The Defenders The Defenders General Discussion Thread - Part 1

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Yeah and Netflix typically offers free one month trials even the month a new show premieres. You don't have to subscribe to Netflix every month. And the mobile apps offer offline downloading now.
 
Good for you... it's not like Netflix is that expensive though...

True. But I've gotten so use to torrents that I can't stand watching something online, unless it's on Youtube.

I've used Netflix to watch a Norwegian series earlier this year, since there wasn't English subs available online.
 
Btw after re-watching Iron Fist, I have to wonder how was he so popular in the comics to begin with? His fists light up and he knows hella king-fu, but was that really a clincher for fans? I know the 70's kung-fu/karate films were all the rage, but maybe I'm missing something.

Since haven't we seen many of the rich guy turned crimefighter in Batman/Iron Man/Green Arrow to say the least. what set Iron Fist apart?
 
Btw after re-watching Iron Fist, I have to wonder how was he so popular in the comics to begin with? His fists light up and he knows hella king-fu, but was that really a clincher for fans? I know the 70's kung-fu/karate films were all the rage, but maybe I'm missing something.

Since haven't we seen many of the rich guy turned crimefighter in Batman/Iron Man/Green Arrow to say the least. what set Iron Fist apart?
it was the rage you must not have heard of kung fu the legend continue's with the guy that played bill in kill bill.

there was alot popular back inthe day and through the 90's and early 2000's and iron fist was capable of alot inthe book's he was able to free people from telepthic control and a special technique , other iron fist's before danny can channel their chi energy into bullets of hand guns and as the series of heroes for hire and the marvel knights went on and to avengers he's able to a lot more .
 
To elaborate. It was part of craze and bigger than life trend and where they have people of other race since the time of Bruce Lee where he got people of other races into martial arts and any one of any race can learn it. and Danny came into being following all that and both film tv and comic ate it up. where white guys got into or those of bi racial mixing of white and Asian and then other races followed it .

The actor I spoke of that played bill, the actor David Karadeen was in the well-known show of "kung fu" and the show I mentioned "kungfu the legend continues " that stars him and his one-quarter Asian son that was defective. It was a very popular series thing. back in the day.


As to the "Rich" thing. it's was just common with comic writers. but Danny wasn't that into it in the books compared to others like Bruce who used it as his cover or Tony Stark. (That loved fame from it.)
 
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It also helps that the Iron Fist comic was *vastly better written* than the TV show. When your writer is Chris Claremonte just before his peak. . .
 
It also helps that the Iron Fist comic was *vastly better written* than the TV show. When your writer is Chris Claremont just before his peak. . .
Well yeah, there's that and the fact that unlike the time when he came back he was mostly doing focus work on one titled series. when he came back and did x-men and during x treme x-men and Excalibur.

He was also doing other comic titles for other comic publishers at the same time as well. That's also a factor of current day comics. some certain writers especially great legendary vets like Claremont shouldn't be multitasking.

That's what different from back for him and what happening these days .
 
I appreciate the posts. I knew kung-fu was popular, but not to the extent that it was. I grew up in the 90's with Jackie Chan films.

80% on RT ain't bad. Though I hope it climbs a little.

Most fans would think 8 episodes might be perfect for all the series going forward.
 
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I appreciate the posts. I knew kung-fu was popular, but not to the extent that it was. I grew up in the 90's with Jackie Chan films.

80% on RT ain't bad. Though I hope it climbs a little.

Most fans would think 8 episodes might be perfect for all the series going forward.

Kung Fu was popular, but when I tried to watch it again recently a couple of years ago, it was absolutely crap. It was deadly slow at a glacial pace and the fighting was even worse than I remembered (and I already recalled it being rather bad). I think I couldn't even make it through the whole of the pilot.
 
Truth be told they were really into slomo's with the older version. And I liked the legend continues better. but I 'm only speaking for my self. a lot becomes dated eventually.


I appreciate the posts. I knew kung-fu was popular, but not to the extent that it was. I grew up in the 90's with Jackie Chan films.

80% on RT ain't bad. Though I hope it climbs a little.

Most fans would think 8 episodes might be perfect for all the series going forward.
Yeah, the whole martial art's craze thing was huge from before Jackie chan he came in the mid part popularity wise. it's gone little quiet these days it. Due to both cultural shifts and the current day problems of recession and referendum's other craziness like nutty prez's running country's. oy

it's still in decent place. but the craze was before this the 90's through out early 00's was the golden age. these things go down and make come back though. so we'll see.
 
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It also helps that the Iron Fist comic was *vastly better written* than the TV show. When your writer is Chris Claremonte just before his peak. . .
He was at his peak actually, issue 15 shows the Phoenix as friends with Misty Knight.
 
Truth be told they were really into slomo's with the older version. And I liked the legend continues better. but I 'm only speaking for my self. a lot becomes dated eventually.

I thought the Legend Continues was even worse personally. David Carradine just sucks.

Yeah, the whole martial art's craze thing was huge from before Jackie chan he came in the mid part popularity wise. it's gone little quiet these days it. Due to both cultural shifts and the current day problems of recession and referendum's other craziness like nutty prez's running country's. oy

it's still in decent place. but the craze was before this the 90's through out early 00's was the golden age. these things go down and make come back though. so we'll see.

Jackie Chan didn't come in midway. His early films start in the 1970s, which is exactly when the Kung Fu craze really kicked off. Of course, not all of them are well known, but two of his most famous films from that period are Snake in the Eagle's Shadow and Drunken Master. Drunken Master is still probably his best film IMO. It actually showcases his martial arts ability rather than later relying on wirework or just crazy stunts.

Drunken Master is of course an influence on that villain that Iron Fist fought in season 1 of his own series. How Finn Jones's Rand managed to beat him is bewildering. I don't know how he beat anyone.

Iron Fist was created in the 70s during the Kung Fu craze, along with Shang Chi, who was made to look a bit like a Bruce Lee clone. I think Power Man and Iron Fist as a combined book capitalised on the success of films like Enter the Dragon which combined both martial arts and blaxploitation. I would rather see a series with those two than just an individual series for both. That way it would force the writers to strip away any unnecessary filler and boring bits like board meetings, because you'd have to cater to both Cage and Fist, and there would be more than enough material both to fill out the whole 13 episodes and to keep it interesting.
 
I wouldn't say that martial arts is unpopular. Its just that martial arts is now ubiquitous. Hong Kong cinema is no longer the exclusive source of high quality hand to hand stuntwork.
 
Yeah martial arts is ubiquitious. Even the three musketeers can do it, and the characters from Pride and Prejudice. :hehe:

That's why Iron Fist is nothing special. Even his iron fist is nothing special. Sammo Hung channelled his chi into his fist in the series finale of Martial Law to smash down a solid steel door, and he was just a normal human being.

That's why Danny Rand needs his costume to set him apart from others, so that he's a superhero. Otherwise he's just one of hundreds of martial artists who are a dime a dozen.
 
I thought the Legend Continues was even worse personally. David Carradine just sucks.hmm , no, it was just the style of how they wanted it filmed and what it was known for. besides I was more for the detective one Quarter Asian son of hi s parts any ways.



Jackie Chan didn't come in midway. His early films start in the 1970s, which is exactly when the Kung Fu craze really kicked off. Of course, not all of them are well known, but two of his most famous films from that period are Snake in the Eagle's Shadow and Drunken Master. Drunken Master is still probably his best film IMO. It actually showcases his martial arts ability rather than later relying on wirework or just crazy stunts.


Drunken master is known as his best work to everyone.but there were a lot of other's before him which I skipped cause I wanted to sorta keep this short. it was late and I did have other stuff to post else where before I wore out mentally . to me he's middle. Everyone has slightly different views of when some certain knows came in so for me and some others he was in the middle and thick of it . and his biggest name shout out was the just at 90's I'm talking world wide. he was known before but that's still his golden age . next to samo hung. and jet lee etc

Also kung fu the legend continues, introduced the whole merc with a heart of gold thing with detective sykes who formerly was one. that Marvel loves pushing anything else with mercenary they are the most hated soldier's alive in tv history and other media next to real life depending and the 80's kung fu is the only show that treated merc's the same way Marvel does.

So there's a reason I said that show there's a lot that fed into marvel from there even if people didn't or don't see it.
Drunken Master is, of course, an influence on that villain that Iron Fist fought in season 1 of his own series. How Finn Jones's Rand managed to beat him is bewildering. I don't know how he beat anyone.



that may have more to do with production and mistakes there. of which
I won't bother to answer cause on the people behind the scene can answer that. and I don't work there. they made a chose it's all for them to answer.
Iron Fist was created in the 70s during the Kung Fu craze, along with Shang Chi, who was made to look a bit like a Bruce Lee clone. I think Power Man and Iron Fist as a combined book capitalised on the success of films like Enter the Dragon which combined both martial arts and blaxploitation. I would rather see a series with those two than just an individual series for both. That way it would force the writers to strip away any unnecessary filler and boring bits like board meetings, because you'd have to cater to both Cage and Fist, and there would be more than enough material both to fill out the whole 13 episodes and to keep it interesting.


the board room talks are a thing for net flix it's self danny in the books didn't deal with that cause in the books they made clear his education was like high school grad level at best from what the monk's at the city taught him and he didn't have a head for business. so the book's didn't bother with it at all and later like the 90's someone else a female CEO was more prominent for that company of his.

this is for the show and they will likely have Danny drop it all together. or they may push it in different direction cause the writer's of the show wants to make a name for them selves. they just want to get all the later stories about the iron fist lore out of the way before they are come full on partners I guess.


in the comic's he barely dealt heavy with his family company it was their line early stories. but he never cared for it. not the way they are pushing it in the show.

Yeah martial arts is ubiquitious. Even the three musketeers can do it, and the characters from Pride and Prejudice. :hehe:

That's why Iron Fist is nothing special. Even his iron fist is nothing special. Sammo Hung channelled his chi into his fist in the series finale of Martial Law to smash down a solid steel door, and he was just a normal human being.

That's why Danny Rand needs his costume to set him apart from others, so that he's a superhero. Otherwise he's just one of hundreds of martial artists who are a dime a dozen.
oh martial law was cancelled too soon and that when CBS really become the weird old people channel. killing some shows like the martial arts weekend was big mistake.


well hey the french from france do have a martial arts call savate though the musketeers knowing it??? and I've seen french film like the one where they had a French men and his native American umm Canadian actually taking some weird psycho with a bone snake blade in what was supposed to be a period piece on Canada too. I did question that part though. the actor that played woe fat was playing the native inthe movie .


Did they kick people well with other Musketeer movies they did but I don't think I'd call it martial art's
 
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well hey the french from france do have a martila arts call savate though the musketers knowing it??? and I've seen fren film like thone where they a french men and his native american umm canndian actully taking some weird psycho with a snake blade in what was supposed to be a period piece on canada too. I did question that part though. so

The Musketeers knowing martial arts was from the 2001 movie "The Musketeer" with fight choreography from Xin-Xin Xiong who also served as a stunt double for Jet Li previously.

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And Pride and Prejudice characters knowing it was in Pride and Prejudice and Zombies. Elizabeth Bennett and her sisters had all been sent off to train in China and learn martial arts to defend themselves against zombies. And Mr Darcy also knew it too.

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With everyone doing it, Iron Fist looks nothing special, especially if he's only at the level of Finn Jones.
 
The Musketeers knowing martial arts was from the 2001 movie "The Musketeer" with fight choreography from Xin-Xin Xiong who also served as a stunt double for Jet Li previously.

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And Pride and Prejudice characters knowing it was in Pride and Prejudice and Zombies. Elizabeth Bennett and her sisters had all been sent off to train in China and learn martial arts to defend themselves against zombies. And Mr Darcy also knew it too.

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With everyone doing it, Iron Fist looks nothing special, especially if he's only at the level of Finn Jones.

lol like i said before there other period in media where the musketeer kicked people in their fights of the othe mediums alot before this. but I wouldn't call it martial art's . not the way both you and me most people that fallow martial art's really know it.


understand when I say this I'm not argueing. I get what your saying on the when it started and it for that movie of the musketeer and then that movie pride and zombie which was about being slighty jokey and stylized was just doing it all cause they thought it was cool next to that other you mentioned befor it.

which trying to be unique. lol I think there some animted show where they had the musketeer alwys running roof top and doing aqabatic's too. that might confuse some thinking they were doing martial arts too. oh and they were dog's
 
lol like i said before there other period in media where the musketeer kicked people in their fights of the othe mediums alot before this. but I wouldn't call it martial art's . not the way both you and me most people that fallow martial art's really know it.


understand when I say this I'm not argueing. I get what your saying on the when it started and it for that movie of the musketeer and then that movie pride and zombie which was about being slighty jokey and stylized was just doing it all cause they thought it was cool next to that other you mentioned befor it.

which trying to be unique. lol I think there some animted show where they had the musketeer alwys running roof top and doing aqabatic's too. that might confuse some thinking they were doing martial arts too. oh and they were dog's

I think "The Musketeer" was more like the slapstick fight and stunt choreography of some of Jackie Chan's later movies in the 90s. The emphasis on those movies was more on stunts and wire work. Compared to his earlier stuff, he was rather light on the martial arts.

When I want to see Iron Fist doing martial arts, I want it more like Jackie Chan's 70s films where he was less reliant on the stunts and it was pure fighting - like the stuff you see in Snake in the Eagle's Shadow or Drunken Master. I don't want to be wowed by wire work and gravity-defying moves like Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon. I want to be wowed by impressive fighting techniques and martial arts prowess.

I was less impressed by Jackie Chan's later movies than his earlier ones where it was pure martial arts. That's why I prefer Bruce Lee's movies to Jackie Chan's later movies, because that was just pure fighting techniques too, and none of these other tricks to try to wow you.

Finn Jones would be better off playing Kwai Chang Cain in a Kung Fu remake, if they wanted to get someone of the same ability as David Carradine (which is not much ability at all).
 
I think "The Musketeer" was more like the slapstick fight and stunt choreography of some of Jackie Chan's later movies in the 90s. The emphasis on those movies was more on stunts and wire work. Compared to his earlier stuff, he was rather light on the martial arts.

When I want to see Iron Fist doing martial arts, I want it more like Jackie Chan's 70s films where he was less reliant on the stunts and it was pure fighting - like the stuff you see in Snake in the Eagle's Shadow or Drunken Master. I don't want to be wowed by wire work and gravity-defying moves like Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon. I want to be wowed by impressive fighting techniques and martial arts prowess.

I was less impressed by Jackie Chan's later movies than his earlier ones where it was pure martial arts. That's why I prefer Bruce Lee's movies to Jackie Chan's later movies, because that was just pure fighting techniques too, and none of these other tricks to try to wow you.

Finn Jones would be better off playing Kwai Chang Cain in a Kung Fu remake, if they wanted to get someone of the same ability as David Carradine (which is not much ability at all).

lol he's gonna feel type casted and a lot other weirdness will ensue from that. and know the people that do bother with a remake of the kung fu series I'm not sure they will hire him since net flix even if it was as good it still got a second season. and it's still what hot now. to a degree.

Also, it may be better to continue with Kwai Chang Cain's quarter Asian detective son as the lead .take a lesson from the karate kid and move forward. she should have learned enough from his pops to be a master now.


lol, truth be told before they hired Finn. I didn't know him as martial artist if at all. He's still some what new to me. And if you did see me in the iron fist thread's I did say I wish Brandon lee was still around or they hired some similar to him if they were going younger. if not a bi racial actor at least someone of martial arts high back ground.

But I also like unknowns, cause they last longer. I think what went wrong has something to do with both the writing and the production.

this is the only thing I can say and the maker's of the show know it them selves admit to it. and they are doing a lot with this cross over and likely the second season of iron fist after this to remedy their mistakes there.
 
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I recall in Avengers Alliance (remember those days? - was it a year ago it ended or was it two years ago?) how Iron Fist was a pretty awesome character to play. He was one of the best fighters.

Imagine if that game had still been going and we got a Defenders Spec Op or even a Netflix Iron Fist Spec Op. We'd get a costume variation of Iron Fist of Finn Jones with a beard and no costume and severely nerfed powers and fighting skills.

I don't know if they would've done one of Iron Fist though, because they didn't do one for Daredevil or Luke Cage when those series came out. But they did do one for Jessica Jones. But I'm sure they would've done one for an event like the Defenders.

I miss that game.
 
I recall in Avengers Alliance (remember those days? - was it a year ago it ended or was it two years ago?) how Iron Fist was a pretty awesome character to play. He was one of the best fighters.

Imagine if that game had still been going and we got a Defenders Spec Op or even a Netflix Iron Fist Spec Op. We'd get a costume variation of Iron Fist of Finn Jones with a beard and no costume and severely nerfed powers and fighting skills.

I don't know if they would've done one of Iron Fist though, because they didn't do one for Daredevil or Luke Cage when those series came out. But they did do one for Jessica Jones. But I'm sure they would've done one for an event like the Defenders.

I miss that game.
it was my best & longest running active thread .

now he's a major player in marvel future fight where that stuff from avengers alliance has gone to that game with the addtion of the X-men etc.




there's also Marvel heroes omgea on console's too where he's there and cool. there' supposedtobe live stream on twitch for the latter with give aways like they do every time prior to that .
 
Since we don't have a thread for it yet, just wanted to mention that the Critics Consensus is in: "Marvel's The Defenders further develops well-known characters in an action-packed arc whose payoff packs more than enough of a punch to offset its flaws."

Looks promising!
 
http://www.rollingstone.com/tv/news...superhero-show-is-three-fourths-great-w496490


Enter The Defenders – the long-awaited all-star team at the heart of the Netflix Marvel universe. Four superheroes, all loners with radically different powers and personalities. There's blind lawyer Matt Murdoch (Charlie Cox), who used to kick ass by night on the streets of Hell's Kitchen as the vigilante Daredevil; now he's trying to stick to his day job after hanging up the mask and retiring from the superhero racket. There's Luke Cage (Mike Colter), the bulletproof Harlem avenger, and the hard-boiled private eye Jessica Jones (Krysten Ritter). And then there's the billionaire martial-arts master Danny Rand (Finn Jones), a.k.a. the Iron Fist, whose superpower is his ability to make everyone in the room cringe. No wonder they all have their doubts about the future of the superhero racket – as Jessica Jones hisses at one point, "Don't say the H-word!"

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Watch Netflix's Intense, Wisecracking 'Defenders' Trailer
Daredevil (Charlie Cox), Jessica Jones (Krysten Ritter), Luke Cage (Mike Colter), Iron Fist (Finn Jones) unite against evil in preview of Marvel show
The Defenders thrives on the conflicts in this crew – their differences end up being a lot more fascinating than their similarities. What brings them together is an epic battle against the forces of evil, courtesy of none other than Sigourney Weaver, who rules in slinky dominatrix mode as Alexandra, the evil queenpin with ties to the elusive criminal empire known as the Hand. Daredevil, who has been mourning the death of his lover Elektra (Elodie Yung), finds that she's come back to life. Only she's now under the spell of the Hand, and each of these four different h-words get pulled into the fight. Hence, figures from the complete quartet of the streaming juggernaut's Marvel franchises show up here – including Rosario Dawson as the nurse Claire Temple, who seems to function as a symbolic guardian angel for the whole crew.

Luke Cage and Jessica Jones have their own personal connection as exes – we first saw him on her show, as they teamed up to wreck her bed in a bout of cathartic superhero sex. But if anything unites this fight club, it's that the other three can agree that the Iron Fist is a royal *****e. Cage, Jones and Murdock all seem like haunted adults who've endured some serious ****; they have apparently let their barista tag along as part of his gap-year Outward Bound course for aspiring alienated kung-fu masters. It could have been titled Three and a Half Superheroes, though that would be too kind. As the mentor of Daredevil, Scott Glenn's Stick says, "The Immortal Iron Fist, protector of the sacred realm, is still a thundering dumbass."

Like most Netflix series, the show gets off to a mighty slow start – the foursome don't get together until the end of the third episode, for a fight scene. And it's only in the fourth that they sit down over some Chinese food and agree to join forces. As Jones, Krysten Ritter is the only one who knows her way around the business end of a one-liner, so she handles most of the banter burden when it comes to quips. All four of these Netflix Marvel shows had deeply different tones and styles, but since Daredevil was the one that came first – and the only one that's completed a second season so far – it makes sense that it's the template for The Defenders, especially since it has the same showrunners, Douglas Petrie and Marco Ramirez.

Luke Cage and Jessica Jones, the best of these series, thrived on mood, personality and atmosphere rather than story – both seemed to run out of plot before the debut season was up. But both characters remain credible full-fledged humans here. Ritter and Colter carry themselves with a protective emotional armor over their private grief and trauma; in his quieter, moodier way, so does Cox as Murdock. They've survived crippling pain – that's what makes them dangerous.

The weak link: Danny Rand, the Iron Fist, is just tragically devoid of charisma. His elevator just doesn't seem to reach the upper floors. (If this guy's a "major" superhero, who are the minor ones?) Jessica Henwick returns as his partner and dojo-mate Colleen Wing, but she'd be a far more intriguing character if she had something to do besides shake her head at her twit of a boyfriend– if only they'd cast her as the Fist. The series tries to make the most of Danny's limitations by making him the butt of everyone else's scorn. That isn't quite enough to make you glad when he shows up in a scene, but at least it's useful for Luke Cage to have a dim-bulb rich white kid to snarl at. The Defenders is not exactly a team of equals, to say the least. But it goes three for four – and with these three different compelling superheroes in the mix, it's a squad worth rooting for.
 
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