BvS All Things Batman v Superman: An Open Discussion - - - - - - - - - - Part 137

[craigdbfan]

This section sure could use a trailer.

 

[roach]

This section sure could use a trailer.

 

[Travesty]

 

[Spider-Aziz]

Good one folks.

 

[mithravishnu]

I'm kinda curious as to why they split up JL with a two year gap. Usually when they do split up films, it's a year apart. Seems like it's better if they took out "part 1" and "part 2" and substitute a real subtitle instead.

Because it is going to be the biggest epic movie ever made

 

[I Am The Knight]

Because dat drama with the Zimmer doom music

 

[LurkNoMore]

I have extremely high standards for what is considered acceptable superhero tv/movies and Flash does everything right IMO. I love the **** out of that show. Ezra will be good but I honestly think that the Flash tv show could easily fit into the DCCU quality wise

Trying to drag this back into a discussion about BvS while still critiquing The Flash…

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I like The Flash (TV). I watch it every week. I appreciate the way the actors inhabit their roles and the creative direction the show has taken in order to adapt it as serialized television.

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That being said…There’s no way I would accept the level of quality presented in The Flash as a standard/baseline for the cinematic DC universe.

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The writing isn’t anything I’d be proud of. There’s far too much reliance on convenience and the expectation that the audience will suspend disbelief simply for the reason that; "Come on, it’s just a comic book character, who cares?" attitude that the show runners so often seem to demonstrate.​

The way the show uses The Flash’s powers is often silly, with the partial exception of the episode where Barry was artificially enraged in the cross-over episode with Arrow. His attack on Officer Eddie demonstrated a slight hint of just how powerful a speedster can be. Then there’s the whole situation about Dr. Wells’ spending tons of money and time to help Barry ‘fight crime’. I get that Wells has ulterior motives, fine, but why aren’t Cisco and Caitlan, who are supposed to be genius-level nerds, able to determine that there’s something amiss in spending so much time and money helping Barry fulfill such a limited and slightly adolescent use of his abilities? Barry could be like a god if he used his powers to their extreme, and wouldn’t Barry, an intelligent scientist, along with his new best friends who, again, are genius-level scientists, be able to come up with more creative/effective uses for his powers?

​

Then there’s the hit and miss quality of the villains. Snart (Captain Cold) and Rory (the pyromaniac) are portrayed by actors who are very talented, but to those who aren’t familiar with their previous work on Prison Break (where they played brothers) would be able to tell they had more than a week of drama classes from the local community college under their belts. Don’t get me started on Victor Garber as Professor Stein (the elder portion of the Firestorm collective). This man was a force of nature on Alias and gave wonderfully subtle performances in Argo as the Canadian Ambassador to Iran, and as the designer of the Titanic in Cameron’s movie. Talk about phoning in a performance for The Flash.

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Granted, I haven’t seen the latest episode yet (watching it tonight) that apparently raises the bar quite a bit from what’s come before, but while it’s good enough for populist television, The Flash isn’t what I would want or expect from talents like Terrio & Snyder, along with creative input from Affleck, who you know demanded that Terrio should be brought in after having read Goyer’s screenplay/outline.

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I want as much verisimilitude as can be extracted from the characters in play (granted, that’s tough considering the characters of an alien, a demi-goddess, and a costumed Holmesian vigilante), but I at least want the writer and director to try as best they can.

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I want the actors to take their roles seriously and convince me that their characters are facing life threatening situations and who burden themselves with saving the lives of thousands, millions, or billions of people on their shoulders. I want the villains to do more than chew the scenery. I want them to convince me that they are doing what they are doing because they feel that they are justified in their actions, or that they are so evil that they really do simply crave to harm others for the sheer enjoyment they derive from carrying out their nefarious plans (see Ledger’s Joker in TDK).​

I want the DC universe to feel as ‘real’ as possible. That doesn’t necessarily mean all the physics have to make complete sense, but it does to mean that the motives make sense, that the reactions of the characters to each other’s actions makes sense, that the consequences of both the actions and inactions are appropriate to the situations these characters are going through.

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I want those characters who are experienced with super-powers, such as Wonder Woman and Aquaman to behave appropriately. I don’t want them wasting their powers in battle, I want them to fully exploit what they are capable of to their best advantage. In MOS Supes and the Kryptonians were new to their powers (at least in how to use them in battle), but the Amazonian and the Atlantean will have no such excuses and I want to be awed by them. I want Supes and Batman(especially) to be awed by them (not cowed, but awed).

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I want a lot, I know, but I see the potential that the Cinematic DC universe has because of the talent that’s been hired to create it, and I have faith that they will at least come closest to addressing my wants more than any other comic book movie/franchise has done so far. I’m setting myself up for disappointment, I know, but I can’t help but feel excited.​

 

[Fallen Angel]

That's a might fine trailer Roach.

 

[queendarkness12]

A picture of Lex Luthor could do for now, since we don't know what he looks like.

I got a thread up about the world building element of this movie and the wider DCCU.

http://forums.superherohype.com/showthread.php?t=495599

 

[Silliminite]

My insider sources are telling me he looks a bit like Jesse Eisenberg, but take that with a huge grain of salt for now.

 

[Joeyjojo72]

I agree. And that's why i dont really like Flash's rogues gallery or watching him on his own.

This also explains why QS was only used in that one scene in DOFP. And why he will likely be significantly slower than both the Peters QS and (any version of) the Flash in AoU.

On-topic: do we have a definitive list of all the hero cameos in BvS?

 

[Fallen Angel]

This section sure could use a trailer.

This time next week marks the one year to the day of the release so I'm expecting something. Doubt it will be a trailer though.

 

[Silliminite]

I'm calling it now: It will be a pic of Batman and Superman together.

 

[GreenKToo]

Not really. We're talking about a film production about which we have very little concrete information, aside from who the major players are and a bunch of unverified rumors. We've seen like 5 official still photos from the film, none that give anything away. Even during the film's production, we only got a peak at a couple of filmed sequences that can only vaguely be described at best. "Some kind of destruction happens and Bruce Wayne saves a kid." "There's a Superman statue and people holding signs." "There's a party or event at Lexcorp and Bruce Wayne was there." "Wonder Woman/Diana Prince gets out of a car." "Superman lands on a city street with Lois in his arms, then flies away."

We don't even have an official synopsis for the film yet. We don't know how Wonder Woman or Lex figure into this story. We don't know who the guy with the green-screen legs is supposed to be. We don't know where/how/why most of the major action set pieces take place. Batman himself was never even spotted on set.

So, this film has done a pretty awesome job of keeping a lid on things. I imagine there's a TON of things we don't know by know that have been kept under wraps, like the possibility of an additional villain.

agreed, and I like it this way. nothing has been spoiled.

just speculating here but imo we will see a much bigger threat emerge toward the end of BvS, he might even be behind the physical threat that will be in BvS.
my money is on it being revealed that Darkseid has been behind things, setting up JL1 and 2, and perhaps having the solo films hint it at as well..

We know Lex is in it of course, but apart from him we dont have a clue who the physical threat will be and you KNOW it will have one, question is, who??
Lex is a good villain and all, but I cant see the other heroes teaming up because of just Lex.
It could be any number of villains that cause them to come together, metallo, bizarro, doomsday, maybe brainiac, or maybe even more than one physical villain.

 

[John Locke]

Next week we'll probably get a teaser poster(s).

 

[HaplessHenchman]

This time next week marks the one year to the day of the release so I'm expecting something. Doubt it will be a trailer though.

I'm thinking a very short teaser with very quick glimpses of the heroes.

 

[Kane52630]

I'm calling it now: It will be a pic of Batman and Superman together.

Spoiler

 

[Fallen Angel]

Next week we'll probably get a teaser poster(s).

I would put a little bet on that.

 

[Rocketman]

I reject the notion that TV shows do not have the same quality as films, specifically that CW's Flash couldn't be in the cinematic universe with BvS. You could easily throw Grant Gustin in that group. There are plenty of examples of bad writing, conveniences, bad acting, and sloppy effects in EVERY SUPERHERO MOVIE EVER, including Nolan's trilogy. Especially so. People hold superhero movies to too high of a standard now, especially in this age of phenomenal television.

There are elements of Arrow and Flash that are better than the MCU, and there are elements that aren't. Same with Nolan. There are some episodes of the CW's Flash that I think can take the Pepsi Challenge against elements of any DC or Marvel movie ever put in movie theaters, and I'm dead serious.

I think too many people act like TV shows are a lesser medium and that they're just C-Level entertainment while movies are reserved for the big boys that produce Masterpiece Theatre, and it's just outrageously false. In fact, I'm starting to feel like movies are reserved for the overbloated budgets for CGI and big-name actors and rely on mindless action within a two-hour timeframe, while TV shows rely on stories, writing, arcs - the stuff that actually matters. Don't forget, we've been waiting since 2013 for BvS and it comes out in 2016. We're hyped, we're thirsty, we're begging for news, and when the movie's released it'll be two hours long. Meanwhile, we're getting 80+ hours of content with The CW and that's just in four seasons, and we're getting more with hardly any wait.

 

[LurkNoMore]

I reject the notion that TV shows do not have the same quality as films, specifically that CW's Flash couldn't be in the cinematic universe with BvS. You could easily throw Grant Gustin in that group. There are plenty of examples of bad writing, conveniences, bad acting, and sloppy effects in EVERY SUPERHERO MOVIE EVER, including Nolan's trilogy. Especially so. People hold superhero movies to too high of a standard now, especially in this age of phenomenal television.

There are elements of Arrow and Flash that are better than the MCU, and there are elements that aren't. Same with Nolan. There are some episodes of the CW's Flash that I think can take the Pepsi Challenge against elements of any DC or Marvel movie ever put in movie theaters, and I'm dead serious.

I think too many people act like TV shows are a lesser medium and that they're just C-Level entertainment while movies are reserved for the big boys that produce Masterpiece Theatre, and it's just outrageously false. In fact, I'm starting to feel like movies are reserved for the overbloated budgets for CGI and big-name actors and rely on mindless action within a two-hour timeframe, while TV shows rely on stories, writing, arcs - the stuff that actually matters. Don't forget, we've been waiting since 2013 for BvS and it comes out in 2016. We're hyped, we're thirsty, we're begging for news, and when the movie's released it'll be two hours long. Meanwhile, we're getting 80+ hours of content with The CW and that's just in four seasons, and we're getting more with hardly any wait.

I don't disagree with you. I would put Game of Thrones up against any theatrical release fantasy movie. Same thing with Hannibal against horror films.

The medium of TV isn't the issue, neither is the budget of theatrical films. The issue is one of talent and the willingness of studios to get out of the way of the talent when necessary to allow that talent to create quality entertainment.

I think there are more examples of elite-quality franchises on TV than there are of film franchises right now: Game of Thrones, Hannibal, True Detective, Mad Men, House of Cards, Downton Abbey...

 

[Silliminite]

Spoiler

Looks like Supes has already discovered the Batcave.

 

[Sleiek]

Epic.

I especially like the shot in the middle..

 

[roach]

There is bad writing in every film...it's just up to the viewer to determine how much they can deal with...if it's something people like...say Raiders of the Lost Ark...they'll over look some of the conveniences and reliance on coincidence.
But if it's something they dislike....say Kingdom of the Crystal Skull...a small convenience or coincidence will send people into a rage.
People tend to rage about the nuke the refrigerator scene while forgetting the inflatable raft airplane scene in Temple of Doom.
It's all whether you enjoy the movie/show or not.

 

[king666]

That last episode of The Flash was ****ing awesome. Best superhero material I've seen since The Winter Soldier.

 

[GreenKToo]

There is bad writing in every film...it's just up to the viewer to determine how much they can deal with...if it's something people like...say Raiders of the Lost Ark...they'll over look some of the conveniences and reliance on coincidence.
But if it's something they dislike....say Kingdom of the Crystal Skull...a small convenience or coincidence will send people into a rage.
People tend to rage about the nuke the refrigerator scene while forgetting the inflatable raft airplane scene in Temple of Doom.
It's all whether you enjoy the movie/show or not.

or the fact that in raiders, the sub never submerged, then traveled hundreds of miles, all while indy was hanging on to it lol ( one of my all time favorite films btw )