The New Diamond List for August 25th, 2010

[Tron Bonne]

It's just weird that they went through the trouble of renumbering it all the way up to 500...only to have it canceled

 

[StreetWarrior]

Pull List
AVENGERS #4 $3.99
PUNISHER MAX HAPPY ENDING #1 (MR) $4.99

Maybe
SHADOWLAND MOON KNIGHT #1 (OF 3) SL $3.99

Tradesitting:
Secret Warriors

 

[TheCorpulent1]

I'm sure they'll renumber it to 600 when that comes along after they relaunch it.

 

[JewishHobbit]

Avengers 500 ISSUE MILESTONE.... 503 will be the final issue of this classic Avengers run.... Disassembled to make way for something new.


Daredevil 600 ISSUE MILESTONE.... November issue will be the final issue of this classic run... Who will be the NEW Man Without Fear?


And on a side note... I just realized that I posted that in the wrong thread. I meant it to go in the November Solicits thread... whoops! But at least it's still on topic due to the $4 price conversation here. It takes talent to mispost in a completely wrong thread and your post STILL winds up on topic. I'm quite proud of myself.

 

[Tron Bonne]

Oh yeah, that's right, Avengers did end and get relaunched at that high of a number, too. Well, yeah, I guess it's not as a big thing as I figured it's suppose to be

 

[JewishHobbit]

I read somewhere that Diggle's going to calm Daredevil's world down post Shadowland and put him back in the courtroom. I'm okay with that, but if there's a relaunch with a $4 pricetag I might back out of the book and call Shadowland the final showdown of a many year event starting at Bendis (maybe even Smith).

 

[Psykoelf]

DARK HORSE COMICS

STAR WARS BLOOD TIES TALE JANGO & BOBA FETT #1 (OF 4)

IMAGE COMICS

ANGELUS #5 (OF 6)
DARKNESS FOUR HORSEMEN #1 (OF 4)

MARVEL COMICS

ASTONISHING X-MEN #35
DARK WOLVERINE #90
NAMOR FIRST MUTANT #1
ULTIMATE COMICS MYSTERY #2 (OF 4)
X-FACTOR #208
X-MEN CURSE OF MUTANTS BLADE #1
X-MEN CURSE OF MUTANTS STORM & GAMBIT #1
X-MEN LEGACY #239

COMICS

ROBOCOP #6 (MR)
WOLFSKIN HUNDREDTH DREAM #4 (OF 6) (MR)
WOLFSKIN HUNDREDTH DREAM #4 (OF 6) BLOOD THIRST CVR (MR)
WOLFSKIN HUNDREDTH DREAM #4 (OF 6) PAINTED CVR (MR)
WOLFSKIN HUNDREDTH DREAM #4 (OF 6) WRAP CVR (MR)

 

[imdaly]

IMAGE COMICS

INVINClBLE #74


MARVEL COMICS

AMAZING SPIDER-MAN PRESENTS AMERICAN SON #4
ASTONISHING X-MEN #35
AVENGERS #4
BLACK WIDOW #5
CAPTAIN AMERICA #609
CAPTAIN AMERICA 1940S NEWSPAPER STRIP #3
DARK WOLVERINE #90
DEADPOOL TEAM-UP #890
DREAM LOGIC #2
FANTASTIC FOUR #582
HEROIC AGE PRINCE OF POWER #4
NAMOR FIRST MUTANT #1
PUNISHER MAX HAPPY ENDING #1
SECRET WARRIORS #19
SENSE & SENSIBILITY #4
SHADOWLAND MOON KNIGHT #1
SPIDER-GIRL END #1
SPIDER-MAN #5
THOR #613
ULTIMATE COMICS MYSTERY #2
X-CAMPUS #3
X-FACTOR #208
X-MEN CURSE OF MUTANTS BLADE #1
X-MEN CURSE OF MUTANTS STORM & GAMBIT #1
X-MEN FOREVER 2 #6
X-MEN LEGACY #239

 

[CConn]

Action Comics #892
Batman #702
Superman/Batman #75
Wonder Woman #602
Invincible #74
Avengers #4
Captain America #609
Fantastic Four #582

 

[Dread]

I'm going to take a guess and say they're doing the same thing with Daredevil as they did with X-Force. Both sold well but are being canceled. Note that the new title, Uncanny X-Force is a shiny new number one, but now also with a spiffy ongoing $4 price tag. My prediction... a Daredevil: The Man Without Fear ongoing with an ongoing $4 price tag.

That is a wise prediction. Marvel is keen on ensuring that the price of comics, especially theirs, complete a 101% increase within the decade, at a time when Marvel has never been richer and their retailers & fans have never been poorer.

 

[JewishHobbit]

What annoys me is Daredevil doesn't need any spiffying up. It's doing well and sales are good. It kinda reminds me of New X-Men (the student book). At the time of Messiah Complex it was doing well. The sales were good the story was good and it was building and getting better and better. Then they canceled it and started Young X-Men with a new shiny number 1. Not only did sales drop like a rock to the point where the book was canceled only one year after launch, but it killed that entire generation of X-Students. They've just been background characters for the past few years and will likely be pushed aside even more as we now introduce the new generation of X-Students... the Five Lights! I doubt it'll be as dire being that Daredevil is a bigger list character, but nonetheless.

And this idea isn't even original. We get a new mystery... Who is the new Daredevil?! with differant characters posing for it. We just had this a couple years ago... Who is the new Black Panther?! It's stupid!!!

 

[Dread]

To be fair, I wouldn't call DD's sales "good". In June, DD #507 sold 34,744 copies. The title's sales fell 10% other the last six months and 16% since June 2009. It is worth mentioning that DAREDEVIL #500 sold over 74,000 copies, yet a few issues later sales fell below when DAREDEVIL was still renumbered; #119 (before the old numbering returned) sold about 41k. Like virtually every comic book, DAREDEVIL was in a state of slow and steady decline, month in and month out. Books that remain steady are books whose debut was so high that it takes a while to hit the danger zone, or drops of 1%-3% a month. DD was slipping 4%-7% a month before July.

SHADOWLAND #1 sold just under 55k, which some are calling middling for an event (which Marvel denies is one). It was under-ordered and will see at least one reprint, if not two. But even if those reprints boost it's sales to, say, 60k for that debut, that is about where WAR OF KINGS #1 started off last year. However, DAREDEVIL #508 saw a sales boost from July, moving under 38.5k copies - or back to sales levels from December.

My point in all of this is that DAREDEVIL's sales are not steady and are not terribly high. Marvel would like to see it do better, especially the guy in charge who used to draw it. If not for the success of Quesada's MARVEL KNIGHTS line and his run alongside Kevin Smith, he would not be EIC. Before Joe Q decided to meddle with Spider-Man, the last comics he drew was a Daredevil mini, if memory serves. Obviously, Marvel was going to try something to revive the title's sales. SHADOWLAND is one step of that, and at least for one month it turned back the clock on DD's sales decline, at least to the glory that was 12/2009. It will remain to be seen whether those sales hold up.

Your overall point, though, is valid. It does make little sense to launch a big #500 issue and then cancel it barely a year or so later. It likely will backfire to relaunch it as DAREDEVIL: MAN WITHOUT FEAR or something else with a new #1 and a higher cover price. Marvel fails to realize what a "jumping off point" is, but their readers know it well, and know when to jump. ULTIMATE SPIDER-MAN's sales never recovered after Mark Bagley left. As you stated, those NEW X-MEN readers never returned. Fans look for any ol' excuse to ditch books and never return if you study sales charts.

There are several theories as to why Marvel and DC are flooding the market with high priced books. One is they cynically see the death of the direct market coming and greedily want to cash as much as possible before the cow is milked to bones for the last time. The second theory is greed and incompetence with the idea that the crash of 1993 will never happen and never be as bad. The third is the idea that creator contracts have genuinely become that expensive. The fourth is the collapse of ad revenue since 2008. Flip through any Marvel comic this month and, including front & back covers there may be about 8-9 ads. One of them may be for licensed merchandise, like t-shirts ordered online. Two may be ads to promote good living for kids paid for by nanny agencies, like Got Milk and Above The Substance. One ad may be for a video game. The rest will be House Ads for other comics (WOLVERINE #1 in particular has seen two ads within one issue). DC is faring slightly better, in that their latest issues have ads for React 5, NBC TV shows, Nintendo games, and Converse sneakers, but it still isn't as lofty as in 2006-2007. I remember once when I counted 21 pages of ads in a RUNAWAYS comic (which didn't include covers), I complained how it ruined the flow. Ironically, getting what I wished for may cripple comic sales for the big two.

The reason why Marvel may try a strategy with Daredevil that either will only work short term or not at all is simple. They have no other ideas. And DC isn't much wiser.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

It's not a big deal. Just give it a year or two, at most, and Daredevil will be back to normal. Comics are cyclical. Just gotta wait for your train to come 'round again.

 

[Dread]

The dilemma is being cyclical isn't wise when one is rolling downhill off a cliff, as the direct market seems to be forecasting this year so far. What happens when the events, variant covers, relaunches, renumberings, and so on collectively fail to work even in the short term?

 

[TheCorpulent1]

Who cares? I was just talking about people who are upset that Daredevil's going away for a little while. He'll be back. It's not a big deal. The potential demise of the entire comic book industry is a bit beyond the purview of my cynicism in this particular instance.

 

[Dread]

Fair enough. Yeah, I don't particularly care for DD right now, but I know he'll be back. I do understand the fear that the cancellation of his title will be a "drop off" point and whatever arises in it's place won't sell as well. Marvel is either slow to realize when a strategy isn't working or unable to come up with anything new.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

I don't think we have to worry about any drop-off point. Usually when Marvel cancels something big and restarts it, they tend to do a good job of making it sell well for a while, at least. Fans may not particularly like whatever the revamped version is (see: New Avengers), but the people at Marvel have a knack for revitalizing the big characters' sales after taking them off the board for a little while.

 

[Dread]

Actually, NEW AVENGERS is a fine example; after a large sales spike for the new NEW AVENGERS #1, sales for the next issue slipped back low enough that it may as well have been another issue of the prior volume. Retailers are getting wise to the tactics and not doubling down as much.

Still, with Joe Q as EIC, DD will always be around.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

I wasn't talking about the current New Avengers. That was just an arbitrary relaunch. I'm talking about the really major relaunch after Disassembled. There's no way you can tell me that New Avengers was ever in the kind of shape Avengers was in before that. Whether NA was the right (or even a good) way to deal with the apathy concerning the Avengers, it definitely worked. The Avengers, thanks to Bendis and, to some extent, the upcoming movie, now occupy a central position within the Marvel universe that they haven't had since the '70s or '80s.

Similarly, Thor's absence and subsequent relaunch have done wonders for his series. The idea of Thor selling consistently in the top 10 for about a full year was unthinkable even to me before JMS' relaunch.

 

[Dread]

You're right. The problem, though, is it isn't 2004 anymore. It isn't even 2008 anymore. It remains to be seen how the general economy is going to go and how comics will continue to be effected by it. Arbitrary relaunches seem to have less and less effect on sales the more Marvel employs them. Marvel isn't a one trick pony in terms of marketing gimmicks; they're a 3 trick pony. Alas, what happens when all 3 tricks are spent?

It is worth noting that despite Bendis and Avengers and all that hoo-hah over it, no Avenger title sold at 100k last month. Hell, no Avenger title sold at over 97k last month.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

There's always the movies.

 

[Dread]

Don't forget licensed merchandise and TV shows!

 

[TheCorpulent1]

I know I'll be buying my Thor underoos in another 7 or 8 months.

 

[Spider-Man '92]

BATMAN #702
AVENGERS #4
DEADPOOL TEAM-UP #890

Keeping it small this week, need to fill in the gap on previous titles.