and in a galactic civil war? Dedra gets a promotion? An audience with Darth Vader? Emperor Palpatine? Like, I think the acting is like solid, but I'm not sure why I'm supposed to care about Dedra and the ISB agents investigating the Rebel Alliance and this much attention.

    * Now on one hand, lots of setup. This will be good because next week will be lots of action. With 12 episodes, it looks like they are pacing things in three-episode segments. First three episodes were like a little movie. Now we are in the next three-parter setting up the siege in Aldhani. They stopped just before the raid, so that means the next episode will have to mostly be the raid on Aldhani. That means it will have to be a very action-packed climactic episode. Building up to a big battle blowoff episode can be good as we will be given more time to focus on the battle. IMHO the problem is that the setup and development can be a little frustrating.

    * Here's the weird thing, despite the dozens of subplots and characters, these episodes feel a bit short to me. These aren't even legit 40-42 minute episodes. But like they are spending all this money to give us Syril and his sci-fi apartment and interstellar cocoa puffs. Arguably, if you cut out some of these extra subplots and gave these episodes another 20 minutes, we actually could've maybe had a big climax this episode instead of putting it off for the next one.
     
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  15. Sithborg Gundam Utena

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    [shrug] I am loving the pace. Now granted, it is feeling like old school miniseries, with essentially 4 chapters at under 3 hours each. Its why I watched episode 4 just before this episode. And I think when you put 4-6 together, the pacing will feel better.

    I did greatly enjoy Clem and the gang prepping. And I absolutely loved that little hint of future Clem when he revealed the truth about himself.

    Oh Nemik. You dead.

    The short time with the other of the case was nice. Just small, little snippets to flesh them out a bit more. The banality of evil with the Empire. The stress of Mon Mothma and Luthen.
     
  16. DarthSkywalker Regular As Clockwork (he/him)

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    But it worked out very well for the Mando and has for House of the Dragon.

    But there is a difference between a huge set piece every episode, and nothing happening for the majority of the runtime. One of my favorite shows is Better Call Saul. Even while not doing the biggest thing every week, the episode's felt full. Andor episodes feel like they can easily be summed up in the 1 min recaps at the start.

    This not a miniseries. If we are going to give crap to shows for not being proper shows, we should point out this is a 24 episode television series. And to say, "well you should wait to watch" feels like a very bad argument for a weekly released television show.

    I am going to be curious about the stats for this show. The conversation I've noticed here and other places has already dropped off, and it's because outside of pointing out the little things one likes about it, it hasn't really been generating chatter. Not the way other SW shows have.
     
  17. Kane52630 BATMOBILE USER

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    [​IMG]
     
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  18. DarthSkywalker Regular As Clockwork (he/him)

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    Well as you are not a fan of SW Kane, I guess whether this type of stuff continues doesn't matter to you. But yes, some of us are fans. Those that rather not have to live through the Filoni/Fav stuff forever.
     
  19. Sithborg Gundam Utena

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    Yes, is it a problem that they have stretched out the releases. Take that up with Disney+'s release schedule. Its not even a Marvel problem, as Boba Fett pointed out.

    And considering the... quality of a lot of Star Wars discourse, is it really a bad thing to have it be a bit more low key in terms of chatter.

    I love this show. I greatly enjoy the slower pace. And it is not problem if it isn't for others.
     
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  20. DarthSkywalker Regular As Clockwork (he/him)

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    I'm confused by your first point. Bad shows are bad shows. But weekly release schedules on Disney+ are the norm. And releasing a movie every week was never on the table. Not when each would cost 60m apiece.

    It is if you want other things from Star Wars, it's an issue. Obi-Wan had a ton of issues, and I hated how it ended. But it was super popular. Just like the Mando is super popular. The much maligned Boba, was definitely more popular then Andor so far. We know how LF handles such things already.

    Also in general on discourse, It's hard for me to say the one surrounding this show hasn't bene super belittling of fans of Star Wars. It went from fanboy snobbish, to non-fan snobbery.
     
  21. TheVileOne Registered

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    Social media chatter is really irrelevant for this show because they are doing 24 episodes that's it. And those 24 episodes are already ordered. So they are gonna happen.
     
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  22. Sithborg Gundam Utena

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    That's just my impression. Watching the first 3 episodes, and then watching the next two together just reminds me of watching Merlin or The Odyssey or Childhood's End. What is envisioned and shot can change in the editing room. Yeah, the way the episodes are split up is an issue, much like a few other Disney+ shows.
     
  23. TheVileOne Registered

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    To me the main issue was the way the first three episodes were split when they were clearly mean to be a single pilot movie type of episode. But we got all three of those episodes at once, so *shrugs*?

    It does it feel like they are doing three episode mini-arcs though and next week's episode will be a climactic blowoff.

    A part of me wonders if they should've done this season like Sherlock. But oh well, I'm not Bob Iger.
     
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  24. Gaultheria Registered

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    I'm one of the dissatisfied. My take on the series so far is that most of what we've seen feels like backstory, the kind of detail that authors generate volumes of as part of the creative process but which doesn't make it into the finished novel.

    We don't need to see backstory play out. The maxims "Show, don't tell" and "A picture is worth a thousand words" aren't always good advice. In TESB, when Leia said to Han "I thought you had decided to stay" and Han replied "Well, the bounty hunter we ran into on Ord Mantell changed my mind", that handful of words was enough to paint a vivid and emotionally-charged energetic picture, with an impact far greater than if we'd had to watch that background story happen.

    This series seems to be operating on the assumption that the only way for the audience to understand that a character has strong feelings and motivations is for the show to spend a lot of time establishing and describing those feelings and motivations.
     
  25. blackdragon6 Registered

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    So anyway, I loved the interaction between the small Rebel cell. I also love how the tension is slowly building up. Chalk me up as one or the people who LOVES the slow pacing. I never thought I'd say that about a Star Wars property lol. Andor is continuing to be my favorite live action Star Wars content ever made!
     

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