TIH vs. Ang Lee's Hulk

[BigThor]

And, TIH had great elements, too. TIH's action is not the only reason I prefer it. I prefer its approach to the Banner character. Ang's Hulk film sought to understand the Hulk, while TIH sought to establish its relationship between the two. Banner wants to destroy the Hulk, and at first he has no control over the beast. It is only when he attempts to control it to some degree that he learns it can be guided. This makes him a hero. Strong arc. It also hilighted how great of a man Banner is when he jumps out of the plane, not knowing he will become the Hulk again. That is a strong character moment, and shows us a lot about the kind of man Banner is inside. You see why the Hulk is a noble monster.

Ang's Hulk also has a gaping plothole. The military randomly lets his father see his son...why? It makes no sense. Then, they let him yell and insult him for like 10 minutes. The guys who are super worried about the Hulk coming out are letting the source of his pain make him angry. What kind of military morons are they? That whole scene makes no logical sense. The first second he looked remotely mad, they should have zapped him. TIH follows the plot's logic much more fluidly.

I also liked the fast paced action and movement of the camera in TIH. Added a lot to the atmosphere. I liked how everyone approached their characters, and I felt the arcs all met up strongly at the end of the film. It doesn't attempt to be as deep as Hulk is, I agree with Hulk fans here. But, that doesn't make Hulk better because Hulk didn't accomplish what it set out to do. TIH is just a better movie.

This is my opinion, of course. But all the Hulk fans saying TIH are basically idiots who like it cause it is faster paced are just making accusations that don't exist. I have a number of reasons for my opinion.

I feel the exact same way on all counts, I just was never a big enough fan of either film to go through the trouble of listing what I thought made TIH a better film.

 

[The Chris]

And, TIH had great elements, too. TIH's action is not the only reason I prefer it. I prefer its approach to the Banner character. Ang's Hulk film sought to understand the Hulk, while TIH sought to establish its relationship between the two. Banner wants to destroy the Hulk, and at first he has no control over the beast. It is only when he attempts to control it to some degree that he learns it can be guided. This makes him a hero. Strong arc. It also hilighted how great of a man Banner is when he jumps out of the plane, not knowing he will become the Hulk again. That is a strong character moment, and shows us a lot about the kind of man Banner is inside. You see why the Hulk is a noble monster.

Ang's Hulk also has a gaping plothole. The military randomly lets his father see his son...why? It makes no sense. Then, they let him yell and insult him for like 10 minutes. The guys who are super worried about the Hulk coming out are letting the source of his pain make him angry. What kind of military morons are they? That whole scene makes no logical sense. The first second he looked remotely mad, they should have zapped him. TIH follows the plot's logic much more fluidly.

I also liked the fast paced action and movement of the camera in TIH. Added a lot to the atmosphere. I liked how everyone approached their characters, and I felt the arcs all met up strongly at the end of the film. It doesn't attempt to be as deep as Hulk is, I agree with Hulk fans here. But, that doesn't make Hulk better because Hulk didn't accomplish what it set out to do. TIH is just a better movie.

This is my opinion, of course. But all the Hulk fans saying TIH are basically idiots who like it cause it is faster paced are just making accusations that don't exist. I have a number of reasons for my opinion.

Sounds right to me.

 

[El Payaso]

Woah, I knew audiences liked TIH more than HULK but I didn't know the difference was that large and honestly I find the user rating to be more important that the critical rating.

User rating = the GA which makes up over 90% of the viewers

Critics rating = A few people who's job is to review movies and make up considerably less than 10% of the viewers

People visiting Rottetnokatoes enjoyed TIH more (no surprise there since it was a mass-appealing movie), but in general:

TIH
Production Budget: $150 million

Total Lifetime Grosses
Domestic: $134,806,913 51.2%
+ Foreign: $128,620,638 48.8%
= Worldwide: $263,427,551



HULK
Production Budget: $137 million

Total Lifetime Grosses
Domestic: $132,177,234 53.9%
+ Foreign: $113,183,246 46.1%
= Worldwide: $245,360,480



Not much of a difference if we talk about general audiences.

 

[Captain Marvel]

TIH had to fight against the massive negative reaction that Ang Lee's Hulk garnered, not to mention that a lot thought it was a direct sequel to what was widely considered to be a terrible movie as opposed to a reboot. That and Marvel screwed up the promotion, including Edward Norton doing practically no promotion for the film at all.

As for Rotten Tomatoes, both Hulk AND The Incredible Hulk have hundreds of thousands of votes each. That's more than enough to have a representative sample of what the general audience, those who saw the movies, thought of them. And the general audience overwhelmingly prefered TIH over the Ang Lee Hulk by a margin of 75%-34%. Remember, these reviews aren't counting how many people saw the movies, but what the people who DID see the movies thought of them. That TIH only made a little more than Hulk is immaterial, because half a million movie goers who did see the movie thought it was vastly better than Hulk.

 

[BigThor]

People visiting Rottetnokatoes enjoyed TIH more (no surprise there since it was a mass-appealing movie), but in general:

TIH
Production Budget: $150 million

Total Lifetime Grosses
Domestic: $134,806,913 51.2%
+ Foreign: $128,620,638 48.8%
= Worldwide: $263,427,551



HULK
Production Budget: $137 million

Total Lifetime Grosses
Domestic: $132,177,234 53.9%
+ Foreign: $113,183,246 46.1%
= Worldwide: $245,360,480



Not much of a difference if we talk about general audiences.

Yeah that's true but I think the sour taste Hulk left in the GA's mouth was a big part of the reason why TIH didn't perform much better with the other reason being lazy marketing.

 

[El Payaso]

So, you don't think there's the word of mouth factor that could have made the difference at the BO, let's say, a liiiiiiiiiiiiittle better?

 

[BigThor]

I think word of mouth is one of the things that kept it from ending up as a flat-out flop.

 

[Captain Marvel]

I'd say it did, as it did make more money than Ang Lee's Hulk. Word of mouth from the last movie does seem to have a large effect, though, and can result in plenty of people passing on a movie while it's in theatres. Take Batman Forever. That movie, while it made a ton of money, was godawful. So when Batman & Robin came out, with the horrid taste left over from the last Batman movie still in the mouths of the audience, they avoided it and it tanked. The terrible X-Men 3 likewise depressed the turnout for X-Men: First Class despite the fact that it's clearly a superior movie. So given all the negatives TIH had going for it, a terrible predecessor as well as a botched marketing, that it made more attests to its being a better movie. Had it been more of the same that we saw in the Ang Lee Hulk then it probably would've tanked hard.

 

[Spider-Fan]

Agreed to a certain extent. I think Ang's Hulk hurt TIH big time, but Marvel's marketing did it no favors. Hopefully post-Avengers, TIH2 gets another look.

 

[craigdbfan]

I think The Avengers will definitely leave Hulk on a much more positive note with the GA. He's already been receiving a great deal of love from the internet and I have a feeling that the GA's reaction wont be to far off.

 

[Mrs. Sawyer]

Haha, as the OP it seems as though I started a war. I just wanted to start the thread because I thought it would be fun and I wasn't disappointed.

When it comes to my opinion, I don't feel like going into detail, so I'm just gonna say that Spider-Fan's opinions mirror mine. TIH does succeed more at what it wanted to do. It's a better mainstream action movie than Hulk is as a character study because it certainly is more organic and doesn't come off as forced. I watched both a few days ago and I must say that even though I was too harsh on Hulk in the past, I find TIH to be a better movie.

And on another note, just because people like TIH more does not mean they're dumb, or stupid. Every movie with depth does not mean it's going to be good. There are more factors than depth when it comes to film, like how it flows and it's pacing, in which both Hulk had a huge problem with.

But, just to appease the Hulk fans: Jennifer Connelly

EDIT: One last note. Just a bold prediction. Hulk in Avengers > TIH and Hulk

 

[Spider-Fan]

I think The Avengers will definitely leave Hulk on a much more positive note with the GA. He's already been receiving a great deal of love from the internet and I have a feeling that the GA's reaction wont be to far off.

I think so too. I have been wanting TIH2 since I watched TIH. I think Avengers will get it made

I hope they continue with the Leader as the villain.

Haha, as the OP it seems as though I started a war. I just wanted to start the thread because I thought it would be fun and I wasn't disappointed.

When it comes to my opinion, I don't feel like going into detail, so I'm just gonna say that Spider-Fan's opinions mirror mine. TIH does succeed more at what it wanted to do. It's a better mainstream action movie than Hulk is as a character study because it certainly is more organic and doesn't come off as forced. I watched both a few days ago and I must say that even though I was too harsh on Hulk in the past, I find TIH to be a better movie.

And on another note, just because people like TIH more does not mean they're dumb, or stupid. Every movie with depth does not mean it's going to be good. There are more factors than depth when it comes to film, like how it flows and it's pacing, in which both Hulk had a huge problem with.

But, just to appease the Hulk fans: Jennifer Connelly

EDIT: One last note. Just a bold prediction. Hulk in Avengers > TIH and Hulk

Great minds think alike

And I have a bolder prediction: Avengers > Every other comic film!

 

[BigThor]

I think so too. I have been wanting TIH2 since I watched TIH. I think Avengers will get it made

I hope they continue with the Leader as the villain.

Agreed

Great minds think alike

And I have a bolder prediction: Avengers > Every other comic film!

Oh and I agree with this as well.

 

[El Payaso]

I think word of mouth is one of the things that kept it from ending up as a flat-out flop.

So neither Hulk movie was a flat-out flop.

I'd say it did, as it did make more money than Ang Lee's Hulk. Word of mouth from the last movie does seem to have a large effect, though, and can result in plenty of people passing on a movie while it's in theatres.

But the dropping from weekend to weekend was very similar in both.

Batman Begins had Batman & Robin before and even when it didn't fantastic numbers it did better and had good legs.

One would say that TIH could at least have had better legs, even if not fantastic numbers, if it was so liked by people.

Take Batman Forever. That movie, while it made a ton of money, was godawful. So when Batman & Robin came out, with the horrid taste left over from the last Batman movie still in the mouths of the audience, they avoided it and it tanked.

Are you trying to say that the fact that Batman & Robin was terrible and universally considered one of the worst superhero movies ever produced had NOTHING to do with its result? It was all Batman Forever?

Man. Not the best example out there.

Plus BF did better than Batman Returns precisely because BR was dark and gritty and parents didn't like it and BF was more kid-friendly and action-packed.

Seems to me that the previous movie's effect is not that definitive. You can reverse it.

The terrible X-Men 3 likewise depressed the turnout for X-Men: First Class despite the fact that it's clearly a superior movie.

Wasn't the Wolverine movie before X:FC, not X-Men the Last Stand?

So given all the negatives TIH had going for it, a terrible predecessor as well as a botched marketing, that it made more attests to its being a better movie. Had it been more of the same that we saw in the Ang Lee Hulk then it probably would've tanked hard.

Again,

Batman and Robin
Domestic: $107,325,195 45.1%
+ Foreign: $130,881,927 54.9%
= Worldwide: $238,207,122


Batman Begins
Domestic: $205,343,774 55.1%
+ Foreign: $167,366,241 44.9%
= Worldwide: $372,710,015

Seems to me that Begins made 134 more million than the worst superhero movie ever produced, whereas TIH masde just 20 more.

Haha, as the OP it seems as though I started a war. I just wanted to start the thread because I thought it would be fun and I wasn't disappointed.

When it comes to my opinion, I don't feel like going into detail, so I'm just gonna say that Spider-Fan's opinions mirror mine. TIH does succeed more at what it wanted to do. It's a better mainstream action movie than Hulk is as a character study because it certainly is more organic and doesn't come off as forced. I watched both a few days ago and I must say that even though I was too harsh on Hulk in the past, I find TIH to be a better movie.

That's true, TIH succeeds to be mainstream and formulaistic, even when many parts of it are very good. Specially the first third in Brazil. Sadly, part of being the model blockbuster includes bad jokes and things like the taxi scene.

And yes, I think I mentioned that Hulk was trapped in between a summer blockbuster and a deep psychodrama, and that hurt. Sometimes - Betty's dream - it really dragged.

And on another note, just because people like TIH more does not mean they're dumb, or stupid. Every movie with depth does not mean it's going to be good. There are more factors than depth when it comes to film, like how it flows and it's pacing, in which both Hulk had a huge problem with.

That's also true. A movie that's pure fun doesn't mean you're dumb if you like it.

EDIT: One last note. Just a bold prediction. Hulk in Avengers > TIH and Hulk

Ah, I kinda hope. But I really dislike the concept of this particular character working as part of a group. I'll just wait and see.

And I have a bolder prediction: Avengers > Every other comic film!

At the BO? I gotta see that.

 

[Spider-Fan]

At the BO? I gotta see that.

I was talking quality. In my opinion, of course.

 

[BigThor]

So neither Hulk movie was a flat-out flop.

Nope, I don't consider either Hulk film to be a flop maybe a mild disappointment at the most.

 

[the gael]

There is a bad reputation for Ang Lee's Hulk but there is also another thing that damaged TIH box office even more : the competition with TDK ! 2008 was a year with many superheros flicks (and a very successfull one, iron man) and TIH had to compete with TDK more or less directly. nothing could have been successful against TDK, nothing. Even a well established franchise like X Files sunked.

After seing TIH, I liked it a lot more than the first one. Because of the action but also because I felt they succeeded in merging the TV series with the comic, something I didn't thought possible considering the difference between the two. I guess Marvel hasn't been very wise with the hulk movie by changing their lead actor at each movie. Batman begins was a success, but, like the first highlander, it wasn't massive and became really a success over time and the word of mouth. Had Marvel done another sequel, they probably would have established the franchise.

It wouldn't have been a colossal success like TDK, don't get me wrong (I'm not even sure that TDKR can beat TDK at box office), but it could have been a solid franchise. Marvel took, to my mind, a great risk by replacing Norton.

 

[ComicForAWife]

I haven't read all the posts here so I don't know if I'm repeating something already said. My opinion is that Hulk is far more superior in almost every way: better story, better acting, better action & effects. I loved the psychological aspect of Hulk 03. The way they explained Hulk being Banners inner child was brilliant. Loved how they showed Hulk breaking out in Banners mind as well, using the door as a type of psychological barrier. They even showed Hulks relationship to Banner albeit brief, "Puny human". Definitely liked Banners relationship to his father as well. His father sees Banner as a weak shell to his "real" son.

Hulk 03's representation was much more faithful to the comics as well. Besides the growing to 20 ft (the one thing I disliked about the movie), the Hulks abilities and character are spot on. I felt TIH lacked the more heroic part of Hulks character besides him saving Betty, this Hulk was also much more ruthless, trying to kill those who attacked him (he was trying to slice Blonsky in half in the campus fight scene). Whereas Hulk simply incapacitates his foes and moves on, simply defending himself without killing.

I thought the cast in 03 was superior as well, still haven't decided whether I prefer Norton or Bana, they played two very different parts of Banner. Elliot as Ross was perfect, I felt Hurt was very bland. Tyler as Betty was ok, but she sounded like she was whispering throughout the entire movie.

The effects in Hulk 03 have been criticized. They are some of the best effects I have seen. Hulk in the desert was amazing looking, which is usually the problem with these things, the daylight scenes. TIH campus scene looked awful for example. I do feel TIH had its moments and 03 had its off-moments. Hulk holding Betty in the helicopter crash fire is probably better than anything in Hulk 03, and alot of the final fight with Abomination looked convincing, but in general the Hulk 03 effects were superior. It has to do with rendering, that's why TIH looked bad, the design was great, but the movement suffered because of the rendering. So I am very pleased that ILM are doing the Hulk effects again for the Avengers, which looks awesome so far from the trailers.

TIH was more of an action movie, while Hulk 03 had more story. I feel the desert scene in 03 is one of the best action scenes in all of cbm, while Hulk vs Abomination was one of the coolest one-on-one fights in cbm.

I enjoyed TIH, but compared to Hulk 03, it's not even in the same league. Well in my opinion anyway.

 

[Captain Marvel]

There is a bad reputation for Ang Lee's Hulk but there is also another thing that damaged TIH box office even more : the competition with TDK ! 2008 was a year with many superheros flicks (and a very successfull one, iron man) and TIH had to compete with TDK more or less directly. nothing could have been successful against TDK, nothing. Even a well established franchise like X Files sunked.

Yeah, Hellboy II: The Golden Army had the same exact problem. It came out the week before The Dark Knight and, for that week, it was the #1 movie in the US. Then The Dark Knight came out and it was absolutely crushed at the box office, and everyone forgot all about it.

 

[BigThor]

Hellboy II: The Golden Army was a good too, I think it's one of the better CMB films out there.

 

[DorkyFresh]

Another reason why I preferred Ang's Hulk over TIH is that the Hulk actually looked like Bruce Banner. When Bruce transformed into the Hulk, he still looked like Eric Bana. In TIH, the Hulk looked NOTHING like Ed Norton. Granted, Ed Norton has a long, skinny face but if they can put Andy Serkis' features into Gollum then they could have still made the Hulk resemble Ed Norton. The Hulk resembling Bruce Banner is one of the reasons I look forward to the Avengers movie. The new Hulk resembles Mark Ruffalo.

 

[BigThor]

I think Hulk looks too much like Bruce Banner in The Avengers, I'm not a big fan of Hulk looking almost exactly like Bruce Banner.

 

[MeenieWK]

I enjoy both Hulk Movies however both have flaws.

I have Watched Hulk many more times that TIH, so that maybe says which i prefer but i do also feel that there were pacing issues with HULK which out off alot of the GA.

However, i almost feel like tehy are two ends of the scale, HULK was too in depth.... and the Marvel lot though, **** we alienated the AG by trying to be clever.. at which point the initiated operation Dumb down.

TIH Hulk... to me, feels too simplified... almost vapid with no depth to appease the masses, which is a shame.

I think i deally i would like an amalgamation of the 2 movies.

Depth and emotion of Angs
FX of Angs (TIH all started to get a bit resident evil for my liking)
Some of ANGS action
NO Hulk Dogs
I liked the way he defeated absorbing man... but didnt rate absorbing man as main villian (possibly Nolte into abination would have worked)
The Pacing of TIH
Swap the Hulk dogs for the Uni/Helicopter action (TIH)
Drop the Run time by 30mins.

 

[Spider-Fan]

I think TIH is way more clever and far less dumb than people give it credit for. It is distinctly more fun and action oriented, but that doesn't mean it lacks any depth.

 

[El Payaso]

I think TIH is way more clever and far less dumb than people give it credit for. It is distinctly more fun and action oriented, but that doesn't mean it lacks any depth.

I absolutely agree. Problem is that they tried way too hard to make it everyone's cookie, and there were fast pace and the usual one-liners that made it the average superhero movie.

The first act was perfect IMO. Except for crap like "don't make me hungry" which doesn't make anys ense because anyone knows that Portuguese doesn't have the same play of words.

But the fugitive angle from the TV series worked at a different level than in the TV series. It was great. Also when he had problems getting new clothes, something to eat. It was fantastic. But then there was so much going on to get. Since it didn't styart fropm the beginning, I felt disconnected with Bruce and Betty's romance. I just assumed it was the classic love interest and that's it. Abomination, Mr. Blue, etc, all good elements that were compressed into the less-than-2-hour movie.

Now things like "Can't make love... might hulk-out" or that completely unnecessary, made just for the sake of emotion free fall from Bruce was weird. Really? there was no chance but to suicide? And Ross and the military would allow a man to commit suicide just in case he turns into Hulk? Add to that that, once you get over that, in the middle of the fallen, in the middle of the excitement... Bruce goes "Oh, *****." Yes, THE worst part to place a joke. And they did it.

Now, this is just me, but I'm not keen on the Bruce controls Hulk thing. To me that's just like a gritty Superman, a smiling happy-with-life Batman or a Peter Parker that has no money problems. It's taking the tragedy out of a tragic character.