The Trump Presidency (A Discussion)

[Victarion]

I saw where Trump said he would send the Feds into Chicago to address the violence if the city didn't take care of it. I also saw where he said he'd sign an executive order giving the OK to advance the Keystone and Dakota Access pipelines...

can he actually do that with executive orders? I thought the pipeline dispute was settled with the protesters. The Chicago thing doesn't even sound like something that would fly in Congress.

 

[Sithborg]

It sounds like it essentially expedites the environmental impact review.

 

[Marvolo]

I saw where Trump said he would send the Feds into Chicago to address the violence if the city didn't take care of it. I also saw where he said he'd sign an executive order giving the OK to advance the Keystone and Dakota Access pipelines...

can he actually do that with executive orders? I thought the pipeline dispute was settled with the protesters. The Chicago thing doesn't even sound like something that would fly in Congress.

The pipeline will likely happen. But the courts can interfere and might be able to change where its located at. He cant executive order a pipeline into existence and executive order it across and through native american land.

The chicago thing is tricky. Under certain circumstances its not illegal or even strange to have the FBI investigate a serious crime or string of crimes. IF a city had a skyrocketing murder rate and it was out of control and local PD and city and statr investigators werent getting the job done then sending in the FBI to get the situation under control isnt the worst idea Ive heard. But the tone Trump has in that tweet is like a dictator threatening to send in troops to quell an uprising. A sensible congress and and a sensible GOP would tell him to sit down and shut up because he sounds like an raving idiot. But the GOP and congress are not behaving sensibly so they might allow him to send the FBI to Chicago. Honestly, with this administration and congress Idk where the line is. Idk how far they will go. We're in dangerous uncharted waters.

 

[TheCommissioner]

it won't be the FBI, he'll try to send troops and file it under the Patriot Act or DHS

 

[Sithborg]

Or he tries to use a version of MI's Snyder's "emergency managers", where a "failing" city gets their democratically elected leaders replaced with a crony.

Which is one major reason that lead to the Flint crisis.

 

[Wise]

So in the past week, the White House has deleted its website section for climate change and subsequently issued a gag order/media blackout for the EPA, whilst they try to get congress to confirm climate change denier Scott Pruitt to be the next administrator of the Environmental Protection Agency. I guess Trump wasn't kidding.

This is happening in the same week that China announced they will invest 360 billion dollars (USD) into renewable energy by 2020, in effect creating 13 million jobs in the sector.

You literally couldn't make this stuff up.

 

[The Incredible Hulk]

The key to survival is adaptation.

There's a large segment of this country, and now a controlling political interest, who is more than happy to stay content in our accomplishments and norms from 60-70 years ago, and assumes the World has basically stayed in stasis during that time. They also act as if all of our actions still happen in some kind of isolationist vacuum.

They loudly state that we're "the greatest country on Earth" and the "only country with 'true' freedom" because it was uttered to them in grade school decades ago. They think that America is some infallible entity who is always in the "right" no matter what action we take if for no other reason than "we're America!".

Meanwhile, other nations have either matched or blown past us in that time in almost every measurable category (be it wealth, quality of life, education, standard of living, scientific and technological development, mortality rate, etc.) with maybe the exception of things like military size.

The U.S. is quickly getting left behind, and most of it is our own doing. Trump isn't the cause of this, but basically the manifestation of the result of it. He and his ideology and most of his constituents are stuck in a time that no longer exists and for good reason. The World is smaller, more inclusive, and smarter since the end of WWII. We better keep up of we're going to be continuing to be the country that brings knives to gun fights.

 

[TheComicbookKid]

I don't hate Republicans.

I hate that they don't seem to have any 21st Century ideas that don't involve defund or repeal what the other guy did. We as a country can't get into this cycle of the President's 100 days being a recap of the last person's administration(that goes for the next Dem, too)

Tax Cuts, Less Regulations, Women's Right. Let this stuff go.

People may hate ObamaCare, but it was a new policy addressing an actual problem we were facing as a country.

Oil hasn't been a great boon to the US since the 1800s. It's gotten us involved in the Middle East in a way we wouldn't be otherwise.

 

[summerteeth]

The key to survival is adaptation.

There's a large segment of this country, and now a controlling political interest, who is more than happy to stay content in our accomplishments and norms from 60-70 years ago, and assumes the World has basically stayed in stasis during that time. They also act as if all of our actions still happen in some kind of isolationist vacuum.

They loudly state that we're "the greatest country on Earth" and the "only country with 'true' freedom" because it was uttered to them in grade school decades ago. They think that America is some infallible entity who is always in the "right" no matter what action we take if for no other reason than "we're America!".

Meanwhile, other nations have either matched or blown past us in that time in almost every measurable category (be it wealth, quality of life, education, standard of living, scientific and technological development, mortality rate, etc.) with maybe the exception of things like military size.

The U.S. is quickly getting left behind, and most of it is our own doing. Trump isn't the cause of this, but basically the manifestation of the result of it. He and his ideology and most of his constituents are stuck in a time that no longer exists and for good reason. The World is smaller, more inclusive, and has found better ways of doing things.

We are not being left behind. We are still incredibly wealthy. We have both very high disposable income and high average salary. In education we have fallen behind and mortality rate is largely due to eating habits and sedentary lifestyles. The whole idea was to catch up everyone to us and there would be greater wealth that was the whole idea behind the Marshall Plan.

 

[summerteeth]

I don't hate Republicans.



Oil hasn't been a great boon to the US since the 1800s. It's gotten us involved in the Middle East in a way we wouldn't be otherwise.

uh...what? Statement is absolutely divorced from reality except for the Middle East bit.

private sector employment increased by more than one million jobs, about 1%. Over the same period, the oil and natural gas industry increased by more than 162,000 jobs, a 40% increase.

http://www.eia.gov/todayinenergy/detail.php?id=12451

 

[Handsome Rob]

I don't hate Republicans.

I hate that they don't seem to have any 21st Century ideas that don't involve defund or repeal what the other guy did. We as a country can't get into this cycle of the President's 100 days being a recap of the last person's administration(that goes for the next Dem, too)

Tax Cuts, Less Regulations, Women's Right. Let this stuff go.

People may hate ObamaCare, but it was a new policy addressing an actual problem we were facing as a country.

Oil hasn't been a great boon to the US since the 1800s. It's gotten us involved in the Middle East in a way we wouldn't be otherwise.

This kind of simplistic thinking can be applied to the Democrats, who don't seem to have any 21st Century ideas that don't involve higher taxes, more spending, and more regulation . . . and more government control.

Our federal government is $20 trillion in debt. Back when the annual deficits were at their highest, we heard calls from the Democrats to increase taxes on the wealthy to cover it. Yet, for at least one of those years, raising the top income tax rate on individuals to 100% would not have gained enough revenue to eliminate that deficit. Yet, they still harped on it like it would. The cries of "raise taxes on the 1%" continued unabated.

Any call for regulatory reform is met with reactionary cries of "rats in our hamburger meat," "child labor in factories," "poisoned drinking water," etc. There is never any acknowledgement that certain regulations may cause more harm than the problem they were intended to solve. There is never any acknowledgement of the costs of regulations--costs which weigh most heavily on smaller businesses and the poor. There is never any acknowledgement that the private sector may be able to self-regulate better and for less cost than government. The only cries are for "More regulation!"

The state of Vermont--solidly blue Vermont--tried to implement single payer, and the Democrat governor ultimately admitted that it would be too costly to do for the state. Yet, this little story is all but ignored by Democrats who believe the only solution acceptable with regard to our health care system is single payer.

The bullheadedness in our politics is quite at home in both parties. The person who insists that there is never a role for government is just as narrow-minded as the person who insists that the government is the solution. But, good luck getting them to see that . . . that's part of the whole bullheaded mentality.

 

[TheComicbookKid]

uh...what? Statement is absolutely divorced from reality except for the Middle East bit.



http://www.eia.gov/todayinenergy/detail.php?id=12451

The Middle East bit is why it's not. I lived in Mississippi. I grew up around the old oil industry that we abandoned, cause it was cheaper to go to the Middle East instead of domestic oil drilling.

Jobs are the only indication of good.

 

[summerteeth]

The Middle East bit is why it's not. I lived in Mississippi. I grew up around the old oil industry that we abandoned, cause it was cheaper to go to the Middle East instead of domestic oil drilling.

Jobs are the only indication of good.

It may not be at its peak but it hasn't been since the 1800's and shale oil was a game changer and a boon to the economy. Now since there is so much of it out the industry is starting to decline again but that's the nature of commodities. It also has to compete with other energy sources as they became better alternatives it will decline.

It hasn't just been jobs, the shale gas has also reduced our carbon emissions to the point that if we leave the Paris Agreement on Climate Change (not advocating for that) we will still meet our carbon emissions goal without really doing anything because of shale.

 

[TheComicbookKid]

This kind of simplistic thinking can be applied to the Democrats, who don't seem to have any 21st Century ideas that don't involve higher taxes, more spending, and more regulation . . . and more government control.

Since there's only been one Democrat. The push for renewable energy, higher fuel standards, and Obamacare. Are addressing issues that were ignored in our society throughout the late 20th. Jimmy Carter called for reducing energy consumption and as laughed at.

What programs to you see on the Republican side? Common Core was probably the most forward thinking attempt i've seen.

Our federal government is $20 trillion in debt. Back when the annual deficits were at their highest, we heard calls from the Democrats to increase taxes on the wealthy to cover it. Yet, for at least one of those years, raising the top income tax rate on individuals to 100% would not have gained enough revenue to eliminate that deficit. Yet, they still harped on it like it would. The cries of "raise taxes on the 1%" continued unabated.

I'm actually fiscally conservative. The fact that Republicans have lost that ideology is a large part of my frustration with them. There's no balance.

Any call for regulatory reform is met with reactionary cries of "rats in our hamburger meat," "child labor in factories," "poisoned drinking water," etc. There is never any acknowledgement that certain regulations may cause more harm than the problem they were intended to solve. There is never any acknowledgement of the costs of regulations--costs which weigh most heavily on smaller businesses and the poor. There is never any acknowledgement that the private sector may be able to self-regulate better and for less cost than government. The only cries are for "More regulation!"

The problem is that some on the Republican side don't want to admit there was problem when they want to defund stuff. I agree wholeheartedly that not everything we try works(that's why we rework or try something else), but if we know there's a problem, then not addressing it means what exactly?

The state of Vermont--solidly blue Vermont--tried to implement single payer, and the Democrat governor ultimately admitted that it would be too costly to do for the state. Yet, this little story is all but ignored by Democrats who believe the only solution acceptable with regard to our health care system is single payer.

That's interesting, but that's not necessarily the same as, something won't work.
The ARTICLES OF CONFEDERATION didn't work, that didn't mean the US should just go back to being a colony of Britain. We get together and try something else.

The Constitution is called a living document cause even they knew stuff would have to be adjusted.

The bullheadedness in our politics is quite at home in both parties. The person who insists that there is never a role for government is just as narrow-minded as the person who insists that the government is the solution. But, good luck getting them to see that . . . that's part of the whole bullheaded mentality.

Agree with everything in this.

 

[TheComicbookKid]

It may not be at its peak but it hasn't been since the 1800's and shale oil was a game changer and a boon to the economy. Now since there is so much of it out the industry is starting to decline again but that's the nature of commodities. It also has to compete with other energy sources as they became better alternatives it will decline.

It hasn't just been jobs, the shale gas has also reduced our carbon emissions to the point that if we leave the Paris Agreement on Climate Change (not advocating for that) we will still meet our carbon emissions goal without really doing anything because of shale.

The boom bust nature of oil is part of it. The idea that fracking is a good idea when it's know how toxic the chemicals they use are and the ever continuing search for land/sea to do it when we know how fragile the environment is.

It reminds me of an addict keep needing to find veins cause they tapped out the others, but the larger point is that this stuff is dangerous, no matter how good it feels.

 

[Legendver2]

I guess that wall's about to happen. Where's he gonna get the funding for that?

Also, just out of curiosity, what's the difference between this and the other Trump thread? Seems kinda redundant.

 

[Isildur´s Heir]

I guess that wall's about to happen. Where's he gonna get the funding for that?

Mexico will pay for it....

And then it will be time for mass deportations....and the civil war: the sequel, will start.

 

[Kelly]

I guess that wall's about to happen. Where's he gonna get the funding for that?

Also, just out of curiosity, what's the difference between this and the other Trump thread? Seems kinda redundant.

The money for the beginning is coming from funds given to DHS, once that is gone he will have to go to Congress for more... So as of right now and this EC, the funding is coming from DHS.

 

[Kelly]

All he is doing with these Executive Orders, and its actually pretty damn smart...is he is setting up Congress AND SCOTUS...in that if something he does gets struck down he can simply say.....HEY, I tried to make good on my campaign promise, but Congress and SCOTUS kept me from doing it....pretty damn genius.

 

[Handsome Rob]

I guess that wall's about to happen. Where's he gonna get the funding for that?

Also, just out of curiosity, what's the difference between this and the other Trump thread? Seems kinda redundant.

I think the idea is that here we can discuss Trump's policies and actions without all the "Trump is teh orange Hitlerz!!!11!!1!" garbage that is consuming the other Trump thread.

 

[Legendver2]

Basically for him to say he kept his promises of trying to do it, but whether it happens is totally not on him.

 

[Sithborg]

All he is doing with these Executive Orders, and its actually pretty damn smart...is he is setting up Congress AND SCOTUS...in that if something he does gets struck down he can simply say.....HEY, I tried to make good on my campaign promise, but Congress and SCOTUS kept me from doing it....pretty damn genius.

I honestly don't think its that. This is how he is used to running a business.

 

[Legendver2]

I honestly don't think its that. This is how he is used to running a business.

I think that's exactly how he does business. He puts his name on so many things, but when those ventures don't work, he backtracks saying all he did was license the name, he had no dealings in the development of the venture. This is exactly what he's doing. He's using his name as president to sign all these EOs, but the funding, actual building, the nitty gritty, that's all Congress, and if it doesn't happen, it's all on Congress. So if it pans out, he will swoop in and take credit. If it doesn't, he can push blame and responsibility on someone else.

 

[Marvolo]

This thread is for official stuff he does as president and is meant to be a more mature thread. No gifs, funny pics, funny videos etc. The other thread is for all the dumb "private" **** he does and is a bit more laid back. But you can post stuff he does as president in either thread.

 

[Schlosser85]

Report finds that stemming the flow of undocumented immigrants across the southern border---which accounts for between 50 and 70% of the agricultural workforce---would cause retail food prices to jump an average of 5 or 6%, and the quality and quantity of grocery store produce would diminish

http://modernfarmer.com/2017/01/trump-builds-wall-will-happen-food-system/