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Transformers Transformers 2 Info + Why The Movie Designs Are Different From G1

Well, again, it depends on your perspective.

He just arrived on Earth and scanned the first thing
A truck with flames just happens to be there on the highway...yeah....right.
are you saying that Prime would be so worried about how he looks than taking care of business (finding the cube before the Decepticons can find it and Megatron?)
Perhaps not. Yet he'd wouldn't have scanned the truck first..plenty of cars pass by on highways
That'd be more in character than worrying about hiding.
Aside from the fact that Bumblebee is told, by Prime in TFTM07, not to make contact with humans...apparently he is VERY concerned about blending in.
Wasn't there a big fuss from you guys that Prime was hiding in the bushes which was totally against the characterization?
Probably because the whole notion of a robot hiding in the bushes (and getting peed on by the neighbors dog) seems stupid more than anything else.
 
Apparently so, since that's what everyone saw in the recent TV spots..

Within the logic of the movie, it makes sense.
What, no it doesn't. It takes place on modern day earth, not "The Post Apocalyptic Future of Macho Man Randy Savage world" where you might ACTUALLY see a truck as obscenely painted as that.
No one said it was permanent. The early script even leaves an opening for future change (which I'm sure Hasbro is thrilled to hear)
And I'm sure we'll get a million repaints, redecos and redos of every character...that is, after all, the Hasbro way. However that's not the point.
(Although, it's rumored that change may be out with the new script, which detractors are convinced hasn't changed)
I have no idea what the f*** you're saying at this point (aside from the typical gibberish we get from you), but the script isn't changing. In fact every trailer only confirms the old script more and more.
 
Really, already Transformers 2 is being prepped for '09? On wikipedia.org, it says Michael Bay hasn't signed on to direct the movie as of yet. But, I bet they can easily think of ideas for a sequel though.
 
It's too bad that in the process of telling Bay to change the character designs they forgot to tell him he didn't have to make them look like crap.
 
Well, now that we've established the level of discourse here, let's begin..
Your ego bruises far too easily, just an FYI.
Actually, USM never used organic webbing.
He did, but it was changed rather rapidly.
I agree, it made perfect sense, but there was still the outraged fanboy reacting to something they felt was INTEGRAL to the character. Furthermore, getting online and posting pure hate over something they barely had any information about.
Okay and this proves what exactly, that the internet community complains about everything:huh: I thought most people knew this. However that does not somehow make ALL of their complaints illegitimate. They complained about Beast Wars, yet Beast Wars was a competent show produced by people who actually went to fans (Benson Yee specifically) as advisors and constantly referenced past materials...therefore resulting in a good product.

Not exactly the case here.
Yes, everyone knows Bay does that. Ultimately, it doesn't impact the CHARACTER. Look at the Spider-Man movie costume.. raised webbing was another complaint fans had. Look how that film turned out.
Your analogies are consistently poor, if not abysmal. Raised webbing is somehow equivelent now??? Are you mad? Are you working for Bay? Spider-Man, for all intents and purposes, looked exactly the same as his comic counterpart. Not Optimus, who is vastly dissimilar aside from a head that bears a strong resemblence.

Flames are integral to the character. Rodimus, his replacement, has flames. Rodimus also was a brash young upstart trying to come to grips with his responsibilities. Hence why he looked both the part of the rad Hot Rod and noble leader, the roles which he went between. Not Optimus, Optimus doesn't have flames because Optimus is a noble stoic war time leader. Optimus isn't trying to be cool like Hot Rod.
Such a changing him into a fire truck or a robot monkey? I'm sure if they did that we'd never hear the end of it. It's a good thing they never attempted something like that, it'd cause the fanbase to leave in droves, right?
People wanted a semi, yes. However if this were a Beast Wars or RiD adaption (which it isn't), then yes you'd want a monkey and firetruck respectively.

However I think you missed the point (as usual) entirely. Armada, Energon, G2, G1, Masterforce, Battlestars and several other universes have produced Semi-Optimi who don't look alike yet preserve the character of said Autobot leader (except for maybe Fatimus Energon Prime). So no, it's not that hard to produce a non-flames Optimus who looks like Optimus while looking different.
As pointed out in the original article, since you didn't bother to read, the design changes were REQUIRED by Hasbro. So, while you're tossing blame about, you might want to blame them too.
Most fans, as you haven't cared to note, blame Hasbro from the onset. In fact the term "Has-Blow" is a veritable cliche' now in the Transformers community, who trust me, give them a ton of slack. You really thinks fans have been happy with the last wave of "Pokemon-esque" cartoons and gimmicks Hasbro has been doling out to the general public.

But what the article did not say was Hasbro "required Optimus have flames", you'll have to find that part for me because it doesn't say that.

Does Optimus need flames, are flames something Optimus would care to have. If the answer is no, then guess what. It means that the flames were all Bay, or potentially the Producers who are always attempting to input what they deem as "cool" and "hip" into Films.

It's not even just the fact that Optimus has flames, it's that some *****e somewhere actually thinks people think flames are still "cool". They don't. I got past putting flames on my car when Superman dropped his mullet. It's cliche (much like most of Bay's films), it's trying WAY to hard to be cool, it looks gady, and unnecessary, and goes against any logic the film ought to have.

I didn't see Spider-Man's villains dress in flames.

I didn't see Magneto with a pimp cain.

I didn't see Batman wearing techno-color costumes.

KISS, Keep it simple stupid. This isn't simple, but it sure is stupid.
 
A truck with flames just happens to be there on the highway...yeah....right.

That's what was filmed. You really sound like you haven't seen the recent tv spots that everyone else has bothered to watch and discuss. Let us know when you get around to that ok?

Perhaps not. Yet he'd wouldn't have scanned the truck first..plenty of cars pass by on highways

Something that'll support his bulk? Sure.

So, if Optimus scanned a VW beetle you'd have no problem with it?

Aside from the fact that Bumblebee is told, by Prime in TFTM07, not to make contact with humans...apparently he is VERY concerned about blending in.

Probably because the whole notion of a robot hiding in the bushes (and getting peed on by the neighbors dog) seems stupid more than anything else.

Again, you're applying a double standard. Either it's stupid to have them hide, or it makes sense for them to hide. Make up your mind.

What, no it doesn't. It takes place on modern day earth, not "The Post Apocalyptic Future of Macho Man Randy Savage world" where you might ACTUALLY see a truck as obscenely painted as that.

It's called a movie. You can accept giant alien robots that can transform, yet you can't accept something as simple as that? It must suck to have that little imagination.

And I'm sure we'll get a million repaints, redecos and redos of every character...that is, after all, the Hasbro way. However that's not the point.

No, that's the exact point. Over and over for months, the tired fanboy tirade has been "WAH WAH! Michael Bay is changing things to suit his ego!" The minute someone points out that was incorrect, we're told "Oh but that's not the point!"

I have no idea what the f*** you're saying at this point (aside from the typical gibberish we get from you), but the script isn't changing. In fact every trailer only confirms the old script more and more.
[/quote]

Genius. It's great to have fans watching my every post. Do enlighten the rest of us and let us know what posts you're referring to "Cyclops".. for someone who claims to have read everything I've posted (I lurk cause of posts like yours, so when I post, it's generally to contribute something to the community. Can you say the same? Doubtful.) you'd realize I gave a concrete example of how the script has changed.

Your ego bruises far too easily, just an FYI.

He did, but it was changed rather rapidly.

Interesting. Could you please let the rest of us know how you can tell that? Frankly, you have absolutely zero clue about anything. I suppose I can understand this distorted reality you're laboring under, given your posting history. The facts remain, however, you couldn't be further from the truth :D

Okay and this proves what exactly, that the internet community complains about everything:huh: I thought most people knew this. However that does not somehow make ALL of their complaints illegitimate. They complained about Beast Wars, yet Beast Wars was a competent show produced by people who actually went to fans (Benson Yee specifically) as advisors and constantly referenced past materials...therefore resulting in a good product.

Not exactly the case here.

By your reasoning, the producers showing the film to the fanbase (TF2005, Seibertron, etc) who coincidentally loved what they saw, will result in a good product.

Your analogies are consistently poor, if not abysmal. Raised webbing is somehow equivelent now??? Are you mad? Are you working for Bay? Spider-Man, for all intents and purposes, looked exactly the same as his comic counterpart. Not Optimus, who is vastly dissimilar aside from a head that bears a strong resemblence.

Keep telling yourself that you have this grand power to make things reality by saying it over and over.

If you think the analogies are poor, SHOW it.. otherwise, quit pretending as if you're smarter than your posts really show.

The fact is, Spider-man's costume stirred up quite a fuss at the time because of the raised webbing. If you were too young to be around the net at the time, it's understandable. There's always the wayback site if you'd care to educate yourself about what you're attempting to pretend to be an authority on :)

Flames are integral to the character. Rodimus, his replacement, has flames. Rodimus also was a brash young upstart trying to come to grips with his responsibilities. Hence why he looked both the part of the rad Hot Rod and noble leader, the roles which he went between. Not Optimus, Optimus doesn't have flames because Optimus is a noble stoic war time leader. Optimus isn't trying to be cool like Hot Rod.

So, flames ALWAYS indicate brash and young qualities?

Again, you're bringing in your own preconceived notions about things and that's ruining things for you.

People wanted a semi, yes. However if this were a Beast Wars or RiD adaption (which it isn't), then yes you'd want a monkey and firetruck respectively.

Way to avoid the question.

Are you saying you'd have zero problem if he was a fire truck? Or a monkey?

Most fans, as you haven't cared to note, blame Hasbro from the onset. In fact the term "Has-Blow" is a veritable cliche' now in the Transformers community, who trust me, give them a ton of slack. You really thinks fans have been happy with the last wave of "Pokemon-esque" cartoons and gimmicks Hasbro has been doling out to the general public.

Funny how most of the posts around here don't reflect this :D

I'm sure with the plethora of posts you can surely post ten examples?

But what the article did not say was Hasbro "required Optimus have flames", you'll have to find that part for me because it doesn't say that.

Ok, let's see if you can keep up with this line of reasoning..

A) Hasbro mandates all characters must be different.
B) Bay made changes required by Hasbro

B could not have happened without A.

I never said Hasbro required the flames, but none of this would have happened if Hasbro hadn't required it. Yet, all you guys do is obsess over Bay. Seems kinda odd.

Does Optimus need flames, are flames something Optimus would care to have. If the answer is no, then guess what. It means that the flames were all Bay, or potentially the Producers who are always attempting to input what they deem as "cool" and "hip" into Films.

*shrug*

Which has ZERO to do with his personality.

If he was solid white, would it matter? No wait, let me guess, that'd make him a coward since surrender flags are typically white. Please, get a new thing to harp on. Off all the problems with the film, you're still going on and on about flames. Obsess much?

It's not even just the fact that Optimus has flames, it's that some *****e somewhere actually thinks people think flames are still "cool". They don't. I got past putting flames on my car when Superman dropped his mullet. It's cliche (much like most of Bay's films), it's trying WAY to hard to be cool, it looks gady, and unnecessary, and goes against any logic the film ought to have.

Again, it's a movie, you're picking this as your Waterloo?

I didn't see Spider-Man's villains dress in flames.

I didn't see Magneto with a pimp cain.

I didn't see Batman wearing techno-color costumes.

KISS, Keep it simple stupid. This isn't simple, but it sure is stupid.

Says the guy who posted 3 huge posts in a row? KISS indeed.

GG was a Power Ranger. Doc Ock wasn't tubby and had his arms attached to his spine.

Either way, we can agree, this was indeed stupid. Do us all a favor and educate yourself and stick to discussing reality. Stop attributing made up behavior to other posters. Go outside, get a breath of fresh air, and realize it's only a movie.
 
PS -

Ultimate Spiderman never had organic webshooters. If you'd care to take it up with the author I'd love to provide the means for you to do so.

Let's see if you can be honest enough to admit when you're wrong ;)
 
Sources say that Optimus was trying to be hip, maybe he thought "Hey, this is what these people find cool, scan!" all in all, it doesn't really matter. Knowing HASBRO, his design will change next film so will you people please just shut the heck up and deal like the adult geeks you are? It's been...two years now?

And on the subject of 'organic web shooters', why the heck are you geeks still still crying about that? For God's sake, the public obviously doesn't give crap seeing as how BIG both motion pictures have been. Honestly mechanical web shooters are just a lame dues ex machina (is that the phrase?) in adding them in (with the limited webbing thing) would just drag down the film. Aren't the two films we've gotten worht the sacrifice?
 
What difference would it make? I think there's a big difference between a decorative paint job on a truck, and nipples on clothing. Nipples on the bat costume made it look stupid because it gave the appearance that Batman is naked. You can't really make the same argument with a flame design on a vehicle.

Um, that's not why nipples on the Batman custome suck. :whatever: Nipples on Batman suck because they detract from the character. Putting a juvenille flame paint job on a stoic, honorable, five-star general detracts from the character.

It would be like having Charles Xavier wear a purple pimp hat or have Atticus Finch sport trendy tribal tatoos or Obi Wan having a mohawk or Indiana Jones with a backwards baseball cap. Giving characters inappropriate appearances detracts and distorts the entire purpose they serve to the story. It's a pointless distraction that ruins the potency and purpose of the characters and what they represent.
 
Yūgi's BM;11480440 said:
Sources say that Optimus was trying to be hip, maybe he thought "Hey, this is what these people find cool, scan!" all in all, it doesn't really matter. Knowing HASBRO, his design will change next film so will you people please just shut the heck up and deal like the adult geeks you are? It's been...two years now?

You're on the same geeked out forum we're on. :whatever:

And on the subject of 'organic web shooters', why the heck are you geeks still still crying about that? For God's sake, the public obviously doesn't give crap seeing as how BIG both motion pictures have been. Honestly mechanical web shooters are just a lame dues ex machina (is that the phrase?) in adding them in (with the limited webbing thing) would just drag down the film. Aren't the two films we've gotten worht the sacrifice?

If you bothered to read then you would've seen that they were just making a comparison to how Spidey fans used to complain about organics. People here aren't STILL complaining about it. Think before you spew next time.
 
You're on the same geeked out forum we're on. :whatever:



If you bothered to read then you would've seen that they were just making a comparison to how Spidey fans used to complain about organics. People here aren't STILL complaining about it. Think before you spew next time.

You're right, I did skim a bit but I sort of took a general consensus of what I thought I was reading, which sometimes, I might missread. Totally my fault.
 
Yūgi's BM;11480440 said:
Sources say that Optimus was trying to be hip, maybe he thought "Hey, this is what these people find cool, scan!" all in all, it doesn't really matter. Knowing HASBRO, his design will change next film so will you people please just shut the heck up and deal like the adult geeks you are? It's been...two years now?
Bay has been involved with Transformers for maybe 1 or 2 years. I've been hoping to see these characters in live action since Reagan was in the White House. You expect me to embrace pointless changes and support a director who resents the source material and is wiping his ass with characters that reasonated me and made TF popular in the first place? I'm a life-long Tranformers fan, dude. Apathy is not an option.

And on the subject of 'organic web shooters', why the heck are you geeks still still crying about that? For God's sake, the public obviously doesn't give crap seeing as how BIG both motion pictures have been.
Yeah Jar Jar didn't hurt the box office revenue for the prequels but he definitely didn't help.
 
I still don't understand why this movie has to be an exact translation of G1...

-TNC
 
I still don't understand why this movie has to be an exact translation of G1...

-TNC

It doesn't. Merely has to be respectful to the reason it even exists, G1. G1 is its parent, afterall. We all respect our parents, don't we? maybe?
 
I still don't understand why this movie has to be an exact translation of G1...

-TNC
It doesn't have to be an exact translation. But we want the changes to be minimized instead of getting the GINO, LXG hack-treatment.

Transformers has survived 20 years because the original characters reasonated with millions. It makes sense to stay as close as possible to the source material and capture that same magic rather than try an untested formula. It's not that easy to create characters that stand the test of time so you might as well use what works.

If Bay wants to revamp Transformers fine but don't call it Transformers. Doing so is nothing more than a shameless bait and switch trick.
 
Exec 1 = "Ok, let's do a GI Joe movie because it's popular. First thing we need to do is change the story and characters."

Exec 2 = "But doesn't that change what made it popular in the first place."

Exec 1 = "Don't worry we got the guy who wrote Catwoman and the producer of LXG"
 
Nah, it's X-Men and Spider-Man all over again.

no-organic-webshooters = no-flames-on-optimus :D

Besides, it seems to say that the changes are a direct result of the licensee's requirements (read: Hasbro) than Bay deciding on his own.

So, if you want someone to blame, blame the guys who made the G1 line originally :)


no its "teh puffy", "there are creases in his armor" and "the \S/ is too damn small" all over again:whatever:
 
Um, that's not why nipples on the Batman custome suck. :whatever: Nipples on Batman suck because they detract from the character. Putting a juvenille flame paint job on a stoic, honorable, five-star general detracts from the character.

What about the countless cultures throughout history where soliders have gone into battle with their bodies decorated in some fashion. Warpaint, those "trendy tribal tattoos" you speak of, scarification. You telling me none of those military leaders exhibited stoicism or honor?

Stop fishing for reason for not liking the paint job other than, "It doesn't like exactly like the cartoon." Because that's all it is.
 
I don't really see how the designs of the last four Transformer cartoons have paid that much respect to the G1 designs.
 
What about the countless cultures throughout history where soliders have gone into battle with their bodies decorated in some fashion. Warpaint, those "trendy tribal tattoos" you speak of, scarification. You telling me none of those military leaders exhibited stoicism or honor?

Stop fishing for reason for not liking the paint job other than, "It doesn't like exactly like the cartoon." Because that's all it is.

Let's be honest. This is Michael Bay we're talking about. Do you really think he got went on the level of, "Let me see what different cultures' military leaders wore into battle so I can create a proper image for Optimus Prime".

I think it went more like this, "Man, some flames would be really ****ing nice on this giant ****ing robot, get me some cholo guy who can paint really good".

Yūgi's BM;11482299 said:
I don't really see how the designs of the last four Transformer cartoons have paid that much respect to the G1 designs.

Those are just more Transformers cartoons. This is the first live action movie that is BASED mostly on G1...but the only Transformer who you can recognize as G1 based is Optimus Prime.

Go check out Transformers comic books...they're still using G1 designs and the stories are sci-fi and smart. That's more of what I wanted in a Transformers live action movie.
 
I think it went more like this, "Man, some flames would be really ****ing nice on this giant ****ing robot, get me some cholo guy who can paint really good".

Ha ha. :woot:

Man, he said cholo in the whitest way I've ever heard. Yeah, I know he's white, but even the word coming out of his mouth was pasty. :csad:
 
Let's be honest. This is Michael Bay we're talking about. Do you really think he got went on the level of, "Let me see what different cultures' military leaders wore into battle so I can create a proper image for Optimus Prime".

I think it went more like this, "Man, some flames would be really ****ing nice on this giant ****ing robot, get me some cholo guy who can paint really good".



Those are just more Transformers cartoons. This is the first live action movie that is BASED mostly on G1...but the only Transformer who you can recognize as G1 based is Optimus Prime.

Go check out Transformers comic books...they're still using G1 designs and the stories are sci-fi and smart. That's more of what I wanted in a Transformers live action movie.

But the thing is, how many non-geeks read those comics? Not many, I would suppose. This film is mainstream first, geeks second.

We're bound to get new designs for the next film so who knows, maybe you'll get your precious G1 designs, or something more akin to them.
 
What about the countless cultures throughout history where soliders have gone into battle with their bodies decorated in some fashion. Warpaint, those "trendy tribal tattoos" you speak of, scarification. You telling me none of those military leaders exhibited stoicism or honor?

Stop fishing for reason for not liking the paint job other than, "It doesn't like exactly like the cartoon." Because that's all it is.

Your logic is impeccable.... except for
1) None of those guys were ROBOTS
2) Optimus Prime didn't pick flames to throw off or strike fear in his enemies, which is the point of warpaint. He did it to look cool to humans.

And, contrary to what you say, the problem is that the paint DOES look like the cartoon. It looks like Rodimus Prime!
 

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