Who is to blame if this film doesn't do well?

[Odin's Lapdog]

Alright, let's look generally at this from a hypothetical point of view

1. the film has changed, they are providing a better looking hulk in most people's eyes

2. They fix up the cgi movements

3. They include abomination, his greatest foe

4. There's a 26 minute fight scene

5. It has elements from the old series

6. They have cameos from stark/fury tying in other marvel films

7. Less intense drama, more action

So they have all these things now put in pretty much as a request from fans based on the reaction from the last film.

So the film fails to make an impression on the box office, who is to blame?

 

[Sava]

Alright, let's look generally at this from a hypothetical point of view

1. the film has changed, they are providing a better looking hulk in most people's eyes

2. They fix up the cgi movements

3. They include abomination, his greatest foe

4. There's a 26 minute fight scene

5. It has elements from the old series

6. They have cameos from stark/fury tying in other marvel films

7. Less intense drama, more action

So they have all these things now put in pretty much as a request from fans based on the reaction from the last film.

So the film fails to make an impression on the box office, who is to blame?

i'm sure they'll find a way to blame Ang.


It will be Marvel's fault for not starting marketing earlier, but, they couldnt do that cause they started shooting AFTER Iron Man finished shooting, so they have less time for CGI stuff than IM ...which one needs more time for CGI?... anywho, It'll be Marvel's fault for not taking their time.

 

[Dangerous]

If the film does not do well enough, I guess the hype machine starting up so late in the day could be noted as a significant factor.

 

[dark_b]

i think some people here will blame the fans. like we were to negative.

 

[S_H_F_4839]

i'm sure they'll find a way to blame Ang.


It will be Marvel's fault for not starting marketing earlier, but, they couldnt do that cause they started shooting AFTER Iron Man finished shooting, so they have less time for CGI stuff than IM ...which one needs more time for CGI?... anywho, It'll be Marvel's fault for not taking their time.

agreed.

 

[Nivek]

i think some people here will blame the fans. like we were to negative.

Yes, I know I will blame ignorant, judgmental idiot "fans" the most. The people who complained about Ang's movie like it was some heady art house P.O.S., and wanted more "Hulk Smash" without any kind of substance to it.

As well as Universal/Marvel marketing, they are not marketing this film the way the should, especially considering all the Hype directed at Iron Man.

But nothing has failed. So I hate people who start these treads anticipating fan disappointment and it being a box office bomb.

 

[Odin's Lapdog]

Well the nothing has failed aspect may be a little bit misleading.

The trailers have taken their time to come out and they haven't made the same impression with respect to other projects at this time like the dark knight and iron man who are gathering the majority of the hype (for good and bad reasons)

I'm not saying this film will or won't fail, i'm just making a hypothetical assumption

 

[HULKFish]

This thread makes no sense... Neither do your comments. The Dark Knight and IM are coming out BEFORE TIH, that's why there has been so much come out. Give it a month and revisit this thread.

 

[ultimatefan]

Ang Lee. Kidding! Who knows, so many things can determine a movie´s success or not. If the movie´s great, even if it´s not the license to print money every studio wants its summer tentpoles to be, it will find an audience, it needs to make enough to warrant a sequel, and not one that takes five years in the making.

 

[Odin's Lapdog]

This thread makes no sense... Neither do your comments. The Dark Knight and IM are coming out BEFORE TIH, that's why there has been so much come out. Give it a month and revisit this thread.

I wasn't talking about the quantity, I talking about the general reaction from all their marketing campaign at the same relevant point.

Sure this is called a teaser trailer but it's 2 minutes long so i'm comparing it to the response of both the dark knight's and iron man's first theatrical trailers.

besides, coming back in a month doesn't change the hypothetical question addressed in the initial post so.....meh....

 

[Doc Samson]

I know i would be blaming the fans wholeheartedly, just like you said almost everything in this new movie is some result of what people supposedly didnt like about the previous one, so there shouldnt be any excuse for them not to go see it right? This is what you all have been crying for, so you all had better damn well enjoy it and love it and see it multiple times and make it break box office records worldwide but lets be realistic about a few things here....

Regardless of the movie's quality, theres no way it can compete with a Batman movie, especially if its as good as it looks to be. Iron Man is brand new, and thus, will get a bunch of casual fans in addition to hardcore fanboys just off the "cool" factor of a dude in a Iron suit that can pretty much do anything. Add to that the late marketing, and I don't see this movie doing spiderman numbers if thats what you consider successful, but if its well done, and has enough for the kids to get into, it will be good enough, and to me, as long as it recoups the budget and has a little life after that, it wont be a failure. On the other hand if some of you guys think its going to dominate the summer, Im not so sure about all that.....

 

[dark_b]

its funny. even if there is everything a fan wants that doesnt mean that the GP will like it.
so even if every fan likes it this movie could still bomb.

 

[Finlandman]

Absolutely 26 minute fight. It's insane and impossible. No one wants to watch fight that long. Imagine whole Simpsons episode, where Homer just fights with Bart.

 

[SuperFerret]

It all depends on why the movie was bad, if it is at all.

 

[Knightsaber Priss]

We should all blame it on WMD just because....

 

[ArtTeacher]

Who is to blame if this movie doesn't do well?


The starter of this thread.


Just kidding.


I blame Batman.


Again, just kidding.


Well, let's see...who will get the blame? Probably the same people that have gotten the blame for everything else so far....



...Emerald Beast and Advanced Dark.


Honestly, who should get the blame is probably different than who will.

Let's see....
When the very FANS of the character/comics/genre are the ones relentlessly ripping on it, why would any casual fans or general public go see it?

If I knew nothing about Frankenstein but wanted to watch a good Frankenstein movie, and I overheard all these experts and life-long fans talking about how the original Boris Karloff movie sucked and Andy Warhol's was the way to go, I'd probably avoid the Karloff movie and try to find the Warhol version.

 

[M.E.H.Z.E.B]

There's a Marketing discussion thread:

http://forums.superherohype.com/showthread.php?t=294498

There's also a Hype an general buzz discussion thread:

http://forums.superherohype.com/showthread.php?t=296944

Now, this thread is pure speculation about a movie which only has one trailer, and "hypothetically" assumes that it will fail. Yes, I know that times are slow, and we need something to talk about, but this does not warrant a thread of it's own. If we let this run, then we might as well have threads like:

"Who is to thank if this movie is a success?"

"What if this movie breaks all B.O records?"

So...

 

[M.E.H.Z.E.B]

For more hypothetical threads, visit here:

http://forums.superherohype.com/showthread.php?t=298562

 

[He-Man]

i'm sure they'll find a way to blame Ang.


It will be Marvel's fault for not starting marketing earlier, but, they couldnt do that cause they started shooting AFTER Iron Man finished shooting, so they have less time for CGI stuff than IM ...which one needs more time for CGI?... anywho, It'll be Marvel's fault for not taking their time.

Agree. They'll say people were still turned off by the last Hulk movie but in the end it will be Marvel's fault.

 

[Odin's Lapdog]

For more hypothetical threads, visit here:

http://forums.superherohype.com/showthread.php?t=298562

hmm, alright, why don't you merge these two threads together and then have points of views coming in from both sides so it doesn't seem like there is a negative bias here

or allow me to change my opening post and then erase the other one.

I think making an anti thread is a lil bit immature, if you wish to have both sides of the coin expressed in a thread conversation, why not simply ask for me to do so?

 

[thegameq]

If this movie fails it will be because of the usual suspects:

1. Execution: The bane of comicbook films. Either the vision (direction) or story (or both) will falter. Norton will supply the meat and potatoes to LL's action, or so we hope. Fans and the GA no doubt want more "Hulk smash!", but at what cost to the rest of the film. Also, how well will the comicbook and TV show angle blend. It sounds good on paper, but will the two really blend as a whole or stick out like to separate ideology's?

2. Hulk 03: The film wasn't terrible, but it didn't have mass appeal or live up to expectations. If the GA thinks this film is a sequel to Ang's film, that will definitley hurt it. How forgiving of Hulk 03 will the GA be? Are they ready for another go-round? Do they even want another go-round? which leads to.....

3. Marketing: A lot has been said of this one already. Both sides have made very valid arguments. But considering what's at stake and the stigmatism this film has to overcome......? Then comes the obvious comparison to the major marketing other tentpole films have received and TIH's marketing looks tame if not outright weak.


It's been said time and time again on these boards and no doubt others. If Marvel can't get their own characters right on film, they will have no one to blame but themselves this time.

 

[ArtTeacher]

Great post, 'Game.

Friends, fear not.

The main things are the plain things and the plain things are the main things.

(“Oh, Lawd, Martha, ArtTeacher’s on one of his long monologues again…get a pillow!&#8221

The ArtTeacher Manifesto in Three Parts:
(Brought to you in Technicolor courtesy of Hulk5150)

Part I:

There’s no need to stress.
It only seems that everyone’s being negative about it.
In reality, you’ve got a handful of negative, moody, pent-up fanboys that want so desperately for The Dark Knight to beat Spider-Man numbers that they’ll badmouth anything that gets in its way.*

As a result, people that haven’t seen the trailer are talking about how fake it looks.
In addition, people that ripped Ang Lee’s Hulk are now praising it as the definitive Hulk while saying the 2008 Hulk just plain sucks.
Guys that absolutely RIPPED on people that made snap judgments on “unfinished” CGI from the Superbowl trailer of 2003 are now ripping the 2008 trailer, even though the director himself went on record as saying that the CGI is not complete.
And I absolutely love the people that can’t be bothered to watch the trailer in HD and have only seen it on a fuzzy YouTube video and say that the Hulk doesn’t look as clear and crisp as he should.
(Obviously, I’m not saying this is everyone that ever had a bad thing to say about the trailer)

But, like I said, focus on the big picture and the main things: If you had never had sex (with another person) outside of your imagination, you might be a little testy, too.

I keed, I keed.

…Probably.

Part II:

Now, if you talk to people that DON’T have an agenda, you might start to see a different trend:
Several of my friends have no problem endlessly ripping on me for “making” them watch Ang Lee’s Hulk. When they heard Marvel was going to make another, the ribbing started. But I have to tell ya, they’ve all had to eat a bit of crow; they’ve all said, “You know, ArtTeacher, I gotta say, it looks pretty good…which sucks because I really wanted 5 more years of jacking with you.”

After watching the debut on MTV, the girl I’m dating right now (who has NO comic book knowledge…other than seeing my classroom) said, “The Hulk looks the way he’s supposed to look…like the Hulk.”

The funny thing is…not one person ripped the CGI. But that’s all you hear around here and a seemingly endless list of other sites occupied by young people that sound like cantankerous curmudgeons.

Joe Sixpack isn’t watching the trailer frame by frame and counting the striations on Hulk’s left deltoid and comparing that to the right one. Honestly, Joe Sixpack wants to be entertained…and he (and his live-in ex-wife’s girlfriend) will gather up the kids, pack them in the Winnebago and head off to whichever movie looks like it will babysit them for a couple hours.

To me, the trailer says, “This isn’t the old movie; it’s going to be good this time!”
Good or bad, right or wrong, true or false, the public’s general association with Ang Lee’s Hulk is, “It wasn’t good,” even if they have never seen the movie (bad word of mouth has stuck in the population’s memory).

Part III

I have no problem with the marketing. Yes, we had to wait a really long time. But I’ve always been the type of guy that would rather have it done well than done quickly. Sure, I felt like I was going to absolutely burst waiting for a pic, an action figure, a trailer, or any little tidbit. But, with the heaviest genre-filled summer in history, I didn’t mind Marvel being sly little devils and waiting until the air from the tires of TDK, Iron Man, etc. deflate a bit.

Now, the success of a plan like that hinges on the quality of the product…or at least the perceived quality of the product. Could the trailer have had more of a “WOW” factor? Sure. But what trailer couldn’t? The trailer showed that the Hulk will layeth the smacketh down. And, really, isn’t this what we’re paying our $9 to see? Yes, yes, of course we want a great story, strong performances, dazzling special effects, etc.…but if the Hulk isn’t…smashing…do we really care?

Now that the wait is over, there really is no excuse to not bombard us with Hulk. I am okay with the marketing being skimpy up front as long as they pull a Sir Mix-A-Lot (and stuff the back end).
April (and especially May) should be Hulk Month. I should see the Hulk everywhere. I should hear “The Incredible Hulk” more than I hear my own name. I shouldn’t be able to buy a gallon of milk without running into 5 people talking about the new Hulk movie.

All in all, I was pleased. Is there room for improvement? Surely. Will we get it? That remains to be seen. Did you read that? It remains to be seen. Which means even the craftiest fanboys with their inside scoops and crystal balls can’t say for sure, yet. So, why get panties in a bunch?

It’s good that Marvel may hear that not everyone laid down like a sacrificial lamb and blindly praised the trailer…but at this point, is there that much they can do to change it? I’m asking because I don’t know. I mean, filming is done. Sure, there are a lot of things you can do in an editing room…but there IS only so much you can do in an editing room, you know?

I want so badly for this movie to be astounding, astonishing, and amazing. I want it to make gobs of money.
But let’s face it; no matter how the movie does, it’s probably not going to be regarded as the new Godfather…nor should it try or pretend to be...
...nor should the fans expect it to be.

Guys, everything is not perfect.
If it were, this wouldn't be called Earth, it would be called Heaven.
So, quit comparing everything to perfection.
Doing that can only result in disappointment.
That doesn't mean you should expect mediocre product; but you probably wouldn't want your boss, friends, etc. demanding absolute perfection from you every day, either.

The plain things are the main things, indeed.




*By the way, I’ll eat a dead dog’s penis if The Dark Knight does Spider-Man numbers.

 

[Odin's Lapdog]

that post really has no place here

 

[ArtTeacher]

Do you have something against posts of color?
(Just kidding)

Sorry.

Mods--axe away if you deem it necessary.

I guess the post was a response to the general tone of worry, stress, and alarm that many are exhibiting, instead of who, in particular, to blame if the movie doesn't do well (especially since I already did that in my first post in this thread).

Instead of starting yet another thread ("The Official Alarmist Thread: Reponses to the General Tone of Worry, Stress, and Anxiety that Two Minutes and Eight Seconds Caused You"), I put it here.

 

[Odin's Lapdog]

put it in the trailer reaction thread. I'm not saying it's a bad post, it's just side tracking.