The Health Thread

[rodhulk]

I think most of us are concerned with our health, perhaps more than ever before due to what's in our food these days. The first thing I'm curious of is:

SODIUM

I've been told two things in regards to this in respect to water.

I've been told that water will help against too much sodium as it will help dilute it and/or wash it out of the system faster. So, the more water you have, the more sodium you can have.

Yet I've also been told that water will dilute it but no matter how much water you drink, the sodium still will eventually play it's usual unhealthy role as it would have if you hadn't had any water at all (so, regardless of how much water one may drink, it will do nothing to limit the effects of sodium).


I'm also curious on what foods would help against excessive sodium. I'm assuming fruits and vegetables but what kind of fruits and vegetables would be best and what other foods may halp against excessive sodium?

 

[Bboy]

Good questions that I need the answers for as well! Haha.

 

[Midnyte_Sun]

I think most of us are concerned with our health, perhaps more than ever before due to what's in our food these days. The first thing I'm curious of is:

SODIUM

I've been told two things in regards to this in respect to water.

I've been told that water will help against too much sodium as it will help dilute it and/or wash it out of the system faster. So, the more water you have, the more sodium you can have.

Yet I've also been told that water will dilute it but no matter how much water you drink, the sodium still will eventually play it's usual unhealthy role as it would have if you hadn't had any water at all (so, regardless of how much water one may drink, it will do nothing to limit the effects of sodium).


I'm also curious on what foods would help against excessive sodium. I'm assuming fruits and vegetables but what kind of fruits and vegetables would be best and what other foods may halp against excessive sodium?

Why not just lower your intake of sodium? Reduce your intake of processed foods like Chips and other salted snacks, fast food, canned foods, and frozen dinners.

Also exercise helps reduce your sodium as your body will sweat it out.

 

[AndThePickles]

I agree, the most effective solution is just to not ingest as much sodium.

 

[rodhulk]

Why not just lower your intake of sodium? Reduce your intake of processed foods like Chips and other salted snacks, fast food, canned foods, and frozen dinners.

Also exercise helps reduce your sodium as your body will sweat it out.

Well, I don't have excessive sodium all the time but when I do, I was curious about the effects of water in regards to sodium, plus some other foods that can help. As I mentioned above, I know lots of fruit and vegetables will help.

You are right about exercise. It also helps at reducing sodium as you can sweat it out. That's a great point.

Basically to null the effects of sodium, eat healthy and exercise. Even if water doesn't diminish effects of sodium (though it might, I'm still not sure), it is still good for general health as ones body is very much water plus it does cleanse out some toxins.

 

[Anita18]

I agree, the most effective solution is just to not ingest as much sodium.

This.

And I'm a biologist. Not a doctor though, but probably a lot closer than many of you here. (And I will attest that a lot of doctors don't know what they're doing anyway.)

Periodic consumption of sodium-rich foods shouldn't hurt you. I think our bodies are pretty used to that. Even animals will search out salt licks from time to time if they need more salt.

Water will definitely help. It's how our bodies keep our electrolytes regulated, anyway. If you've got too much sodium or potassium in our blood, the body will release more water to balance it out. (Hence the high blood pressure - the more sodium you consistently have in your blood, the more the body will release water, the more it pushes against your vessels, etc etc.) The right electrolyte balance is important because sodium and potassium are neurotransmitters and if the concentration is wrong, your muscles and brain won't work as well as they should. Serious complications from it takes a lot of REAL fecking up though. Like, not drinking for days or drinking gallons of water at one time. Your body will let you know if you're fecking up.

Otherwise if you're only periodically having salty foods, you don't have to think about that. If you need more water to balance out the salt, you WILL get thirsty. (Last time I had a pizza, OMG I couldn't quench my thirst it was so bad.) Be sure to drink water during that time, not Coke. Coke has a lot of salt in it, but you don't taste it because of the massive amounts of sugar.

I'm a bit disappointed in this health thread, I thought it could be a place where I could gripe about my recent digestive troubles since my bf didn't want to hear the morbid details. (Hint: last week I had a colonoscopy. ) But I've been improving and I think making the switch to unprocessed, preferably organic foods has been helping.

 

[Anita18]

From reading around, it also seems that there are some new studies that say you don't even have to have high blood pressure from excessive sodium to experience negative effects from "salt sensitivity." This is reportedly because excessive sodium can increase platelet activity, which is bad because the clots in your vessels come from platelets sticking together to eventually lead to heart attacks and stroke.

Apparently some people are just more sensitive to salt than others. And you won't know unless you sign up for one of these newfangled studies.

I can believe something like that. Heck, I work in cancer research and we are so far from coming up with a "cure" or even figuring out how it manifests to begin with, and cancer involves A LOT less physiological systems than metabolism. We are pretty much never going to figure out how metabolism works, basically. It's ridiculously complicated and it involves too many individual genetic and environmental things. I just follow one simple rule: Go as unprocessed as possible. Everyone should do okay with that no matter what their body type.

 

[AndThePickles]

Haha, you can still gripe here, Anita!

 

[Anita18]

Haha, you can still gripe here, Anita!

You're still awake? I'm still awake reading papers so I can be somewhat not-clueless about the important scientist coming to our lab tomorrow - she studies aging and cancer, it's pretty interesting stuff. But I still don't like reading papers.

One thing I CAN randomly snark about - those colon cleansing diets and supplements from the drugstore? Weaksauce. You ain't got a properly cleansed colon until you've gone through a colonoscopy prep.

I'm so glad I only had to go through half of the stuff. It isn't as nasty as I thought it would taste, but the texture's a little weird and the fact you have to drink so much of it at once makes you sick of it very quickly. That and the whole sitting on the toilet all night part....

 

[AndThePickles]

Still? I'd woken up for work already.

 

[rodhulk]

This.

And I'm a biologist. Not a doctor though, but probably a lot closer than many of you here. (And I will attest that a lot of doctors don't know what they're doing anyway.)

Periodic consumption of sodium-rich foods shouldn't hurt you. I think our bodies are pretty used to that. Even animals will search out salt licks from time to time if they need more salt.

Water will definitely help. It's how our bodies keep our electrolytes regulated, anyway. If you've got too much sodium or potassium in our blood, the body will release more water to balance it out. (Hence the high blood pressure - the more sodium you consistently have in your blood, the more the body will release water, the more it pushes against your vessels, etc etc.) The right electrolyte balance is important because sodium and potassium are neurotransmitters and if the concentration is wrong, your muscles and brain won't work as well as they should. Serious complications from it takes a lot of REAL fecking up though. Like, not drinking for days or drinking gallons of water at one time. Your body will let you know if you're fecking up.

Otherwise if you're only periodically having salty foods, you don't have to think about that. If you need more water to balance out the salt, you WILL get thirsty. (Last time I had a pizza, OMG I couldn't quench my thirst it was so bad.) Be sure to drink water during that time, not Coke. Coke has a lot of salt in it, but you don't taste it because of the massive amounts of sugar.

I'm a bit disappointed in this health thread, I thought it could be a place where I could gripe about my recent digestive troubles since my bf didn't want to hear the morbid details. (Hint: last week I had a colonoscopy. ) But I've been improving and I think making the switch to unprocessed, preferably organic foods has been helping.

You mentioned that with excessive sodium, the body will release more water. But if you drank more, will not that extra drinking wash out the excessive sodium quicker and with less to no high blood pressure?

 

[Anita18]

You mentioned that with excessive sodium, the body will release more water. But if you drank more, will not that extra drinking wash out the excessive sodium quicker and with less to no high blood pressure?

I'm talking chronic high sodium, where you're taking in a lot of sodium for a long time. It's very possible (I'm not an expert on this) that in such a situation, your body may "reset" the level where the hormone that controls all this works. It's kind of like obese people getting type 2 diabetes - after a long time of getting bombarded with glucose and insulin, cells don't respond to insulin anymore There's a hormone that your liver releases that controls the concentration of blood plasma, and if that goes wonky, it can be a cause of hypertension.

So yeah, your body can handle temporary changes very well, but once it gets bombarded with stuff, a lot of things can reset and cause bad things. Be nice to your body.

 

[Colossal Spoons]

One thing I CAN randomly snark about - those colon cleansing diets and supplements from the drugstore? Weaksauce. You ain't got a properly cleansed colon until you've gone through a colonoscopy prep.

I'm so glad I only had to go through half of the stuff. It isn't as nasty as I thought it would taste, but the texture's a little weird and the fact you have to drink so much of it at once makes you sick of it very quickly. That and the whole sitting on the toilet all night part....

Yeah, those cleansing drinks are a waste of time and money. I used to sell them to ladies who thought the extra 5-10lbs they were carrying around was just undigested food and gas

I'm due for my colonoscopy pretty soon. Not looking forward to the fast, I needz proteins

 

[Anita18]

Yeah, those cleansing drinks are a waste of time and money. I used to sell them to ladies who thought the extra 5-10lbs they were carrying around was just undigested food and gas

I'm due for my colonoscopy pretty soon. Not looking forward to the fast, I needz proteins

Due for one? Do you haz a digestive issue like I do? I don't think you're that old... I was by far the youngest patient in the gastroenterology dept that day.

Since I'm a scientist and I like researching things, I found a paper (link is a .pdf) about different kinds of colonoscopy preps.. They found that Ensure or any other meal replacement drink can be counted as a "clear liquid" (as long as it's not milk-based, meaning lactose-free) and as long as you don't have the high fiber version, it's good to have the day before the procedure when you're supposed to be fasting. I've seen high-protein versions, maybe you could do that.

 

[AndThePickles]

Yeah, why in the world do you need a colonoscopy, babe?

 

[Colossal Spoons]

Men on both sides of my family have had polyps, I'm not "due" till I'm 30 but I may get it done sooner just to check.

 

[AndThePickles]

Ah, yeah, it is a good idea for you to get one earlier than you're due, then. Just like me having to get mammograms started earlier than the norm, can't wait

 

[rodhulk]

Question of the day:

Which is better to have between too much sodium or sugar, which one would be better to have too much of (I know they're both not good but still....)?

I ask this because alot of people will have excessive amounts of both, myself included (sometimes).

 

[Anita18]

Question of the day:

Which is better to have between too much sodium or sugar, which one would be better to have too much of (I know they're both not good but still....)?

I ask this because alot of people will have excessive amounts of both, myself included (sometimes).

That entirely depends on your genetics. If you've got family history of high blood pressure, sodium is worse than usual. If you've got family history of diabetes, sugar is worse than usual. So ask your parents, we can't help you here.

And what's your definition of "sometimes?" Having a fried chicken or a piece of cheescake once a week surely will not kill you no matter how crappy your genetics are. Once a day every day is excessive. Although binging on a bucket of KFC or an entire Cheesecake Factory cheesecake once a week is excessive too. But IMO that's common sense.

 

[rodhulk]

That entirely depends on your genetics. If you've got family history of high blood pressure, sodium is worse than usual. If you've got family history of diabetes, sugar is worse than usual. So ask your parents, we can't help you here.

And what's your definition of "sometimes?" Having a fried chicken or a piece of cheescake once a week surely will not kill you no matter how crappy your genetics are. Once a day every day is excessive. Although binging on a bucket of KFC or an entire Cheesecake Factory cheesecake once a week is excessive too. But IMO that's common sense.

Hey Anita,

I did consider the 'family history' and there is no high blood pressure or diabetes. With that, I was wondering which one would be worse. Just over a week ago, I went to a brief course on sodium and had asked this question between sodium and sugar and the person giving the course didn't really seem to have a definite answer but assumed that since sodium was the 'talk of the day' that sodium would be a bit worse for a normal person without any family history of high blood pressure or diabetes.

As for the "sometimes," well, I would eat healthy 4-5 times a week and bad 2-3 times.

 

[Anita18]

Hey Anita,

I did consider the 'family history' and there is no high blood pressure or diabetes. With that, I was wondering which one would be worse. Just over a week ago, I went to a brief course on sodium and had asked this question between sodium and sugar and the person giving the course didn't really seem to have a definite answer but assumed that since sodium was the 'talk of the day' that sodium would be a bit worse for a normal person without any family history of high blood pressure or diabetes.

As for the "sometimes," well, I would eat healthy 4-5 times a week and bad 2-3 times.

Well, nobody has a definite answer. How's that for a definite answer for you? Metabolism is probably the last thing in the human body we'll figure out, and we're a far cry from really figuring out a lot of things. (I work in cancer research, and despite many successful treatments that have been developed, we really don't know much of the basic mechanics of how it comes about. It's sobering, to say the least.)

And something being the "talk of the day" is poor reasoning to determine if something is important or not. All it tells you is that it's a fad, nothing more.

Frankly, if it concerned you that much, it would be much easier for you to take initiative and eat healthier more often. How about that? Research is expensive and takes time!

 

[Lighthouse]

After my kidney transplant, I had to switch to the "low-everything" diet. Low cholesterol, low fat, low sugar, low potassium and low sodium. The most difficult of these, by far, was cutting sodium. It's really astonishing how most of our foods are totally loaded with it, especially soup. Even bread has a lot of salt in it. It's still something I really struggle with, because even eating low sodium foods, its really hard to keep it under 1500mg.

It doesn't help that it receives barely any attention in the food market. You can find low-fat, fat-free, low-carb on almost anything, but finding low-sodium products is a real challenge.

 

[Anita18]

After my kidney transplant, I had to switch to the "low-everything" diet. Low cholesterol, low fat, low sugar, low potassium and low sodium. The most difficult of these, by far, was cutting sodium. It's really astonishing how most of our foods are totally loaded with it, especially soup. Even bread has a lot of salt in it. It's still something I really struggle with, because even eating low sodium foods, its really hard to keep it under 1500mg.

It doesn't help that it receives barely any attention in the food market. You can find low-fat, fat-free, low-carb on almost anything, but finding low-sodium products is a real challenge.

Bread needs salt because otherwise the yeast won't make the bread rise. But I only know the salt content because I use a bread machine - for each loaf it's never more than a teaspoon. Is it a lot more in store-bought breads?

Yeah, when it comes to diet considerations like that I think it's just easier to cook your own food from scratch. Forget any of the packaged stuff, especially when it comes to salt content. I only add salt to pasta water when I'm cooking and whenever I eat out, everything tastes insanely salty to me. Just this weekend we went out to a hole-in-the-wall restaurant (it was in the middle of nowhere, I guess they didn't have fresh produce nor knowledgeable cooks. ) and the rice pilaf they had was basically a pile of salt. Ugh.

 

[rodhulk]

Well, nobody has a definite answer. How's that for a definite answer for you? Metabolism is probably the last thing in the human body we'll figure out, and we're a far cry from really figuring out a lot of things. (I work in cancer research, and despite many successful treatments that have been developed, we really don't know much of the basic mechanics of how it comes about. It's sobering, to say the least.)

And something being the "talk of the day" is poor reasoning to determine if something is important or not. All it tells you is that it's a fad, nothing more.

Frankly, if it concerned you that much, it would be much easier for you to take initiative and eat healthier more often. How about that? Research is expensive and takes time!

I've been told a couple of things in reference to cancer:

1) Treatement can burn/kill cancer so cancer is curable but those involved in cancer, from the doctors to researchers, would then lose money from such things as fundraisers, be out of jobs or reassigned to a perhaps lesser paying job, etc... so the 'cure' is simply hidden. I doubt this is true, at least for all and most cancers but still, it's something I've come across.

2) I've also been told that if certain foods were consumed, most/all cancers would go away on their own? Any truth to this, at least for some cancers?

Unrelated subject:

Is it true, too, that depending on where you live will mean what fruit you should eat. So, if an appple is native to my location, that would be good when an orange, which is not native to my location, is not good (or at lkeast not as good as it is to somebody who os from an area that grows oranges. Any truth or just a myth?

Thanks again, Anita!

 

[Colossal Spoons]

1. Totally untrue. I'd make that argument about AIDS, but def not cancer. That disease is so tricky, we really are trying our hardest to rid people of cancer when they're diagnosed. Problem is, when it gets into the blood and metastasizes, it's usually game over. Not to mention if the cancer is located somewhere inoperable.

2. Any examples of these foods? I can't think of any foods that will rid a person of cancer.