The Jared Leto is The Joker(?) Thread

[Erzengel]

Having a great intro scene isn't worth diddly squat if you don't follow up the scenes with that same quality. People won't give a crap if every time he pops up is a forgettable nonentity scene like Leto's were. If anything it would be an even greater disappointment because people would be thinking they gave him such a great intro scene and then he does bugger all for the rest of the movie.

At least with SS the intro set the tone for what we got. A whole load of forgettable nothing. Expectations were not unjustly raised. Tension has to be earned. Ledger started with his crazy bank robbery, then next scene he does his magic trick with a pencil, then next scene is the infamous Why So Serious scene, then next scene we see him torturing a copycat Batman on TV etc. That's how you keep an audience on edge with a character. By showing them this villain does some serious disturbing stuff every time he pops up. A great intro scene alone won't sustain tension on a bunch of subsequent flaccid scenes for the next 2 hours.

You made me think of Vader entering Tanitive IV but the rest of the movie just continues his awesomeness.

 

[BlueLanternKal]

No excuse not to read it Blue Lantern. ��

Problem with what you wrote was that TDK was a cat and mouse between Batman and Joker. Nolan had to keep ratcheting up the tension. Whereas in Suicide Squad Joker wasn't the antagonist.

Ayer could have peppered scenes where Joker did disturbing stuff with scenes where you think he was going to do disturbing stuff and it still would have served his purpose in the story.

 

[shauner111]

It IS amazing the amount of time some people spend almost every single day on a message board for something they really dislike.

Sometimes there's trolling. Then you have fans who are passionate about a character, so even if they disliked an interpretation, they'll discuss it to the death because of their love for that character.

 

[hellblazer103]

Not even kidding, there are fan film Jokers out there better than this one.

 

[The Joker]

You made me think of Vader entering Tanitive IV but the rest of the movie just continues his awesomeness.

Any villain that evokes analogies or memories of Vader is a good thing.

Sometimes there's trolling. Then you have fans who are passionate about a character, so even if they disliked an interpretation, they'll discuss it to the death because of their love for that character.

Exactly.

This isn't a fan forum. It's a discussion forum.

 

[hellblazer103]

Not even kidding, there are fan film Jokers out there better than this one.

Speaking of which, anyone else miss the hell out of TheJokerBlogs ? I thought that was a really well done fan series.

( I probably look like a tool for quoting my own post, but oh well. )

 

[The Joker]

Speaking of which, anyone else miss the hell out of TheJokerBlogs ? I thought that was a really well done fan series.

( I probably look like a tool for quoting my own post, but oh well. )

They were exceptionally well done, and the guy did an incredible impression of Ledger. The make up was spot on, too.

 

[Erzengel]

And if people are complaining about posters expressing their dislike, that why separate threads have to be made for strictly "positivity" and that's really only for things that aren't that well received.

 

[hellblazer103]

They were exceptionally well done, and the guy did an incredible impression of Ledger. The make up was spot on, too.

I thought the makeup and the mannerisms were spot on , but the voice left something to be desired. He ended up making the performance his own, though, so that makes up for it, along with the writing.

 

[Tacit Ronin]

Having a great intro scene isn't worth diddly squat if you don't follow up the scenes with that same quality. People won't give a crap if every time he pops up is a forgettable nonentity scene like Leto's were. If anything it would be an even greater disappointment because people would be thinking they gave him such a great intro scene and then he does bugger all for the rest of the movie.

At least with SS the intro set the tone for what we got. A whole load of forgettable nothing. Expectations were not unjustly raised. Tension has to be earned. Ledger started with his crazy bank robbery, then next scene he does his magic trick with a pencil, then next scene is the infamous Why So Serious scene, then next scene we see him torturing a copycat Batman on TV etc. That's how you keep an audience on edge with a character. By showing them this villain does some serious disturbing stuff every time he pops up. A great intro scene alone won't sustain tension on a bunch of subsequent flaccid scenes for the next 2 hours.

Exactly.

 

[shauner111]

I didn't see every episode of the Joker Blogs but I should go back to it because I was really enjoying it. The voice was different but that guy killed it. There were times when I forgot it wasn't Heath's Joker.

 

[hellblazer103]

I didn't see every episode of the Joker Blogs but I should go back to it because I was really enjoying it. The voice was different but that guy killed it. There were times when I forgot it wasn't Heath's Joker.

It gets pretty insane near/at the end of series 1 and all throughout series 2. The style becomes much more " cinematic " ( I guess you could say ) in series 2. They had to change the actress for Harleen, though, for whatever reason. They've been kinda leaving us hanging waiting for more for years, but's not over.... apparently.

 

[C. Lee]

I can't read what you wrote, you've been ignored for a while now. Sorry. Your bias is unpalatable and your lack of humor and charm makes reading your posts unbearable.

If you have him on ignore....THEN IGNORE HIM.....do not make snarky comments about a post that you do not and can not read.

 

[Wildcard]

It IS amazing the amount of time some people spend almost every single day on a message board for something they really dislike.

That's the kicker. And also the biggest part I don't understand about it all.

The problem with Leto's Joker wasn't Leto's fault.

It's the way he was written. Ledger's Joker was introduced in a bank robbery where he guns down all his accomplices and escapes in a school bus.

That set the tone right there. It showed why the Joker was so menacing. Every time he was back on screen the audience did not know what to expect.

With Suicide Squad the Joker didn't have an establishing scene like that. Ayer took it for granted that his audience would already know who the Joker was. It was a bad call, just like any other mistake in film making. It happens.

Had Leto's Joker been established as almost supernaturally competent and chaotic the rest of his scenes would have earned the tension Ayer wanted the audience to feel.

Once again have to agree here. But on an even larger note, it seems like Ayer took just about all of the characters for granted. It was just done to a bigger degree with the Joker, which I think Ayer is aware of now, hence his recent comments.

 

[DeadStroke]

Problem with what you wrote was that TDK was a cat and mouse between Batman and Joker. Nolan had to keep ratcheting up the tension. Whereas in Suicide Squad Joker wasn't the antagonist.

Ayer could have peppered scenes where Joker did disturbing stuff with scenes where you think he was going to do disturbing stuff and it still would have served his purpose in the story.

It seemed Ayer was set on doing something different and not making the Joker the main villain. Which is fine if its executed right.

It was clear Ayer/WB realized he couldn't blend a proper intro for the Joker in the DCEU while making a Suicide Squad movie.


I thought the opening shot of the Joker was GREAT.

For a split second I was thinking he was going to be very mysterious in Suicide Squad.

Now it has two problems.
One it has Rick James music, love the song, but kills the mood.
Two there's no dialogue and we buzz right past it.

If they were only going to use 8 minutes of screen time for the Joker they would have been better off dedicating the majority of that to Arkham.

Never show us the Joker pursuing Harley. Just hint at it. I'd maybe show the car chase scene from earlier, but that would be it. In fact I might just show Harley riding with him and crashing, but no Joker shot. It would have made him disappearing that more mysterious.

Keeping Harley's flashback's primarily to the Joker breaking her down in Arkham allows us to see how he operates.

The helicopter scene elevates if thats the first time we see him "free"

Then him breaking her out at the end would have been a nice set up for a future movie.

In a lot of ways they needed to actually cut more of the Joker scenes we saw. Allow the reshoots to be primarily in Arkham and it might have fixed some of the issues.

Of course they weren't going to do that promoting Leto's Joker 24/7. I think only a few more edits/reshoots/less marketing could have solved the problem.

 

[Wildcard]

I love the opening scene, but we shouldn't see Joker free of restraints on a couch talking to Harley (something that wouldn't ever be sanctioned) and then in the next scene he's in a straitjacket.

 

[Boom]

I love the opening scene, but we shouldn't see Joker free of restraints on a couch talking to Harley (something that wouldn't ever be sanctioned) and then in the next scene he's in a straitjacket.

That ****ing movie, man.

 

[hellblazer103]

I guess maybe something happened that caused them to put the straightjacket on him ? Ya know, yet another unexplained event ?

 

[DeadStroke]

That's the kicker. And also the biggest part I don't understand about it all.



Once again have to agree here. But on an even larger note, it seems like Ayer took just about all of the characters for granted. It was just done to a bigger degree with the Joker, which I think Ayer is aware of now, hence his recent comments.

Yep. Even Nolan had more people assisting him with crafting the Joker and others. Silly to think he could do it by himself.

I love the opening scene, but we shouldn't see Joker free of restraints on a couch talking to Harley (something that wouldn't ever be sanctioned) and then in the next scene he's in a straitjacket.

That ****ing movie, man.

lol...just thinking about that.

They were probably going for a BTAS vibe, but then skipped ahead when he's restrained.

All the Arkham stuff were chopped to hell or had no real vision. That was where the majority of his scenes should have been.

 

[DeadStroke]

I guess maybe something happened that caused them to put the straightjacket on him ? Ya know, yet another unexplained event ?

My exact thought. Which is why I didn't mind it so much at the time.

Time just passes by in that movie and we're meant to put the pieces together.
I'd rather they just did the Mad Love setup for the majority of his scenes in the movie. Could have worked imo.

Leto didn't have a full grasp of the character anyway. So keep him confined and isolated on screen until others can find the vision.

 

[DeadStroke]

Its crazy how the rumors of Joker being locked up most of the movie turned out to be better than what we got.
Still liked it :shrugs:

 

[Luke234]

We like the Joker character. So we discuss all versions of the character, including the crappy ones like Letoker. Star Wars fans discuss the crappy prequels all the time. Schumacher's Batman threads are still active in the Batman forums. You take the bad with the good when you are a fan of something.

Considering this is the current version of Joker in the movies, we want better than what we are getting. The character deserves better. We deserve better.[/QUOTE


I respect people's opinions. That's just it, though. I loved the original Star Wars and the prequels were just shockingly bad for me but I don't get continuously posting on a message board about how bad each part was. I get the venting, totally. I certainly did.
But after awhile, everything has been said. So what's the point?I apologise if I sound or am being rude and judgemental.
I get sharing something you enjoy with other people but I don't get sharing something people hated with eachother after awhile.
Maybe the people running / involved with these things read message boards. I kinda doubt it. But I could be wrong. But even if they went in a direction and depicted characters the way the majority wanted, I can't imagine there's anything left to criticise for every DC movie so far.
I just don't get the point.

 

[The Joker]

If you have him on ignore....THEN IGNORE HIM.....do not make snarky comments about a post that you do not and can not read.

Thank you.

I respect people's opinions. That's just it, though. I loved the original Star Wars and the prequels were just shockingly bad for me but I don't get continuously posting on a message board about how bad each part was. I get the venting, totally. I certainly did.
But after awhile, everything has been said. So what's the point?I apologise if I sound or am being rude and judgemental.
I get sharing something you enjoy with other people but I don't get sharing something people hated with eachother after awhile.
Maybe the people running / involved with these things read message boards. I kinda doubt it. But I could be wrong. But even if they went in a direction and depicted characters the way the majority wanted, I can't imagine there's anything left to criticise for every DC movie so far.
I just don't get the point.

But that's you. Because you don't like discussing things you found bad or flawed is not universal for everyone. Don't judge everyone by your own standards. Sometimes the best discussions are ones based on criticism. By your logic why should people keep repeating the same praises about something when it's all been said before. It's the same broken record syndrome.

In fact if people followed your train of thought these forums would be a ghost town because 95% of what is discussed here has all been said before many, many, MANY times.

Where you get the idea people state their opinions here in the hope that WB or any movie studio reads here in the hope they will listen to us, I have no idea. I may have mentioned this before, but it obviously needs repeating even though it is obvious; this is a DISCUSSION forum. Not a fan forum, not lets try and get the movie studios to listen to us forum. Just discussion. That includes criticisms.

If you want to be surrounded by positive comments then go into one of the positivity threads the fans of the DCEU created because the forum itself is full of people criticizing the movies. Like most normal people do. Which reminds me....

And if people are complaining about posters expressing their dislike, that why separate threads have to be made for strictly "positivity" and that's really only for things that aren't that well received.

The "safe" zones for those who can't handle criticism. Too hard to just state their own opinion and ignore the ones that they don't like.

 

[Timebomb]

Having a great intro scene isn't worth diddly squat if you don't follow up the scenes with that same quality. People won't give a crap if every time he pops up is a forgettable nonentity scene like Leto's were. If anything it would be an even greater disappointment because people would be thinking they gave him such a great intro scene and then he does bugger all for the rest of the movie.

At least with SS the intro set the tone for what we got. A whole load of forgettable nothing. Expectations were not unjustly raised. Tension has to be earned. Ledger started with his crazy bank robbery, then next scene he does his magic trick with a pencil, then next scene is the infamous Why So Serious scene, then next scene we see him torturing a copycat Batman on TV etc. That's how you keep an audience on edge with a character. By showing them this villain does some serious disturbing stuff every time he pops up. A great intro scene alone won't sustain tension on a bunch of subsequent flaccid scenes for the next 2 hours.

Agreed. Also the Joker in TDK didn't need a horrible editing job to make him seem crazy.

 

[harryoscop]

Haha, Joker you feel the same way about Leto as I do about Tom's Spider-Man. Dude, we're like counter-parts to one another. But yeah, Leto left a lot to be desired.