Superman II Which Superman II is Best?

Which 'Superman II' is Best?

  • Theatrical Cut

  • Donner Cut


Results are only viewable after voting.
the donner cut is much better and having marlon brando be in this version is a big plus the scene between him and chris reeve was such a beautiful scene so acted well by the both of them. it is just that donner's film just had more heart and soul and the scenes of lois trying to proove that clark kent is superman is much more believable in this version. plus the scene of superman destroying the fortress is a amazing scene.
 
There is a THIRD VERSION, the Restored International Cut which you can find if you are very lucky on DVD. It's basically the Lester version but longer, with a lot of added bits for TV, such as Non killing the kid in Huston.
 
Any version which takes all the comedic nonsense out of Superman II is the better one in my book. In the Donner version Non was threatening and not a bumbling moron.

So, Donner version all the way for me.

It's like watching a different film at times.

Although, I do wish the "General, would you care to step outside?" was a good line which should have stayed in. But that was a Lester line...
 
It's a wash as far as I'm concerned. They both share the same big aggravating problems. Which are most especially the handling of Superman's priorities, and Luthor's characterization.

I'd be perfectly happy with Lois finding out Clark is Superman, and them spending the third act of the movie on a romantic getaway at the Fortress of Solitude. My problems are how they executed it.

Obviously, the biggest problemin the film is Superman giving up his powers. Whether to be with Lois or for anything else. It was a desperate, sloppy and unneeded attempt to add tension and drama. The plot would've been just as well served simply with him being away for a day, courting his new girlfriend and showing her all his cool stuff, while on the outside world Zod wreaked havoc. How Lois finds out Clark is SMis another thing I don't like. Whether it's the blanks or un-singed hand, both are equally lame and underwhelming ways for such an important development to be done. I'd prefer him making the choice to tell her. In the scene where he's about to tell her and she's in the other room, the way Reeve transforms from Clark to SM is so cool, that performance should have been utilized better and more prominently. It would have been great if he had her sit down and with calm confidence, straightened his posture, removed his glasses and in his deepened voice told her he's Superman.

With Luthor, I liked the humor in the first film well enough, but in II, they developed him in the opposite direction they should have, making him a complete loser and laughingstock. They should've made him less humorous, more threatening, more embittered and obsessed with getting revenge on Superman.
 
personally,i'd like a combo of both....
combine some of the stuff together....

like have Lester's Paris scenes and Niagra Falls stuff,along with Donner's Fortress scenes with Brando,and Superman sleeping with Lois rather than Clark....have the repowering scene be Donner's version,for sure....

battle of Metropolis and the Fortress be the Donner cut....don't have them kiss in the Arctic,but keep the extended scene at Lois apartment...then the Super-Kiss ending from the Lester version,as well as the diner scene and the flag/White House scene....i feel the actual ending of the film flows better in the Lester cut,believe it or not...i love the Donner cut,but i HATE that he basically erased the whole movie with the reverse Earth spin thing....as silly as a Super-Kiss is,i'd rather see that,and it was an actual superpower of his during the silver age....and the diner scene at the end works SO much better if the previous scene hadn't been,you know,erased from existence!
 
personally,i'd like a combo of both....
combine some of the stuff together....

like have Lester's Paris scenes and Niagra Falls stuff,along with Donner's Fortress scenes with Brando,and Superman sleeping with Lois rather than Clark....have the repowering scene be Donner's version,for sure....

battle of Metropolis and the Fortress be the Donner cut....don't have them kiss in the Arctic,but keep the extended scene at Lois apartment...then the Super-Kiss ending from the Lester version,as well as the diner scene and the flag/White House scene....i feel the actual ending of the film flows better in the Lester cut,believe it or not...i love the Donner cut,but i HATE that he basically erased the whole movie with the reverse Earth spin thing....as silly as a Super-Kiss is,i'd rather see that,and it was an actual superpower of his during the silver age....and the diner scene at the end works SO much better if the previous scene hadn't been,you know,erased from existence!

Agree mostly. In Donner's version, Clark is just beating up on random customers with that diner bully at the end, since he never even touched him before in this reality.
 
Any version which takes all the comedic nonsense out of Superman II is the better one in my book. In the Donner version Non was threatening and not a bumbling moron.

So, Donner version all the way for me.

It's like watching a different film at times.

Although, I do wish the "General, would you care to step outside?" was a good line which should have stayed in. But that was a Lester line...


You hit it on the head! I agree with everything you said, and I too was very disappointed in the fact that the Donner version did not have that "General would you care to step outside" line (that is my Fav part of either version) Especially since almost every other part of Donner's version was better.
 
Donner Cut hands down. But, I'm a HUGE fan of directors cut films anyway. Lucas's "THX1138", Riddley Scotts "Blade Runner." Are at the tops of my list. As are the Donner collection.
 
If Donner had stayed on the project and Superman the Movie had remained exactly as it was with the spinning the world back on its axis, then I wonder if he would've used that same deus ex machina again or whether he would've come up with something different.
 
I doubt it. They used the turning back time scene in the Donner cut because they wanted to make the movie as close to Donner's original intentions as possible, and nobody knows what Donner would have done in place of it, since he was fired not long after they made the decision to put the time travel scene in the first movie. It's just working with what you have.
 
You hit it on the head! I agree with everything you said, and I too was very disappointed in the fact that the Donner version did not have that "General would you care to step outside" line (that is my Fav part of either version) Especially since almost every other part of Donner's version was better.

one of the things that bugged me in the Donner cut was when they changed that excahnge between Zod and Luthor in the Planet :

LL: " What do I get for my troubles? Bow! Yield! Kneel! That kinda stuff opens out of town!"

GZ: " Why do you say this to me,when you know I will kill you for it?! "

now,the actual lines don't change,but i like Zod's reply in the Lester Cut better...the incredulous tone of his voice,that he can't believe a lowly human being is talking to him like this...
 
one of the things that bugged me in the Donner cut was when they changed that excahnge between Zod and Luthor in the Planet :

LL: " What do I get for my troubles? Bow! Yield! Kneel! That kinda stuff opens out of town!"

GZ: " Why do you say this to me,when you know I will kill you for it?! "

now,the actual lines don't change,but i like Zod's reply in the Lester Cut better...the incredulous tone of his voice,that he can't believe a lowly human being is talking to him like this...
I heard that Richard Lester was told to re-film as much scenes as possible of which were already filmed by Donner so he (Lester) could receive a directors credit on the film, from what I've read in numerous articles dating back to the 90's the theatrical cut of Superman II has only about 30% of Donner footage which all include Gene Hackman because he (Hackman) didn't come back to film when Lester came onboard.
 
I heard that Richard Lester was told to re-film as much scenes as possible of which were already filmed by Donner so he (Lester) could receive a directors credit on the film, from what I've read in numerous articles dating back to the 90's the theatrical cut of Superman II has only about 30% of Donner footage which all include Gene Hackman because he (Hackman) didn't come back to film when Lester came onboard.

Aye, I read this too, and they used a body double for some scenes that were re-shot with Luthor, presumably with his face out of shot. I think they may even have used a sound-a-like to overdub some lines as well, not sure if I'm mis-remembering that part though.

I do think that they just chose to use some deleted scenes just to fill the 'donner' cut up with as much unseen material as possible, like that example mikey1974 was talking about, same with the 'Don't you believe in freedom of the press?' line, I mean, who on Earth would think that was a better line than would you care to step outside, even apart from the line just being better because it is more direct and to the point about it being 'ok you three, it's fight time', it's a good hark back to the diner scene.

I was just watching the 'superhero rewind' reviews on youtube, of both the Lester and Donner cuts, and it was one of the few times I just about completely disagreed with the guy. He felt the Donner cut was better, but at the same time, he said that Donner had rushed through all the Brando scenes, and had wanted to re-shoot them.
This makes a lot of sense to me now, as I never really liked the Brando scenes in the Donner cut, despite thoroughly enjoying his turn in SMTM.
I think he looks a bit silly now and again, the floating head, and like an old man in his pyjamas, and is overused to the point of losing his mystique.

I prefer Superman getting his powers back offscreen to the bit with Jor-El giving Clark that big flashing shoulder clasping bit.

I also think all the scenes with the villans, Luthor and the Daily Planet staff plays much better in the Lester cut.

and I miss the Paris rescue and Lois' jump into Niagra Falls...

eh, I have went on about the differences before, and at length, some I am forgetting as well, but even though it has some cheesey humour added, I prefer watching the Lester cut, and I think I might even have preffered it this way, if Donner had shot it the way he wanted in the first place.
Because I don't like how the Lois/Clark secret I.d. ideas played out in the Donner cut, it's pretty much perfect for me the way it plays out in the Lester cut, and that is a huge part of my enjoyment of watching the film.

Ideally, as what happens with these alternate cuts, I'd want to do my own edit, I do prefer seeing the battle at the end without the really daft bits.
But man, the cut of the final battle on the released 'Donner' cut, it's pretty bad the way it plays, again, it's like they just wanted to make it as different as they could from the Lester cut with what was vailable, when what was already in the film *was* the best availiable material. I mean, Donner didn't shoot any scenes of the final battle.
 
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^ yeah I pretty much agree on what you've said.

Lester's cut might be viewed as silly by some purists but that version of the film was my favorite as a kid and brings back fond memories of me and my buddies re-enacting the Metropolis fight at the school playground. :)

Donner's cut is a good film on it's own but it's not the version I'd prefer, watching the lost Brando and Reeve footage is cool but I like it better when it was just considered "lost footage", the Metropolis battle with it's unfinished SFX just looks amateurish and the doubles of Reeve and Kidder are obviously noticeable to fill in the gaps.
 
I don't think there was any actual Donner battle footage added into the movie. It looked like it was either new footage using body doubles or Selutron-esque tricks using footage from other scenes and movies, like the bit where he's laying against the smashed torch. They simply used footage from where he was on the side of a building after being sucker punched there by Non and digitally replaced the building with the torch.
 
I don't think there was any actual Donner battle footage added into the movie. It looked like it was either new footage using body doubles or Selutron-esque tricks using footage from other scenes and movies, like the bit where he's laying against the smashed torch. They simply used footage from where he was on the side of a building after being sucker punched there by Non and digitally replaced the building with the torch.

Aye, but they also re-incorporated some shots that Lester chose not to use, presumably because they did not look as good as the shots that went into the theatrical cut.
eg, the 'Donner' cut adds some flying scenes between Supes and Non(when non is chasing him), that would have sat between the bits we do see in the Lester cut. I know this because there are bits of deleted/extended scenes from SMII on youtube, and one video shows you all that cut flying stuff attached to a version of the Lester cut, and it doesn't look as good as the stuff we got, so they just added it because it was unseen imo, not because it was better.
 
I just realized upon watching the Donner Cut again that aside from the re-used Superman scenes in the recap of STM that Clark Kent doesn't suit up as Supes for a good 40 minutes into the film, if this version had actually made it to theaters in 1981 then the audience might've gotten restless.
 
I just realized upon watching the Donner Cut again that aside from the re-used Superman scenes in the recap of STM that Clark Kent doesn't suit up as Supes for a good 40 minutes into the film, if this version had actually made it to theaters in 1981 then the audience might've gotten restless.

I've noticed that too. In the Leicster cut there's the bomb in Paris so he's Superman much earlier.
 
There should be a 3rd option in this poll if you think they're about the same, or you like some parts of one better than the other, and vice versa.

I think the Paris bomb (not referring to any of Hilton's movies :D ) brings Superman into the story earlier and we get to see him in action.

I'm not too keen on the ending of the Donner cut where Superman spins the world on its axis. Although it was originally meant to be here and not in Superman 1, I didn't even like it in that film. It feels like a deus ex machina.

However, I don't like the Super kiss at the end of the Lester cut either. I'm not too sure how they would get round Lois knowing though. I would personally say let Lois in on the secret. That would get round the need for any roundabout ways to solve that. Also, let the world still suffer the devastation of the Kryptonians without Superman needing to repair it.

My thoughts exactly
 
There is a THIRD VERSION, the Restored International Cut which you can find if you are very lucky on DVD. It's basically the Lester version but longer, with a lot of added bits for TV, such as Non killing the kid in Huston.

It was the evil chick that killed the kid.
 
It was definitely Non. He used the police light he ripped off of the squad car. You might be getting mixed up because when one of the townspeople says "He was only a boy", Ursa finishes her sentence with "who will never become a man."
 
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Going back to the Donner Cut once Superman has turned back the Earth over basically reversing everything done by the Phantom Zone villians and putting them back into the phantom zone.

But how is it that the bully at the diner remembers Clark, I mean why would Clark want to confront him again? just to teach him a lesson?
 
I looked up the Donner version again and I wouldn't say it was the better version. I thought some of the scenes were better. Like the scene with Lois jumping out of the Daily Planet window and Clark 'swooshing' down to the street through the Bullpen, sheets of paper and everything flying around, I really liked that. But also the scene where Clark and Lois have the conversation in the hotel where Lois shoots him with blank. Those two scenes, to me, should've been included in the second movie, rather than the lame scenes with the fire and where Lois jumps in the river...
 
Going back to the Donner Cut once Superman has turned back the Earth over basically reversing everything done by the Phantom Zone villians and putting them back into the phantom zone.

But how is it that the bully at the diner remembers Clark, I mean why would Clark want to confront him again? just to teach him a lesson?

In the Donner version, Superman is basically a bully at the end. He goads the man into taking a swipe at him, and then beats him up. However, he might have just been an innocent customer minding his own business and trying to get some lunch. Who is to say he had any of those bullyish qualities in this reality?
 
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