Superman & Lois Superman & Lois Original Discussion Thread

[flickchick85]

I had a feeling that I would he seeing you here soon. You always come around when I have something to say about Supergirl.

Either the way my feelings won't change about this show. I see it the way you see MOS and BvS

Fair enough.

And for the record, I'm PLENTY critical of Supergirl (and all the Arrowverse shows) in several respects, as anyone who spends any time on those boards can tell you. But their treatment of Superman has simply never been one 'em. And I feel like at least half the people who are, are simply taking information out of context because they either don't watch the show or have watched a little of it and couldn't stand the obnoxious "girl power, rah rah" vibe of S1 and assumed these out-of-context things must be true, so that's why I'm always feeling the need to set the record straight when it comes to that.

Because the one thing that keeps me watching the Arrowverse, despite s****y production values, sloppy plotting, atrocious romance, horrible villains, etc....is that they clearly love their heroes and that affection shows on screen, and garners affection with the audience. Berlanti's formula has one mostly-consistent success, and it's that they make these heroes extremely likeable to audiences. And that definitely applies with Superman to me, and is something the Supes brand could definitely use more of in current times if you ask me.

But poor Ray Palmer/The Atom. I don't think anyone in the Legends writers room ever gave two ****s about him.

 

[SupermanFan]

Superman and Lois sharing a title ain’t exactly a new thing, either. And Lois has headlined comics herself. She’s a big name. She’s not Alex Danvers. She Lois ****ing Lane, arguably the most famous woman in all of comics-dom.

Exactly, I’m glad a she’s sharing the byline

 

[Flash525]

So by that logic, Lois is obviously as important to the show as Superman. That’s why her name is in the title.

Superman and Lois sharing a title ain’t exactly a new thing, either. And Lois has headlined comics herself. She’s a big name. She’s not Alex Danvers. She Lois ****ing Lane, arguably the most famous woman in all of comics-dom.

I’m willing to bed that eventually she won’t be. It’ll be a Superman show, and Lois will ultimately be no more important than Felicity or Iris.

 

[Boy Scout]

I’m willing to bed that eventually she won’t be. It’ll be a Superman show, and Lois will ultimately be no more important than Felicity or Iris.

Um, if anything, Felicity and Iris are way more important than they should be, judging from the lurking I’ve done on the Flash and Arrow boards. Felicity was basically the co-lead, if not simply the second most important character on her show, and Iris and Barry apparently share Barry’s codename.

 

[Prison Mike]

Iris is the leader of Team Flash

 

[Flash525]

Um, if anything, Felicity and Iris are way more important than they should be, judging from the lurking I’ve done on the Flash and Arrow boards. Felicity was basically the co-lead, if not simply the second most important character on her show, and Iris and Barry apparently share Barry’s codename.

Exactly my point, but Arrow isn’t called ‘Arrow and Felicity’ and Flash isn’t called ‘Flash and Iris’ (although Iris seemed to be under the assumption that she was part of the Flash persona at one time or another - thankfully she hasn’t alluded to that this season).

 

[Herolee10]

Iris is the leader of Team Flash

Not anymore.

The recent episode of The Flash somewhat re-established Barry as the leader again as he was looking to prepare Cisco as the new leader upon his reported demise during the upcoming Crisis.

 

[batdude]

The title is just a reverse of Dean Cain and Teri Hatcher's 'Lois and Clark, the new adventures of Superman" Lois wiil probably be about the same level as Iris or Felicity true, but they will start as married and knowing his identity. it is what it is.

 

[Dark Raven]

I think it's called Superman and Lois because it's a show about them as working parents.

 

[LifesEnd]

its a series about two parents raising a superbaby...of course lois will be important. Also I dunno if they will do it but I want stuff like incredibles 2 in terms of superbaby. Hope they don't age him immediately.

 

[Boy Scout]

Exactly my point, but Arrow isn’t called ‘Arrow and Felicity’ and Flash isn’t called ‘Flash and Iris’ (although Iris seemed to be under the assumption that she was part of the Flash persona at one time or another - thankfully she hasn’t alluded to that this season).

No, that’s not your point. You’re saying that Lois’ name shouldn’t be in the title of this show because it’ll ultimately be about Superman. That’s a contradiction on the logic you presented, which should have you assume that Lois would be every bit as important as Superman precisely because her name is in the title. To then go on to compare her level of important to Felicity’s and Iris’ in their respective series was just a weird decision on your part, because they’re incredibly important to Arrow and Flash, to the point where fans have been calling for them to be removed for years.

 

[The Batman]

Overrated is an overused word by people who don’t agree with others.

That's good for people. I said I think he's kinda overrated....because I think he's kinda overrated. That's the case. Don't try and tell me what the case is. If I wanted that from you, I would've asked.

 

[Boy Scout]

That's good for people. I said I think he's kinda overrated....because I think he's kinda overrated. That's the case. Don't try and tell me what the case is. If I wanted that from you, I would've asked.

How’d you like to see Hoechlin’s version improve? I vaguely recall you saying that you prefer a more Pre-Crisis Superman. Is that right?

 

[The Guard]

I have nothing personal against Hoechlin but in Supergirl they basically switched roles were Supergirl is the symbol of hope and Superman is just there and every time he shows up it's just to prop up Supergirl more and hammer home that fact. And if that's what they want to do fine but to have a Superman series set in that world you're for the most part going to have to rewrite the whole history of that Universe where it is Superman who inspires the formation of the Legion, who is friends and has a close relationship with Flash and Green Arrow and inspires hope. That's why I personally don't want to see a CW Superman show based off of this Superman. He has given me no reason to care for him. But then again the Supergirl show has really turned me off as well. That's why I say they should just start everything over in Max and go from there.

So Superman can't be a symbol of hope unless he inspired the Legion? Nevermind that he inspired Supergirl herself.

It's a little like you're saying he can't be a symbol of hope unless no one else is a symbol of hope. That makes no sense.

The Superman mythos is vast. The character can afford to share some of it with another character. That's the way it is in many comics as well.

 

[The Batman]

How’d you like to see Hoechlin’s version improve? I vaguely recall you saying that you prefer a more Pre-Crisis Superman. Is that right?

That's a good question. Honestly, I can't see myself ever finding this version of Superman great. Ideally, I'd like to see a 21st Century Live Action Superman that takes some cues from the original Golden Age Superman or Grant Morrison's New 52 version, but I don't see Hoechlin fitting that bill.

The best I could ask for is that they stop using this Supes to prop up another hero, and I feel that'll probably be a given since he's a lead character now.

 

[Calvin Ellis]

So Superman can't be a symbol of hope unless he inspired the Legion? Nevermind that he inspired Supergirl herself.

It's a little like you're saying he can't be a symbol of hope unless no one else is a symbol of hope. That makes no sense.

The Superman mythos is vast. The character can afford to share some of it with another character. That's the way it is in many comics as well.

I'm not saying he can't afford to share it. What I am saying is it's backwards on Supergirl and comes off more insulting than anything else. I would not have a problem with things if it was written much better and delivered better than what they are doing.

 

[LifesEnd]

Ehh even in the comics they are giving the legion stuff to his son now. That stuff can be shared imo.

 

[WhoMani]

With the exception of Supergirl and MM, I personally hope we don't see any of the Supergirl characters on this show.

 

[Boy Scout]

That's a good question. Honestly, I can't see myself ever finding this version of Superman great. Ideally, I'd like to see a 21st Century Live Action Superman that takes some cues from the original Golden Age Superman or Grant Morrison's New 52 version, but I don't see Hoechlin fitting that bill.

The best I could ask for is that they stop using this Supes to prop up another hero, and I feel that'll probably be a given since he's a lead character now.

Gotcha.

I can see that sort of aggressive, social crusader activism/heroism being expressed through his reporting as Clark Kent, but I agree that it’s unlikely to see that sort of attitude regularly represented as Superman.

 

[SupermanFan]

That's good for people. I said I think he's kinda overrated....because I think he's kinda overrated. That's the case. Don't try and tell me what the case is. If I wanted that from you, I would've asked.

Lol you’re on a forum dude people can and will respond to your posts whether you like it or not. I stand by what by I said.

 

[The Batman]

Lol you’re on a forum dude people can and will respond to your posts whether you like it or not.

Thank you for pointing out the obvious. And if my problem were simply that you responded to me, this would be the appropriate response. But that wasn't the problem.

Gotcha.

I can see that sort of aggressive, social crusader activism/heroism being expressed through his reporting as Clark Kent, but I agree that it’s unlikely to see that sort of attitude regularly represented as Superman.

It'd be great if we could get that kind of Superman in the movies. I know this TV show probably means that Film Supes is being put on ice, but then again, they did put out "Superman Returns" while "Smallville" was still on TV.

 

[YÅ«gi's BM]

This...is an interesting turn of events. My guess is that after Crisis history is rewritten a bit. If Earth-38 isn't merged with Earth-1 then maybe it's just a change of their history? This way the series can start with a twelve or thirteen year old Jon and Lois and Clark having been married for twelve-plus years. Flashbacks could be used to cover any interesting material from their early days.

 

[Milk Tray Guy]

And considering he already has a Legion ring in the Fortress...

That's interesting.

 

[Flash525]

No, that’s not your point. You’re saying that Lois’ name shouldn’t be in the title of this show because it’ll ultimately be about Superman. That’s a contradiction on the logic you presented, which should have you assume that Lois would be every bit as important as Superman precisely because her name is in the title. To then go on to compare her level of important to Felicity’s and Iris’ in their respective series was just a weird decision on your part, because they’re incredibly important to Arrow and Flash, to the point where fans have been calling for them to be removed for years.

Actually yes, it was my point. Don’t perceive to tell me otherwise just because you disagree with my logic.

I think this show will ultimately be more about Superman than Lois, or even their child, regardless of how it may be being sold. That is why I’d prefer the show to aptly be named Superman.

You disagree? Fine, that’s your prerogative, but don’t feel the need to tell me what I mean. It’s arrogant.

 

[Boy Scout]

Actually yes, it was my point. Don’t perceive to tell me otherwise just because you disagree with my logic.

You’re not even following your own logic.

I think this show will ultimately be more about Superman than Lois, or even their child, regardless of how it may be being sold. That is why I’d prefer the show to aptly be named Superman.

You disagree? Fine, that’s your prerogative, but don’t feel the need to tell me what I mean. It’s arrogant.

I’m not. I responded to what you said. If you meant something else, it wasn’t expressed well.