To Believe or Not To Believe? (SHOW RESPECT, OR RISK A BAN)

[Feenix]

Fair enough, but didn't you just say a poster was disrespectful and offensive for criticizing feminism? Couldn't someone suggest you're being offensive criticizing religion? Tight rope we walk around here.

No, I didn't.


Religion is not above criticism nor should it be.

 

[ShadowBoxer]

For a person who is a Christian not engaging pre marital sex isn't a punishment or something that's oppresive. It actually has a sound reason behind it. See for us Christians, God created sex as an expression of love between a man and wife. Yes, he gave all human's a sexual desire, but the reward of being obedient to his word is being intimate with your significant other on your wedding night. Pre martial sex/ *********ion/sleeping around with anybody just teaches self gratification. Like I mentioned before, the idea of waiting until your married to have sex seems outdated, lame, oppressive, un cool to people who aren't christians, but I wouldn't have it any other way.

Personally, I think it's kinda sad when couples who have already been having sex eventually get married. To me, it makes the occasion less special for the couple. They don't really have anything to look forward to on their wedding night. It's like opening up your Christmas presents weeks before its actually Christmas. So by Christmas morning ( wedding night) the gifts ( sex) will still be cool but it won't really be as special, nor will it be a new experince shared between the couple.

Now I will admit it's not a easy thing to stay pure before marriage. Sex is glorified in media and society. Pre martial sex is pretty much encouraged by society. It's a struggle between media, porn etc but I know people who remained virgins until marriage and so far their relationships have been solid. So it's not an impossible thing to to. It just takes will power and for us Christians a love for God and his word. I am 27 and have not had sex. I had my struggles with porn in the past ( which I asked God for forgiveness for) , but I have not engaged in any sexual intercourse with a girl, and will not do so until I met and marry the girl I am meant to spend the rest of my life with. I don't need to have had slept with multiple women prior to marriage to "explore myself sexually". Sex with my future wife is all I need or want.

 

[Apollo]

I joined a religion.

Dudeism.

The Dude is my Zen Master.

Also, I prefer brown/black Jesus over Swedish looking Jesus.

I thought Color of the Cross was a fairly interesting adaptation where Jean-Claude La Marre played Jesus.

[YT]5vlexGEg1sU[/YT]

 

[ShadowBoxer]

No, I didn't.


Religion is not above criticism nor should it be.

Atheism isn't above criticism either.

 

[DarkSentinel]

Neither is grammar.



Can we end this argument now?

 

[ShadowBoxer]

Neither is grammar.



Can we end this argument now?

Well played sir lol.

 

[Feenix]

Atheism isn't above criticism either. Both sides of the coin.

I never said it wasn't. You guys were the ones complaining about criticism.

Also, in regards to your post about sex, I have sex with my fiancé often and it's awesome and not sad at all. Sexual compatibility is huge in relationships and I would never marry someone without having sex with them first.

 

[Feenix]

What about people who don't want to get married? They shouldn't have sex?

Some couples choose to not get married for whatever reason.

 

[ShadowBoxer]

That's fine for some people I suppose. When I marry the women I am meant to be with it will be because I genuinely love her and want to spend my life with her. Not just because of looks or how good sex is. Those things are superficial and won't last forever. But a strong love for each other will. I am not gonna dump a girl I really care about or wanna marry solely based on sex. That can be improved upon. Marriage/ lasting relationships are bigger than that. But that's just my two cents.

 

[Marvolo]

What about people who don't want to get married? They shouldn't have sex?

Some couples choose to not get married for whatever reason.

Yes, premarital sex is out if you don't want to commit a mortal sin. But you are free to commit any sin you want. Everyone possesses free will. The Church and the Catechism doesnt deny free will.


But if someone doesn't believe in the Bible or any of the Doctrines of the Faith or that there will be consequences for premarital sex then the Church's disapproval or Doctrine on the matter shouldn't matter to them.

 

[Feenix]

Yikes. I'm so glad I'm not religious. It's psychological torture to think that every time you feel "lust", you're committing a sin.

 

[Feenix]

That's fine for some people I suppose. When I marry the women I am meant to be with it will be because I genuinely love her and want to spend my life with her. Not just because of looks or how good sex is. Those things are superficial and won't last forever. But a strong love for each other will. I am not gonna dump a girl I really care about or wanna marry solely based on sex. That can be improved upon. Marriage/ lasting relationships are bigger than that. But that's just my two cents.

I never said that relationships are just about sex. I said sexual compatibility is a huge part. Which it is.

You're coming off as really judgemental. I'm glad my choices are "fine for some people, I suppose."

 

[ShadowBoxer]

I never said that relationships are just about sex. I said sexual compatibility is a huge part. Which it is.

You're coming off as really judgemental. I'm glad my choices are "fine for some people, I suppose."

I wasn't coming off as judgemental. Sorry if you took it that way. I was saying sexual compatibility isn't a huge deal for everyone. Physical attraction ( apperance ) plays a part but not nesscarily sexual compatibility. As a person of faith, I don't need to sleep with a woman during the dating season to know if I am attracted to her or want to build a lasting relationship or marriage with her. But again, this comes down to personal beliefs and opinons.

 

[Warhammer]

I feel bad for childless Catholic women.

Honestly, I do as well.

I've always wandered how that started. Does anyone here know the original basis for those rules?

It basically started with Thomas Aquinas. He was a philosopher in the 1200s who basically said that if a dude doesn't climax inside of a woman, it is a sin among many other things. The purpose for busting a nut is for procreation. The Church liked this and adopted his teachings. It became Catholic doctrine due to the Church being the ultimate interpreter of the word of God.

This all goes back to the spilling of the seed (sometimes called "onanism") told in Genesis. Basically, it is about a man named Onan. His brother, Er, dies and God commands him to impregnate his brother's wife. The offspring will claim Er's inheritance. Onan does not want to do this because he wants the inheritance for himself. He has sex with Er's wife and pulls out. God then kills him.

The Catholic Church interprets this story as the spilling of the seed to be evil. Because of this, unless you climax in your woman's vagina and allow the process of procreation to take place, it's a mortal sin. No oral, no *********ion, no pulling out, no condoms, etc. They are fruitless acts. For me, it's clear as day that Onan died because he refused to follow God's command, not because he pulled out. *********ion is a sin because of lust, not because I'm climaxing in a piece of tissue, etc.

 

[spiderman2]

For a person who is a Christian not engaging pre marital sex isn't a punishment or something that's oppresive. It actually has a sound reason behind it. See for us Christians, God created sex as an expression of love between a man and wife. Yes, he gave all human's a sexual desire, but the reward of being obedient to his word is being intimate with your significant other on your wedding night. Pre martial sex/ *********ion/sleeping around with anybody just teaches self gratification. Like I mentioned before, the idea of waiting until your married to have sex seems outdated, lame, oppressive, un cool to people who aren't christians, but I wouldn't have it any other way.

Personally, I think it's kinda sad when couples who have already been having sex eventually get married. To me, it makes the occasion less special for the couple. They don't really have anything to look forward to on their wedding night. It's like opening up your Christmas presents weeks before its actually Christmas. So by Christmas morning ( wedding night) the gifts ( sex) will still be cool but it won't really be as special, nor will it be a new experince shared between the couple.

Now I will admit it's not a easy thing to stay pure before marriage. Sex is glorified in media and society. Pre martial sex is pretty much encouraged by society. It's a struggle between media, porn etc but I know people who remained virgins until marriage and so far their relationships have been solid. So it's not an impossible thing to to. It just takes will power and for us Christians a love for God and his word. I am 27 and have not had sex. I had my struggles with porn in the past ( which I asked God for forgiveness for) , but I have not engaged in any sexual intercourse with a girl, and will not do so until I met and marry the girl I am meant to spend the rest of my life with. I don't need to have had slept with multiple women prior to marriage to "explore myself sexually". Sex with my future wife is all I need or want.

While put. Sex with sever people can lead to std, unwainted pregese and I fell like sex is soposed to be special so should just be with some one you really love.

I never said it wasn't. You guys were the ones complaining about criticism.

Also, in regards to your post about sex, I have sex with my fiancé often and it's awesome and not sad at all. Sexual compatibility is huge in relationships and I would never marry someone without having sex with them first.

While I belive that if you really love some one that you are going to be sexual compatible because there is going to be a lot of passion when you have sex with some one that you really love compared to just having sex with some one you don't love.

 

[spiderman2]

That's fine for some people I suppose. When I marry the women I am meant to be with it will be because I genuinely love her and want to spend my life with her. Not just because of looks or how good sex is. Those things are superficial and won't last forever. But a strong love for each other will. I am not gonna dump a girl I really care about or wanna marry solely based on sex. That can be improved upon. Marriage/ lasting relationships are bigger than that. But that's just my two cents.

I hear you looks doesn't last forever. Heck I would say most people by the time they are like 50 don't even look like the same person that they where at like 20-30 and like I said on a post before this if you really love some one I think the sex is going to be good because of the pastion that you have for each another.

 

[spiderman2]

I wasn't coming off as judgemental. Sorry if you took it that way. I was saying sexual compatibility isn't a huge deal for everyone. Physical attraction ( apperance ) plays a part but not nesscarily sexual compatibility. As a person of faith, I don't need to sleep with a woman during the dating season to know if I am attracted to her or want to build a lasting relationship or marriage with her. But again, this comes down to personal beliefs and opinons.

The thing is yeah you don't have to have sex with some one because even if you don't if you love them and are attracted to them I am sure you are going to think about it even if you don't do it. So there for you now just by having that strong hurged to have sex that you are compatible.

 

[Greens]

I had my struggles with porn in the past ( which I asked God for forgiveness for)

How you can you tell me this is not oppressive? You should not have to feel sorry or ask for forgiveness because you viewed porn. That is ridiculous no matter how you spin it.

 

[ShadowBoxer]

How you can you tell me this is not oppressive? You should not have to feel sorry or ask for forgiveness because you viewed porn. That is ridiculous no matter how you spin it.

Well it leads to a bad habits, teaches self gratification, gives some people unrealistic expectations of sex, treats women like sex objects, then there are some down right degrading and disgusting things in that industry that people do on camera. Not to mention the behind the scenes stuff of how some women are force feed drugs and abused to do scenes. As a christian, I view women as daughters of God. From his stand point, he doesn't desire them to be lusted after only as sex objects. There is so much more to them than that.

 

[Greens]

Well it leads to a bad habits, teaches self gratification, gives some people unrealistic expectations of sex, treats women like sex objects, then there are some down right degrading and disgusting things in that industry that people do on camera. Not to mention the behind the scenes stuff of how some women are force feed drugs and abused to do scenes. As a christian, I view women as daughters of God. From his stand point, he doesn't desire them to be lusted after only as sex objects. There is so much more to them than that.

Trust me, in professional porn women are not drugged and abused. These women choose to work in the industry and they make tons of money doing it. You shouldn't feel ashamed for looking at a couple of boobs on the internet.

 

[ShadowBoxer]

In addition, porn leads to lust which could lead to other issues. For example, married men becoming so obbssed with porn they compare their wife's to porn stars or force them to do acts seen in those movies. Also could lead to them lusting after other women and cheating or lusting after another man's wife. I can support or encourage a industry that treats women as sex objects and generally teaches bad habits like I memtioned in my previous post as well as this one.

 

[moviedoors]

While I belive that if you really love some one that you are going to be sexual compatible because there is going to be a lot of passion when you have sex with some one that you really love compared to just having sex with some one you don't love.

That's very naive.

Edit: this originally came off more harshly than I intended. I've reworded it. My apologies.

 

[PacificBoy]

For those who are saving themselves for religious reasons, would you be okay with your SO being a non-virgin?

 

[Spider-Aziz]

Yikes. I'm so glad I'm not religious. It's psychological torture to think that every time you feel "lust", you're committing a sin.

Feeling it is not a sin, acting upon that feeling is, if done in a none-permitted manner.

How you can you tell me this is not oppressive? You should not have to feel sorry or ask for forgiveness because you viewed porn. That is ridiculous no matter how you spin it.

I stated that sex is more than the release of desire, it's sharing secrets.
A hug, a kiss, those are acts of trust and love, sexual intercourse is taking it to higher level of trust and love, and most folks do it behind closed doors.

Porn cheapens the experience, viewing it can make a person he was in place of one of the two in the movie, and the more it is viewed, the more insecure a person might be.
Viewing often leads to *********ion, men viewing naked women often leads to *********ion, more *********ion will weaken the penis, erection will come slower, the erection will lean sideways, ejaculation will release faster, discharge becomes weaker.

And for the actors, they don't have the right emotions doing what they do, their is no proper joy. Actors have to do it more often than a couple love to have sex, it taxes them, takes them over the natural limit.
Sisyphean sex, that's what porn is, it lacks the proper discharge of hormones during the process.

God knows how we are created, how we function, because we are creations of God. God knows what is best for us, and gave us the basic rule of limitation and guidance how to act on such desire. These guides are mercy, not oppression.
Some people enjoy watching porn, but there are things some folks come to enjoy, while these things are not good for them.

Science is supposed to give a cleared image of why certain acts are denied or limited to us, by explaining our body functions and limitations, and through this I came to have better grasp of why some of the acts are forbidden, what makes certain food good, and other food bad, etc...

For those who are saving themselves for religious reasons, would you be okay with your SO being a non-virgin?

If I unite in marriage with a widow or a divorcee, I won't have much of a problem.

 

[-Arya-]

In addition, porn leads to lust which could lead to other issues. For example, married men becoming so obbssed with porn they compare their wife's to porn stars or force them to do acts seen in those movies. Also could lead to them lusting after other women and cheating or lusting after another man's wife. I can support or encourage a industry that treats women as sex objects and generally teaches bad habits like I memtioned in my previous post as well as this one.

Looking at another men/woman on the street can lead to lust as well. Lust isn't something to be ashamed of. It's a normal reaction to sexual images. You can be in a committed relationship, feel lust towards other people, and yet still be able to control those impulses and not endanger your relationship.