Arrow "The Vigilante", "The Hood", "GREEN ARROW!" (Name Discussion)

[DrCosmic]

So, a lot of people have a serious issue with them not calling him Green Arrow yet. Here's my thoughts:

• The Name is Corny, very Silver Age-y and not natural to use/come up with in a modern time
• Newspapers don't give out cute nicknames to killers, if you've noticed
• The show is trying its best to be realistic
• They should probably have a realistic way of coming up with the name, right?
• The show should be on for a while, so it's not really a rush, is it?
• Right now, Oliver isn't a superhero - he isn't trying to represent something, have an image, or anything like that
• For the story they're telling, which is really about how Green Arrow comes to be, having this period where he doesn't quite know his destiny, makes it better
• With a story like this, when the name finally comes out of the story, instead of a rushed 'make it like the comics' one liner, it means something, it represents something, even if you've never read the comics, it means something important in this story.

Share your thoughts.

 

[KenK]

So, a lot of people have a serious issue with them not calling him Green Arrow yet. Here's my thoughts:

• The Name is Corny, very Silver Age-y and not natural to use/come up with in a modern time

• 
  
  It's the name of the damn character!
  
  

  [*]Newspapers don't give out cute nicknames to killers, if you've noticed

  
  The Unibomber
  BTK
  Son Of Sam
  Zodiac
  
  Should I go on?
  
  
  

  [*]The show is trying its best to be realistic

  
  It's half-assing it. For all the realism Nolan stressed in his Batman films, no one ever entertained the idea of not referring to him as "Batman"! There's no reason Oliver couldn't have just started saying, "BEWARE THE GREEN ARROW!!!" Don't give me that "realism" bulls#!+
  
  

  [*]They should probably have a realistic way of coming up with the name, right?

  
  The newspapers don't have to be the ones to give him the name. Enough information about him is a matter of public record that those who believe him to be a hero, which many characters on the show who don't know he's Oliver Queen do consider him to be. Some random citizen plugged into social media could start calling him Green Arrow, and that's how it would ultimately stick.
  
  

  [*]Right now, Oliver isn't a superhero - he isn't trying to represent something, have an image, or anything like that
  [*]For the story they're telling, which is really about how Green Arrow comes to be, having this period where he doesn't quite know his destiny, makes it better
  
  [*]With a story like this, when the name finally comes out of the story, instead of a rushed 'make it like the comics' one liner, it means something, it represents something, even if you've never read the comics, it means something important in this story.

Excuses excuses. Clearly, the show is making a certain number of concessions in regards to the source material as it is, the least they can do is refer to the character they're basing the damn show on as such. It doesn't elevate the quality of the show, or play into some progression of the character. It's a corporate mandate to keep the show from seeming too "comic booky". It's the same reason they don't want to do a Woman Woman show called "Wonder Woman", but they want to call it "Amazon"! This is the same BS we had to endure in the latter seasons of Smallville, with Clark's crimefighting identity being "The Blur"? SERIOUSLY?!?!?!

 

[Justin]

I don't know if they'll ever change the name. But the writers have really hinted for a while now that after the events of the finale, he's going to become less vigilante and more hero, and he's going to have fans and detractors in the general public.

If they're going to go with the name, I expect it to be part of that transistion. Maybe a nickname that sticks. But in all honesty, as a fan who doesn't come from a comic book background, I really honestly don't care. I don't mind it one bit. I can see why GA fans are a little off with it, but if thats the worst thing about the show then it's not so bad.

 

[Human Torch]

The problem I have is that I don't know why Ollie couldn't just pick a name for this persona the way Bruce did with Batman.(I mean,hell,they took so much from Batman Begins,why stop with him actually saying "I'm Arrow")

They had a built in reason for the police to call him Green Arrow had they chose to go that route.(The whole thing where Arrow uses Green Arrows vs The Dark Archer's Black Arrows.) Have them say to the press "this was done by the Green Arrow vigilante".Eventually it would get shortened to Green Arrow or just Arrow.

 

[DrCosmic]

It's the name of the damn character!

It is... that doesn't mean that giving it a half-arsed or rushed explanation is anything more than bad writing.

The Unibomber
BTK
Son Of Sam
Zodiac

Should I go on?

None of those sound particularly cute. Newspapers make killers sound bad "The Hood" rather than something nice and colorful like "The Green Arrow."

It's half-assing it. For all the realism Nolan stressed in his Batman films, no one ever entertained the idea of not referring to him as "Batman"! There's no reason Oliver couldn't have just started saying, "BEWARE THE GREEN ARROW!!!" Don't give me that "realism" bulls#!+

Do you realize "Green Arrow" is not a scary concept and "Batman" is. Batman sounds like some night monster. Green Arrow sounds like a brightly colored primitive weapon.

The newspapers don't have to be the ones to give him the name. Enough information about him is a matter of public record that those who believe him to be a hero, which many characters on the show who don't know he's Oliver Queen do consider him to be. Some random citizen plugged into social media could start calling him Green Arrow, and that's how it would ultimately stick.

The people who believe him to be a hero are like, three people. Even if you invent a character and do a social media subplot, it still sounds forced, because social media sites don't do cute old fashioned names either.

Excuses excuses. Clearly, the show is making a certain number of concessions in regards to the source material as it is, the least they can do is refer to the character they're basing the damn show on as such. It doesn't elevate the quality of the show, or play into some progression of the character. It's a corporate mandate to keep the show from seeming too "comic booky". It's the same reason they don't want to do a Woman Woman show called "Wonder Woman", but they want to call it "Amazon"! This is the same BS we had to endure in the latter seasons of Smallville, with Clark's crimefighting identity being "The Blur"? SERIOUSLY?!?!?!

The latter seasons of Smallville were not corporate mandate. Tom Welling refused to play any character called "Superman." They were perfectly clear to do so. But that's another story. The reason Amazon is pitched as so is because "Arrow" is successful. You're making up a story and getting made at something that's not actually happening.

What *is* happening is that this grounded (albeit soap-y) take on Green Arrow - including things like not throwing in random Silver Age goodness without sufficient modern realistic reasoning - this take is very successful. The fact that he's moving towards being more of a hero means that him not defining himself as a hero now definitely lends towards the progression of the character. Not knowing who or what he is gets hammered into us for every opening monologue.

It honestly sounds like you think of the current story as "excuses" or outright don't even acknowledge its existence, and make up your own stories about why this is so. It sounds like you should be writing your own stuff, since that's what you're doing anyway.

 

[DrCosmic]

The problem I have is that I don't know why Ollie couldn't just pick a name for this persona the way Bruce did with Batman.(I mean,hell,they took so much from Batman Begins,why stop with him actually saying "I'm Arrow")

They had a built in reason for the police to call him Green Arrow had they chose to go that route.(The whole thing where Arrow uses Green Arrows vs The Dark Archer's Black Arrows.) Have them say to the press "this was done by the Green Arrow vigilante".Eventually it would get shortened to Green Arrow or just Arrow.

On the first part, I think it's because Bruce knew what he wanted to become, what he wanted to symbolize. Ollie has no fracking clue what he wants to symbolize. So he really isn't in a place to pick a good name.

On the police part, that would have been a nice nod. Unfortunately, I don't think adding the press to that story would have been good.

 

[ThePhantasm]

It is... that doesn't mean that giving it a half-arsed or rushed explanation is anything more than bad writing.

I liked the days when you didn't have to overly explain every detail about a superhero in order to enjoy watching their movies... you just suspended your disbelief and went along with it.

Nowadays if nothing has a "reason" its "bad writing." Meh.

 

[Destructus86]

Green Arrow IS corny.

Maybe just call him The Arrow or something like that.

 

[mr. peasant]

The Unibomber
BTK
Son Of Sam
Zodiac

Should I go on?

The thing about the names you quote is that they are examples that are decades old. Practices, attitudes and principles then and now are different. For instance, JFK had Addison's disease but the press did not reveal this at a time on his request out of respect for the guy. Nowadays, this is a lot less likely to happen.

 

[The Sage]

"The Vigilante" and "The Hood" aren't scary names either, yet these are the monikers Ollie is operating under. I don't see what's wrong with Green Arrow, since he leaves green arrows at the scene and it could just be how they identify and distinguish him. Something that will be needed if other vigilantes start appearing in Starling City.

 

[Compi716]

Detective Lance even referred to him once as Green Arrow, and for a moment I was elated. Then they went back to the usual bs.

I'm hoping that in season 2 Oliver picks a name (preferably Green Arrow), and starts wearing a mask of some sort. Paint just ain't gonna cut it.

 

[Shikamaru]

I would prefer if they fall him Green Arrow but at this point, I just want him to get a name. If Green Arrow sounds corny, then give him a cool name that doesn't. I don't buy the excuse that him getting any sort of name is somehow unrealistic. Human beings are generally drawn to giving names to things. If a vigilante showed up tomorrow in a major American city, you can bet your butt he will eventually get a name. It may not be a name as comic booky as Green Arrow but definitely some sort o name would be given to him, and one more unique as opposed to just "the hood guy". I can buy that he wouldn't realistically get a name as soon as he debuts but the vigilante has operated in Starling City for almost a year now in the show's continuity.

I always found it a bit funny that Nolan's Batman films gave Batman and his villains all their names from the comics (except for Catwoman) while a lot of the MCU films never named a lot of their characters and yet the Nolan Batman films were far more realistic than the MCU ones. Just pointing that out.

It's good they confirmed that Oliver will make that transition from vigilante to hero. Now all that's left is to give him a name and a mask.

 

[mr. peasant]

I would prefer if they fall him Green Arrow but at this point, I just want him to get a name. If Green Arrow sounds corny, then give him a cool name that doesn't. I don't buy the excuse that him getting any sort of name is somehow unrealistic. Human beings are generally drawn to giving names to things. If a vigilante showed up tomorrow in a major American city, you can bet your butt he will eventually get a name. It may not be a name as comic booky as Green Arrow but definitely some sort o name would be given to him, and one more unique as opposed to just "the hood guy". I can buy that he wouldn't realistically get a name as soon as he debuts but the vigilante has operated in Starling City for almost a year now in the show's continuity.

How so? From what I've found, most named vigilantes out there self-selected/identified their names as part of their public relations and image. Meanwhile, American media does not give fancy names to unidentified serial killers in recent years, as evidenced ]. Rather, they get names like "the Daytona Beach killer".

 

[Human Torch]

I liked the days when you didn't have to overly explain every detail about a superhero in order to enjoy watching their movies... you just suspended your disbelief and went along with it.

Nowadays if nothing has a "reason" its "bad writing." Meh.

If you can't deal with a character's name or the fact that no one can see through his disguise,you ought not even bother with the superhero genre.

 

[chamber-music]

The thing about the names you quote is that they are examples that are decades old.

There is the Crossbow Cannibal. Its the name Bradford Serial Killer Stephen Griffiths dubbed himself in 2010 and the press ran with it. In the news media he was often referred to by that nickname.

 

[S. Grundy]

The show missed the perfect opportunity to get the Green Arrow name out there. It was during the dinner party with Malcolm when he suggests Green Arrow as a new name for the vigilante, and since the chief of police was there too, and he was having a press conference about the vigilante in the next scene, they could have had him throw the name out there.

At this point I'll take just calling him The Arrow, God knows their never going to actually call the character Green Arrow.

 

[Justin]

Detective Lance even referred to him once as Green Arrow, and for a moment I was elated. Then they went back to the usual bs.

I'm hoping that in season 2 Oliver picks a name (preferably Green Arrow), and starts wearing a mask of some sort. Paint just ain't gonna cut it.

Did he? The only time I remember it mentioned was when Oliver said the vigilante needed a better name than the hood guy, and Malcolm said "how about green arrow"? Oliver said it was lame. Shame it wasn't Tommy who suggested the name, then he could take it up in his memory.

I'm still hoping Felicity fixes him up with those applied sciences goggles!

 

[mr. peasant]

There is the Crossbow Cannibal. Its the name Bradford Serial Killer Stephen Griffiths dubbed himself in 2010 and the press ran with it. In the news media he was often referred to by that nickname.

The part in bold being the key part. The media didn't name him. They just went with "the Bradford serial killer" until he named himself.

 

[hjb155]

im not finding anything wrong with him not being called 'green arrow' the show is awesome. i also dont find it to be bad writing, take any superhero or comic that has been made into a tv show or movie and they always leave something out. to chronicle the entire writings onto the screen would take far more time and money than most production companies are allowed. anyone who sits down to watch either a movie or tv show such as this and expect it to be exactly the way they read it is kidding themselves. this factor also opens up the whole discussion on personal interpretation. everyone takes something different from what they read, perhaps this is the interpretation of the writers. im assuming that the writers must be superhero fans and comic readers for even agreeing to take on this challenge.

 

[Luane]

That didn't disturb me they didn't call Oliver Green Arrow because we know he is. Then as hjb155 said it's maybe the interpretation of writers. Look, for Man of Steel, Snyder explains that they didn't call the film Superman because he is not a human but a man with superpowers, a man of steel, for making the difference between a human and a kryptonian. For Arrow - notice they don't call the series Green Arrow - perhaps they want to make a difference with antecedent productions.

 

[S. Grundy]

They don't call the series Green Arrow because it's too comic book-y.

 

[kryptonselite62]

The emerald archer doesn't sound tough enough especially when paired with Merlin's "dark archer" name. The hood or green hood would work for me just as long as they get rid of the vigilante name.

 

[Human Torch]

How the heck does "The Hood" sound less comic book than "Green Arrow"?

 

[Justin]

How the heck does "The Hood" sound less comic book than "Green Arrow"?

Because it's almost always said by Detective Lance, criminals or other policeman who usually refer to such people by a short distinctive name. In the same way the same sort of people refer to Batman as "the bat" in the modern media. It's just a nickname that spreads.

"watch out it's the hood" or "this looks like the hood again" sounds a lot more plausible to me than "watch out, it's the Green Arrow" or "this looks like the Green Arrow again". Maybe it's just me, but i think it makes sense.

 

[S. Grundy]

Then they should have called the show "The Hood," and not bothered adapting Green Arrow if they are so embarrassed by it.