Ziggler gets a Wrestling Thread...It's About Damn Time!!!

[Project862006]

It seems like no matter what some people will immediately spring into action to defend the WWE HOF. Not surprising.

The WWE HOF isn't legit because ONE guy chooses who goes in based on his mood that day or if he had a good BM. There is no vote. And certain people get passed over instead of getting a legit look while other people who have no business being in there are in. He was never the best judge of talent, he's biased against some, and he's becoming more out of touch every day.

Warrior sees The HOF for what it really is. Why do you think Vince keeps asking even though Warrior keeps saying no? Vince wants it HIS way. He gets him in and he gets his way more on his terms.

If the Von Erich FAMILY can go into the WWE HOF there is no reason the Poffo family can't. Angelo Poffo did more for the business than Chris Von Erich (God rest his soul) ever did and I'd love to see certain people try to argue otherwise.

Part of that deal was the WCCW tape library to sweeten the pot. Same was true for Verne Gagne. It was more than just putting them in because it was the "right thing."

The HOF isn't just a money thing but an EGO thing for McMahon. I'd think anyone could see that at this point. He sees himself as the keeper (and writer) of the businesses history and the more control he gets over records of that history he can get to tell it however he wants to and put his name on it.

He threw a way a sh**load of money on The Invasion just to make a point. And that whole thing could have gone better even if they didn't have certain WCW talent. In the end he did the same with with ECW's revival. It probably would have made more money if he hadn't tampered with it as much as he did. evolving it is one thing but he was out to make a point by remolding it so much into something he thought would sell better when the opposite happened.

UFC HOF is the same way

UFC President Dana White Refuses to Induct Frank Shamrock even tho he became the 1st UFC LHW champ and defended it 4 times and retired undefeated in the UFC

all because he has a personal beef with the guy

 

[Slushy]

All the wrestlers dying steroid and drug related deaths are more efficient? You could have fooled me. A lot of that is the stuff Bruno dislikes and that was a false "efficiency" that McMahon had a hand in increasing.

He's mad at his son because he felt he bought into that lifestyle.

Bruno's a *****e? What does that make Vince? Vince is a bigger d***bag than Bruno ever will be. The only reason he WANTS Bruno for his so called hall of fame is so he can say he has him. Its got little to do with "the business." The WWE HOF ain't legitimate (even by wrestling standards) and Bruno knows it.

I think Sammartino is bitter (and stubborn) that doesn't mean there isn't some truth in what he says no matter how many people McMahon has programmed.

Bruno overrates himself, but he is the longest reigning WWF Champion in history so he deserves to be in there (even Vince knows this) and Triple H is pushing to make the HOF legitimate by having that building constructed.

Had he been smarter and shown a little respect over the years, WWE would praise him instead of treating him like an afterthought.

Now if he wants to continue to live in the past and still hold a grudge, that's his choice, but he has nobody to blame, but himself. He's only selling himself and his fans short.

Re: Austin Vs. Punk

The match is 50/50 right now and it depends on if WWE will cater to Austin's demands which are:

1.) It's the last match on the card (which I don't have a problem with.)

2.) Punk is a heel (This I do have a problem with as its dumb to turn him just for one match. Austin claims the feud would work better given Punk's Straight Edge lifestyle, but IMO I still think its Austin being insecure about being outcheered by Punk.)

 

[Metallo]

Bruno overrates himself, but he is the longest reigning WWF Champion in history so he deserves to be in there (even Vince knows this) and Triple H is pushing to make the HOF legitimate by having that building constructed.

Had he been smarter and shown a little respect over the years, WWE would praise him instead of treating him like an afterthought.

Now if he wants to continue to live in the past and still hold a grudge, that's his choice, but he has nobody to blame, but himself. He's only selling himself and his fans short.

For TRUE fans of Bruno him going into the WWE HOF isn't going to change that. His career doesn't need McMahons validation and Bruno knows that. He was also the FIRST long term star for WWWF as an independent entity. I don't agree with everything Bruno says but I RESPECT the man enough to make his own choice and stand by his principles if thats what he feels. The way you talk fans are owed something by wrestlers like they should sell their hides in indentured servitude. Bruno gave his fans his blood and sweat every night and he was an honorable face for his era. Thats more than I can say for some wrestlers.

The HOF clearly needs him more than he needs it. Bruno is the one that seems content to stay out of it. VINCE is the one that keeps asking. Vince McMahon has always had this feeling that he's entitled to anything he wants and when he doesn't get it that pisses him off. If anything more people NEED to take a stand against him and show him he doesn't have carte blanche to do anything and snap him back to the real world outside of WWE's walls.

Its his way of thinking that caused his stupid antics during his wifes Conn. senate run that probably hurt her chances even more.

 

[Project862006]

^but fans of him wont get the validation of a cermeony to celebrate his career and achievements and even a speech

 

[The Apocalypse]

Who cares about the HOF? We all know who the greats are and aren't.

 

[Hunter Rider]

Agreed. I think between the way WWE seems hellbent on doing business lately and the fact that its Austin...AUSTIN would go over. I think Punk would probably be OK with that too.

Punk NEEDS to beat HHH at Mania at some point. That sh** from last year just cannot stand as is.

Punk may be ok with it but he has an ego to, and given all his griping about The Rock I am not sure he'd be quite so keen if Austin took the same approach.

Agreed, that is a match and feud that has legs and was only really touched on last summer.

2.) Punk is a heel (This I do have a problem with as its dumb to turn him just for one match. Austin claims the feud would work better given Punk's Straight Edge liftstyle, but IMO I still think its Austin being insecure about being outcheered by Punk.)

This set the alarm off for me as well as both Austin and Punk have criticised weak angles and yet Austin wants to do the most generic angle possible with Punk? Instead they could do a more complex angle where Punk See's Austin as his hero from boyhood but their life ideals are different, which creates a conflict with them in a well written angle where Austin gets huffy over Punk not accepting a beer and sees it as disrespect.

Have Austin challenge Punk and Punk say no, then have Austin slap him and ask him if he is saying no out of misplaced pity for an old hand that could still whoop his ass? stuff like that to really give the angle some weight as opposed to "I love beer vs beer kills your liver and I'm better because I don't drink it!"

 

[Hunter Rider]

There's probably a few stumbling blocks on a Punk vs Austin match.

- Does WWE and Austin REALLY think Punk is a big enough name to have Austin's first match in 10 years?

- Do WWE want to split their fans on the only face they have that is actually over with the two key demos?

- Austin has not worked in 10 years, look at how much a natural athlete like The Rock struggled after 7, Austin has 2 bad knees and a bad neck, he'll need carrying, ironically Punk is one of the few who could carry him.

- Last but not least Austin will want a huge payday to work a Mania, after The Rock vs Cena buyrate didn't do any better than a Mania that simply had two well booked title match main events, is it really worth WWE's while shelling out a huge fee for a novelty match again?

 

[Project862006]

yeah SE angle has been done twice one with punk as a heel and one with punk as a face

kind of been there done that

 

[MMMMM...Pancakes]

Teddy sure does love tag-team matches.

 

[Benstamania]

Cena almost dies last week... Perfectly fine tonight, lol.

 

[The Apocalypse]

There's probably a few stumbling blocks on a Punk vs Austin match.

- Does WWE and Austin REALLY think Punk is a big enough name to have Austin's first match in 10 years?

- Do WWE want to split their fans on the only face they have that is actually over with the two key demos?

- Austin has not worked in 10 years, look at how much a natural athlete like The Rock struggled after 7, Austin has 2 bad knees and a bad neck, he'll need carrying, ironically Punk is one of the few who could carry him.

- Last but not least Austin will want a huge payday to work a Mania, after The Rock vs Cena buyrate didn't do any better than a Mania that simply had two well booked title match main events, is it really worth WWE's while shelling out a huge fee for a novelty match again?

It's because a lot of the people who used to watch when Rock and Stone Cold were huge don't really give a **** about wrestling anymore. I'm the only one of my friends who kind of pay attention to whats going on in the wrestling world. But even when SCSA was big I was only 8-10 years old. I had to buy VHS tapes of the PPV's. It would be a dumb move by WWE to get him back in the ring vs Punk, for all those reasons you listed.

 

[Metallo]

Punk may be ok with it but he has an ego to, and given all his griping about The Rock I am not sure he'd be quite so keen if Austin took the same approach.

Agreed, that is a match and feud that has legs and was only really touched on last summer.

I think the difference there is Austin probably has Punks respect more. Austin had been around more and was warmer with everyone else backstage while it took Rock a while to warm up to some of the new faces.

Remember it was Austin who went up to Punk and warmly greeted him after Hogan gave Punk the cold shoulder.

I think it would help Punk more if he went over Austin because Austin doesn't need to win at this point. It would be nice but somebody has to go to the mat (literally) for this generation.

Who cares about the HOF? We all know who the greats are and aren't.

Agreed. Its nice but its not something I NEED to appreciate the great names. A HOF induction isn't going to make me love Savage or Bruno any more or less.

^but fans of him wont get the validation of a ceremony to celebrate his career and achievements and even a speech

He's in the Pro Wrestling HOF so anybody who was interested had a chance to hear him speak about his career and get the validation of a ceremony. And that induction was one voted by his PEERS. All those great legends who knew what it was like to bust their a**es to get there gave Bruno his due. For the boys thats got be an honor. The PWHOF doesn't have the exposure of the WWE HOF but its far more legitimate IMO. If you can convince that many guys when ballot time comes up thats pretty impressive.

 

[The Sage]

Truthfully yes, I like and respect Austin but he rarely did the job for anyone once he became a star and now Rock has won his comeback match I don't see Austin agreeing to lose his.

Triple H is a pretty ideal opponent if it is a title match as Haitch is synonymous with the belt at Mania. I actually wouldn't mind Punk/Taker, I mean we know that the only way Taker is jobbing the streak is to Cena, but Punk being the guy that follows HBK and Triple H in pushing Taker to the limit would be big, and I think Punk's size and talent will aid the more limited Taker in having a good match.

Punk's lighter size will definitely help as Taker would be able to go into his repertoire and use more power moves.

Isn't that only because some of the older matches were shot in a different format?

Ah, that explains it. But it ruins the experience. I watching Bret/Austin two weekends ago and the border was annoying.

 

[The Sage]

Wow, some Cena/Punk interaction. It's been awhile.

 

[Slushy]

If Austin doesn't not work out, I wouldn't mind seeing Punk take on Helmsley or Orton. At least they can make up for not putting him over to begin with.

The HOF clearly needs him more than he needs it. Bruno is the one that seems content to stay out of it. VINCE is the one that keeps asking. Vince McMahon has always had this feeling that he's entitled to anything he wants and when he doesn't get it that pisses him off. If anything more people NEED to take a stand against him and show him he doesn't have carte blanche to do anything and snap him back to the real world outside of WWE's walls.

Having integrity is fine and dandy, but sometimes it isn't worth it. Such as this case where instead of being treated like a legend that he should be given his accomplishments, Bruno insists on remaining in obscurity

out of some misplaced sense of self-righteousness.

True fans will know, but its not the same because

but fans of him wont get the validation of a cermeony to celebrate his career and achievements and even a speech

(Perfectly said) because now the new generation of WWE fans can at least be introduced to another blast from the past.

For example, if it wasn't for the Vince's Hall of Fame, I wouldn't have known too much about Nick Bockwinkel, Gordon Solie, The original Sheik, Bill Watts, Antonio Inoki, or Mil Mascaras. Having seen the tribute video packages and their speeches, it made me feel better because now I had an idea of what kind of person these great men were and at least what their background was.

Say what you will about Vince, but at least he's willing to forgive (for the most part anyway) like he did for Billy Graham who deserved to be honored despite his mistakes.

Since Bruno is content with his decision, I'll just wait for Morales, Backlund, and Savage to be inducted. They're more deserving anyway.

 

[Benstamania]

None taken Mr Bon Jovi, Hahaha.

 

[Benstamania]

I marked hard for Jericho's catch lines.

 

[LOBO3315a]

The Wrestling Thread Doesn't Take Offense Mr Bon Jovi.

 

[The Sage]

Crazy thought, anyone think they'd consider Daniel Bryan vs John Cena at Wrestlemania?

 

[The Apocalypse]

I marked hard for Jericho's catch lines.

Same.

LOL at Punk just standing there shaking his head at them.

 

[Benstamania]

The Wrestling Thread Doesn't Take Offense Mr Bon Jovi.

Make it so!

 

[OnTheAir]

I marked hard for Jericho's catch lines.

Likewise!

 

[Superark]

I marked hard for Jericho's catch lines.

Me too! I actually miss Jericho as a babyface.

 

[Hunter Rider]

It's because a lot of the people who used to watch when Rock and Stone Cold were huge don't really give a **** about wrestling anymore. I'm the only one of my friends who kind of pay attention to whats going on in the wrestling world. But even when SCSA was big I was only 8-10 years old. I had to buy VHS tapes of the PPV's. It would be a dumb move by WWE to get him back in the ring vs Punk, for all those reasons you listed.

I feel the same in truth, I'd rather see the next 9 months spent on building current guys up and see Mania headlined by two title matches between guys relevant to todays product.

I think the difference there is Austin probably has Punks respect more. Austin had been around more and was warmer with everyone else backstage while it took Rock a while to warm up to some of the new faces.

Remember it was Austin who went up to Punk and warmly greeted him after Hogan gave Punk the cold shoulder.

I think it would help Punk more if he went over Austin because Austin doesn't need to win at this point. It would be nice but somebody has to go to the mat (literally) for this generation.

There's certainly a greater degree of respect and some friendship there, but things can take a sour turn once careers and business become intertwined.

They say never meet your heores, doing business with them may be an even worse idea.

Punk's lighter size will definitely help as Taker would be able to go into his repertoire and use more power moves.

Yep, a guy that can move and is light and can also work smart without a lot of spots is perfect for Taker.

Ah, that explains it. But it ruins the experience. I watching Bret/Austin two weekends ago and the border was annoying.

It ruined the Rude Steamboat Iron Match on the Dragon's DVD set.

 

[cabel]

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