The Rumors, The Facts, The Speculation: Cyclops

Discussion in 'X-Men 1, 2 & 3' started by The Original Bamfer, Apr 22, 2006.

  1. The Original Bamfer Big, Bald and Beautiful

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    The Rumors, The Facts, The Speculation: Cyclops
    By: The Original Bamfer

    Disclaimer: Known Spoilers Ahead. I realize this could have belonged in the Official Cyclops Thread. I just feel that with all the information, it could use its own thread rather than getting left behind. If it must be merged, than do so.


    Comic Background​

    It’s pretty obvious that most X-men fans associate the Phoenix Saga with the characters, Jean and Scott. The two shared a real love, unlike the infatuation shared between Logan and Jean. This love is what allowed Scott to stop the Phoenix in the comics – he is known to be the only one that can do so.

    Infamous Script Review

    Yup. It said Cyclops would be “demolecularized” by Jean’s uncontrollable powers. It portrayed Scott going to Alkali Lake – Jean rises and asks Scott to take off his shades, saying she “can control it” but really can’t. Scott dies, and that’s it for him – in the first two acts. Strangely enough, the third act was never given to the script reviewers, which is the act heavily believed Cyclops will return – The Final Battle.

    What backs it up – The Trailers and TV Spots prove that Scott does go to Alkali Lake, at the time, by himself. He does take off his glasses… In addition, some hints the promotion have given to his apparent death are: Floating shades and no Scott in sight, when Logan and Storm arrive at Alkali.

    What defies it – A lot more seems to happen at Alkali Lake than mentioned in the Script Review. For some reason, Scott throws off his glasses and releases a raw optic beam. Domino effects of large splashes occur, with a red/pink energy below, possibly occurring from the optic shots. A violent wave, seemingly water, hits Scott (with glasses on) – throwing him back, hitting the rock below. There is also a kiss between a shade-less Scott and Jean.

    Further Conclusion (Script Review) – The writers have said that a lot has changed since the draft (above) mentioned was made. It’s obvious from what we’ve seen that it certainly has. The Third Act was not given to review…

    Promotion

    The first ‘promo’ shot we got of Scott was on the Official Website and was a headshot of him with shades, scruffy, and wearing a presumably Photoshopped x-suit. Later, however, Magazines came out with new character promo’s including a cleaned up Cyclops in a real x-suit (See below, picture 1). Once asked, it was revealed that this particular photo was not from X2, but from X3. More promotion pictures came out of Cyclops suited up. So far in the X-movies, any character who has been advertised as wearing a uniform has worn one in that installment.
    [​IMG] [​IMG]

    In The Ultimate Summer Movie Preview ’06! Issue of PREMIERE movie magazine, Cyclops actor, James Marsden, talked about getting back into the leather x-suit, saying “It was a Pavlovian response once I got into the suit: ‘Ah yes, this discomfort.’” Most likely meaning that he will show up in the film with the suit on. It does not seem likely he’d comment on the garb used for promotional work. Among the movie-based books being released, is a children’s book titled Meet the X-men. This book had most of the X-men team characters on it apart from Angel, Jean and Cyclops. A preview was given of the book (see picture below) that reveals Scott with the X-men. Oddly enough, Beast is also in the same shot – who is heavily believed to join after Cyclops’s presumed disappearance. If Scott is to die in the movie, wouldn’t they leave him out of the promoting children books, rather than leaving him in?
    [​IMG] [​IMG]

    Cameron Bright’s Behind the Scene Picture​

    Cameron’s fan site showcased some of his behind-the-scenes shots from X3. Most parts of the pictures, besides Cameron, were blurred out due to ‘spoiling.’ One shot (see below) had a non-blurred space which had the face and hair of a male figure. The figure also seemed to be wearing a visor, or at the very least had something covering his eyes. At a closer inspection, the neckline and collar are visible. Many agree that it is/could be Cyclops – but some believe it is a poster, or cardboard cut-out, but is most likely a person. The visible, non-blurred, background behind the figure matches up exactly with that of the Alcatraz scene (easily seen in some Beast promo’s), as well as its ground.
    [​IMG]

    Theories/Contradictions

    Many believe Cyclops will be in the movie toward the end. Either he will turn up or Jean will bring him back. Who’s to say Jean won’t revive Scott after she demolecularizes him? She has the power to. Even though Scott coming back from the dead would be ‘beating the dead horse’ after Jean’s grand rebirth, it’s still a possible theory. Another hot theory is that Cyclops doesn’t die – but is, instead, kidnapped by someone until the ending battle. Usually the kidnappers are thought to be Magneto/Callisto. Especially after Callisto tells Magneto that she knows of a mutant “more powerful than [him].” Could it be Callisto and a few others were there at Alkali Lake when Jean rose? That could be a reasonable explanation for the violent happenings in the scene during the trailers. Psylocke is also given the possible role of creating an illusion to fool Jean into believing Scott is dead (much like what happened in the Comics). Why would Magneto plan to do this? Possibly because he knows how powerful Jean is and wants to get her to side with him. To further this theory, it is believed Magneto tells Jean that Xavier blocked off her powers and -THE THEORY ADDS IN- that Scott would not be dead if it hadn’t been for Xavier, ultimately getting Phoenix’s alliance and anger toward the X-men. It wouldn’t be unlike Magneto’s scheming self to do such a thing. Other characters, such as Rogue and Angel, are missing from the Final Battle. With them, Cyclops could return to aid the X-men. It is official that more mutants will help the X-men than what is seen (Storm, Wolverine, Iceman, Kitty, Colossus and Beast).

    Kinberg & Penn (The Writers)

    The Writers seem to be big fans of the comics, as well as Cyclops. They said that Scott will have emotional scenes, and is a driving part in the Story. Every scene from this movie can be referenced from a scene in the actual comics. They also said that…

    ”Things will come full Circle”

    All three movies, by the end of X-men: The Last Stand, will fit together – emotionally, socially and politically. This, to me, is what assures Scott’s survival. The relationship between Scott and Jean is obvious in X-men and X3: X-men United, and will be concluded in this installment. In X2, Jean and Logan share a moment where Logan claims he is capable of being Jean’s lover. Jean mentions her crush for him, but her true love for Scott. If things play out like that, then Scott is truly the only one capable of bringing the fury of Phoenix to an end – not Logan. Also, the Jean and Scott seem to be engaged… could it be, though unlikely, that there may be a marriage? Their emotional arc will come full circle, and for this to happen for Scott, he must be with Jean. And likewise. Scott, sharing a touching moment with Xavier in X-men (1), assured him that he would take care of the X-men “if anything happened.” Xavier is heavily rumored to die in X3.




    This is why I believe he lives - the proof.
     
  2. Halcohol Suit up

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    Excellent post, TOB... a much-needed summary of the controversy surrounding Cyclops.

    By the by.... how long did it take you to write this post?
     
  3. The Original Bamfer Big, Bald and Beautiful

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    Thanks - A while, man... why?
     
  4. gap5ewl inconspicuous since '03.

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    awesome post TOB:up: great points
     
  5. Halcohol Suit up

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    Because to format the same post would've taken me an hour :p Hell, it took me a half hour just to get the colours in my signature this way and it's still not right :D Anyways...

    While you make some valid points, and I must admit there is a ton of evidence that supports your theory, I must say a lot of it is only circumstantial. I'm not trying to discredit your theory, but I'm going to remain on the side of caution and not expect either outcome. They've done such a good job keeping his role in the film secret that I honestly don't know WHAT to believe.

    Though I will give a small cheer if/when he shows up at the final battle... I'll cheer twice if he decapitates a Sentinel :cool:
     
  6. The Original Bamfer Big, Bald and Beautiful

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    :up: The fence is a nice place :p
     
  7. Redd_Angel ooh la la!

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    wow! :up: i call that dedication! good job
     
  8. CrypticOne Poetic Violence

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    Good post, good read. I completely agree with you. That emotional scene in X1 between Professor X and Cyclops, proves to me that Cyclops will most likely survive.

    We need to have more posts like this.
     
  9. cyke93 Registered

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    very nice summary .. thought i wish i could believe scott lives i am not on the same boat as you.. it will take me a while to respond to many of your comments.
     
  10. Nell2ThaIzzay Registered

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    *standing ovation*

    I feel that you left out one key piece of evidence though. And that is, in the Premiere article about X-Men 3, James Marsden mentions the Pavlovian response he has to wearing the uniform... "Ah yes, THIS discomfort"

    I highly doubt that James would be talking about PROMO SHOOTS when he's talking about the experience of filming the movie.

    My theory:

    Cyclops blasts out at the lake, in anger over the fact that the flooding waters are what killed Jean Grey. She happens to rise though... they share an intimate reunion, in which she does control his optic blasts so she can see his eyes, and they kiss. However, her new found powers begin to corrupt her, and she erupts in a violent outburst that knocks the 2 of them out. When Storm and Wolverine arrive at the lake, both Cyclops and Jean are found (we just don't see Cyclops in the trailer), and taken back to the mansion. Cyclops' glasses would be found, because an unconcious Cyclops wouldn't need the glasses to hold back his optic blasts... his eyes would be closed.

    Jean's newfound powers allow her to awaken at the mansion before Cyclops. A mind read by Xavier reveals the truth behind her powers:

    When Jean was first found by Xavier, he realized how powerful she could be. He put the mental blocks in her mind to prevent her from becoming so powerful. However, Magneto's machine, which appeared to have no effect on mutants, actually did have an effect on Jean Grey by destroying the mental blocks. This is why we see her evolution of her powers in X2. Her new found powers were able to keep her protected while she was underwater underneath Alkali Lake, until she finally awoke.

    Now, without the mental blocks, she has powers stronger than anything she has ever known before... and with that comes a corruption; she has the potential for absolute power, and that potential is corrupting her mind. Not totally corrupted yet, she fears what damage she can cause by her newfound powers, and wants Wolverine to kill her, despite his pleas with her to let them help her. And then the corruption once again comes over her, she slams Wolverine against the wall telekinetically, and storms out of the mansion, going back to her childhood home.

    She learns about the cure, and realizes that it is the one thing that can prevent her from having her absolute power. She sides with Magneto, who she knows will take an active stand against the cure, unlike Xavier who will try to work out the situation diplomatically. She has no interest in the well-being of mutants, her only care is to keep her power. After learning about the blocks Xavier put in, an action taken to keep her from reaching her full power, she kills him. Her and Magneto go off with the Brotherhood, with a plan to destroy this cure.

    When the X-Men plan to go to Alcatraz to stop the Brotherhood, they tell Scott to stay behind. Their reasoning; after being knocked out by such an attack from Jean Grey, he is in no physical shape to take part in such a large scale battle. Nor is he emotionally capable of taking part in this battle, in which he will have to fight against the woman that he loves, the woman that he lost, the woman he saw rise from the dead, only to be lost to the corruption of her own power.

    The X-Men, now led by Storm, take the Blackbird to Alcatraz to confront the Brotherhood. However, Cyclops is not about to give up, not on himself, not on his team, and especially not on the woman he loves.

    He has Angel (who told the X-Men where the secret lab was that was developing the cure, afterall, he'd know) take him to Alcatraz. Rogue, who has finally made a decision on her mutancy, goes along with Cyclops, ready to finally make a stand, and accept who she is.

    In typical movie fashion, Cyclops and the reinforcements arrive just in the nick of time, when the tide of the battle has turned against the X-Men (I imagine this change in tide being Sentinels, but that's for another thread). Cyclops takes command of the X-Men and leads his team into a victory in this battle, and in the end, when it's just the X-Men and Phoenix left, Cyclops reaches out to Jean, in a way he hadn't had an oppourtunity to yet, and in a way that Wolverine never could. He touches Jean (emotionally, not physically), and her deep, undying love for Scott, and his for her, becomes stronger than the corruption of the Phoenix. Perhaps it is even his reaching to Jean, and bringing her back from her corruption, that is what leads the X-Men to victory, as she uses her powers for those that she loves, instead of for her own gain, and she destroys that ultimate threat (whether it be some Sentinels, or a deranged Magneto, or whatever), and it is because of Cyclops' love for Jean Grey that she returns to herself, and the X-Men save the day.

    That's how I'd like to see it done, and though it might not play out exactly like that, I have a feeling it will play out similar to that. And if it is anything like what I've posted here, then there is no doubt that this will have been the best movie of the series, runtime be damned.

    But one way or another, I agree with you, that Cyclops does live, does take part in the final battle, and is the determining factor is Jean's return from the Phoenix.
     
  11. Nell2ThaIzzay Registered

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    And man! I said the exact same thing like, a month ago man! Did everyone forget already?! :(
     
  12. Joined:
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    Great post, and a great point!
     
  13. The Original Bamfer Big, Bald and Beautiful

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    Sorry - I don't recall it. I'm sure it was awesome, none-the-less! And thanks for the quote... I forgot that one. :up:
     
  14. cyke93 Registered

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    you make certain good points while some i doubt. im not trying to prove either way he lives or dies, no one knows for sure and we'll all find out once someone leaks the information by watching the actual movie. with that said:

    as far as cyclops getting kidnapped, i do not think they would do that simply because they did that in x2, which leads into why they would make cyclops dead only for him to be really alive.

    plus it makes no sense to shelve his character off for the entire movie only to see him in the end, like i said its been done in x2 and i dont know why they would want to do a repeat. it would seem plainly obvious that they really just needed to push him off to the side

    changes to the script are just that .. but major plot points still hold true. scott still goes to alkali lake, while filming they could've easily changed their mind and say do this instead of that ,kiss with your glasses off, etc.

    with the promotional pictures of cyclops in uniform, i have no doubt we will see him in uniform, but then again this could be in the beg. of the film, when we know he's still around. unless we see an actual pic of cyclops in uniform from the movie and we can clearly tell that it was after alkali lake then thats the solid proof we've all been waiting for.

    i agree that since the 3rd act was never released, we do not know how it'll end. will there be surprises? probably, as far as cyclops is concenred? maybe not mayb so..

    "full circle" - cyclops running the school after xavier "dies" is a nice thought but i doubt it. storm could also take up helm and we could always bank on them to focus on wolverine, at the end of x2, we saw him make the commitment to the xmen, x3 could see him fulfill it by stasying full time at the school

    the other things are more studio politics, which in this day of age, constitutes to a lot of decisions made by the studio/writers etc. basically singer left, marsden joined up to superman, fox managed to get ashmore to not do superman .. so lets just say that marsden was already in a tight situation and killing him off was the easiest thing to do given the whole deal with superman and not having enough time

    and who's not to say we dont see cyclops and jean meet on the "astral plane" or in her head. this is a theory i came up with and it seems to be the easiest fix to get cyclops back on screen with out actually bringing his character back to life. he would be the voice of good within jean and would fulfill his comic book duties as being jean's most avid supporter.

    but basically.. we still have to wait till may 26. just dont come in with too much expectations from cyclops character, dead or alive .. and if he comes out doing more than dying then ill be somewhat happy ... or rather not as pissed as i could've been hehe.
     
  15. Halcohol Suit up

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    Sit down, Nell. :p

    No, you've made the same points repeatedly, and while your posts are a tad more verbose but still intriguing to read, you've gotta give the props to TOB for putting up pictures and big bold letters ;)
     
  16. LEX Registered

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    Great thread and great post. :up: Cyclops must live!
     
  17. Nell2ThaIzzay Registered

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    Oh, I give him his props. Did you just not tell me to sit down? It's cuz I was standing and cheering.

    My comment wasn't meant to be taken seriously.
     
  18. muscaremy Registered

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    good read bamf... and i gotta say it makes a lot a sense but dunno what i think is gonna actually happen
     
  19. Halcohol Suit up

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    Neither was mine ;) Let the joyous banter continue forever. FOREVER, I SAY!
     
  20. the_scream Registered

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    Good post. I think you have summed it up a lot better.
     
  21. Nell2ThaIzzay Registered

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    How's this for a big change:

    -The 3rd act has been completely reworked. The Golden Gate Bridge sequence, which was originally going to be Magneto breaking out captive mutants for his Brotherhood, is now an assault against the cure-lab in the 3rd act.

    -The main human villian has been changed from Warren Worthington, Jr. to somebody else. Most likely General Trask. A character who was never even in the original DRAFT that was reviewed by AICN.

    Those are some pretty big changes. So um, why can't the fate of Cyclops be one of them? You guys have to remember, what was reviewed by AICN, was not a set in stone, final script. It was an early draft, so the studio could get an idea of what they'd need to shell out for this movie. For budgeting and stuff. Major changes have been made since then.

    And I've stated it before, the reason why the Alkali Lake scene seems so familiar to the AICN review is because that scene, since the beginning, has been influenced from a page directly out of the comics. Even changing it around so Cyclops doesn't die, the scene is still going to play out pretty much the way it was originally supposed to. Because it's inspired directly from the comics.

    And when exactly would Cyclops wear the uniform in the beginning? The uniforms are only worn when the X-Men are on assignment. And we know he's not in the Danger Room, because he's not with the group of X-Men who are walking to the Danger Room in the trailers. He'll most likely have left for Alkali Lake by then.

    The conflict that the X-Men will face, when they would suit up, will be at the end of the film. And the fact that he suits up (as Marsden states that he did) is pretty reassuring to the fact that he will be a part of the final battle. Which means he won't be dead...

    And I suppose it's an option, but in my opinion, it's just bad storytelling to have Jean Grey kill him, then "remolecularize" him later. First of all (I suppose I could be wrong, seeing as though I'm not a comic expert), I never remember Jean having powers to resurrect others. But maybe she does. But even if she does in the comics, it's just bad storytelling in the movies to just have her resurrect him at the end of the movie. It takes away what makes her character unique... her sacrifice, and then coming back later as the Phoenix. If everyone gets resurrected, it will be corny. Her resurrection won't be special, when everyone else gets resurrected. And why wouldn't she just resurrect everyone else, as well? Like Xavier? And even Magneto? Sure, they are enemies, but they don't hate him enough to wish death upon him. And even though they may be enemies, Magneto is still Xavier's friend.

    It just wouldn't be good storytelling. You can get away with stuff like that in the comics, but it's just dumb in the movies, and would really kill the whole "realistic" vibe they are going for.

    It's also bad storytelling, because you have to assume that if she resurrects Cyclops, that she is not longer corrupted by the Phoenix. And if she's good, surely the battle would be over, seeing as though she could use her powers to destroy whatever threats to the X-Men exist. And if Cyclops died at Alkali Lake, not in his uniform, why would he be resurrected, in his uniform?

    So, therefore, that leads me to believe even further that Cyclops will never die at Alkali Lake. These writers, and the director, have made it really clear that they are striving to keep the realistic tone set by Bryan Singer. I doubt that they'd kill it by including a bunch of cheesy resurrections. And if you look at the context a resurrection would happen in, it just wouldn't make sense.
     
  22. PWN3R Instagram:@Mannie_Bothans

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    Excellent post TOB. You deserve more than a cookie. ;)


    I agree with everything, except Cyclops being kidnapped. They did that in X2, if he fell for the same trick twice, that would make the movie Cyke lame. :(
     
  23. JP Smelly

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    Meh.. Cyclops will die. So will Xavier and Jean. Mystique will get cured, and if certain pictures are accurate, so will Magneto. All of this and more in only 1h43!! :)

    Whee! :(
     
  24. cyke93 Registered

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    id like to comment on your post but i saw some key words there and lets face it, i dont want to be spoiled even more than i have been, im sticking strictly to cyclops, once i know he lives or dies for sure then im out of here until i watch the movie .. but just the feeling i got from your post, ok fine they bring cyclops back for the 3rd act and we're all supposed to be shocked to see him back alive, i dont kow if they're going to do this, this isn't 24 when they completely do a complete flip around every 4-6 episodes (24 fans u know what im talking about, esp during this season! hehe) .. but the problem is what does he do if he comes back for the final act or battle? i dont want to count injury because thats more of wolverines thing. logan can get seriously hurt and they can shelve him off till the end of the movie because its his power, but if cyclops is injured, it just seems too much perfect timing for him to be coming back.
     
  25. Nell2ThaIzzay Registered

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    But that would show how much of a leader he is. And how devoted he is to Xavier's dream, and the people that he loves, including Jean.

    I'm not saying that he's magically healed of his injuries, and then he goes into battle.

    I'm saying he goes into battle despite it. Despite the emotional wreck he is in, after watching the woman he loves die, resurrect, become corrupted, and become his enemy. Despite the physical state he'd be in from the blast he would have taken at the hand of said woman. Despite all that, it would show just how devoted he is. And just how strong he is. That he refuses to give up on Jean Grey, even when everyone thinks the only solution left is to destroy her. He will still go out and fight with all that he's got to bring her back.

    With all the *****ing people have made about how lame Cyclops is in the movies (and that is a statement I disagree with 100%), don't you think that this would be the payoff? His determination to fight for Xavier's dream, his determination to fight for the love of his life, no matter the cost?

    I dunno about you, but if I were a Cyclops fan (and I am, he's just not quite my favorite character, but he's up there), and that's what his role was in this movie, the final movie of the trilogy, the overall climax to the saga, I'd be pretty damned ****ing satisfied. I'd be more than satisfied. I'd walk out of the theatre thinking "Holy ****, they really did a good job with Cyclops!"
     

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