Your favorite Gotham?

[Blitzkrieg Bop]

The Dark Knight

Reminds me of...

 

[Cain]

I like them all besides BB and TDK. That's not Gotham City in those 2 films.

How is the one in BB not Gotham City? I could understand TDK since it seems so static and not imaginative enough but not BB. Once removed from it's NY roots back in the very early days of Batman Gotham in the comics became an amalgamation of different cities across the world. It features a little London, a bit of Chicago, some NYC, a bit of Pittsburgh, some Detroit, a little Baltimore etc. so in that sense to just pretty much see Chicago was blah.

BB however had sections inspired by the Kowloon Walled City, sections inspired by Washington, sections influenced by Chicago etc.

It was a real melting pot of metros and IMO the closest we've gotten to seeing a truly genuine Gotham in live action outside of the first Burton movie.

This is also why I'm glad Nolan (guess even he realized that TDK's Gotham was too static) decided to go out to Pittsburgh and also come out here to shoot some Gotham stuff as opposed to just sticking to Chicago again.

 

[Lead Cenobite]

I like Gotham looking old, rusted, claustrophobic, smog filled and ugly, so guess which one I prefer. I did like the Narrows in Begins, though, and it's presence is probably part of the reason why I prefer Begins to TDK.

 

[uniqueweasel]

Batman Returns, I like the sort of iron looking statues and stuff on some of the sets infront of the buildings, looks great.

 

[Indy Flash]

Tdk.

 

[AlphaWolf]

B89 - Too German / Bohemian, too self contained, and small.
Returns - Even more GERMAN ... and even smaller and too "Burton".

Gotham is supposed to be an American City, it's not a literal excessive extension of Gothic and Germanic architexture. It should be identifiable as an American Metropolis ... Burton's films don't feel like America. Way too small, way too self contained. Also, Batman being an extension of the other worldly enviornment lessens the impact of such an amazing freak and monster like character.

Forever / Batman and Robin - Too bright, too homo-erotic, too small, non-threatning.

Batman Begins / The Dark Knight is the best for me. And it really is the same city in each movie, recognizably so too, it's just story wise by TDK the city is cleaner due to Batman's impact.

But in BEGINS I love the real world threat of Gotham having a dirty underbelly. I'm more fascinated with real architexture, and REAL SLUMS. In real life they are so much more captivating and dangerous than excessive Gothic architexture. The Narrows are a great homage to the claustrophobic slums of Kowloon.

Nolan's Gotham is a recognizable American City. It feels and looks like the Gotham from Miller's Year One. Love the monorail. The city is EXPANSIVE, has rich areas, and really poor areas. You have actual sections. The docks, the narrows, etc. It feels like a REAL setting. Which makes the story that much more EPIC.

TDK's cleaned and sterile Gotham is supposed to represent the calm of normal society, with the brewing of terror and chaos (the Joker) lying and bubbling beneath the surface. Gotham has been potrayed as a real American City with normal architexture before. See YEAR ONE, Killing Joke, TDK Returns etc.

 

[Ultra Lantern]

B'89

 

[GothamAlleys]

B89 - Too German / Bohemian, too self contained, and small.

But the first movie's architecture has nothing to do with German, that came in Returns. Its all 1940s industrial era NYC with prison architecture mixed in. As far as containment, thats budget limitations. When you build entire city from scratch, few streets with buildings is already an amazing feat and I think the wide shots of the city and different locations (such as Wayne Manor and Axis Chemicals industrial area) did the job, kind of like in Blade Runner. The model extensions work really well, as someone who spends almost entire week in NYC I can tell the most used street in B89 reminds me very much of Times Square with its heavy traffic, crowded sidewalks and the whole vibe (music playing, vendors outside, steam from sewers etc)

 

[Cain]

But the first movie's architecture has nothing to do with German, that came in Returns. Its all 1940s industrial era NYC with prison architecture mixed in. As far as containment, thats budget limitations. When you build entire city from scratch, few streets with buildings is already an amazing feat and I think the wide shots of the city and different locations (such as Wayne Manor and Axis Chemicals industrial area) did the job, kind of like in Blade Runner. The model extensions work really well, as someone who spends almost entire week in NYC I can tell the most used street in B89 reminds me very much of Times Square with its heavy traffic, crowded sidewalks and the whole vibe (music playing, vendors outside, steam from sewers etc)

It's crazier if you remember pre-Giuliani NYC. One of the reasons the movie intially spoke to me so much as a kid was it's familiarity. Back in the late 80's and early 90's the seediness found in this movie you could see all the way from the inner city neighborhoods I grew up in to times square which today looks like Disney land. It was the first time I could believe that Batman could exist in a world like mine cause it looked so much like the NYC from those days.

 

[TX85]

IF the next Bat film's Gotham takes inspiration from any of the big films &/or other films..Which would you like to be used as a template?

I say do a mixed combo of BR and BB or BR&The Crow!!

 

[GothamAlleys]

Its also important to note that the idea of Gotham beiong just another American metropole is completely not true. As someone already mentioned, and its something confirmed and easily available to read about, Gotham is a mix of many different cities, including European ones.

While B89 Gotham was primarily a 1940s NYC, it also took elements from architecture from all over the world. Here are only SOME of the examples:

 

[Mister Meddle]

Wow great post, as usual.

 

[Mister Meddle]

IF the next Bat film's Gotham takes inspiration from any of the big films &/or other films..Which would you like to be used as a template?

I say do a mixed combo of BR and BB or BR&The Crow!!

I first watched The Crow a few months ago (I know, shocker). The first thing that came to mind was "the city that this takes place in looks like Gotham".

Hopefully it will be something along those lines.

 

[Macphisto]

B89. It feels like another character, and you can practically smell the filth.

To be honest, Narrows aside, the Gotham in BB/TDK looks like a pretty cool place to live.

 

[Mister Meddle]

B89. It feels like another character, and you can practically smell the filth.

To be honest, Narrows aside, the Gotham in BB/TDK looks like a pretty cool place to live.

Coming from somebody that lives in the Chicago area it's hard to really imagine it as Gotham if those are the same streets that I drive on. A very nice location is where the "hit me" scene took place (in front of the Board of Trade building, it was used as Wayne Enterprises in BB).

 

[GothamAlleys]

Coming from somebody that lives in the Chicago area it's hard to really imagine it as Gotham if those are the same streets that I drive on. A very nice location is where the "hit me" scene took place (in front of the Board of Trade building, it was used as Wayne Enterprises in BB).

That reminds me of one quote from Paul Dini (BTAS writer): Christopher Nolan's Batman was very modern day; it almost got to the point where I was watching the movie and I was noticing landmarks as I'm a native of Chicago where it was shot. To some degree I don't think Batman works in a completely modern city; I think Gotham has be reflective of his personality and those of his enemies

 

[Mister Meddle]

That reminds me of one quote from Paul Dini (BTAS writer): Christopher Nolan's Batman was very modern day; it almost got to the point where I was watching the movie and I was noticing landmarks as I'm a native of Chicago where it was shot. To some degree I don't think Batman works in a completely modern city; I think Gotham has be reflective of his personality and those of his enemies

I pretty much feel the same way. However I didn't have any issues with selective locations being used in BB. It was cool seeing a couple familiar areas but Gotham still managed to look different. They had the narrows, CG in the shots of the city (so it wouldn't look like Chicago), Wayne Manor, the set from the sound stage that was used in the final battle, etc. I'm glad that they decided to film in a number of different locations this time.

 

[Fudgie]

B89 - Too German / Bohemian, too self contained, and small.
Returns - Even more GERMAN ... and even smaller and too "Burton".

Gotham is supposed to be an American City, it's not a literal excessive extension of Gothic and Germanic architexture. It should be identifiable as an American Metropolis ... Burton's films don't feel like America. Way too small, way too self contained. Also, Batman being an extension of the other worldly enviornment lessens the impact of such an amazing freak and monster like character.

Forever / Batman and Robin - Too bright, too homo-erotic, too small, non-threatning.

Batman Begins / The Dark Knight is the best for me. And it really is the same city in each movie, recognizably so too, it's just story wise by TDK the city is cleaner due to Batman's impact.

But in BEGINS I love the real world threat of Gotham having a dirty underbelly. I'm more fascinated with real architexture, and REAL SLUMS. In real life they are so much more captivating and dangerous than excessive Gothic architexture. The Narrows are a great homage to the claustrophobic slums of Kowloon.

Nolan's Gotham is a recognizable American City. It feels and looks like the Gotham from Miller's Year One. Love the monorail. The city is EXPANSIVE, has rich areas, and really poor areas. You have actual sections. The docks, the narrows, etc. It feels like a REAL setting. Which makes the story that much more EPIC.

TDK's cleaned and sterile Gotham is supposed to represent the calm of normal society, with the brewing of terror and chaos (the Joker) lying and bubbling beneath the surface. Gotham has been potrayed as a real American City with normal architexture before. See YEAR ONE, Killing Joke, TDK Returns etc.

Agreed. That is a great post.

 

[GothamAlleys]

Oh I sure dont have a problem with Chicago Gotham either. It fits the story and the feel of it. And I became an avid Batman reader a good couple of months before the 1989 movie, and my first impression of Gotham was a regular city because of panels like this one

There was this short period of time in the comics when Gotham was basically an image or even picture of an actual city

 

[Mister Meddle]

Yeah. I don't have a problem with Gotham looking a bit more modern. Although I'd rather have something that that looks more like a classic NYC. But that's just a personal preference. I guess it has more to do with being from Chicago. Like I said, I'm glad that they decided to film in different locations this time.

 

[redfirebird2008]

I voted for Returns, but sometimes I prefer '89.

 

[Galactus123]

My favorite Gotham is in Batman The Animated Series. But in movies the best is 89 or Returns.

Batman TAS Gotham is the best:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m-u07UEDT5I

 

[Lead Cenobite]

The one thing I dislike about the 89 Gotham is the absurdly tall cathedral. I suppose it's not impossible to build one that large, but it's clearly a very old building, probably one of the city's first, and yet it dwarfs all the modern skyscrapers.

 

[Godzilla2014]

Sorry IF this has been posted,But I'm just curious out of the 6 big films..Which Gotham had your favorite look&feel?

Batman'89

Batman Returns

Batman Forever

Batman&Robin

Batman Begins

The Dark Knight

.................................................................................................................................................................................
BR&BB are my choices!

I'd say that my favorite depictions of Gotham (on film) are Batman, Batman Returns, Batman Begins, and The Dark Knight, in no particular order, each bringing something to the table. Both Batman and Batman Begins portray Gotham as a urban hell, Batman Returns's Gotham had interesting art deco architecture, and The Dark Knight depicts the centers of money and power in Gotham City.

 

[AlphaWolf]

Coming from somebody that lives in the Chicago area it's hard to really imagine it as Gotham if those are the same streets that I drive on.

For me it isn't ... they still mix up enough other shots, along with sets to make it a creation onto it's own. Plus, Year One artist described his opening shots of the elevated train and filth to be lifted and based on Chicago itself and it's elevated train. They even give a nod to it by Gordon being a transfer from the Chicago Police Department.

Alex Ross, one of the best comic book artists of all-time, from Chicago as well, CLEARLY in his brillaint "War on Crime" graphic has his Gotham based on Chicago very obviously as well. His Gotham is potrayed as a modern metropolis.

I prefer my Batman more grounded in actual real world horrors, and enviornment.

Real life ghettos, and slums, or China Towns in REAL cities, when driving by at night, or being in them ... I can very much appreciate the intimidating nature of the surroundings, and can cathartically envision a real Batman prowling the roof tops at night.

They are MUCH more horrifying to me than excessive, and overdesigned city scapes with German values, as opposed to American architexture.

My favorite depictions of Gotham, visually have all been real world, gritty takes. Year One, TDK Returns, War on Crime, Year 100 (my favorite)

Like I said, and to respectfully disagree with Paul Dini ... when Batman himself is an EXTENSION of the art design of Gotham, and if Gotham is too "freak-ish" like in itself ... a Batman being inside of it is well ... kind of normal.

In a real urban enviornment, the image of a Batman is more POWERFUL as it stands out, and you can recognize the symbol that he stands for in a much more empowering way.

But the first movie's architecture has nothing to do with German, that came in Returns.

"I'm gonna fight you on this ..." ~ Bruce Wayne (Batman Returns)

No, B89's design CLEARLY is set with a nod to Bohemian and German architexture. The museum is called the "Fugelheim" for christ sakes, lol ...

What do you think that's a reference to my good man?

In Returns, he takes it further an makes it German Expressionist.

Either way, I feel like I'm in some other wordly German City in BOTH films. And it's funny considering Burton is an American director, yet his film doesn't feel like America itself ... AT ALL. And while Nolan is a dual citizen of both the US and Britain ... most of his production staff is english, and their ENTIRE creation is DECIDINGLY more American.

And I call bull honkey on making the films "timeless" with it's Gotham ... as if that has EVER been important to a STORY, anyway. In fact the BEST stories are the ones OF their time. That reflect the state of society at that precise moment in history.

And even in making the films timeless, he ultimately failed at that too considering we see 80's vehicles, 80's style dress at certain times (B89 - Bruce's FUGLY Bill Cosby sweater, Mock Turtle Neck and Jeans), and of course ... the PRINCE music, and not truly giving the Joker his own theme, but rather basing his appearances off Prince music. MAJOR face palm.