filmakers do not make a film with the focal priority of doing these things (unless theyre really that pretentious about the film theyve made)
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Umm yeah, I did say that it was pretentious of filmmakers making a film under the impression that it would automatically compel audiences by default.
Of course filmmakers strive to do more then entertain, but that doesn't mean they will...so yeah, the basis of every film first and foremost is to entertain, which will entice the audience into giving the film the chance to make its statements, etc...
It's not really that hard a concept to understand.
Besides, I highly doubt I'd ever be offensive about an art form I'm paying and going to school for.
Okay so we disagree on that and thats fine, what about any other points? Also another one:
No strong female character: Thats one of the sticking points to the Terminator films and I just hated the Bloodgood scene where she gets taken by the 4 guys before we are treated to another "Worthington is unbeatable" scene.
Well he's in a war with them and paranoid, and them trying to build new machines while capturing humans at the same time can make you a little untrustworthy of a man who thinks he's human don't you think?
I just got back from seeing Terminator. I thought it was decent. The acting wasn't too bad inspite of a few cheesy lines. The action sequences were pretty darn good and the storyline was okay. The only thing lacking was the ending was fairly predictable and storylines after this will be repetitive. I give the movie a 7 out of 10 because it was entertaining and had no boring moments. Forget the reviewers.
A hint here or there would've been good to show this fact from the previous films. Connor was driven by pure hatred of them in this movie, I thought that'd come in the next film perhaps. He should've been more naive and inexperienced in this movie.
Considering it's been I think 23 years or more since T2 in particular in this film, and the fact that he's been fighting machines everyday for the last 15 years, I think his hatred was a logical way to go for his character.
Also considering the fact that he was told in T3 that he was killed due to letting himself slip it seems (the boyhood experiences thing), I think this was just wise. I've been thinking lately how stupid that twist in T3 was anyway. That's one thing I liked about this. He sees
Well he's in a war with them and paranoid, and them trying to build new machines while capturing humans at the same time can make you a little untrustworthy of a man who thinks he's human don't you think?
I'm just saying, this didn't feel like the same John Connor. I think this Connor should've been smarter and had more insight.
What is it about those Terminators that they were able to surpass their programming and become sympathetic to humans? John should be trying to figure that out.
Considering it's been I think 23 years or more since T2 in particular in this film, and the fact that he's been fighting machines everyday for the last 15 years, I think his hatred was a logical way to go for his character.
Also considering the fact that he was told in T3 that he was killed due to letting himself slip it seems (the boyhood experiences thing), I think this was just wise. I've been thinking lately how stupid that twist in T3 was anyway.
I'm not sure those two instances are enough to trump all the pain that I would think John has right now. The deaths of almost everyone around him, the probable anger and disappointment in the fact that Judgment Day happened anyway, no matter what they did. And then remembering what he's supposed to do, who he is supposed to be. Those two instances where machines saved him (from other machines who are doing what the machines are meant to do, kill us) were along time ago. I think too much has happened since then for him to revert back to those moments. He is and should be, focused on entirely preserving human life (which is one thing I liked about him here, because that general seemed to forget why the hell they were fighting skynet in the first place)
Amen to that. As I read through this thread today, I see that most of the "reviews," coming in are an attack on the "naysayers," or "lovers," as opposed to reviews of the film.
Based on what I've heard (the use of "You Could Be Mine", the explanation of John's facial scars, etc.) McG basically threw things in that said "Hey guys, remember how totally awesome T2 was? Well I'm referencing that so that you can think about how great T2 was, and then hopefully those emotions will bleed over in to your reaction to my film!"
I know that it's usually fun to reference past movies like that, but in this case it screams of lazy film making.
Also considering the fact that he was told in T3 that he was killed due to letting himself slip it seems (the boyhood experiences thing), I think this was just wise. I've been thinking lately how stupid that twist in T3 was anyway. That's one thing I liked about this. He sees
You'd think Connor would react in some way to the Terminator model which played such a huge role in his childhood. I'm not saying he should have high-fived it or anything, but he didn't even blink an eye.
Then so be it, that was a half-assed way of offing Connor. You'd think if John was going to die he'd die in a heroic way, not by being fooled into thinking he could trust a machine from his childhood that self terminated before his eyes.
just saw it. 7/10. would be a 5/10 if i didn't love the end so much. from the moment john went out on his own i thought the flick was great. and the T-800 was the incredible, indestructable bad mother ****er he was always meant to be.
filmakers do not make a film with the focal priority of doing these things (unless they’re really that pretentious about the film they’ve made)
-----
Umm yeah, I did say that it was pretentious of filmmakers making a film under the impression that it would automatically compel audiences by default.
Of course filmmakers strive to do more then entertain, but that doesn't mean they will...so yeah, the basis of every film first and foremost is to entertain, which will entice the audience into giving the film the chance to make its statements, etc...
It's not really that hard a concept to understand.
Besides, I highly doubt I'd ever be offensive about an art form I'm paying and going to school for.
I am sure your intention was not too offend but never the less i find your opinion unfortunate. Perhaps it is because so many in the "general audience" feel the same as you. That movies exist primarily for entertainment and are often willing to settle for little more.
My primary dissagreement is with two of your assumptions/assertions.
First, that the basis of every film is "first and foremost" to entertain. Sorry but i could not disagree more strongly. Perhaps if you feel that is the case maybe you should see more movies. The less mainstream the better. And heres another point. Sweeping generalizations such as those you have made are almost always wrong.
Second, i disagree that any filmaker who sets out "with the focal priority to do these things" (these things being the intention to inspire, move, or compel) is pretentious. You also put it this way "the intent to purposely compel and inspire is pretentious". isnt that what great filmakers should strive for? Some of my favorite films do this. In fact most of them do. I still think sarge said it best:
"The best filmmakers make films with specific ideas in mind, and "entertainment" value takes a back seat to making sure that the film is engaging, absorbing, and crafted in a way that illustrates the filmmakers intentions and elucidate abstract ideas or feelings. The best filmmakers make movies with the intention of tackling the the mysteries of the human condition and the way that people move through life."
Do you really think coppola set out to entertain when he made apocalypse now? Do you think shnabel set out to entertain when he made "diving bell and the butterfly"? Do you think goddard and the french new wave were trying to put butts in seats? Do you think that was their primary concern? I promise you it wasnt. If you think they are pretentious then i wonder why it is you want to make movies at all?
In fact i think you have it exactly the opposite. I think great filmakers set out to make movies because they have something to say and if people happen to be entertained along the way, so be it.
Those are the type of movies i love. Those are the type of films i consider great.
You are more than welcome to your opinion and to disagree but when you make sweeping generalizations (as you did) about the purpose of any art form and its respective artists you are always going to find yourself completely wrong.
enough derailing. since this is a review thread i will give a secondhand report.
My son just got back from the movie.
He said "it was like watching someone else play halo for two hours. Kyle Reese and Marcus were great but John Conner was annoying. And the ending was awesome"
BTW he is eleven.
I hope my heated and passionate argument has not offended you CFE or anyone else for that matter. If you would like to debate further i suggest we take it to p.m.
By the way? Mother**** Armond White. Anyone who has read his TS review should know what I'm talking about. He's the second worst film critic in America.
just finally saw it 8/10! only regret is the character development but It had GREAT action and If you've seen all the Terminators I believe you'll like this one too, Way better then T3 and 20 times better then Wolverine origins. Star Trek is still the best summer movie out now but TS had better action. great summer movie all the way
By the way? Mother**** Armond White. Anyone who has read his TS review should know what I'm talking about. He's the second worst film critic in America.
no kidding man. talk about pretentious. terminator salvation is the first film in the series with any humanity? give me a break white.
he is an psuedo iconoclast and gets off by being the odd man out. a contrarian, not by nature, but by necessity. if everyone was praising the film im sure he would bash it.
For those who actually enjoyed Terminator Salvation...
We've been fighting a long time and we have all lost so very much (sleep that is) so many hours gone, but you are not alone. There are pockets of resistance all around this site. We are at the brink.
They pack a lot of firepower but these critics are heavy and slow, they are primitive designs. If you can't ignore them you have one option...their motor cortex is partially exposed at the back of their neck, a knife to this area will disorient their ability to construct a compelling argument over the web...but not for long.
Above all stay awake, you have no idea how important you are. This is LostSon88, if you're listening to this...you are the resistance.
**just a joke y'all...I actually find the back and forth between everyone to be entertaining.
For those who actually enjoyed Terminator Salvation...
We've been fighting a long time and we have all lost so very much (sleep that is) so many hours gone, but you are not alone. There are pockets of resistance all around this site. We are at the brink.
They pack a lot of firepower but these critics are heavy and slow, they are primitive designs. If you can't ignore them you have one option...their motor cortex is partially exposed at the back of their neck, a knife to this area will disorient their ability to construct a compelling argument over the web...but not for long.
Above all stay awake, you have no idea how important you are. This is LostSon88, if you're listening to this...you are the resistance.
**just a joke y'all...I actually find the back and forth between everyone to be entertaining.
For those who actually enjoyed Terminator Salvation...
We've been fighting a long time and we have all lost so very much (sleep that is) so many hours gone, but you are not alone. There are pockets of resistance all around this site. We are at the brink.
They pack a lot of firepower but these critics are heavy and slow, they are primitive designs. If you can't ignore them you have one option...their motor cortex is partially exposed at the back of their neck, a knife to this area will disorient their ability to construct a compelling argument over the web...but not for long.
Above all stay awake, you have no idea how important you are. This is LostSon88, if you're listening to this...you are the resistance.
**just a joke y'all...I actually find the back and forth between everyone to be entertaining.
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isnt that what great filmakers should strive for? Some of my favorite films do this. In fact most of them do. I still think sarge said it best:
. terminator salvation is the first film in the series with any humanity? give me a break white.
You sir win the internet's!
Nice!
