What makes America right?

[maxwell's demon]

strike- why wont you respond?

 

[Constantine J.]

man, I ask you for your thoughts and you post the same quotes that you have been doing for the past week or so

I ask you to tell why Kerry is a traitor...same link from a the week past.

fine......



No, it is You who are living in the Nile!!!!

CONCOURSE!!!!!

 

[strike-hard]

this is not a matter of opinion.

Again, it's your opinion, to both this post and the original question.

do you still hold that people who question our governnment, who dissent, are traitors?

If they do not believe that over throwing an evil dictator (something most have agreed on) should be taken out for the safety and good of the world

Than yes, I think they are disloyal and traitors to America and the rest of the world.

Do we sit back and do nothing against an evil force in this world?

do you still hold that peopel on these boards are actually evil?

See my response to your other question.

what did those quotes mean to you?

They are what they are.

"Without debate, without criticism, no administration and no country can succeed -- and no republic can survive"

Agreed.

If people are fighting for a side that is evil and a growing threat to the world

Than it's obvious they are wrong, and we need to point it out to them.

If they continue to insist that fighting an evil force in the world is wrong, than they are evil just as they side they are taking.

 

[maxwell's demon]

do you believe in an ultimate truth or is it just one pserons opinion versus someone elses (or in this case, many others- including some of the founders of our country and many of its leaders and most pre-emininent thinkers)?

do you really think that this matter was as simple as taking out an evil dictator?
(ps- my computer couldnt play the kerry clip so im not sure what it said)

do you think its possible that there were other factors involved and maybe THAT is the reason people are dissenting?

you specifically addressed one quote out of many. for the rest- all you can say is "they are what they are"? is it possible that in those quotes lies not only the spirit that dirves many of the posters on these boards, but also the spirit of america?

how is anyone here fighting for the wrong side?

 

[bluejake01]

You asking me to be a good American, something I already am.

I don't agree with you on your views, so therefore you might think I am not.

Which is your opinion, and probably the the opinion all of the liberals.

This is REALLY damned funny coming from you. I am not a liberal *******...In fact I am and have always been a Republican. Bush ****ed up a LOT of things. He has violated our constitution, our ideals and our American way of life.

 

[strike-hard]

Bush ****ed up a LOT of things. He has violated our constitution, our ideals and our American way of life.

We were attacked on 9/11

Way of life for Americans were changed.

We didn't feel as safe as we did on September 10th, and probably never will until the people that are threatning us are taken out.

Bush declares war on terrorism and goes after an evil dictator that people believed to be a growing threat and also on the people responsible for killing thousands of Americans, to ensure our safety and that it wouldn't happen again.

Please excuse me if I do not share your point of view on our President.

 

[bluejake01]

From start to finish the war in Iraq has been handled poorly. Bush circumvented due process, took liberties he simply did not have. He took a course of action that was irresponsible, and violates everything our founding fathers stood for. He has, time and time again, proven his inability to operate within the very foundation of our government's established code of conduct. What is so hard for you to understand? Not ONE DAMNED PERSON has said not even ONCE that Saddam Hussien was a fantastic chap. Even Bush Sr. knew this war was a foolish effort. The war on terror will not be won with bombs, but with brains.

 

[bluejake01]

Please excuse me if I do not share your point of view on our President.

Here's a thought...why don't you do the same thing...excuse people that don't agree with you, rather than insulting them?

 

[strike-hard]

We were attacked on 9/11

Way of life for Americans were changed.

We didn't feel as safe as we did on September 10th, and probably never will until the people that are threatning us are taken out.

Bush declares war on terrorism and goes after an evil dictator that people believed to be a growing threat and also on the people responsible for killing thousands of Americans, to ensure our safety and that it wouldn't happen again.

Please excuse me if I do not share your point of view on our President.

Again.

The war on Iraq.

We took out Saddam.

We are working on weeding out the insurgents so we can begin with the rebuilding process so that the Iraqi people will have a more prosperous future.

War is never perfect.

We try to make the best of it.

 

[bluejake01]

We were attacked on 9/11

Way of life for Americans were changed.

We didn't feel as safe as we did on September 10th, and probably never will until the people that are threatning us are taken out.

Bush declares war on terrorism and goes after an evil dictator that people believed to be a growing threat and also on the people responsible for killing thousands of Americans, to ensure our safety and that it wouldn't happen again.

Few things...

I thought we weren't supposed to let 9/11 change our way of life...that's what Bush said anyway.

We are no more or less safe than we were pre 9/11. If you think we are, you are dellusional.

War on terror. How does one declare war on an emotion?

Do you really think for one instant that giving up constitutional rights and freedoms is really the right answer? Our history is filled with people that have died for our freedom. It is a dis-service to their actions to allow GWBush to strip away freedom for the illusion of safety. It dishonors the memory of the victims of terrorism to allow their deaths to take away constitutional rights. If you think about that would mean they died and it took away freedom. I wouldn't want my death, or a loved ones death to be responsible for such a gut churning reality.

It is not the result that Bush says he is trying to accomplish that I take issue with. It is his actions that I firmly believe are counter productive to those goals that I am upset with. I don't have the answers, unfortunately neither do Bush or Kerry.

 

[bluejake01]

Again.

The war on Iraq.

We took out Saddam.

We are working on weeding out the insurgents so we can begin with the rebuilding process so that the Iraqi people will have a more prosperous future.

War is never perfect.

We try to make the best of it.

Honestly...WTF do I care if the Iraqi people have a bright future if my own is so bleak? Why do I care if they are free if my in my own backyard there are people suffering and having their freedom limited or challenged in the name of "safety"? Why is it right to murder people in order to free them? The Iraqi people need to stand up for themselves and decide what they want. If they really wanted Saddam gone they should have done it. War must be fought as a last ditch resort when not taking action at that given momment would mean death for our people.

I find it funny that you would use the "more prosperous future" angle when it suits you, and then turn a blind eye to the harm we have actually done to them. If you cared about them as a people, perhaps you would bother to hear both sides of their plight. They are getting it in the ash, coming and going. They were ****ed before, and now we are ****ing them all over again. They are now torn, between wanting to be rid of Saddam, and not knowing where their next meal will come from, when they will have power and sanitation. They don't know when and where they will lose their next loved one, and if it is our bullets and bombs that will be responsible, or theirs.

 

[strike-hard]

Few things...

I thought we weren't supposed to let 9/11 change our way of life...that's what Bush said anyway.

True.

"Weren't" is the key word.

But it has, ask the people.

We are no more or less safe than we were pre 9/11. If you think we are, you are dellusional.

No, we haven't beefed up security at airports or other such targets for terrorist.

War on terror. How does one declare war on an emotion?

We are waging a war on terrorist that have threatened our society and continue to do so, is that wrong?

We are fighting a threat so that we never feel the actions of the threat.

I don't have the answers, unfortunately neither do Bush or Kerry.

So you just like to complain about how things are handled yet you have no answers for the problems yourself.

Good one.

 

[Computron2005]

Umm, you still haven't answered my question about the madrassas in Afghhanistan, Strike-hard. BTW I have a suggestion for your custom title. "Shock and Awe" It'
ll be awesome do it! Seriously tho:

I agree with you about the KKK plan half way, we do have to educate people to change their mind. But I also think symbols of the KKK such as the confederate flag should be removed. What if a state adopted the swastika? And the US should start monitoring members of NRA. They already monitor people who are brown so why not members of the NRA?

Please answer my questions and points I have answered yours, why hasn't the US cracked down on Saudi funded Madrassas?

Wow, this is like the third time I brought up the madrassas point, strike-hard and you have chosen to ignore it again, since it was a counter argument to one of your statements, how about you make an acknowledgement at least. I like how you have just been conveniently ignoring me.

 

[strike-hard]

Honestly...WTF do I care if the Iraqi people have a bright future if my own is so bleak? Why do I care if they are free if my in my own backyard there are people suffering and having their freedom limited or challenged in the name of "safety"? Why is it right to murder people in order to free them? The Iraqi people need to stand up for themselves and decide what they want. If they really wanted Saddam gone they should have done it. War must be fought as a last ditch resort when not taking action at that given momment would mean death for our people.

I find it funny that you would use the "more prosperous future" angle when it suits you, and then turn a blind eye to the harm we have actually done to them. If you cared about them as a people, perhaps you would bother to hear both sides of their plight. They are getting it in the ash, coming and going. They were ****ed before, and now we are ****ing them all over again. They are now torn, between wanting to be rid of Saddam, and not knowing where their next meal will come from, when they will have power and sanitation. They don't know when and where they will lose their next loved one, and if it is our bullets and bombs that will be responsible, or theirs.

Besides fighting the War in Iraq for the benefit of their people, haven't I and many other people have said that Iraq was a threat, a country lead by an evil man that either had, or was attempting to obtain a large arsenal of weapons, which might include WMD's.

Should we sit back and let them become an even bigger threat and hope he never takes action?

 

[bluejake01]

No, we haven't beefed up security at airports or other such targets for terrorist.

Actually security measures at the Airport are pointless. You see they hijacked the ****ing planes with BOX CUTTERS. Do you think they would be able to do that anymore? No...We had adequate security at the Airport. The terrorists took advantage of the belief that we all had that behaving for a hijacker would get us out alive. We don't have that belief anymore...they wouldn't be able to pull a 9/11 style attack again. The cuurrent Airport security measures do not help, and they violate our bill of rights. You do know what "illegal search and siezure" means right?


You have no answers yourself, you regurgitate what you have been told by your narrow minded red-neck daddy. You have no original thoughts, nor do you have a firm grasp of history or our constitution.

 

[strike-hard]

Actually security measures at the Airport are pointless. You see they hijacked the ****ing planes with BOX CUTTERS. Do you think they would be able to do that anymore? No...We had adequate security at the Airport. The terrorists took advantage of the belief that we all had that behaving for a hijacker would get us out alive. We don't have that belief anymore...they wouldn't be able to pull a 9/11 style attack again. The cuurrent Airport security measures do not help, and they violate our bill of rights. You do know what "illegal search and siezure" means right?

So your saying that all the beefed up'd security at the airports is all for show? That it does no good?

You have no answers yourself, you regurgitate what you have been told by your narrow minded red-neck daddy. You have no original thoughts, nor do you have a firm grasp of history or our constitution.

Just what I was expecting....

complain.....complain.....complain...

Yet you have no answers....

Go watch Fahrenheit 911 some more....

Michael Moore is almost the same way.....

 

[bluejake01]

Should we sit back and let them become an even bigger threat and hope he never takes action?

You do understand that we had an extremely tight leash on Iraq right? Sanctions, no fly zones, routine missle strikes and bombings? Iraq was contained. Even Bush Sr. knew that a war with Iraq was a waste of money, lives and time.

 

[strike-hard]

You do understand that we had an extremely tight leash on Iraq right? Sanctions, no fly zones, routine missle strikes and bombings? Iraq was contained. Even Bush Sr. knew that a war with Iraq was a waste of money, lives and time.

What's this?

Where Bush Got His Marching Orders

"One way or the other, we are determined to deny Iraq the capacity to develop weapons of mass destruction and the missiles to deliver them. That is our bottom line."
- President Clinton, Feb. 4, 1998

"If Saddam rejects peace and we have to use force, our purpose is clear. We want to seriously diminish the threat posed by Iraq's weapons of mass destruction program."
- President Clinton, Feb. 17, 1998

"Iraq is a long way from [here], but what happens there matters a great deal here. For the risks that the leaders of a rogue state will use nuclear, chemical or biological weapons against us or our allies is the greatest security threat we face."
- Madeline Albright, Feb 18, 1998

"He will use those weapons of mass destruction again, as he has ten times since 1983."
- Sandy Berger, Clinton National Security Adviser, Feb, 18, 1998

"We urge you, after consulting with Congress, and consistent with the U.S. Constitution and laws, to take necessary actions (including, if appropriate, air and missile strikes on suspect Iraqi sites) to respond effectively to the threat posed by Iraq's refusal to end its weapons of mass destruction programs."
- Letter to President Clinton, signed by Sens. Carl Levin (D-MI), Tom Daschle (D-SD), John Kerry ( D - MA), and others Oct. 9, 1998

"Saddam Hussein has been engaged in the development of weapons of mass destruction technology which is a threat to countries in the region and he has made a mockery of the weapons inspection process."
- Rep. Nancy Pelosi (D, CA), Dec. 16, 1998

"Hussein has ... chosen to spend his money on building weapons of mass destruction and palaces for his cronies."
- Madeline Albright, Clinton Secretary of State, Nov. 10, 1999

"There is no doubt that .... Saddam Hussein has invigorated his weapons programs. Reports indicate that biological, chemical and nuclear programs continue apace and may be back to pre-Gulf War status. In addition, Saddam continues to redefine delivery systems and is doubtless using the cover of a licit missile program to develop longer-range missiles that will threaten the United States and our allies."
- Letter to President Bush, Signed by Sen. Bob Graham (D, FL,) and others, December 5, 2001

"We begin with the common belief that Saddam Hussein is a tyrant and threat to the peace and stability of the region. He has ignored the mandate of the United Nations and is building weapons of mass destruction and the means of delivering them."
- Sen. Carl Levin (D, MI), Sept. 19, 2002

"We know that he has stored secret supplies of biological and chemical weapons throughout his country."
- Al Gore, Sept. 23, 2002


"Iraq's search for weapons of mass destruction has proven impossible to deter and we should assume that it will continue for as long as Saddam is in power."
- Al Gore, Sept. 23, 2002

"We have known for many years that Saddam Hussein is seeking and developing weapons of mass destruction."
- Sen. Ted Kennedy (D, MA), Sept. 27, 2002

"The last UN weapons inspectors left Iraq in October of 1998. We are confident that Saddam Hussein retains some stockpiles of chemical and biological weapons, and that he has since embarked on a crash course to build up his chemical and biological warfare capabilities. Intelligence reports indicate that he is seeking nuclear weapons..."
- Sen. Robert Byrd (D, WV), Oct. 3, 2002

"I will be voting to give the President of the United States the authority to use force-- if necessary-- to disarm Saddam Hussein because I believe that a deadly arsenal of weapons of mass destruction in his hands is a real and grave threat to our security."
- Sen. John F. Kerry (D, MA), Oct. 9, 2002

"There is unmistakable evidence that Saddam Hussein is working aggressively to develop nuclear weapons and will likely have nuclear weapons within the next five years ... We also should remember we have always underestimated the progress Saddam has made in development of weapons of mass destruction."
- Sen. Jay Rockefeller (D, WV), Oct 10, 2002

"He has systematically violated, over the course of the past 11 years, every significant UN resolution that has demanded that he disarm and destroy his chemical and biological weapons, and any nuclear capacity. This he has refused to do."
- Rep. Henry Waxman (D, CA), Oct. 10, 2002

"In the four years since the inspectors left, intelligence reports show that Saddam Hussein has worked to rebuild his chemical and biological weapon stock, his missile delivery capability, and his nuclear program. He has also given aid, comfort, and sanctuary to terrorists, including al Qaeda members. It is clear, however, that if left unchecked Saddam Hussein will continue to increase his capacity to wage biological and chemical warfare, and will keep trying to develop nuclear weapons."
- Sen. Hillary Clinton (D, NY), Oct 10, 2002

"We are in possession of what I think to be compelling evidence that Saddam Hussein has, and has had for a number of years, a developing capacity for the production and storage of weapons of mass destruction."
- Sen. Bob Graham (D, FL), Dec. 8, 2002

"Without question, we need to disarm Saddam Hussein. He is a brutal, murderous dictator, leading an oppressive regime ... He presents a particularly grievous threat because he is so consistently prone to miscalculation .. And now he is miscalculating America's response to his continued deceit and his consistent grasp for weapons of mass destruction... So the threat of Saddam Hussein with weapons of mass destruction is real."
- Sen. John F. Kerry (D, MA), Jan. 23. 2003

Why didn't they feel the same way as you Bluejake?

 

[Computron2005]

Wow come on strike hard, hows about you answer my questions?

 

[bluejake01]

So your saying that all the beefed up'd security at the airports is all for show? That it does no good?


Just what I was expecting....

complain.....complain.....complain...

Yet you have no answers....

Go watch Fahrenheit 911 some more....

Michael Moore is almost the same way.....

Yup...the beefed up security is pointless.

BTW...that is a pointless statement. You see, first of all...I hate Michael Moore. Second, I am a Republican. Third of all, I form my own opinions by seeking facts and studying American History.

 

[bluejake01]

What's this?


Why don't these people don't feel the same way as you Bluejake?

Actually they do. You do know that we have been taking action on Iraq for years. Routine missle strikes, bombings and military action when appropriate. That is far less costly than an all out war that in the end will produce similar results.

Oh and as for why they wouldn't feel the same way I do? Well you see, they are Democrats...I am a Republican. ****wit.

 

[strike-hard]

I form my own opinions by seeking facts and studying American History.

Afterall of that studying and seeking facts that you say you do and still no answers......

But when thing we know is that you love to complain.

Good one.

 

[bluejake01]

Afterall of that studying and seeking facts that you say you do and still no answers......

But when thing we know is that you love to complain.

Good one.

Oh how cute...you don't have an intelligent response so you repeat some one liner that you think is verily clever.

 

[Computron2005]

Afterall of that studying and seeking facts that you say you do and still no answers......

But when thing we know is that you love to complain.

Good one.

strike-hard, I guess only you of all people can see the truth, you know what I don't even think America is right. How about just YOU are right? I don't know why we all don't come to our senses and make you president, oh wait why not God?

 

[strike-hard]

Oh how cute...you don't have an intelligent response so you repeat some one liner that you think is verily clever.

Cute huh?

I like it when you complain, it's nice.

You Rag on both sides

you complain.

When asked what should be done.....

You reply..."uhhh....uhhhh....I dunno"

I have laid the facts out for you.

It's up to you to accept the truth.