The Pope on Evolution, creationism

[Cyrusbales]

A lot of unexplainable things has scientific speculations, ways that they will try to explain it using knowledge we already have, it's like an estimated guess with evidence rather than blind faith.

I'm not trying to be agressive, it's just very rare that any conversation with someone of a religious nature gets past, "well it's my belief, I don't wanna talk about it."

 

[Sloth7d]

And you realise if science could explain everything, then noone would say that. But it doesn't. So everyone chooses their orientation. Whether sciencetology or christianty.

 

[bulok]

What does Atheism have anything to do with the Big Bang theory? In case you didn't know, Lemaitre who first originated the theory of Big Bang was a priest. It supports the Genesis account of the universe beginning from a primeval atom.

 

[Victarion]

I believe in the Big Bang as much as a pencil neck scientist does. I believe in all the intricate workings of atoms, protons, electrons and all that jazz. But tell me what the catalyst was that sparked it all? This is where I believe God stepped in.

 

[Wilhelm-Scream]

What does Atheism have anything to do with the Big Bang theory? In case you didn't know, Lemaitre who first originated the theory of Big Bang was a priest. It supports the Genesis account of the universe beginning from a primeval atom.

NO.
WRONG.

Genesis makes no mention of the origin of the universe, or even the Earth itself.
When we join the story in Genesis 1, It's all just already there, and God "refines" it and shapes it.

1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

What does "Heaven" mean? And where is a "Primeval Atom" mentioned?

2 And the earth was without form, and void;

Formless and void, and already there...as early as verse 2.

and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

We're only at verse 2, and there's no mention of the creation of water. Even the Bible just says, "It was just there."

And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters.

Where were "the waters"?
On Earth, that was blobby and formless.
So, the Bible doesn't say anything about the Creation of EARTH, let alone the whole Universe.




Please, people, if you want to talk about the Bible, read it first.

 

[Malus]

^ Yes, how utterly telling that Genesis doesn't mention the Primeval Atom.
Now why would that get left out? t:

 

[ProjectPat2280]

I believe in the Big Bang as much as a pencil neck scientist does. I believe in all the intricate workings of atoms, protons, electrons and all that jazz. But tell me what the catalyst was that sparked it all? This is where I believe God stepped in.

See im in complete agreement with this. Why cant you have both, science AND divinity?

 

[ProjectPat2280]

I'll give the Nazi-Pope this: He's a lot more open-minded about science and evolution than I figured he would be.

But he's still a Nazi.

I know you are entitled to your opinion, but i think you just solidified your serious lack of intelligence. You need to go read a history book before you make dumb-ass comparisons.

 

[Manic]

I know you are entitled to your opinion, but i think you just solidified your serious lack of intelligence. You need to go read a history book before you make dumb-ass comparisons.

Was it joking about the Pope being part of the Hitler Youth? Because I know he didn't exactly have a choice in the matter.

 

[Spider-Bite]

You CANT get something from nothing.

Did God come from nothing? I'm not trying to be rude, but that is a hypocritical argument, considering that neither of us know the origin of the origin.

How the hell did the universe start?

That is a good question. A question that many brillaint atheists have devoted their lives to finding an answer. They work at NASA. However...

It cant just start, something or someone had to create it.

Your doing the God gap thing. Scientists dont' know the answer to every question about everything in the entire universe. There are questions we can not answer. Your using God to fill in the gaps in our scientific explanation, and it is mere speculation. You have no evidence to support the existence of God, your merely assuming that he must exist, since we don't yet know all the answers.

As i stated, my belief is, that God created the start, but he let life itself work out. Im not saying God snapped his fingers and poof, Adam and Eve, i dont think it happened like that.

Snapping his fingers and poof, a Universe, is actually harder to swallow, than the Adam and Eve part.

I ask you this. If God created space time, than where was God, prior to it? Where could he have existed, if there was no universe for him to exist in?

And just so you know. There are thoeries as to what caused the big bang. But they are more like theoretical possiblities as to how it could happen. Astronomy has not come far enough for anybody to really know with confidence what caused it.

 

[Spider-Bite]

Well, I don't care what Wittgenstein said. I'm just telling you I'm not a catholic because I'm scared to die. I just know there are things that can't be explained.

What was the murder weapon used by Scott Peterson to kill his wife? Prosecutors were never able to explain how Scott Peterson killed her, even though we know he did kill her.

Prosecutors can not explain it.

Oh my. God must have killed Laci Peterson! Scott is innocent!

You see the problem with the God gap style of debating? It's nothing but speculation to fill in the gaps, where we havn't yet uncovered the answer or explanation. It's not that science can't explain it, it's that scientists, can't explain it yet.

 

[Spider-Bite]

See im in complete agreement with this. Why cant you have both, science AND divinity?

Because there is no scientific evidence that God exists. Everything we know about human behavior and history suggests that God was merely the product of imaginitive humans who had no other way to explain things.

when one contradicts the other, then you can no longer have both.

 

[Victarion]

It was not a matter of snapping fingers and poof, there's Adam and Eve. The other 8 planets and Earth came first. Then from the sand and dust came Adam, then Eve from Adam's rib.

Tis a shame that we have nothing better to do than debate science.

 

[Spider-Bite]

those are some really limited poll options there, bite.

it covers all the bases. people who don't believe in God, people who believe God caused evolution, and people who believe God didn't. It just doesn't require people to specifically announce their religion.

 

[Manic]

it covers all the bases. people who don't believe in God, people who believe God caused evolution, and people who believe God didn't. It just doesn't require people to specifically announce their religion.

What about people who do subscribe to Buddhism? Buddhism isn't exactly a God-themed religion, and it certainly isn't atheism.

Everytime these debates come up, Buddhists get left in the dust.

 

[Victarion]

What about Wiccans? Where are they? I know one, and he does not like you for not including his religion (false as it may be).

 

[StorminNorman]

I personally believe that being atheist is just as narrow-minded and ridiculous as being radical Christian or Islamic or any other religion. There is no scientific evidence that can fully disprove God, just as there is nothing that can prove its existence. It seems to me that being agnostic makes the most sense.

Personally I believe in the Judeo-Christian God and believe that Jesus did exist and was in fact God's son in some way. As far as everything else in the Bible - I take it with a large grain of salt, after all - it was written by flawed man.

So with that belief I do believe in evolution, though I think there was a higher power at work - and I believe in the Big Bang.

 

[Spider-Bite]

What about people who do subscribe to Buddhism? Buddhism isn't exactly a God-themed religion, and it certainly isn't atheism.

Everytime these debates come up, Buddhists get left in the dust.

Many atheists are Buddhists. That's why. This wasn't a "are you a christain, catholic, muslim" poll. It was a do you believe in God, evolution poll.

 

[Wilhelm-Scream]

I personally believe that being atheist is just as narrow-minded and ridiculous as being radical Christian or Islamic or any other religion.

Well, depends on how "radical" you're talking about.

Atheists don't tend to try and impose their Atheism on the rest of the world as much as Religious people try to impose their beliefs.
But we do have those Godless Commies that do it.

Otherwise, I totally agree.
I'm glad that I'm on the BEST side of the issue, and the ONLY thinking man's position is mine.....Agnosticism.
There's not enough evidence to believe.
There's no way to empirically disbelieve.

The only right way is to say, "I'd like this to be true, and I'd like that to be true, and this tends to sound more believable to me, BUT...I can't KNOW for sure.

That's what's so embarrassing about Religion. You can NOT know, but it expects you to.

 

[Spider-Bite]

I personally believe that being atheist is just as narrow-minded and ridiculous as being radical Christian or Islamic or any other religion. There is no scientific evidence that can fully disprove God, just as there is nothing that can prove its existence. It seems to me that being agnostic makes the most sense.

Something doesn't have to be proven in order to be believed. It is compltely possible that a God does exist, but it's highly impropable that our existence is the result of a God. Your talking astronimically impropable.

It actually requires an open mind to become an atheist the majority of the time, because most athests have religous peers, parents, and so on. Most of the time people just go with whatver people around them believe, and no matter how much evidence you show them they refuse to accept the truth. It takes an open mind to look at the evidence objecitively and become an atheist.

Personally I believe in the Judeo-Christian God and believe that Jesus did exist

A lot of people named Jesus lived back then. Somethign like one out of 4 people alive back then were named Jesus.

and was in fact God's son in some way.

Talk about narrow minded? You have no evidence at all, that he was Jesus's son. You claim were narrow minded because we can't prove God doesn't exist, yet you belief this guy was the son of God without proof? isn't that hypocritical?


It all comes down to this. Is there an invisible unicorn on my roof smoking a joint? No. There isn't, and I don't need proof to know that. You can't prove there isn't an invisible unicorn on my roof, but we still know there isn't one.

 

[Spider-Bite]

The only right way is to say, "I'd like this to be true, and I'd like that to be true, and this tends to sound more believable to me, BUT...I can't KNOW for sure.

That's what's so embarrassing about Religion. You can NOT know, but it expects you to.

That's how I feel, and I'm an atheist. That's how all atheist scientists feel. That's crucial to being a scientist. That doesn't make somebody an agnostic. It's possible God exists, but it's highly impropable.

We have scientists right now trying to make life from scratch. In a way they could become a god to somebody. scientists have suggested that it may be possible one day for humans to use technology to create a universe.

It is possible that a being from an alien planet used technology to turn himself into a God. It's possible that there are trillions of universes or civilizations created by some higher power, and it's possible that there are trillions of beings who consider themselves God.

but statistically speaking were probably not one of them. Computer simulations predict that 2 out of 3 solar systems develop a planet with earthlike conditions at one time or another during that solar system's existence. Eartlike planets are probably all over the galaxy, and life has probably evolved an infinite number of times. Chances are were not one of the rare, special unique ones created by a higher being.

Our existence is probably natural.

 

[Spider-Bite]

Atheists don't tend to try and impose their Atheism on the rest of the world as much as Religious people try to impose their beliefs.

We dont' have the luxury of threatening people with hell, considering we have no evidence it exists.

But we do have those Godless Commies that do it.

In the early 1900's China had a dictator who outlawed all religion for 20 years. He was just as dangerous as Osama Bin Laden in my opinion.

 

[ProjectPat2280]

Something doesn't have to be proven in order to be believed. It is compltely possible that a God does exist, but it's highly impropable that our existence is the result of a God. Your talking astronimically impropable.
.

The problem with that is you are trying to say as tho God were merely mortal. Hes not, hes completely divine, hes well, God. Here is my reason as to why its stupid to not believe in God:



Say there truly is NO God, and, like you, you believe so. You live your life as anybody else would, except that when you near your death bed, you begin to slightly panic as you realize that the end is near. You die, and thats it, you fall into that eternal sleep.

Now, same as above there is NO God, but you have someone that DOES believe in God, they live their life as anybody else, but when they near their death bed they can rejoice as they know that the end isn't near, the beginning of a wonderful new life is. The time comes and they fall into that eternal sleep, nothing happens, BUT they died fulfilled. Its not like the second they die they say "o crap, there really is no God". So therefore the believer wins that scenario.

Ok now heres this one : Say there IS a God, and like you don't believe so, you go on about your life saying how silly God is. You lay on your deathbed knowing that the end is here, but when you fall into that deep sleep you find yourself at heavens gate tho you are denied entry based on your lack of faith(not your undenying worship) but the fact that you refused to believe.

So now that leaves the one that DOES believe in God, again, they go about living their life. They reach their deathbed and die smiling because, as i said, they know the beginning of a new life is upon them. They fall into that sleep and arrive at the gates of heaven to start their blissful new life.

So that makes it faithfuls 2, atheist 0.

I mean do you see that? Its not silly for someone to believe in God or a life after death at all.

 

[Skullbearer]

What about a choice of "None of the Above"?

 

[Mr Sparkle]

I totally want to hear what the Maximum voice for the catholic church has to say on things like Science and Evolution.

seriously!

don't you all!

I'll bet it's super-duper-awesome.