XAVIER: The Official Character Discussion Thread

[FieryBalrog]

yea geez, its annoying when people yell at a retcon which is basically undoing another retcon.. the "separate entity" crap isn't the original story, please...

Besides, her powers fluctuate even with access to the Phoenix force. Thats just how it is, I dont really know the explanation. Its always been like that, ever since the first story arc with Phoenix.

 

[Intheknow101]

yea geez, its annoying when people yell at a retcon which is basically undoing another retcon.. the "separate entity" crap isn't the original story, please...

Besides, her powers fluctuate even with access to the Phoenix force. Thats just how it is, I dont really know the explanation. Its always been like that, ever since the first story arc with Phoenix.

I think it was always a combination of factors. Some include the psionic circuit breakers she had in place and later for not wanting to make Scott and the others uncomfortable and nervous. In fact when she once again started expanding her powers and exploring them further, she told Scott that she was sick of holding back and she wanted to be all she could be. Of course Scott was pissing his pants at this point, but he had no reason to worry. Jean was more mature, more experienced, and better suited to handle her power levels this time.

 

[Intheknow101]

double post

 

[MJB]

Why are you yelling? No one said you had anything against Jean. I was just explaining to you what the comics said. It was never intended to be a "seperate entity". They added that later which was called a retcon, and in recent years, they've unretconned it to them being one and the same. For all her power, Jean is still HUMAN. She has the ability to make mistakes, to be duped, to be surprised...and the whole gambit of human emotions. It was originally what caused her to go Dark Phoenix...a human mind that got corrupted and seduced by her infinite powers. She's not omniscient and doesn't "know all". Even cosmic beings like Galactus and the Watcher aren't omniscient. High power levels doesn't = know everything and anything or not capable of making mistakes.

Wait a minuate. So The Phoenix isn't a separate entity? WTF? So all that stuff i read in Excalibur was crap when Rachel Summers was the host for the Phoenix? So when the FF found Jean's body in Jamica Bay or whatever that was crap to? It was said that the Phoenix put Jean's body in that cocoon to heal while it assumed her form, so all that was crap to? Now in that Phoenix End song Jean was supposed to be separated from the Phoenix and that she wouldn't be able to return. What in the name of all that's holy. What in the hell is going on. For God's sake Galactus himself tangled with the Phoenix and seemed to know about it as if he had met with it before and this had to be before Jean grey was ever born. What about Feron. What the devil? The phoenix even spoke to Prof X and Jean and showed them the begining of it's existence at the begining of the Big band. All this stuff should just be erased and never hapened??? I don't get it.

 

[FieryBalrog]

Wait a minuate. So The Phoenix isn't a separate entity? WTF? So all that stuff i read in Excalibur was crap when Rachel Summers was the host for the Phoenix? So when the FF found Jean's body in Jamica Bay or whatever that was crap to? It was said that the Phoenix put Jean's body in that cocoon to heal while it assumed her form, so all that was crap to? Now in that Phoenix End song Jean was supposed to be separated from the Phoenix and that she wouldn't be able to return. What in the name of all that's holy. What in the hell is going on. For God's sake Galactus himself tangled with the Phoenix and seemed to know about it as if he had met with it before and this had to be before Jean grey was ever born. What about Feron. What the devil? The phoenix even spoke to Prof X and Jean and showed them the begining of it's existence at the begining of the Big band. All this stuff should just be erased and never hapened??? I don't get it.

just a question, did you ever read the original Phoenix saga itself, and Endsong?

All the stuff youre talking about "ignoring" is itself a retcon that ignores the original story.

Where in Endsong does it say Jean and the Phoenix are separated, in fact the exact opposite happened, they were revealed to be the same, they united and they went to the White Hot Room. The Excalibur stuff is currently being explained by the "fragments of Jean/Phoenix" idea.

 

[Intheknow101]

just a question, did you ever read the original Phoenix saga itself, and Endsong?

All the stuff youre talking about "ignoring" is itself a retcon that ignores the original story.

Where in Endsong does it say Jean and the Phoenix are separated, in fact the exact opposite happened, they were revealed to be the same, they united and they went to the White Hot Room. The Excalibur stuff is currently being explained by the "fragments of Jean/Phoenix" idea.

Thanks Balrog, and I'll just elaborate by posting what explodingboy and I already posted in another thread...don't feel like retyping everything:

A new body was created, yes, but she was not replaced. As stated by the Watcher, the classic backstory and the current retcon Jean became one with Phoenix.

Since you can't seem to wrap your head around the fact the two are the same. Here is a quote from the "force" herself:

"Take my hands child -- That we two may become one."

What's interestingly enough, Morrison's take on one of the transistions of the Phoenix was mighty close to what she resembled on the shuttle. It furthers that they were just split pieces of one whole.

Here is my take on what happened in the shuttle. We see the "force" speaking throughout the panels leading up to Jean's deterioration in a unique word bubble. Right before the "force" manifests itself those unique word bubbles are now being spoken in the first person by Jean. With no transition it goes from the "force" speaking to Jean speaking. Why would Jean be speaking with the Phoenix word bubble before it even manifested itself. My thoughts there are that the previous word bubbles had been a part of Jean's consciousness unawarely speaking up to the point of physically manifesting. Jean then began speaking as the Phoenix right before her powers manifested themselves in a tangible form. Once in that tangible form they regained the unique word bubble and Jean went back to the standard word bubble. As her powers were forming a new body for her they state, "My consciousness -- My form, and its ability to communicate on this plane of existence -- derive from you." The force that was appearing before her is mighty close in resemblance to the way she appeared in HCT. I look at it not so much as a separate being that combined with her, but that the force was Jean's power personified. At least, that is how I took it when I first read that backstory (minus the HCT part.)

Yep, exactly what I was thinking. And from Morrison's run we see Jean in the same gold woman form saying "you were always here waiting for yourself to arrive" Given the nature of the white hot room outside of time and space, what if it was a future/evolved form of herself "waiting for herself to arrive" on that fateful day on the space shuttle? It's so metaphysical and cool.

And also, Morrison further elaborated on the "cocoon" incident by showing that they are like failsafes, exactly like Jean mentioned here in those panels above, "A second chance..".

1) As shown when she died on the space shuttle she brought herself back as Phoenix and maintained her old body as a failsafe in the bottom of Jamaica Bay.

2 ) When she died on the moon, her conciousness and soul went back to that same body in the bay. But there were still pieces that had been scattered across time and space and didn't come home or had been rejected...ending up in Maddie Pryor and Rachel for example. There was another failsafe made on the moon as we find out in New X-Men.

3) Finally tying it all together was her death in Planet X. Her conciousness ends up on the failsafe on the moon, and without the Fantastic Four or anyone else to find her she is awakened 150 years in the future more fully powered than the FF incident and in the gold woman form.
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[FieryBalrog]

I haven't had this discussion in a while. I'm just hoping I get to bust out my Classic X-men #8 scans.

 

[LMason]

The Professor, and by extension, Patrick Stewart, gets his own thread. Hopefully that means we don't have fifty threads dedicated to one Stewart interview.

 

[xwolverine2]

in that case.....

http://youtube.com/watch?v=UGf9Hc-KpAA

 

[Sunstar]

Wow Professor only got a thread now?

Some other minor characters have had threads and more posts than him *cough*multiple man*cough*!

 

[phoenix_force]

it's cuz they don't think he's sexy he's too old lol

 

[LMason]

Wow Professor only got a thread now?

Some other minor characters have had threads and more posts than him *cough*multiple man*cough*!

Well if you combine every Professor thread, and "Patrick Stewart SAID THIS!" thread, you'd have pages upon pages. Now we're under one roof.

 

[LEX]

I didn't know we didn't have a Xavier thread. Good job, LM.

 

[gap5ewl]

can we get some pics perhaps??

 

[Electrix]

 

[Electrix]

 

[Angamb]

I wonder if Xavier will use his powers in a bigger way this time, I think it's just his time, He can resolve many situations, so it's not logical not using his powers

 

[LEX]

Ah, I feel sorry for the guy now.

 

[Electrix]

Xavier could make everyone accept mutants just like that if he tried. However, he doesnt believe that is a good and fair way of dealing with things. He blocked Jeans powers because she would hinder the accepting of mutants process. Jean is uncontrollable so her controlled her. That will probably backfire but that was a risk he took.
I dont think Xavier 'dies' when Jean contronts him in her house, or I dont want him too anyway. I'd like it if Jean killed his body but his mind lived on. He has the most powerful mind in the world and a weak body. I'd like him to come back in the final battle or something. You hear his voice like God or something! Ha!

 

[Almighty Pejo]

So the bald bastard got a thread of his own, eh? I wonder if he'll make us forget it was created.

 

[Specter313]

Come on, you knew it was coming:

http://patrickstewartloveslittlegirls.ytmnd.com/

 

[Electrix]

Haha! That reminds me. Family Guy starts in 15 minutes. 2 episodes! (BBC2 UK people)

 

[Specter313]

Spin this one at your next party:

http://picard.ytmnd.com/

 

[Kira]

Come on, you knew it was coming:

http://patrickstewartloveslittlegirls.ytmnd.com/

AGAIN!?! I know what he is going to do and I still watch it everytime. EVERYTIME! I can only blame myself...

 

[Specter313]

AGAIN!?! I know what he is going to do and I still watch it everytime. EVERYTIME! I can only blame myself...

You just love picturing the real Patrick in a shorty robe.