The Wrestling Thread MUST End In Pinball Or Submission - - - - - Part 222

[Bat Brain]

Hnng...

 

[The Hill]

Sweet Jesus....

 

[TX85]

 

[famicommander]

well it is a developmental show

Right, but there are a lot of guys on the main roster that are twice as green as anyone on NXT, and there are guys in NXT that are ten times better than the current WWE champ will ever be.

Guys like Samoa Joe and Shinsuke Nakamura shouldn't be in developmental. They're already in their late 30s and both have main event talent and charisma.

They're essentially doing with NXT what major sports leagues have been doing with minor leagues for decades -- using them to hoard talent and keep them away from potential competitors. Note that I'm not against this as a business practice per se -- I don't blame WWE for signing great talent and I don't blame talent for signing wherever will pay them the most. It's just sad to see good promotions get worse while guys leave them to go somewhere that will never use them to their full potential.

I just don't see the point in signing a guy like Kevin Steen and then not letting him package piledriver everybody. I don't see the point in signing a Samoa Joe and then trying to stop matches over a small cut and sticking him in front of crowds of the sizes that the current version of TNA would be ashamed to draw. I don't see the point in signing a guy with mic skills like Ambrose and then heavily scripting all of his promos. I don't see the point in bringing Sting or AJ Styles only to have them lose at the biggest show of the year, then stick them in the title picture anyway.

It's like watching a Richard Pryor or George Carlin stand up special on basic cable rather than HBO. Could still be funny and entertaining, but needlessly constrained.

 

[PyroChamber]

 

[Wheels]

I'm sorry but Steen not using the package piledriver is not even remotely important in my opinion, What do people who like seeing lots of big moves and spots have to complain about with WWE's current style? We see tons of moves that should end matches get kicked out of every week. Shouldn't you be loving that? What? It's a big deal because guys don't do head drops enough? I mean I get the wanting blood thing, but the moveset and match style complaint is unbelievably blown out of proportion.

 

[Dr. Evil]

Outside of Torrie Wilson and Bob Barker, this is a good list for next year's Hall of Fame:

http://whatculture.com/wwe/9-early-wwe-hall-of-fame-2017-predictions

 

[famicommander]

Steen has proven he can deliver the move safely so he should be allowed to use it. It was an organic part of his moveset, it looked great, it looked impactful. Piledrivers have been part of wrestling for a very long time and his package piledriver is part of what made him a popular enough guy to be targetted by WWE in the first place. He literally used to sell shirts that said "package piledriver everybody".

The point is not that I want every sequence of moves to be massive spots. The point is that it's just another arbitrary limitation. WWE goes out of its way to limit the range of what can take place during their matches. Just like wanting them to allow blood doesn't mean I think they should go full CZW. Wanting them to allow more sexuality doesn't mean I think the show should be full of strippers and wanting them to allow the widest range of moves possible doesn't mean I need to see all of those moves every match.

Wanting restrictions lifted or softened doesn't mean I want them to be edgy for the sake of being edgy.

Basically, my point boils down to allowing the talent to be the best possible versions of themselves. Steve Austin needed to swill beer and filp people off; he could still be entertaining without it but those elements of his character were a big part of what made him what he was at his peak. The Hardys need to do ridiculous high spots,

If a guy got a following by cutting excellent spur of the moment promos filled with strong language and off-color jokes, don't sign him and then make him read from a script that has been prepared by countless dozens of writers and corporate "creative" people.

WWE already has tons of guys that fit into Vince's ideal mold of what a wrestler should be. Ryback, Randy Orton, John Cena, Roman Reigns, Sheamus... don't sign guys and take away what made them special in the first place.

 

[Logan0327]

Hnng...

 

[Wheels]

I guess we agree to a certain extent, I just think WWE's matches from athletic standpoint are at an all-time high and I don't see the need to complain about these moveset limitations. The biggest problem with every major wrestling company's matches is overuse of finsher kick outs and the fact big non-finisher spots never end matches so we always get three or four finshers per main event. Yet, the use of the Styles Clash and lack of package piledrivers gets brought up WAY more and are much less a problem.

 

[Dr. Evil]

Well it didn't take long for The Mighty Don't Kneel and Nikki Storm to debut for NXT: They competed tonight at the live event in Tampa.

 

[Pink Ranger]

Hnng...

Sweet Jesus....

I commend you both for your courage, but I have to admit Big E really isn't my type.

 

[Dr. Evil]

So JoJo is how old?

 

[Wheels]

So JoJo is how old?

22 years old.

 

[MMMMM...Pancakes]

Practice makes perfect.

 

[TheVileOne]

To me Steen not being able to do a package piledriver in WWE is the least of the company's problems and a silly thing to complain about. Anyway, Steen has done very well for himself in WWE so far.

As for Samoa Joe, he's performing in big crowds in NXT sometimes. Just for reference TakeOver Brooklyn had over 15,000 people. TakeOver London had over 10,000 people. TakeOver Dallas had over 9,000 people. His big crowds in NXT are bigger than the biggest ones he ever had in TNA pretty much. He's widening his fanbase and getting WWE merch money. Putting time in NXT isn't so bad for him.

I'm not crazy about the blood thing either, but that's the nature of the WWE business today.

IMHO Joe not being on the main roster is not so terrible. Why? Because on the main roster he's at the mercy of the creative team, guys like Kevin Dunn, Vince McMahon etc who may not get how great Joe is. Look at what happened to Tyler Breeze after moving to the main roster. Had a great character and gimmick and then completely bury him.

 

[sweetre15]

Source: F4WOnline

We've noted how there's a lot of speculation on Finn Balor coming to the main roster after he dropped the WWE NXT Title to Samoa Joe on Thursday night in Lowell, MA. Balor even told fans outside of the arena last night that he would see them on Monday.

It was noted on Wrestling Observer Live today that Balor may continue to work NXT for a month or so. This title change had been planned for some time, and there had been other events they discussed doing it on, but the original plan was for Joe to win the title, then build to a big stipulation match at the next Takeover event. This was the plan before Karl Anderson and Luke Gallows debuted on RAW. It was speculated by Bryan Alvarez that WWE may continue with this plan for Balor's rematch. Alvarez said he was told:

"Don't look so much at what happened on this Lowell, MA house show, but when they tape TV next week, that's when you should be paying attention because a lot of questions will be answered at those TV tapings."

WWE will return to Full Sail University next Thursday night for TV tapings and we will have live spoilers. The next Takeover event is scheduled for Wednesday, June 8th at Full Sail.

 

[TheVileOne]

Why change the title at a house show and not TakeOver. That's what I don't get.

 

[S. Grundy]

I guess we agree to a certain extent, I just think WWE's matches from athletic standpoint are at an all-time high and I don't see the need to complain about these moveset limitations. The biggest problem with every major wrestling company's matches is overuse of finsher kick outs and the fact big non-finisher spots never end matches so we always get three or four finshers per main event. Yet, the use of the Styles Clash and lack of package piledrivers gets brought up WAY more and are much less a problem.

It is at an all time high athletically but Christ sometimes the matches feel so repetitive. Like Ambrose doing his clothesline, he is literally just falling back between the ropes now, without any prompting. It's becoming all too predictable.

 

[The Chris]

Why change the title at a house show and not TakeOver. That's what I don't get.

I assume so Finn can become the longest reigning NXT champ.

 

[Wheels]

It is at an all time high athletically but Christ sometimes the matches feel so repetitive. Like Ambrose doing his clothesline, he is literally just falling back between the ropes now, without any prompting. It's becoming all too predictable.

Yeah, that is a bit of an issue.

 

[NDX]

The Rebound Jawbreaker isn't even hit that well. The clothesline itself looks fine but he looks a bit awkward bounding off the ropes like he does.

 

[nite-owl]

 

[TheCommissioner]

Steen has proven he can deliver the move safely so he should be allowed to use it. It was an organic part of his moveset, it looked great, it looked impactful. Piledrivers have been part of wrestling for a very long time and his package piledriver is part of what made him a popular enough guy to be targetted by WWE in the first place. He literally used to sell shirts that said "package piledriver everybody".

The point is not that I want every sequence of moves to be massive spots. The point is that it's just another arbitrary limitation. WWE goes out of its way to limit the range of what can take place during their matches. Just like wanting them to allow blood doesn't mean I think they should go full CZW. Wanting them to allow more sexuality doesn't mean I think the show should be full of strippers and wanting them to allow the widest range of moves possible doesn't mean I need to see all of those moves every match.

Wanting restrictions lifted or softened doesn't mean I want them to be edgy for the sake of being edgy.

Basically, my point boils down to allowing the talent to be the best possible versions of themselves. Steve Austin needed to swill beer and filp people off; he could still be entertaining without it but those elements of his character were a big part of what made him what he was at his peak. The Hardys need to do ridiculous high spots,

If a guy got a following by cutting excellent spur of the moment promos filled with strong language and off-color jokes, don't sign him and then make him read from a script that has been prepared by countless dozens of writers and corporate "creative" people.

WWE already has tons of guys that fit into Vince's ideal mold of what a wrestler should be. Ryback, Randy Orton, John Cena, Roman Reigns, Sheamus... don't sign guys and take away what made them special in the first place.

I think ye doth protest too much

the WWE is like big budget hollywood, smaller companies are independent film

Independent film is typically better, it just doesn't have a large platform

guys like Joe and Balor knew the deal coming into WWE, things are different there

so less of this please

[YT]qS7nqwGt4-I[/YT]

 

[Hunter Rider]

RIP Chyna.