What don't you like about the Marvel Cinematic Universe? (Spoilers)

[psylockolussus]

Legacy characters dominating in phase 4. Ugh.

I prefer them to introduce someone obscure, than taking or sharing the mantle of Capt. America, Black Widow, Thor, Hawkeye, Capt. Marvel, Hulk, Iron Man. The latter just doesn't eXcite me. I thought legacy characters in the comiXs is a lazy way /easy cash grab to introduce newer characters.

 

[Spider-Fan]

I think right now, my biggest gripe would be a few things I find lacking in the Spider-Man adaptation, primarily being Spider-Man hasn't required much sacrifice or true difficulty with his friends and such as I would like. The Raimi films nailed this much better.

I am also sad we are getting the real Mandarin and trying up the 10 Rings....after Tony is dead.

 

[TeeKay]

I think right now, my biggest gripe would be a few things I find lacking in the Spider-Man adaptation, primarily being Spider-Man hasn't required much sacrifice or true difficulty with his friends and such as I would like. The Raimi films nailed this much better.

I am also sad we are getting the real Mandarin and trying up the 10 Rings....after Tony is dead.

And that's why Spider-Man 2 remains the best out of the bunch. Don't get me wrong, I've enjoyed MCU Spider-Man thus far but there's just something lacking when it comes to the character and I think you nailed it.

 

[GreenKToo]

Loved infinity war and endgame.
I Hated weak azz prof Hulk.

 

[GREEN =w= DAY]

Yeah, not a fan of neutered Professor Hulk. Such a joke

Also not really a fan of Ruffalo as Banner. Shame things didn’t work out with Ed Norton

 

[psylockolussus]

The Incredible Hulk the movie definitely would have seen in a better light if Hulk wasn't recast. The movie sticks out like a thumb sore to some people.

 

[Another_Fool]

Yeah, not a fan of neutered Professor Hulk. Such a joke

Also not really a fan of Ruffalo as Banner. Shame things didn’t work out with Ed Norton

Yeah. Ultimately I think it worked out for both parties, particularly Norton as I'm sure he would've complained/hated being handcuffed to the MCU schedule, however I would've LOVED seeing him work with RDJ and Chris Evans.

 

[steamed hams]

Probably already been said but I don't like how so many characters are resurrected. I know Superhero films aren't known as being realistic but they can still carry good messages. The MCU attitude towards death is weak and it's almost like they are saying that death isn't a real thing.

Spoiler

I didn't feel much when Black Widow and Tony died in Endgame because the franchise had cheapened deaths so much.

Gamora - sacrificed for the soul stone which is supposedly the most permanent death but appeared again in Endgame and is now seemingly going to be in future films. I know she's from a different timeline but it's still a cheap move.

Loki - many resurrections. His death scene in Thor 2 was done so well and then is made into a joke, especially at the start of Thor 3. Even when Thanos kills him and says 'No more resurrections' they still find a way to bring him back like Gamora through a tenuous time loop thing.

Vision has now returned twice as Wanda's creation and also this new re-programmed 'White Vision'.

Groot's death in GOTG was done well, but when I re-watch the film it loses some of its emotion as he is resurrected already before the film has even finished, never mind the sequel!

I know Black Widow is a prequel but it seems strange to release it after Endgame.

Even Agent Coulson somehow returned in the TV series!

I know War Machine didn't die in Civil War but it would have been better for the story and more dramatic if he did. And to fall from that height would have realistically killed him.

I'm not saying that it can never be done well, for example I think the Winter Soldier being Bucky worked great but the MCU just goes to the resurrection well way too many times.

 

[steamed hams]

Oh yeah another thing I don't like.... again probably been said many times but Tony Stark always gets jokes scripted in his dialogue at everyone else's expense. These are often funny but the other characters never get to joke at his expense which I'm sure would also be funny. So the general RDJ dominance thing I guess. And in Infinity War he has a pop at Spider-Man for making too many pop culture references which is very hypocritical!

 

[InCali]

Probably already been said but I don't like how so many characters are resurrected. I know Superhero films aren't known as being realistic but they can still carry good messages. The MCU attitude towards death is weak and it's almost like they are saying that death isn't a real thing.

Spoiler

I didn't feel much when Black Widow and Tony died in Endgame because the franchise had cheapened deaths so much.

Gamora - sacrificed for the soul stone which is supposedly the most permanent death but appeared again in Endgame and is now seemingly going to be in future films. I know she's from a different timeline but it's still a cheap move.

Loki - many resurrections. His death scene in Thor 2 was done so well and then is made into a joke, especially at the start of Thor 3. Even when Thanos kills him and says 'No more resurrections' they still find a way to bring him back like Gamora through a tenuous time loop thing.

Vision has now returned twice as Wanda's creation and also this new re-programmed 'White Vision'.

Groot's death in GOTG was done well, but when I re-watch the film it loses some of its emotion as he is resurrected already before the film has even finished, never mind the sequel!

I know Black Widow is a prequel but it seems strange to release it after Endgame.

Even Agent Coulson somehow returned in the TV series!

I know War Machine didn't die in Civil War but it would have been better for the story and more dramatic if he did. And to fall from that height would have realistically killed him.

I'm not saying that it can never be done well, for example I think the Winter Soldier being Bucky worked great but the MCU just goes to the resurrection well way too many times.

They are Comic Book Movies.

 

[TheVileOne]

IMHO there isn't a proper resolution to Hulk and Banner's story arc. We never see it really happen. Endgame also glosses over Star-Lord returning to Earth. No one asks him if he has any memories or bittersweet feelings on coming back, if he intends to visit his grandfather, etc.

Xandar getting destroyed is also glossed over, and we also never get to see it happen. Guardians aren't even aware of it, which I find a bit flimsy.

I think Thor: Ragnarok needed an extra scene to really sell and properly introduce Hela. I didn't like that she just abruptly shows up poof out of thin air. Show how she was able to escape and so easily travel to Earth, explain her death goddess powers. Also, Ragnarok needed a scene to explain to Thor that the Warrior's 3 are all dead. Sif is missing and/or gone. Just really sell how much Thor has lost is losing from his home.

Iron Man 3 was a bigger letdown to me than Iron Man 2. The villains should've been Madame Masque and Ghost. If they weren't going to use Mandarin, those characters would've been a much better fit than that movie. Masque could be good because it would confront Tony on his past reputation for womanizing and treating women like disposable things, meaningless conquests. They wasted Guy Pierce as Killian/fake Mandarin and Extremis.

I think we still don't have clarity on Red Skull. Can he leave Vormir now? Where will he go? Is that all for him as a character?

I think Civil War wasted Zemo as a character. In Falcon and Winter Soldier they basically soft retconned Zemo and suddenly made him more like the comics. We didn't get to actually see Cap dealing with Baron Zemo. A waste IMO.

 

[Bayne]

Probably already been said but I don't like how so many characters are resurrected. I know Superhero films aren't known as being realistic but they can still carry good messages. The MCU attitude towards death is weak and it's almost like they are saying that death isn't a real thing.

Spoiler

I didn't feel much when Black Widow and Tony died in Endgame because the franchise had cheapened deaths so much.

Gamora - sacrificed for the soul stone which is supposedly the most permanent death but appeared again in Endgame and is now seemingly going to be in future films. I know she's from a different timeline but it's still a cheap move.

Loki - many resurrections. His death scene in Thor 2 was done so well and then is made into a joke, especially at the start of Thor 3. Even when Thanos kills him and says 'No more resurrections' they still find a way to bring him back like Gamora through a tenuous time loop thing.

Vision has now returned twice as Wanda's creation and also this new re-programmed 'White Vision'.

Groot's death in GOTG was done well, but when I re-watch the film it loses some of its emotion as he is resurrected already before the film has even finished, never mind the sequel!

I know Black Widow is a prequel but it seems strange to release it after Endgame.

Even Agent Coulson somehow returned in the TV series!

I know War Machine didn't die in Civil War but it would have been better for the story and more dramatic if he did. And to fall from that height would have realistically killed him.

I'm not saying that it can never be done well, for example I think the Winter Soldier being Bucky worked great but the MCU just goes to the resurrection well way too many times.

I'm not going to argue the general point as I can understand where you're coming from even if I disagree. But you are counting several things that are not only not 'technically' resurrections but are in fact not even at all comparable to resurrections. In particular, Westview Vision is literally just a manifestion of Wanda's grief - he is not really real - and Baby/Teen/New Groot is literally just Groot's offspring, not the same Groot resurrected. He doesn't even really have the same characterization at all. Not to mention Black Widow getting a prequel movie clearly has nothing whatsoever to do with this subject at all. It's just a prequel. (And it's not even unique in being a prequel in the MCU.)

 

[steamed hams]

They are Comic Book Movies.

It's a fair comment, and don't get me wrong I really like the MCU and have enjoyed comic book movies for a long time in general. It's more me nitpicking a couple of things that I think could be better for this thread.

I'm not going to argue the general point as I can understand where you're coming from even if I disagree. But you are counting several things that are not only not 'technically' resurrections but are in fact not even at all comparable to resurrections. In particular, Westview Vision is literally just a manifestion of Wanda's grief - he is not really real - and Baby/Teen/New Groot is literally just Groot's offspring, not the same Groot resurrected. He doesn't even really have the same characterization at all. Not to mention Black Widow getting a prequel movie clearly has nothing whatsoever to do with this subject at all. It's just a prequel. (And it's not even unique in being a prequel in the MCU.)

That's fair enough, I probably shouldn't have termed them as resurrections. I mean more instances that for me take away some of the emotional power of brilliantly done character death scenes. I know sometimes it's a trade off though and I am thoroughly enjoying the Loki series even if he has returned somehow from seemingly having died several times.

Spoiler

And with the cosmic and time themed nature of the series such instances don't seem so far fetched and Loki seeing his own 'future' death in episode 1 (I think it was) was an interesting moment.

The MCU has done a great job in keeping things watchable and somehow fitting so many characters and storylines into a shared universe, and keeping it watchable and people caring about what happens.

 

[InCali]

It's a fair comment, and don't get me wrong I really like the MCU and have enjoyed comic book movies for a long time in general. It's more me nitpicking a couple of things that I think could be better for this thread.



That's fair enough, I probably shouldn't have termed them as resurrections. I mean more instances that for me take away some of the emotional power of brilliantly done character death scenes. I know sometimes it's a trade off though and I am thoroughly enjoying the Loki series even if he has returned somehow from seemingly having died several times.

Spoiler

And with the cosmic and time themed nature of the series such instances don't seem so far fetched and Loki seeing his own 'future' death in episode 1 (I think it was) was an interesting moment.

The MCU has done a great job in keeping things watchable and somehow fitting so many characters and storylines into a shared universe, and keeping it watchable and people caring about what happens.

And I wasn’t trying to be critical of you. Sometimes as fans we can forget that CBMs aren’t meant to be The Godfather. I see them as fun, light movies meant to indulge and therefore I don’t get very picky unless they really suck. Heck I even liked Suicide Squad and recognized that it was a bit of a mess. I think the one that left me shaking my head was GL.

 

[Fosterson]

I don't know if I'm alone in this, but I've recently realised that I've been losing interest in the MCU for a while now. I'm not quite sure when it began, but I can attribute it to 2 main reasons:

Firstly, now that the Thanos/Infinity Gauntlet story arc has been concluded, there seems to be a lack of a greater purpose to the adventures of our heroes. And this is important, as I found that the hype for that inevitable final showdown during the Infinity Saga is what allowed me to overlook the glaring mediocrity of films like Ant-Man, Doctor Strange, Homecoming and Captain Marvel as there was a sense that everything was going to build to a final great crescendo. Now however, there's nothing to build towards and this means I'm forced to assess these products entirely on their own merits, which are often minimal.

Secondly, Marvel's refusal to move away from their comfort zone prevents them from telling new or more unusual stories. I hoped that since they had now cashed their $5 billion cheque from IW/EG, this would allow them to do weirder and more bold and experimental stuff. And while they tried this with WandaVision, they did a half-a**ed job and shoe-horned in a cringe-inducing battle for no reason. And Falcon and Winter Soldier's attempts to tackle racism and inequality were as inept as Gamelin's defence of France in 1940. Equally, with the possible exception of Eternals, none of the footage I've seen from the upcoming movies gives me much hope that they are going to break new ground either.

I'll still watch every show and movie because I've come too far to completely ditch this thing, but unless Feige and Co. really pull a rabbit out of a hat and give me something truly great (as opposed to merely "ok"), I fear that I will never again be as hyped for this franchise as I was in the 2012-2019 period.

 

[The Lazarus Pit]

I haven’t lost interest in the MCU, but I do think we’re in a transitional period. Shang Chi, Eternals, and Black Widow don’t interest me at all. But there is a lot of good stuff coming soon with the F4, Silver Surfer, and X-Men in particular.

 

[Fosterson]

I haven’t lost interest in the MCU, but I do think we’re in a transitional period. Shang Chi, Eternals, and Black Widow don’t interest me at all. But there is a lot of good stuff coming soon with the F4, Silver Surfer, and X-Men in particular.

My problem isn't with the characters that these movies are featuring, but rather with how they are used. I'm down for Fantastic Four and X-Men, but if they are just going to be Avengers-lite then count me out.

Is it unreasonable to want some variety and diversity of content?

 

[The Lazarus Pit]

My problem isn't with the characters that these movies are featuring, but rather with how they are used. I'm down for Fantastic Four and X-Men, but if they are just going to be Avengers-lite then count me out.

Is it unreasonable to want some variety and diversity of content?

No but you are not going to get that. Disney/MCU struck a formula that works and appeals to almost everyone. There are no risks involved.

WB/DC is completely different. No synergy, but every once in a while you get a transcendent masterpiece like TDK or Joker, but most of the time you get turds like Suicide Squad or Birds of Prey.

Basically pick your poison... DC is basically mostly mediocre or bad until they bust out a masterpiece. Marvel is just always a certain level of quality and rarely dips above or below that line.

I prefer DC but it’s exhausting waiting for a good movie when they put out so much ****. Meanwhile, Marvel consistently puts out 6/10 or 7/10 products that don’t stay with me for more than a few hours after I’ve watched them. At this point? The last few MCU shows I’ve watched were good entertainment, but not transcendent or great. I’m watching them from a completionist perspective. I want the full story.

 

[Fosterson]

No but you are not going to get that. Disney/MCU struck a formula that works and appeals to almost everyone. There are no risks involved.

Yes, of course. And this is why the Scorsese/Coppola critique of these films is stinging and irrefutable.

I prefer DC but it’s exhausting waiting for a good movie when they put out so much ****. Meanwhile, Marvel consistently puts out 6/10 or 7/10 products that don’t stay with me for more than a few hours after I’ve watched them. At this point? The last few MCU shows I’ve watched were good entertainment, but not transcendent or great. I’m watching them from a completionist perspective. I want the full story.

This is ultimately why I'm convinced that the MCU will not stand the test of time and be remembered decades from now in the way that Star Wars, Bond, etc are. I can certainly recognise the success of Marvel's business model. But then again, Amazon and McDonald's have successful business models too and I don't admire or celebrate them, so why should Marvel be given special treatment?

The MCU is a commercial triumph, rather than a creative one. A tour-de-force of managing the business cycle rather than of creating authentic art. You could just as easily see Feige running a Big Tech company or even a car manufacturer as heading a film studio and that's a problem. It shows that he's a businessman and not an artist.

In other words, a perfect film franchise for our Late Stage Capitalist era!

 

[Drunken Rider]

Phase 4 is basically a "waiting for Xmen/Mutants and F4" period. Or aka a season 2 of a show that starts out with filler content before going into the promising dessert ala the storyline of the season.

 

[InCali]

I don't know if I'm alone in this, but I've recently realised that I've been losing interest in the MCU for a while now. I'm not quite sure when it began, but I can attribute it to 2 main reasons:

Firstly, now that the Thanos/Infinity Gauntlet story arc has been concluded, there seems to be a lack of a greater purpose to the adventures of our heroes. And this is important, as I found that the hype for that inevitable final showdown during the Infinity Saga is what allowed me to overlook the glaring mediocrity of films like Ant-Man, Doctor Strange, Homecoming and Captain Marvel as there was a sense that everything was going to build to a final great crescendo. Now however, there's nothing to build towards and this means I'm forced to assess these products entirely on their own merits, which are often minimal.

Secondly, Marvel's refusal to move away from their comfort zone prevents them from telling new or more unusual stories. I hoped that since they had now cashed their $5 billion cheque from IW/EG, this would allow them to do weirder and more bold and experimental stuff. And while they tried this with WandaVision, they did a half-a**ed job and shoe-horned in a cringe-inducing battle for no reason. And Falcon and Winter Soldier's attempts to tackle racism and inequality were as inept as Gamelin's defence of France in 1940. Equally, with the possible exception of Eternals, none of the footage I've seen from the upcoming movies gives me much hope that they are going to break new ground either.

I'll still watch every show and movie because I've come too far to completely ditch this thing, but unless Feige and Co. really pull a rabbit out of a hat and give me something truly great (as opposed to merely "ok"), I fear that I will never again be as hyped for this franchise as I was in the 2012-2019 period.

I think COVID has thrown a monkey wrench into the film industry in general. I think we'll see whether Marvel decides to "stretch". I see them going into a cosmic phase and let's see how that goes. I think this may both lose and attract people. We shall see.

 

[The Lazarus Pit]

Phase 4 is basically a "waiting for Xmen/Mutants and F4" period. Or aka a season 2 of a show that starts out with filler content before going into the promising dessert ala the storyline of the season.

Ok finally someone said it. I cannot give less of a **** about some of these upcoming projects.

I’ll watch these, only because I’m so invested in the MCU, but I’m not hyped at all for them:
Black Widow
Eternals
Shang Chi
What If?
Ms. Marvel
Hawkeye
Ironheart
Armor Wars
The Marvels
Echo
Wakanda

meanwhile, I can’t wait for these projects:
Spider-Man
Fantastic 4
Silver Surfer (hopefully this is announced w/Adam McKay)
Blade
Black Panther: Wakanda Forever
Ant-Man and the Wasp: Quantumania (other two movies weren’t good. I’m only on board because of Kang)
X-Men and any spin-offs
Dr. Strange in the Multiverse of Madness
Moon Knight
She-Hulk
any upcoming GOTG
Thor: Love and Thunder
and we will see about Secret Invasion. I don’t think it will be nearly as epic as the comic

 

[psylockolussus]

Some of those films might not even happenned if foX was sold earlier like in 2014 or 2015.

I just hope the general audience won't feel fatigue by the amount of D+ shows and movies. I know plenty of people who didn't even watch a single episode of WandaVision but have seen every mcu movie.

Fortunately for me, as someone who have watched all those canceled Marvel TV shows from Aos to Helstrom. I'm not feeling the weight of the amount of D+ shows coming in as, the episode count are shorter and D+ is only airing one series at a time. But I already forgot most of the things that happened in WandaVision and the Falcon and the Winter Soldier. The latter literally came and went for me.

 

[InCali]

Due to D+, there is so much more coming down the pipe that this really could be a bit of an overload. I've been making fun of people for years about CBM fatigue, but I would prefer an emphasis on quality over quantity. I, for example, did not like WandaVision. I don't think it was poorly done, but it wasn't my cup of tea and they took WAAAAAAAAAAAY too LOOOOOOOOOOOOONG to get to the point. TFAWS, was much better IMO, and I rather like Loki so far (big surprise....I love Tom Hiddleston and think it was dead on casting by Marvel). I will probably watch everything, but, hell, I'm watching and scouring Netflix, Amazon, etc. for something to watch so that tells you where I'm at (watching Vikings right now..... ).

I'm just glad the theaters are opening up (safely). There is nothing like going to the movie theater (with a bar) and being excited about seeing a movie on a BIG screen. Sometimes you get TASM2 or Crapformers and sometimes you get GotG, but the run up is still fun.

 

[MessiahDecoy123]

Skrull who aren't evil.

Supposedly lame Taskmaster.