The Flash Who is the Man in the Iron Mask?

[Lilbaz]

You 'admit' you were wrong about Zoom being from E2 (even though there's no actual confirmation he's not) but now, yet again you're 100% right and everyone must 'stop their nonsense'?

I've considered the 'E2 Jay Garrick' to be the hero we know from the comics. And I don't believe they've just killed that character.

Agree. Think we'll see barry and jay team up to take down zoom in the final episode. 3 way speedster battle could be epic.

 

[mr. peasant]

Sooooo.... the man in the Iron Mask is Jay.

this strongly suggests the person we've seen as Jay, all along, is someone else ( I know, you're all thinking, well, duh !).

Could be Zoom, posing as Jay to keep tabs on Barry and co, and also assist with the development of Velocity-9, which will increase his speed.

I'm kind of annoyed about the whole "Jay isn't who you think he is" plotline because well, we did that last season - you know, the "guy who looks like he's helping really isn't " storyline that worked so well in season 1.

There's no need to do that in season 2.

Really, they should have just left Jay as Jay.

Although i suppose it is possible that the Jay they met, and was in the first few episodes (before he buggered off) really was Jay. After he left Zoom captured him and chucked him in the prison - from that point on Jay was actually Zoom.

Actually I don't care, to be honest it feels like a totally redundant plotline in a season that's been pretty good so far.

Bummer.

I dunno. I'm still more inclined to believe that Zoom is actually Evil Future Jay; with Jay turning into Zoom in the future through some fall from grace. And that the reason why Zoom said it complicated things is because he just wounded his past self. In other words, both Jay and Zoom are the "real" Jay - just from different points in time.

 

[gdw]

Can't believe I didn't think of this til just now, but what if it's Ronnie?

I've always assumed E1 Ronnie was "alive" somewhere, in one of the universes, or stuck in a rift in between, but never thought about Zoom having him.

Might still make sense that he would have been masked the whole time, as Zoom was working with E2 Ronnie, and it's certainly possible Jessie might have recognized him from E2 Deathstorm.

I like the idea of him being the "real" Jay, but there's a LOT of questions/paradoxes that seems to present, assuming real Jay looks like the "Jay" we saw killed, and the "Jay" under Zoom's mask.

We already know there are 2, which makes sense, one from each of the main Earths; "Jay", and "Hunter".
Real Jay being under the mask introduces a third doppelganger.

Now, I've read some theories suggesting Zoom is Jay gone bad from the future, so time travel would explain the presence of 3 "Jays", but I imagine that means some complicated switching in and out with his accomplice, the powerless E1 "Hunter".

It also raises a lot of questions regarding Jay's speed, or lack thereof, vs Zoom's faster than Barry speed, especially with regards to Kaitlin's testing of his cells. Exactly who's cells was she testing?

Now, if I recall correctly, in the comic's, Zolomon's powers were actually time based, only mimicking speed. That could explain a lot, and maybe even why the seemingly more powerful Zoom want's Barry's speed; so that he can have actual access to the speed force, and not just mimicking it.

Honestly, as much as I'm happy every time they draw directly from the books, more time stuff, travel or manipulation, at this point would feel too repetitive.
Not to mention, they just did a villain who appeared to move super fast by time manipulation/slowing everyone around him, with the Turtle.
Wouldn't be exactly the same, but might feel to similar none the less.

Any who, long detour but back to Ronnie. Thoughts? I don't think it would be as "layered" a revelation, with extended implications, and completely changing the context of the things we've seen, like with Zoom's unmasking, or even Reverse Flash last season, but it would make "sense."

 

[Silliminite]

Then where is E-1 Jay Garrick? Dead-Jay couldn't find him and that ultimately led him to Zolomon.

E-1 Jay goes/went by a different name.....Eddie Thawne.

 

[gdw]

I dunno. I'm still more inclined to believe that Zoom is actually Evil Future Jay; with Jay turning into Zoom in the future through some fall from grace. And that the reason why Zoom said it complicated things is because he just wounded his past self. In other words, both Jay and Zoom are the "real" Jay - just from different points in time.

I've heard mention of this, and it being a nod to fan theories from season one where some speculated RF was evil Barry from the future, and apparently this itself was a nod from/drawn from the books.

A bit puzzled by that myself. Why did an evil future Barry happen? Or did it not?

 

[mr. peasant]

I've heard mention of this, and it being a nod to fan theories from season one where some speculated RF was evil Barry from the future, and apparently this itself was a nod from/drawn from the books.

A bit puzzled by that myself. Why did an evil future Barry happen? Or did it not?

Not sure about those old theories about Evil Barry. But with respect to the Jay is Zoom theory, my main piece of evidence prior to Episode 15's reveal had been the reveal that Jay Garrick's Earth-1 counterpart was Hunter Zolomon (comic Zoom's civilian name); which I thought was some pretty heavy-handed foreshadowing seeing as it literally said "Jay Garrick = Hunter Zolomon/Zoom".

Meanwhile, there hasn't been any foreshadowing/indication that Jay has been up to anything sketchy; which would make his reveal as a double out of the blue and random, on top of a retread of last season's villain.

 

[edwardc]

I too believe the masked man is Eddie. If you look back at the previous ep, they deliberately showed the msked man's blonde hair. Maybe when Eddie was pulled through the hole at the end of last season, he survived by way of Earth 2's advanced medical technology, had been living there a while, formed a relationship with Jay (hence why he's asking for him) and Zoom went after him because of it.

That does make good sense he is one of the few cast members that hasn't been
doppelgangered yet.

 

[jrmtz543]

Can't believe I didn't think of this til just now, but what if it's Ronnie?

I've always assumed E1 Ronnie was "alive" somewhere, in one of the universes, or stuck in a rift in between, but never thought about Zoom having him.

"

I think, in the first ep this season, it was indicated Ronnie fell to his death after separating from Stein. Barry only caught Stein, and Ronnie wasn't drawn into the singularity.

 

[Dark Raven]

I think, in the first ep this season, it was indicated Ronnie fell to his death after separating from Stein. Barry only caught Stein, and Ronnie wasn't drawn into the singularity.

I thought they just said that there was no trace of Ronnie. Maybe they assumed he fell to his death, but it wasn't conclusive. He just seemed to disappear. If he were drawn into the singularity, that would explain why he was nowhere to be found.

 

[SuperBatman]

I think, in the first ep this season, it was indicated Ronnie fell to his death after separating from Stein. Barry only caught Stein, and Ronnie wasn't drawn into the singularity.

No It was said that Ronnie fell into the worm hole. So I still think he's alive somewhere I wouldn't be surprised if the man in the iron mask was Ronnie. However I don't think Ronnie is blonde.

 

[TheBat812]

It seems faily obvious the man in the mask is another Jay, right? I mean I'm like 80% on that.

 

[jrmtz543]

No It was said that Ronnie fell into the worm hole. So I still think he's alive somewhere I wouldn't be surprised if the man in the iron mask was Ronnie. However I don't think Ronnie is blonde.

I don't think they ever said Ronnie was drawn into the singularity; in fact, I re-watched the scene, and they actually don't clarify if he fell (which I believe because Stein fell) or if he was killed by the explosion that occurred when he separated from Stein.

If he had been pulled into the singularity, the team could assume he was alive once they learned of the existence of Earth 2. They clearly do not believe this to be the case. Of course, they could always retcon.

 

[zenith16]

I thought they just said that there was no trace of Ronnie. Maybe they assumed he fell to his death, but it wasn't conclusive. He just seemed to disappear. If he were drawn into the singularity, that would explain why he was nowhere to be found.

well Garber said Robbie might also be showing up in legends of tomorrow as WELL. to have a reunion with stein. this was posted some time ago, so.. here. it was CBR and I'm not sure when they claim it was a hint

post: #81

paqe 4 thread: The Flash Season 2 Episode 9: "Running to Stand Still"

Cons:
-I'm so sick of Jay... Either give him his powers back or get rid of him. What does he even do all day? You would think he'd be trying to get his speed back but he doesn't. He's really just a wet blanket for the team. I wish they would have made him a little more BA. He's kind of a wimp and hasn't played an important role for a while.
-Jay and Caitlyn's relationship seems so forced. I know it's been a while since she lost Ronnie but I don't think she'd be throwing herself at him. Hopefully this will somehow tie in to her becoming Killer Frost.
-Zoom, he's the stuff made of nightmares, but don't give him the exact same goal as RF. Come on...
-Really, there was no cliffhanger or anything we didn't all see coming. I think they should have at least hinted to who Zoom was. Given us a vague clue or something.


All in all not a terrible episode but not midseason finale worthy IMO

well I think it's a set up for this below. or it will be eventually.

BTW it wasn't terrible episode to me. it was ok.


Comic Book Resources

15 hrs ·






Victor Garber and Robbie Amell hint at Firestorm reunion on "Legends of Tomorrow"; "S.H.I.E.L.D." stars Clark Gregg and Brett Dalton weigh in on last night's big change and more.




COMIC REEL: Former Firestorm Partners Garber And Amell Reunite; Gregg Reacts To "SHIELD" Surprise
Victor Garber and Robbie Amell hint at Firestorm reunion on "Legends of Tomorrow"; "S.H.I.E.L.D." stars weigh in on last night's big change and more.
COMIC BOOK RESOURCES


I put this in the general threads for LOT and the flash. it's likely for tension reason's though amell said he'd return and garber said he'll be around on video. after posting this last night I came up





with this joke cause we know the writers are gonna want to keep Jay around for love triangle none sense and may be make them fist fight. etc.

here's what I'd rather see after Ronnie comes back cause rather see him avoid all the usual none sesne that have certain parts of the fan base hate any of the three.

Ronnie comes back see's Caitlyne has moved on head up to her talks with her and say it's ok he's happy she moved on and then leaves town cause well this has happen twice and the second time was on theur wedding day and honey moon. and she with jay now cause the writers are pushing for this hard core . so he's a free man. he tell's her he'll head to san demico or Deminicon republic as we English call it and have the paper's about their marriage taken care of. in they were never married at all.

And he leaves star labs saying he's headed to Cancoon to find his own happiness, with his fist pumped in the air in freez frame caption with Cisco doing the same at the star Labs door saying right on Brotha.

 

[Dark Raven]

What if the man in the iron mask is E1 Barry Allen? It could be like in season 1, how he was there in the past to save young Barry when Nora was killed. Maybe this is Barry from the future (eg the end of Season 2) where he goes back to Earth 2 and is captured and put in an iron mask. Or he goes back before Jesse was captured to try to put things right, but he himself is captured, which explains how he was there before her.

And so in "Escape from Earth 2", maybe Barry encountered himself from a later timeline. He was warning himself and knows Zoom is Jay and not to trust him, because of everything else that has happened throughout the season.

 

[Golgo-13]

What if the man in the iron mask is E1 Barry Allen? It could be like in season 1, how he was there in the past to save young Barry when Nora was killed. Maybe this is Barry from the future (eg the end of Season 2) where he goes back to Earth 2 and is captured and put in an iron mask. Or he goes back before Jesse was captured to try to put things right, but he himself is captured, which explains how he was there before her.

And so in "Escape from Earth 2", maybe Barry encountered himself from a later timeline. He was warning himself and knows Zoom is Jay and not to trust him, because of everything else that has happened throughout the season.

I like this theory also. It could also explain why he coded the word Jay on the glass.

 

[jrmtz543]

Ronnie showing up in legends doesn't mean he's survived the singularity . They're traveling in time so they could be in the past or they could take him out of time before his death.

 

[Man of Steel]

What if he's not Jay at all? Maybe he's a JSA character.

 

[Dark Raven]

They're not going to suddenly pull someone out of nowhere like the Golden Age Green Lantern, for example.

 

[Dark Raven]

What if the reason the Flash goes missing in the future is because he's held by Zoom as the man in the iron mask on earth 2 in the past?

 

[Hotwire]

I'm thinking...
Zoom is E1 Hunter Zolloman.
Man in the mask is E2 Jay Garrick.
Dead Jay was a clone.

 

[iamjoeking]

It seems faily obvious the man in the mask is another Jay, right? I mean I'm like 80% on that.

Yeah it's obvious the man in the mask was always going to be the twin of whoever Zoom ended up being. So yes, it's Teddy Sears. Only question is if it's Jay Garrick or not, which I'm guessing it is.

 

[mr. peasant]

Yeah it's obvious the man in the mask was always going to be the twin of whoever Zoom ended up being. So yes, it's Teddy Sears. Only question is if it's Jay Garrick or not, which I'm guessing it is.

I agree that the actor playing MitIM is Teddy Sears. However, I disagree that it is necessarily - or even likely - a twin sibling; the main reason being the complete lack of build-up or foreshadowing of such a person existing. Meanwhile, there are frequent references and past precedence to allow doppelgangers from other universes and time travel hijinks as explanation.

 

[TheBat812]

I agree that the actor playing MitIM is Teddy Sears. However, I disagree that it is necessarily - or even likely - a twin sibling; the main reason being the complete lack of build-up or foreshadowing of such a person existing. Meanwhile, there are frequent references and past precedence to allow doppelgangers from other universes and time travel hijinks as explanation.

Ya, at this point, there are multiple possibilities as to the actual character he's playing, but I would say the odds are very very high that it's Teddy Sears under that mask.

Although he probably should've just traced an entire message on the glass instead of utilizing a borderline unknown code that apparently takes forever, haha.

 

[caldwell]

I thought that Earth 1 Jay was already found in the park on the bench?
What if the man in the iron mask was trying to tell Barry that Zoom was Jay. He wasn't getting upset cause Jay was safe or him not even being with barry. Iron mask was just upset cause they still wasn't understanding his warning.

 

[Golgo-13]

I'm thinking...
Zoom is E1 Hunter Zolloman.
Man in the mask is E2 Jay Garrick.
Dead Jay was a clone.

Where are all the clone theories coming from? It's so out of left field.