You know the rules. Just report those moments in comic books that really bug you. I'll chime in once and a while with an update. And for courtesy's sake, for events up to a year ago, put them in SPOILER tags and give the name of the mag you're reporting. So, if something in Ultimate Spider-Man 62 pissed you off, do this.
Ultimate Spider-Man 62
Something that pisses you off
"We have to save Galactus!", Fantastic Four 243 (1982)
John Bryne. No other name inspires quite as much debate as his. We can all acknowledge that at some point he Had It. It let him create one of the most memorable runs on the Fantastic Four since the days of Lee/Kirby, one that was not eclipsed until Mark Waid, with his 'Imaginauts', came along. However, projects like Chapter One and his work with Spider-Man 'luminaries' such as Howard Mackie, Bob Harras, and Ralph Macchio have led us to believe he's Lost It, whatever It may be. Perhaps one day he shall find It again. A good start would be to go back to his early stories and see what worked there, what made him such a beloved icon. However, one story he should definitely skip in searching for the key to his popularity would be this one, FF 243.
Everyone knows about Galactus. Big guy, wears a really cool helmet, gets along by eating planets. He first appeared in Fantastic Four 48. His herald (more like scout) Silver Surfer appeared and basically told the Earthlings to get out, this was about to become a buffet. Upon learning the planet was inhabited, Galactus basically said he was going to eat it anyway because he was so much better then us (don't you hate when superior beings do that? As Marge Simpson said, "Do they really have to rub it in like that?"). Well, he was beaten back despite overwhelming odds and returned to menace the planet several times, although as of yet, he hasn't succeeded (although with the sheer number of homicides occuring throughout the Avengers titles, you'd be hardpressed to tell the difference. Ooh, I made a funny!)
Well, Terrax, one of Galactus' meaner Heralds, got fed up of working for the Big G and basically abandoned him far from any worlds appropriate for him to feast on. He then led the enraged Galactus on a merry chase, further exhausting Conehead's energy, until Terrax decided to make his last stand on the planet whose inhabitants (i.e., the FF) had caused his enslavement to Galactus. Surrounding Manhattan in a force bubble, he lifted the whole thing up into outer space (one of his powers being a mastery over earth and stone).
He then gave the order for Reed, Ben, and Johnny to murderize Galactus, the alternative being the use of the primo New York real estate in his position to... well, the words 'ramming speed!' come to mind.
Things started going south. Onboard Galactus' ship, Thing observed "...if you ask me [Galactus is] a much nicer guy than Terrax! Seems like we're on the wrong side in this one."
UH-OH! Frankly, I don't care if Galactus is Gandhi, Mother Theresa, and Tom Hanks all rolled into one. HE EATS PLANETS! He's been the sole cause of genocide after genocide after genocide. His very existence precipitates the deaths of billions time and time again.
Well, Galactus and Terrax threw down, ending with Terrax being reduced back to mortal status... to the left of the top of the World Trade Center (ouch). Galactus, however, still needed to binge and so started the whole "I'm going to build a doomsday machine to eat your world" process (and no, said doomsday machine did not look like a fork, knife, and spoon).
With a little help from the Thor, Iron Man, Captain America, the Wasp, and Dr. Strange (his contribution being, ironically enough, a spell that forced Galactus to face his trillions of victims), the FF bested Galactus. Reed observed that Galactus "is only moments from death." Johnny, demonstrating wisdom (or maybe just common sense) beyond his years, observed "I hate to sound hard-hearted (cold-hearted being a physical impossibility for the youth), but that WILL solve everything, won't it?"
Reed, from his metaphorical ivory tower, said "No, Johnny, it won't. And if you'll think for a moment you'll realize our problems have only begun!"
"I know what you're going to say, Reed, and I concur," said the Sentinel of Liberty, who had fought Hitler. Adolf, by the way, compared to Galactus is like a firecracker compared to a Gamma Bomb. "Galactus may be the greatest menace we've ever faced, but he is also a living being."
"We have no choice," Reed continued to moralize. "We have to save Galactus!"
That thud you heard was my jaw hitting the floor. I admit, they lost me somewhere around the "Galactus is a living being = we must save Galactus" equation. Perhaps Bryne was trying to say something about the sanctity of life, but GALACTUS! He is not going to repent, change his ways, and Sin No More. He's a virus, a parasite upon the galaxy!
What's worse is that Daredevil and Spider-Man were watching from the wings. You're telling me none of these guys were going to go down there and inject some simple common sense into the equation? Picture Elektra or Gwen Stacy dying a million, no, a billion times over. It doesn't matter if Galactus FEELS SORRY about what he does. The only, ONLY, logical conclusion is to do for the old dog what the old dog cannot do for himself and put him out of his misery (and I do mean MISERY. "If Galactus had but the tears to cry for those whose lives he had wrought, the stars would drown..." and so on and so on).
But no. They fixed Galactus up, changed his oil, even gave him a new Herald (in this case, Johnny's girlfriend, Frankie Raye. Who, when told her job involved selecting planets and their inhabitants for possible extinction, remarked that she's 'only' be killing "bug-eyed monsters". You sure know how to pick 'em, Johnny!). And so Galactus walked into the sunset, ready to devour some other world. But hey, as long as Reed doesn't have to hear from them, he can sleep at night. This is one of those moments where the only response can be to bang your head against something and say "Stupid stupid STUPID!" like a mantra against evil. And that, more then anything else, makes it a fitting kick-off for Worst Moments in Comic Books.
1. A person noted for feats of courage or nobility of purpose, especially one who has risked or sacrificed his or her life: soldiers and nurses who were heroes in an unpopular war.
her·o·ine
n.
1. A woman noted for courage and daring action.
2. A woman noted for special achievement in a particular field.
3. The principal female character in a novel, poem, or dramatic presentation.
4. According to Kevin Smith...
Uhh, Kev... maybe you could try writing a female hero who HASN'T been raped. Just a thought.
Oh, that's just a bit of writerly ass-covering after the fact. No one was saying "We have to save Galactus because he has a special connection with the galaxy!"
Okay. I just want to say that I'm glad they killed him. NOT because I hated Hawkeye. Far from it. I loved it when he originally joined the Avengers and got into fistfights with cap all the time. Great character.
BUT I'm glad because the world of comics needs to change every once in a while. People need to die (and stay freaking dead). This stuff happens. Bad things make the world of comics more interesting and opens more story possibilities. And besides Hawkeye's still alive in our hearts right?
Oh, that's just a bit of writerly ass-covering after the fact. No one was saying "We have to save Galactus because he has a special connection with the galaxy!"
Considering the only reason that nonsense came into existence is because they needed an excuse for Reed not killing the big jerk, in a sense Reed is responsible for letting a planet murderer go free and inextricably tying him to the well-being of creation, making Reed retroactively to blame for all of Galactus' former acts of Gaiacide.
... Look the coffee this morning was really strong, okay?
Agreed, so Bryne shouldn't have put him into a situation where he had to continue as a character by having a multitude of superheroes suddenly go out-of-character. I mean, imagine Osama Bin Laden is having a heart attack and a platoon of nearby Marines were to patch him up, hand him some new box cutters, and send him on his merry way.
Pretty good, eh? Came up with that one all by myself.
...Nah, I'm probably stealing it from somewhere.
Zev said:
Agreed, so Bryne shouldn't have put him into a situation where he had to continue as a character by having a multitude of superheroes suddenly go out-of-character. I mean, imagine Osama Bin Laden is having a heart attack and a platoon of nearby Marines were to patch him up, hand him some new box cutters, and send him on his merry way.
Sentinel of Liberty: All right boys, lets do this purple ****er like we'd would've done Hitler, if the big ***** hadn't capped himself first!
Reed: But wait, we cannot kill him, because... his BRAIN is made out of DOOM! Not even my Super-Science can contain the DOOM that killing Galactus would let loose upon us all!
Johnny: Oh ****, I'm gonna lose another girlfriend somehow, I just know it.
See? Easy!
Odin's Fury said:
Okay. I just want to say that I'm glad they killed him. NOT because I hated Hawkeye. Far from it. I loved it when he originally joined the Avengers and got into fistfights with cap all the time. Great character.
BUT I'm glad because the world of comics needs to change every once in a while. People need to die (and stay freaking dead). This stuff happens. Bad things make the world of comics more interesting and opens more story possibilities. And besides Hawkeye's still alive in our hearts right?
I know what you mean. Some characters have been way too freaking static over the years, hardly changing at all. One I can think of specifically is Cap. And that always seems to get him in trouble. Some authors have even used that part of his personality to show him as someone super resistent to change (1602 is what comes to mind).
Wolverine actually has changed over the years,but after the 90's most writers forgot and decided to just use his Ultimate personality.*insert your own Bendis-bash here*
I know what you mean. Some characters have been way too freaking static over the years, hardly changing at all. One I can think of specifically is Cap. And that always seems to get him in trouble. Some authors have even used that part of his personality to show him as someone super resistent to change (1602 is what comes to mind).
I'm not talking about changing characters over time, I'm talking about dropping Wolverine into an atom smasher and murdering him.
I mean if you're saying that people need to be killed in order to shake up the status quo - then what the **** does that have to do with Hawkeye getting killed? All that does is you get a couple episodes' worth of canned dramatics and then the marquee-name movie-leveraged heroes go on their merry way.
When someone kills goddamn The Wolverine, and does it so it sticks, then you can talk to me about changing the status quo, because that's a death that they would actually have to seriously deal with and that would legitimately change how Marvel makes comics. Anything less is not only not a challenge to the status quo, but precisely in keeping with it -- the marquee-name characters with major movie deals dance through every manner of death-defying idiocy, confident in the invincibility conferred upon them by Narrative Causality, meanwhile the writers squeeze out scripts that read like some editor scribbled in the margin NEEDS POIGNANCY AND DEPTH OF EMOTION - KILL SOMEBODY ON PAGE SEVEN and the writer plugged in the first name he came up with that wasn't going to **** with anybody's box-office residuals.
I'm not talking about changing characters over time, I'm talking about dropping Wolverine into an atom smasher and murdering him.
I mean if you're saying that people need to be killed in order to shake up the status quo - then what the **** does that have to do with Hawkeye getting killed? All that does is you get a couple episodes' worth of canned dramatics and then the marquee-name movie-leveraged heroes go on their merry way.
When someone kills goddamn The Wolverine, and does it so it sticks, then you can talk to me about changing the status quo, because that's a death that they would actually have to seriously deal with and that would legitimately change how Marvel makes comics. Anything less is not only not a challenge to the status quo, but precisely in keeping with it -- the marquee-name characters with major movie deals dance through every manner of death-defying idiocy, confident in the invincibility conferred upon them by Narrative Causality, meanwhile the writers squeeze out scripts that read like some editor scribbled in the margin NEEDS POIGNANCY AND DEPTH OF EMOTION - KILL SOMEBODY ON PAGE SEVEN and the writer plugged in the first name he came up with that wasn't going to **** with anybody's box-office residuals.
Good point. It is an ugly little secret in comics that the characters needed to sell books, movies, TV shows, etc. are effectively immortal, but the B and lower listers are usually the quickest to be sacrificed to the wood-chipper. And yes, DC does it too.
Good point. It is an ugly little secret in comics that the characters needed to sell books, movies, TV shows, etc. are effectively immortal, but the B and lower listers are usually the quickest to be sacrificed to the wood-chipper. And yes, DC does it too.
That's kinda obvious though...it's like stan lee (I think) said when someone asked how comes Spidey is never killed when he's caught by his enemies and he replied something like (in a sort of 'duh' tone) 'Because if he did, series over.'
I don't get why people complain that the most popular characters never die. That's a given, and an obvious one at that. If you don't like that (I say 'you' as in anyone, not anyone in particular btw), then your not gonna find many comics/tv shows/ film series you will like.
That's kinda obvious though...it's like stan lee (I think) said when someone asked how comes Spidey is never killed when he's caught by his enemies and he replied something like (in a sort of 'duh' tone) 'Because if he did, series over.'
I don't get why people complain that the most popular characters never die. That's a given, and an obvious one at that. If you don't like that (I say 'you' as in anyone, not anyone in particular btw), then your not gonna find many comics/tv shows/ film series you will like.
I wasn't really complaining, just agreeing with the point.
Although it does suck the wind out of "this death will change everything" sort of events when you know it's not true in the real sense, which was why I found Decimation so pointless- NO character who was vital to the X-Franchise was in any way inconvienced, so why should I care? It was gutless, which takes the fun out of an event. But events themselves are not always best for comics, though, which is another debate entirely.
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