The Official Wonder Woman Rumors/Speculation Thread

[rogbngp]

Then im going back to the Greek Gods speculation, i guess he could play hermes.

I'll be fascinated to see how the DCEU handles the Olympian pantheon. They've been stylized in a number of films during the last few years, namely Clash of the Titans, Wrath of the Titans, and Immortals.

I'm impressed with how the MCU has handled Asgard as an actual planet apparently located in an alternate multiverse universe (? that's how it seemed to me anyway) accessible via inter-dimensional travel (wormhole 'portals', etc.). But interestingly, the Asgardians used a combination of advanced technology and what appears to be magic, both. They seemed to be developed within the 'Ancient Aliens' theory vein. For that reason when watching Immortals I found it almost tempting to imagine the Olympian gods as extraterrestrial aliens, although it isn't actually intended as such.

We're going to have Aquaman's Atlantis with it's magic as well. Is there a pantheon of deities for Atlanis as well? I don't know the comic book backstory to all that, but I'm on a quest to learn more via New 52 issues about it.

Anyway, gods within a multiverse = aliens?

 

[rogbngp]

I addendumed the original post with this:

If you look at the article even in its original French version the term "super hero" is used. Is "superhero" really such an ambiguous term in the French language, especially given the current explosion of CBMs and its effect on pop culture and the film industry? The French are cinemaphiles. They were the first to engage in serious scholarly film criticism and academic study. Do they really have such an arcane meaning for the term for "superhero" as we understand it in common usage? You can see a screenshot of the article here, in which it is clearly visible that the term "super hero" is used: http://www.**************.com/fansites/MarvelFreshman/news/?a=126993

http://www.**************.com/fansites/MarvelFreshman/news/?a=126993

 

[Vonter-Voman]

He says the word superhero, but as "nice superhero character" and not "I'm playing a superhero", which could mean just "comic book character". It's not the french language but the fact that it is ambiguous from an "outside" perspective...

As for Dr. Fate, Khalid Ben-Hassin (archaeologist) is in Earth 2, Khalid Nassour (med student) is in Earth-0 (main Earth)

 

[rogbngp]

He says the word superhero, but as "nice superhero character" and not "I'm playing a superhero", which could mean just "comic book character". It's not the french language but the fact that it is ambiguous from an "outside" perspective...

As for Dr. Fate, Khalid Ben-Hassin (archaeologist) is in Earth 2, Khalid Nassour (med student) is in Earth-0 (main Earth)

"I'm playing a nice superhero character" sounds like he is making the distinction that it will be a hero versus villain, especially in the context of the other things he says. Granted, I freely admit that that is what I want to see because I would love to see him play Dr. Fate! It's just speculation (and admitted wishful thinking too). But I don't think it's a totally wild or off-the-wall speculation.

If it turns out that he is playing Dr. Fate (which is still a long-shot from the information we can piece together at this point, I acknowledge), my money would be on Khalid Ben-Hassin. In the photo he posted he kind of has the look of a WWI era archaeologist that could easily pass for Egyptian, no?

 

[Guts]

I'm really eager to see how magic is developed in the DCEU. Aquaman's Atlantic has magic. I expect Wonder Woman's Isle of Themyscira to have it. Just how they realize magic and mysticism in the DCEU will be really interesting to see.

Suicide Squad is also going to have magic in it.

 

[rogbngp]

Suicide Squad is also going to have magic in it.

Oh right! Enchantress. I can't wait to see how she is realized.

I mean, maybe WB/DC will just take a straightforward approach to mysticism and magic. But given the whole multiverse/inter-dimensional construct that we so often see now in this type of story, there might be tie-ins to science. I.e., it could be assumed that magic users are basically tapping into other dimensions within the multiverse. The multiverse is a big deal with Flash. And a multiverse framework could unite other types of otherworldly content such as gods, the Atlantean civilization, and so forth.

Also, with magic being one of Superman's vulnerabilities, for magic-wielding foes to appear helps make him seem less utterly invincible and OP in the DCEU.

 

[Clark-Kent]

Saïd Taghmaoui might play Dr. Fate, at least that's the rumor going on.

 

[rogbngp]

Okay, this is probably getting carried away, but another potentially intriguing aspect of all this maybe, is the reference that Saïd made during the Ultra interview to the film's name having "Nightingale" in it. You can see that word written on the trailer above his head in the photo.

According to one article I have read this led to a speculation that it could be a reference to Florence Nightingale who served during the Crimean War. If true I'm not sure how that would relate to Diana/WW. But interestingly, in addition to being a great humanitarian nurse, Florence Nightingale was a spiritualist who was fascinated with the ancient mystery religions, including Egyptian religion, and she traveled to both Greece and Egypt to study it. See the Wikipedia on her.

Just an association, and it may mean nothing at all. But I do wonder what is up with "Nightingale" reportedly being either a code name or a subtitle of the film.

 

[GREEN =w= DAY]

i really want to see Dr. Fate in the DCEU so i hope this rumor is true

 

[Vonter-Voman]

I have read this led to a speculation that it could be a reference to Florence Nightingale who served during the Crimean War. If true I'm not sure how that would relate to Diana/WW.

Originally, Diana disguised as a nurse named Diana Prince (that person actually exists in the story and WW takes her place).

 

[rogbngp]

Ultra is a Moroccan magazine published in French. The interview may have been done in Arabic and then translated to French.

Taghmaoui is French and I believe in France and in other French-speaking countries in Europe refer their comics mostly to Franco-Belgian stuff like Tintin, Lucky Luke, The Smurfs, etc.

I read his "I play a superhero character" comment like "I play a (superhero) comic book character". I wonder if he were playing a superpowered baddie, would he have said "I play a malevolent supervillain character"? Or why didn't he just straight up say "I play a superhero"?

Here's the thing for me, though... Best I can see Ultra is published out of Casablanca. And Saïd's parents are Moroccan, yes. But he was raised in France and the Ultra is published in French as a branch publication of L'economiste. Should we assume that the interview was conducted in Arabic versus French?

Even in a translation from Arabic to French... is the term "superhero"--especially in the context of a modern superhero film!--something that is going to be different from how the term is commonly understood worldwide since its inception? The term "superhero" came into existence in America in 1917 and became popularized not long afterward with Superman comics first appearing in 1938. It's a distinctly American term that was coined only within the last century, with a specific meaning and usage. This isn't like translating an ancient term with possible multiple meanings, such as in the bible from Hebrew to Greek to Latin to Old English to modern English.

I mean, just saying. If an Arabic term that means "comic book character" was used, and it's not a distinct use of the term "superhero," then that's fine (and if we won't be seeing Taghmaoui as Dr. Fate, hey I look forward to seeing who his character is). But when I see the term "superhero" used consistently in the interview in the magazine's native language, it makes me scratch my head at why people are arguing that the term must somehow mean something else!

Here's the link for the actual interview if that helps (see p. 16).

I'll now stop on the usage of the term! But I tend to get about things like this, so apologies.

 

[Vonter-Voman]

Even here (Brazil) it could be ambiguous, it could mean something like "a character from superheroes", which is not necessarily a superhero but a supporting character as well. Or even a villain, from which he separates using "nice". Superheroes in this case is like using "cape comics".

Notice how he says "a nice superhero character". If he was implying he is a superhero, he wouldn't distinguish between nice/bad, nor would he say it's a "character". The use of character implies it's from superheroes.

To me, there's a clear distinction of meaning between saying "I'm playing a superhero" and "I'm playing a nice superhero character", even in english.

 

[rogbngp]

Even here (Brazil) it could be ambiguous, it could mean something like "a character from superheroes", which is not necessarily a superhero but a supporting character as well. Or even a villain, from which he separates using "nice". Superheroes in this case is like using "cape comics".

Notice how he says "a nice superhero character". If he was implying he is a superhero, he wouldn't distinguish between nice/bad, nor would he say it's a "character". The use of character implies it's from superheroes.

To me, there's a clear distinction of meaning between saying "I'm playing a superhero" and "I'm playing a nice superhero character", even in english.

But the qualifier "nice" could simply be to differentiate hero from villain, no? I mean look at Suicide Squad. As we know not everyone with superpowers in the comic book superhero universes uses them for good!

I.e., maybe this is saying (paraphrasing) "I'm playing a 'good guy' superhero character (versus a villainous one)." This in context of what he states about his wish that he had superpowers and could right wrongs in the world by traveling back in time to change history, and so forth.

 

[rogbngp]

Originally, Diana disguised as a nurse named Diana Prince (that person actually exists in the story and WW takes her place).

Wow! It's been a long time since I looked at the WW origin, and I had forgotten that. That is very cool. It would be kind of weird to me, though, if the film actually has Diana playing Florence Nightingale. For me, Florence Nightingale being a famous a person makes that a bit problematic for willing suspension of disbelief. Maybe Diana influences Florence, though?

(Maybe I should post this in the 'skepticism' thread... but it is so hugely speculative to begin with.)

 

[Vonter-Voman]

But the qualifier "nice" could simply be to differentiate hero from villain, no? I mean look at Suicide Squad. As we know not everyone with superpowers in the comic book superhero universes uses them for good!

I.e., maybe this is saying (paraphrasing) "I'm playing a 'good guy' superhero character (versus a villainous one)." This in context of what he states about his wish that he had superpowers and could right wrongs in the world by traveling back in time to change history, and so forth.

That's the point: superhero is a hero. If he meant he is playing a superhero, he wouldn't need to make the distinction between good/bad. But he said superhero character, which is not necessarily a superhero.

Let's imagine if he said he is playing a villain. He could say "I'm playing a supervillain", or "I'm playing a bad superhero character". Notice that both forms are right. The latter indicates that the character is from superheroes, but not a superhero himself, because it's a bad guy. The same applies for a good superhero character: it's not a superhero himself, but "from superheroes".

At the same time "I'm playing a bad supervillain character" is redundant, just as a "nice superhero character" would be redundant if he meant he's playing a superhero. "Superhero" in this case is the genre, and it can't be replaced with "supervillain", which is not a genre.

Taken as a genre, you can say "bad superhero character". You can't say "nice supervillain character" (unless you're saying the villain is pretty cool)

Which is not to say that he isn't actually playing a superhero. But the ambiguosity is there.

And Diana won't disguise as Nightingale. Nightingale was actually dead at the time of WWI. It's just a codeword.

 

[rogbngp]

That's the point: superhero is a hero. If he meant he is playing a superhero, he wouldn't need to make the distinction between good/bad. But he said superhero character, which is not necessarily a superhero.

Let's imagine if he said he is playing a villain. He could say "I'm playing a supervillain", or "I'm playing a bad superhero character". Notice that both forms are right. The latter indicates that the character is from superheroes, but not a superhero himself, because it's a bad guy. The same applies for a good superhero character: it's not a superhero himself, but "from superheroes".

At the same time "I'm playing a bad supervillain character" is redundant, just as a "nice superhero character" would be redundant if he meant he's playing a superhero. "Superhero" in this case is the genre, and it can't be replaced with "supervillain", which is not a genre.

Taken as a genre, you can say "bad superhero character". You can't say "nice supervillain character" (unless you're saying the villain is pretty cool)

Which is not to say that he isn't actually playing a superhero. But the ambiguosity is there.

And Diana won't disguise as Nightingale. Nightingale was actually dead at the time of WWI. It's just a codeword.

Okay, well you have outdone me at splitting hairs here, lol! t: You're right that the correct term would be "supervillain." The use of the term "superhero" is something I could imagine being used loosely in French to refer to a superpowered comic book character.

Anyway, touché! I guess we'll wait and see.

What I have been reading (rumors, speculations from one main source, see here) is that the film will be set in a number of different time periods, including WWI, WWII, the present; but also and possibly the Crimean War (mid 1800s) because of the Nightingale association (see here and here). Diana being an immortal demigoddess is the premise for that. Florence Nightingale and Khalid Ben-Hassin (if that is who Taghmaoui is playing) do live in in different time periods, though, that's true. If any of this speculation is correct, there would have to be some sort of plot thread that connects it all.

 

[DlAMONDZ]

Nah. He's Jason Todd

 

[rogbngp]

Nah. He's Jason Todd

 

[Clark-Kent]

This could easily go in the speculation thread

 

[rogbngp]

You know, as I read more about the original JSA from All Star Comics it is sort of neat to see the first version of Green Lantern among that group.

I know there were reports over the summer that Chris Pine was originally being considered for Green Lantern...

Now... and yes, this is a big stretch... but I wonder if Snyder, Tjusihara, et al., considered rewriting Steve Trevor as a member of the GL Corps. That is, in this construct during the WWI era Trevor's grandfather is none other than Alan Scott... (Yes, this is a revision from the comic books, i.e., an adaptation for the DCEU!) Alan Scott is actually the first human to come across a GL ring. Eventually the very same ring may make its way to his grandson Steve Trevor. And Dr. Fate is perhaps involved in that origin story for Alan Scott.

I mean, yeah, it's total speculation but I think that would be pretty darn cool. It would help explain the GL Corps approach to the first solo GL film. I pitch my own thoughts here about how neat it would be to eventually see a retro Golden Age JSA series of films set between WWI and WWII.

 

[Vonter-Voman]

Please don't go there. Plus, it's confirmed in WB's statement that Pine's character is "Captain Steve Trevor".

 

[adzyps3]

I hope so so we can see Nabu back in ancient Egypt with Adam and Vandal

 

[rogbngp]

Please don't go there. Plus, it's confirmed in WB's statement that Pine's character is "Captain Steve Trevor".

Well, with this concept he would be playing both Steve Trevor (so the release statement would not be inaccurate) and his grandfather, with the latter here adapted as Alan Scott. (This they would keep as a surprise.)

Is this a troubling idea?

It does seem from the WWI era photo that Taghmaoui posted on Instagram that either 1) Pine is also playing Steve Trevor's grandfather (yes, I know this "scoop" is from El Maybe, but it's actually not a bad guess), or 2) Trevor has been rewritten as a WWI era character--in which case he will then not be featured in the modern era that MoS and BvS are set in. I.e., he'd be born in the 1890s.

Unless Steve Trevor is going to time travel from 1916 (in a Den of Geeks article that claims have an insider source, it is reported that 1916 is the year for the WWI act, which the article says is one of three time periods/acts for the film) to the present day, he cannot fulfill his traditional role as Wonder Woman's liaison to Washington, DC, the United Nations liaison for the Justice League, and head of A.R.G.U.S. Of course, maybe he will time travel. But why go to the trouble of placing him first in WWI to begin with?

From what I gather about the JSA it forms in the 1940s (?). If that's correct, and if such an adaptation is being done, then two of the first members' origins are apparently set a generation earlier. Would the JSA still come together in WWII then? Dunno if Dr. Fate's helmet and Scott's ring grant them unnatural longevity or not.

I grant you that this would be packing a lot of story material into one film, though. They'd have to kind of tease all this, really. Just show us enough to stir fascination about it while keeping the focus squarely on WW's story. Or the middle act of the film set in WWI is actually focused on the revelation of inter-dimensional/extra-terrestrial threats as shown through the stories of Alan Scott and Khalid Ben-Hassin (and then the need for the Justice Society).

 

[Question]

The Wonder Woman movie would be an interesting way to set up the Justice Society. We could get a view of all the classic members and than see their heirs in the modern day.

 

[rogbngp]

Here's a bit more thinking on this whole speculation, or hypothesis, or whatever one wants to call it (imho, it's not a rumor since it's just one fan's creative speculation):

In order for Steve Trevor to be Alan Scott's grandson, presumably his daughter would have marry a man with the surname of Trevor--or at least have a child with him. Or perhaps, following in her parents' footsteps, to herself place the child for adoption, then to be raised by parents with the last name of Trevor. (I.e., that would be an adaptation.) Alan Scott does have a daughter who becomes a superhero in her own right, the first earthling female Green Lantern, Jade aka Jennie-Lynn Hayden. Both Jennie and her twin brother Todd inherited meta-human powers from Alan's Scott's exposure to his Green Lantern ring, and (at least in Jennie's case) also from their superhero mother Rose and Thorn. The twins are separated shortly after their birth when they are placed for adoption, with Jennie being raised by loving adoptive parents in Milwaukee. In an adaptation such as this, Jennie-Lynn would give birth to Steve Trevor.