neitchze's superman essentially does things the way he wants to whenever he wants. DC's superman is essentially a conformist.
Hi Blksuperman2. There's no reason for you to feel dumb, just because I confused you. As I mentioned, I stupidly (must have been, because I don't know how it happened) lost my first two posts, so the last one may have been overly condensed. Did you read the article at RakuMon's link? Nietzsche was "a German philosopher of the late 19th century who challenged the foundations of traditional morality and Christianity" (the Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy--I don't know all this stuff, I just like to look things up). He thought we shouldn't just accept what we've been taught to believe is right and wrong, but examine everything and decide for ourselves, in a way that gives us the energy and freedom to live our lives as we see fit.
The author of the PopMatters article suggests that the way Superman is shown in Superman Returns is as a martyr, an object of pity for sacrificing his life for humans. This is against Nietzsche's vision of the "superman" that we can all try to be when we "surpass pity and embrace inspiration." In other words, when we focus on the possibilities of life. The author says that "celebrating a hero who invokes feelings of pity and envy in us is not a way to motivate people to believe in themselves, but rather it increases our doubt in humanitys strength."
He considers the underlying moral of Batman Begins to be much more positive, and closer to Nietzsche's philosophy. Bruce Wayne decides to do what he can for the cause of good, to help whomever he can, to set an example for the citizens of Gotham and lead them to believe in their own capabilities and "limitless human potential." He can't do it all by himself, unlike Superman, but he can inspire others to take up the job and collectively accomplish wonders.
Some thoughts I had about the article were that Clark is actually very conservative, and unlikely to trust himself to create new standards for right and wrong given his Kryptonian heritage and the damage it's already caused Earth. I don't read a lot of modern comics (too expensive!) but isn't (wasn't?)Lex waging a public opinion war portraying Superman as too powerful and alien to be trustworthy? Superman is able to ease the fears of humanity by accepting, not challenging, its conventions, and by serving them. He's the police officer. Batman, on the other hand, is not so concerned with obeying the law if he considers it to be wrong or obstructive. Another example that came to my mind of a Nietzschian superhero was Jesus, whose standards of right and wrong were often completely contrary to the standards of the religious, political and military establishments of the time, and who insisted that he wasn't there to save the day, but to teach people how to save themselves, how to live in possibilities. I thought it was funny that Superman has so often been compared to Christ (even in the article), but IMO Jesus and Batman actually had a lot more in common.
Heroes!
Hi Blksuperman2. There's no reason for you to feel dumb, just because I confused you. As I mentioned, I stupidly (must have been, because I don't know how it happened) lost my first two posts, so the last one may have been overly condensed. Did you read the article at RakuMon's link? Nietzsche was "a German philosopher of the late 19th century who challenged the foundations of traditional morality and Christianity" (the Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy--I don't know all this stuff, I just like to look things up
The author of the PopMatters article suggests that the way Superman is shown in Superman Returns is as a martyr, an object of pity for sacrificing his life for humans. This is against Nietzsche's vision of the "superman" that we can all try to be when we "surpass pity and embrace inspiration." In other words, when we focus on the possibilities of life. The author says that "celebrating a hero who invokes feelings of pity and envy in us is not a way to motivate people to believe in themselves, but rather it increases our doubt in humanitys strength."
He considers the underlying moral of Batman Begins to be much more positive, and closer to Nietzsche's philosophy. Bruce Wayne decides to do what he can for the cause of good, to help whomever he can, to set an example for the citizens of Gotham and lead them to believe in their own capabilities and "limitless human potential." He can't do it all by himself, unlike Superman, but he can inspire others to take up the job and collectively accomplish wonders.
Some thoughts I had about the article were that Clark is actually very conservative, and unlikely to trust himself to create new standards for right and wrong given his Kryptonian heritage and the damage it's already caused Earth. I don't read a lot of modern comics (too expensive!) but isn't (wasn't?)Lex waging a public opinion war portraying Superman as too powerful and alien to be trustworthy? Superman is able to ease the fears of humanity by accepting, not challenging, its conventions, and by serving them. He's the police officer. Batman, on the other hand, is not so concerned with obeying the law if he considers it to be wrong or obstructive. Another example that came to my mind of a Nietzschian superhero was Jesus, whose standards of right and wrong were often completely contrary to the standards of the religious, political and military establishments of the time, and who insisted that he wasn't there to save the day, but to teach people how to save themselves, how to live in possibilities. I thought it was funny that Superman has so often been compared to Christ (even in the article), but IMO Jesus and Batman actually had a lot more in common.
when theres conflict between what is right and good and what the law says, Supes sides with right and good.
Very well put. SR was kind of a downer: what does Superman have to look forward to in the end? Save the world, get belittled at work, envy others their home lives. Save the world, get belittled, envy. Kind of a rut.
Fictional? I could be cute and pretend I'm talking about Superman, but lordy, why do you think Jesus was fictional? There's plenty of documentation to establish his historical reality. And speaking of the big J, umm, I may have overemphasized the similarities to Batman, at least the comics Batman. There is that whole violence thing, and maybe a few occasions (one or two, here or there) when Bats declined to turn his other cheek, and in fact got quite vengeful. He's still on his personal journey. Superman IMO already possesses many of the personal qualities that Jesus asks us to aspire to; a huge capacity for empathy and compassion, for forgiveness and humility. He just needs to look at the bigger picture, as both Lois and Ollie have challenged him to do.
Jesus discussion? Eep!
Back to business - AVID! You have to go to this and get us the scoops from the Goughlar!
http://www.comicbookscifi.com/
Very well put. SR was kind of a downer: what does Superman have to look forward to in the end? Save the world, get belittled at work, envy others their home lives. Save the world, get belittled, envy. Kind of a rut.
Very true. Your recaplet of my post was a good illustration. This is actually me chatting rather than persuasively writing. I feel comfortable here, so may end up inflicting my inner monologues on whomever cares to read, and not always very well edited monologues at that. I regret confusing anyone, but in the end I think we're just fellow geeks (not to offend anyone) hanging out for the company and virtual coffee.
I can't end this post without saying how proud I am of myself for figuring out multi-quote. And I didn't lose this post once! Go me!
Jesus discussion? Eep!
Back to business - AVID! You have to go to this and get us the scoops from the Goughlar!
http://www.comicbookscifi.com/
I'm at work, been busy (on break now)...
Do you really need a keeper?
I can probably find a whip and a pair of handcuffs somewhere if you do...
I keep forgetting you work during the day now. LOL.. I should just leave my AIM on, I guess.
Do you really need a keeper?
I can probably find a whip and a pair of handcuffs somewhere if you do...
Serene said:Um.. does Clark come with the package?
*following B8s bad thoughts..*
I knew you wouldnt be able to let that post go by without saying something.t:
