The Battlestar Galactica and Caprica Discussion Thread

[Sawyer]

There must be some kind of way out of here...

[YT]Ka_sHy9cVH0[/YT]

 

[Darthkush]

"It's almost heavenly. It reminds me of you."


****ing heart-wrenching.

*sniffle*

Now somebody post an youtube clip of Tyrol choking Tory!t:

 

[Sawyer]

*sniffle*

Now somebody post an youtube clip of Tyrol choking Tory!t:

I looked, I couldnt find it. I found fragments of the entire finale, but they were all deleted.

 

[aaron]

so how were six and gaius in the future at the end? is that the angels?

..can people actually see them? i don't get how they are came to be.

 

[Malice]

Man I forgot it was on.
So I watched Part 1 on the scifi channel...then got my DVR out and pressed play for part 2 and 3.

I figured out, that they were going to hit earth, in our past...I knew it...said it from day 1...(I am historically bad at guessing how movies and shows end)

 

[Malice]

I thought the series ended just fine.
No big cliffhangers...no big...what the hells from me....surprised I guessed it so right....

 

[elgaz]

so how were six and gaius in the future at the end? is that the angels?

..can people actually see them? i don't get how they are came to be.

We don't know what they are really, the series was left like that as the writers wanted to leave some element of mystery. Angels? Demons? Agents of 'God'? We never really know. They are definitely not human ........ my personal take on it was that they're observers of some kind working for whatever supreme being has planned all this, but have no particularly good/evil inclination. I don't think the being in question is either good OR evil - they are much bigger than all we can imagine and encompass everything.

 

[Malice]

I wanted to throw my comments in here...and Sentry put a nice little summation, I will throw my comments after his in a few places....

Somehow I guessed the timeline of BSG was actually happening in the past of the Earth timeline....I guessed this back when the show started...but again, just a wild guess that I happened to be right on.

I cried. I'll admit it. And straight away after my life seemed a little more sucky by comparison with what I've shared with these characters. I recorded the mini-series all those years ago with the vague hope that this would be a decent Sci-Fi show, in a genre saturated with SG-1 and Enterprize, while killing off Farscape in it's prime. It went beyond that, it actually made me think and moved me.

I enjoyed the show. I am one of those people that can watch a show and critique it too much.... In the end, I thought it was a good ending. Of course there are issues and little thorns in the theory...but all in all...nice.

I LOVED seeing the classic Cylons fighting....Loved it!

About the Galactica....
Yeah, when they were jumping, I knew it was the last time it was going to jump. The Galactica was another character of the series, that was getting sicker and sicker every episode....It finally decided to help out the main chars one last time...than gave up the ghost.

About Sam
I never had a like/dislike of Sam...*shrug*

Kara I can live with. I even love that aspect. Kara was always better than the rest. I fell in line with the Daniel theory, and while I liked that, I still like this. And in fairness, the Daniel theory isn't decimated by Kara's more metephysical reveal; she could have been Half Cylon, and the Messianic agent of God (God's not on anyone's side). And I like that she goes back to being dead. It does beg the question of how her Viper got to Earth when she died, but I've watched Farscape. Wormholes rock.

About Kara....
I have not read the boards....what is the Daniel Theory everyone is talking about. My thoughts on her, she was a guide. The was a spiritual guide to get them where they needed to go, when the time was right. I see her as the guide, as she repeatedly has had visions and knowledge of places they needed to go. The Painting on the wall.....the music....the arrow of Athena...
In the end, I am little put off she vanishes....

Baltar was awesome. Tyrol was awesome (take that you back stabbing, Callie-murdering, side-switching, two-faced ***** tori!), Cavil's death was AWESOME. Much better than anyone killing him.

About Baltar and 6
Baltar was not good, was not bad. I see him and 6 being one in the same being almost. They are slivers of each other. I see them, as a higher being that serves the same being, Kara was sent as the guide for. When I think back....I see 6 and Baltar are avatars (physical incarnations), of a higher being. Their spiritual side Baltar and 6 is their spiritual side....


About Ty and his wife
I am not sure what the hell to make of them honestly...

About Galen/Chief/Tyrel
I believe the description he gives is for the English Isles....Scottish/Gaelic background as I see it...

About The Dumping of Technology
I see this as a problem and a good thing at the same, so I will break it down.
Think about the majority of the people in that fleet. The majority didn't work, or had suck a god awful job that required them never to really enjoy life for 4 years. Remember, there was no preparation in the exodus. These people now, probably just wanted to be able to stretch their legs and live outdoors again.

I understand from a personal aspect of wanting to try to start over....but starting over to me, doesn't mean, living like a caveman. They still have their minds. Many of them would have the knowledge to apply basic principles to everyday living.

What did this trully mean? I think this meant, that the survivors, were suppossed to meet the natives, and integrate with them, and teach them. Help them grow. This in turn would allow the survivors to grow themselves.

What is everyones thoughts on this?

 

[Superfreak]

I wanted to throw my comments in here...and Sentry put a nice little summation, I will throw my comments after his in a few places....

Somehow I guessed the timeline of BSG was actually happening in the past of the Earth timeline....I guessed this back when the show started...but again, just a wild guess that I happened to be right on.



I enjoyed the show. I am one of those people that can watch a show and critique it too much.... In the end, I thought it was a good ending. Of course there are issues and little thorns in the theory...but all in all...nice.

I LOVED seeing the classic Cylons fighting....Loved it!

About the Galactica....
Yeah, when they were jumping, I knew it was the last time it was going to jump. The Galactica was another character of the series, that was getting sicker and sicker every episode....It finally decided to help out the main chars one last time...than gave up the ghost.

About Sam
I never had a like/dislike of Sam...*shrug*



About Kara....
I have not read the boards....what is the Daniel Theory everyone is talking about. My thoughts on her, she was a guide. The was a spiritual guide to get them where they needed to go, when the time was right. I see her as the guide, as she repeatedly has had visions and knowledge of places they needed to go. The Painting on the wall.....the music....the arrow of Athena...
In the end, I am little put off she vanishes....



About Baltar and 6
Baltar was not good, was not bad. I see him and 6 being one in the same being almost. They are slivers of each other. I see them, as a higher being that serves the same being, Kara was sent as the guide for. When I think back....I see 6 and Baltar are avatars (physical incarnations), of a higher being. Their spiritual side Baltar and 6 is their spiritual side....


About Ty and his wife
I am not sure what the hell to make of them honestly...

About Galen/Chief/Tyrel
I believe the description he gives is for the English Isles....Scottish/Gaelic background as I see it...

About The Dumping of Technology
I see this as a problem and a good thing at the same, so I will break it down.
Think about the majority of the people in that fleet. The majority didn't work, or had suck a god awful job that required them never to really enjoy life for 4 years. Remember, there was no preparation in the exodus. These people now, probably just wanted to be able to stretch their legs and live outdoors again.

I understand from a personal aspect of wanting to try to start over....but starting over to me, doesn't mean, living like a caveman. They still have their minds. Many of them would have the knowledge to apply basic principles to everyday living.

What did this trully mean? I think this meant, that the survivors, were suppossed to meet the natives, and integrate with them, and teach them. Help them grow. This in turn would allow the survivors to grow themselves.

What is everyones thoughts on this?

that's about right.

I don't think the guess about the past was all that far out. This series pretty much followed the narrative of the original, just rearticulated for a more educated audience. In hindsight, much of what happened on the show was quite predictable... but that is just semantic. What was great about the show, is how the predictable turns were delivered... in suprising and new ways.

I'm gonna miss this show. And I can only be left wondering what TV show will or can take BSG away from my top position. BSG and Farscape really have been the two shows that have expanded the sci fi genre for me. They're two shows that took sci fi, and treated it properly: as a setting. I very happy with the ending of both series'


I've been looking forward to 'next week' or 'next season' for so long now and suddenly I have friday nights back (it's been a very long time).

 

[Malice]

I have not read the boards....what is the Daniel Theory everyone is talking about in relation to Kara?

 

[BlackLantern]

I think the 'Daniel' issue was a sinkhole, just thrown out there to mess with people...Ellen even said that Cavil killed him/them off....we are all just assuming he was alive somewhere

 

[Malice]

I think the 'Daniel' issue was a sinkhole, just thrown out there to mess with people...Ellen even said that Cavil killed him/them off....we are all just assuming he was alive somewhere

Maybe I am clueless .... but not following you.

 

[BlackLantern]

when Ellen "returned" to the fleet, she was talking about the final five and the development of the other human form Cylons....she mentioned that Daniel was originally part of that group but Cavil sabotaged the pods and killed them off because, in ellens opinion, she favored him too much over Cavill

 

[TheCorpulent1]

I assumed Daniel was dead because Cavill killed him, but Starbuck was his daughter.

 

[wobbly]

Maybe I am clueless .... but not following you.

When Ellen was resurrected it was revealed that the final 5 were in fact the first 5, and it was them who created 8 humanoid model Cylons for the Colonials mechanical Cylons. One of these was called Daniel, described as being artistic, who Caville effectively had destroyed by apparently polluting his genetic information (According to Ellen he did this out of jealousy).
After this Caville had the 5 banished to live in the colonies with no memory of their true selves. He also wiped the memory of Daniel from the other models and restricted their knowledge of the 5 to simply knowing they existed.
When all this was revealed it seemed possible this Daniel could be Kara's father (what with her own ressurrection and herself being artistic too this did seem like a good bet). When Kara was visited by the piano man (apparently another 'angel') it was an easy leap to think this man was the image of her father* and could still be Daniel.

However, before the finale RDM shot all of this speculation down, saying Daniel is not and never was her father so that was pretty much the end of it.

*I don't think they confirmed the Piano man was her father but it seems safe to assume this was another manifestation of the Angels, like Head 6 and Baltar, appearing for Kara only to help her understand the significance of the music she had learned as a child. This idea is not without problems though: If Kara's father was a normal human, then where did he get the music (complete with notes corresponding to specific numbers that plot the course to Earth from The Cylon colony) that he taught to Kara?

 

[888]

Until contradicted by a tv movie or "Caprica", I'm just gonna keep believing Daniel really was Starbuck's father, even if Ron Moore says differently. It's more interesting to me and does not hurt the mythos in any way.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

I suppose it's possible that Daniel didn't actually have any relation to Kara, but angel-Kara just automatically had new knowledge the humans and Cylons needed to fulfill their destiny in the form of her memories of her dad/Daniel's song.

 

[Sentry2005]

Someone quoted me... awesome.

Yeah, the Daniel theory is as stated. It was really a way of explaining the numbering issues (5 + 7 makes 12, but Boomer being number 8 messed things up.), but it did feel natural or 'right' once people started talking about Kara's human resurrection.

I still like it. It would explain why both the other Final Five and Kara glow when Anders sees them (now it just seems that the others from the five are basking in Kara's glow...), and Kara's general better-ness throughout the show. But alas, it's just something I choose to throw in there to add to the overall tone of the narrative, as RDM has disputed it a hell of a lot.

In regards to what that makes Kara's father? A prophet like Roslin I assume would be the answer. Someone who had such a connection with the way he received knowledge, that when given the choice of his family or his connection to the 'plan' he chose his music.

 

[elgaz]

I had some more thoughts on it today.

In my opinion, the entire saga - the long voyage through space, everything they've been through - was one huge test put in motion by this 'God' or supreme being who is behind everything. The human race was all but dead (only 40-odd thousand left from hundreds of millions), destroyed by their own Cylon creations .............but perhaps this God felt they should have a final chance to prove their worth. And thus the survivors somehow made it through the holocaust, were cast out into space to look for a new home, and were followed by their Cylon adversaries.

The 4 seasons of BSG thus ensued, with all the ups and down, trials and tribulations, the politics, drama, love, everything. And finally we reach an endpoint where the Galactica itself, arguably the symbolic vessel for all that is left of humanity, is starting to come apart at the seams. Given that they are still no closer to finding a home, and Earth has turned out to be a dormant wasteland, it surely seems like there is no hope left - and perhaps that what this God wants to find out; will humanity give up hope completely? Neither religion nor science has offered them a solution, so will they simply die alone in space, cold and hungry as their supplies and fuel run out?

Adama provides the answer. Though they could easily float in space for years and waste away, he asks the entire fleet to look past their own worries, their own concerns, and search for Hera, a child stolen by the Cylons. And this is the critical juncture where the decisions are made that will shape the destiny of the human race; no matter how bad things are for them all, they will still put their lives in danger to save an innocent child. Life itself - not their own, but the life of another - finally proves to be the most important thing to them. It was only through Adama's leadership that this is realised.

The irony is that by saving Hera, they are finally rewarded. Kara realises what the music means and her co-ordinates finally lead them to a new home. Had they not gone back for Hera, would the stimulus have been there for Kara to realise her destiny? Would they have found the new Earth eventually? Probably not. But by doing so, they prove their worth and humanity eventually repopulates.

 

[Malice]

Nice thoughts

 

[Superfreak]

Until contradicted by a tv movie or "Caprica", I'm just gonna keep believing Daniel really was Starbuck's father, even if Ron Moore says differently. It's more interesting to me and does not hurt the mythos in any way.

dude, Caprica occurs well before the first Cylon war... The F5 did not arrive in the 12 colonies until the end of the first war (they ended it). So Caprica takes place well before the idea of skin jobs (the ones we know) were even developed... let alone concieved(they were built after the end of the first war).

 

[TheCorpulent1]

Except they were actually built for the first time before the first Cylon War by humans on Caprica, it seems...

 

[Sawyer]

I'm still not sure what to make of Caprica, to be honest. I got the impression that the final 5 made the 8 skinjobs themselves, not some pansy-ass that lost his daughter...

 

[Superfreak]

Except they were actually built for the first time before the first Cylon War by humans on Caprica, it seems...

yeah, but not the skinjobs we know. Daniel was built by Ellen, given that Caprica takes place 50 years before BSG, atleast 10 years before the 1st cylon war... these won't be the skin jobs we know (or daniel for that matter). This holds true unless the show covers up to the end of the first war, at which point, it is plausible that we might see the F5.

 

[Sawyer]

yeah, but not the skinjobs we know. Daniel was built by Ellen, given that Caprica takes place 50 years before BSG, atleast 10 years before the 1st cylon war... these won't be the skin jobs we know (or daniel for that matter). This holds true unless the show covers up to the end of the first war, at which point, it is plausible that we might see the F5.

Gods, I hope so. This movie "The Plan" cant be the last time I ever see Saul Tigh...