"We Hurt The Ones We Love The Most"

Discussion in 'X-Men 1, 2 & 3' started by Lightning Strykez!, Jan 28, 2006.

  1. Lightning Strykez!

    Lightning Strykez! Former Mod On Pension Pay

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    [​IMG]
    "We Hurt The Ones We Love The Most"
    A Theory On Why Cyclops' Death Might Work


    An Essay By Lightning Strikez!


    I've given much thought to these alleged "death" rumors, and have come to the conclusion that Cyclop's death might--just might--actually work for this film depending on how it's executed. Now, don't get wrong, I think it'd be a crime to waste such a promising and underdeveloped character, especially in lieu of the great actor that is James Marsden. However, this thread is not meant to discuss the *crimes* of this possible outcome, but rather how it might actually work--if it's done for emotional impact.


    A Deeper Motive

    Bryan Singer's prior X-films contained a certain level of believability and realism. Therefore, there obviously won't be outer space aliens or entities taking over bodies as they do in comic books. So what other element could feasibly drive Jean Grey to become Dark Phoenix without compromising the realistic tone in this series?

    The answer? Accidental Manslaughter & Revenge.

    If Jean accidentally deals a fatal blow to her lover, she (and the audience) will be forced to come to a chilling conclusion: She is out of control. And from what we understand, it will be revealed that Charles Xavier set her up for that failure--not only by putting psionic "brakes" in her mind at a tender young age, but also by stifling her attempts to develop her powers (i.e. in Cerebro).

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    Understandably, this revelation would likely pitch Jean into a wide plethora of emotions--including feelings of rage, betrayal, grief, confusion...and of course, insanity. Charles Xavier was her figurative "father" figure, her protector, her teacher. Yet, due to his overprotectiveness, he might have interfered with her natural evolution, thereby "framing" her in a sense with the future murder of Scott Summers. As a result, I think audiences would totally understand her defection to Magneto's Brotherhood Of Mutants.

    So for this reason (and this reason alone), I believe that Scott's death--if it is true--could be one of the most emotionally gripping and pivotal scenes of the film for 3 different reasons: (1) It will show audiences just how powerful Jean has become, (2) his death would provide a "realistic" motive for Jean to apostasize against her mentor and (3) it would give basis to Jean's avenging Scott by killing someone else--as speculated.

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    "We hurt the ones we love the most"

    If these rumors hold true, this old adage will take on significant emotional meaning for Jean Grey, and the two most important men in her life. If done right, I believe it could be a powerful element in this movie--and most importantly--it would ensure that Scott's death would not be an "empty" thing.

    Your thoughts?
     
  2. The Hurricane

    The Hurricane Registered

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    It could be the other way around with Cyclops killing jean or something like that. But my guess is the professor dies. At the funeral scene heis the only person who isnt there from the panning shot.
     
  3. deemar325

    deemar325 Registered

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    Nah! WOLVERINE is the cash cow, so knock the guy who's supposed to be the leader out of the equation and put Hugh"Break out star"Jackman in the front spot and watch the money roll in.
     
  4. JP

    JP Smelly

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    Speaking with both Zack Penn and Simon Kinberg on The Xverse, I must say it seems like those two are bent on doing the Phoenix saga justice and still making it very believable and realistic. I wouldn't be surprised if those points you've made are indeed what they were thinking.

    Although, most people wont see it that way after reading your post, Lighty.
     
  5. The Hurricane

    The Hurricane Registered

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    He has still got to make the wolverine movie though so he cant die yet
     
  6. Lightning Strykez!

    Lightning Strykez! Former Mod On Pension Pay

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    Whoa...before we get off-subject, allow me to make the focus of this thread a bit more clear: It's not meant to be a "the funeral is for this person" etc., nor to go off on the "screentime" thing.

    What do you guys think the emotional impact of Scott's death would have on audiences? And do you think it could be an event powerful enough to make moviegoers believe that Dark Phoenix is justified--without the comic book's "Phoenix Force" from the universe.
     
  7. Lightning Strykez!

    Lightning Strykez! Former Mod On Pension Pay

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    Why not? How do you think audiences would interpret it? Please explain.
     
  8. JP

    JP Smelly

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    Oh no, I meant the rabid fanboys that are Hype members. I think the first two posts in this thread show exactly what I mean.
     
  9. imaperson2

    imaperson2 Bombastic

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    heres what i think is gonna happen: cyclops will go to alkali lake to mourn... phoenix rises... hes surprised to see her... he dies...wolverine gets there..jean fainted...he takes her to the x-mansion...they put that thing on her head(dunno what its called).... meanwhile storm is talking...professor x leaves for a while, maybe to talk at the funeral... meanwhile she wakes up and wolverine tells her that she killed cyclops... she cries... blasts through the door to look for revenge...

    yeah i know this probably wont happen but i think its a good idea.. what do u guys think?
     
  10. Lightning Strykez!

    Lightning Strykez! Former Mod On Pension Pay

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    Even "rabid fanboys" have brains. If they can read and reason, hopefully my theory will give them some food for thought.

    I honestly believe this is the ONLY way that Scott Summers could lose his life and it NOT come across cheap to fans.
     
  11. Lightning Strykez!

    Lightning Strykez! Former Mod On Pension Pay

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    Um, no offense but...did you even read my thread? It's purpose is not to speculate on what the sequence of movie events might be.

    Rather we are taking about kind of emotional impact Scott's death would have on audiences--and whether it's a good enough reason to bring Dark Phoenix into the storyline.

    *smiles pleasantly*

    :cool:
     
  12. sebaa

    sebaa Registered

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    cool! theory!!! but i dont want that the profesor or cyclops died!!!
    question lightinig were do you get that "We hurt the ones we love the most" i listen that before..
     
  13. imaperson2

    imaperson2 Bombastic

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    yes i read the thread i just felt like putting it. what else would i reply: oh yea that would have a lot of emotional impact...? But seriously... i think that cyclops death is for a good reason... not just another death in the movie.
     
  14. The Hurricane

    The Hurricane Registered

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    I think it could work and justify the change if done correctly. But I do think it wont work out that way. They will make her transition i believe do to the ever growing power inside her sort of making her insane. Sort of a power hungry villain. Bent on destruction and so forth
     
  15. JP

    JP Smelly

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    I know. But there are some hard headed fans out there. The fans who claim they'd walk out the theater if Scott dies (yeah right). They don't want Scott dead because it isn't faithfull to the sourse material. But, these are the same fans who wouldn't mind MJ dying because they don't like Dunst.

    The AICN draft never got into how Scott dies, why he dies, or what time in the movie he dies. Fans just jumt to assumptions without knowing the facts and automatically hate.

    I for one am okay with his death as I am certain it will serve the story. I look at Scott and Jean as the Romeo and Juliet of the movies, and I think they should die together.
     
  16. Lightning Strykez!

    Lightning Strykez! Former Mod On Pension Pay

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    Yeah, that's how I feel. I mean, I really can't think of any other believable way that Jean could become the Dark Phoenix in this "realistic" universe. There would have to be a sense of loss or some tragedy to push her over the edge. She's not going to be a symbiote for some heavenly being like in the comics.

    For Magneto it was the separation from his parents that embittered him against humanity. A similiar separation (from Scott in this case) is what I think will drive Jean to apostasize against Xavier.
     
  17. imaperson2

    imaperson2 Bombastic

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    by the way... i love how u make these posts lightning... ur little essay posts... very cool to read
     
  18. Jennifer Walters

    Jennifer Walters Attorney at Law

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    Brava Lightning! Brava! It's magnifcent. Truely beautiful. I was just thinking about this earlier tonight myself. It really is the best and most logical way for Jean to go all the way evil, and even outright kill Xavier. Of course, the only problem with this theory is, if she kills herself in the end to save the day, what would send her to the point of realizing. ''Oh god, I've done wrong. Scott's dead. Xavier's dead."
     
  19. Lightning Strykez!

    Lightning Strykez! Former Mod On Pension Pay

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    And that's my point. This entire series has only loosely been based on the comics. There have been a LOT of liberties taken. So while characters like Collossus, Rachel, Xavier, Jean, Psylocke, etc., can die and return over and over, that's not going to happen in the movieverse.

    I think they might kill Cyclops, but not for arbitrary, empty reasons like revenge on the actor James Marsden. I believe the writers think his death will escalate Jean's reasons for losing her mind.
     
  20. sebaa

    sebaa Registered

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    i really like the thing that JP wrote, the thing that jean and scott died together, a type of romeo and juliet! that will be so dramatic ,strong and shoking! i dont want that these charactes died no way! but if the died this its a very beautifull and dramatic way
     
  21. The Hurricane

    The Hurricane Registered

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    but if jean is going to turn to the darkside which is the anti human side. Wouldnt a human have to inflict pain in her life like by killing scott or the prof X
     
  22. JP

    JP Smelly

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    I think you've just answered your own question.

    She rises to see the man she loves standing before her, but something goes terribly wrong. Now he is gone. This drives her insane. Xavier tries to reason with her, but of course it will not work. She goes out on her own, thus finding Magneto.

    Now Magneto, being the devilishly evil being that he is, will see the beauty that is Jean. Someone who is not restricted by the laws of man. A true mutant with imense power. Power that he had to sit back and watch his 'friend' take away. Magneto will use this to his advantage. He'll toy with her mind and pin her against Xavier. This will drive Jean even farther away from sanity, thus murdering Xavier.

    Now comes the redemption. She will see the error of her ways, an hopefully be an aid to the X-Men in the final battle. Only to die/vanish in the end in a final climactic rush leaving not a single trace of her exsistance.

    Jean MUST die a hero. If she dies an evil *****, then that just leaves a bad taste in my mouth.
     
  23. Jennifer Walters

    Jennifer Walters Attorney at Law

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    The problem with this is Famke's performance might come off so fierce and so crazy, that it just might logicistical seem weird for suddenly in the middle of the war for Jean to come to her own senses and say ''I've killed my father....and my lover...Oh god. I have to do something. I must redeem myself."

    To me, it'd be much better if Cyclops/Storm/Wolverine, someone close to her that was still alive spoke to her, and she finally realized that ''Hey! I'm not in the right here".
     
  24. JP

    JP Smelly

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    Very true. I just hope that these 'fans' go into X3 without the comics in the mind. If they do, they'll just end up hating this move a lot more than the first two.
     
  25. JP

    JP Smelly

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    I'm more than sure that will come into play somehow. And I'm almost certain that it will be Storm. The two will definately go at it at some point.
     

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