BOUGHT/THOUGHT for Wednesday, April 18th.

[PhotoJones]

I'm kind of curious about the Ant-Man thing myself. I've always favored Hank's simple "Dr. Pym" look or his Giant-Man/Goliath costumes over his Ant-Man ones, but anything that gets him out of that stupid Yellowjacket costume is good as far as I'm concerned.

Ares was likable enough. He seemed more like comedy relief these last two issues, though. There's supposed to be an issue coming up where Ares becomes the Mighty Avengers' "only hope," so I'm guessing he'll get some spotlight and shine a bit there.

the ant-man getup's not bad, in my opinion. someone mentioned the avengers forever costume in another thread, and i agree with whoever it was that that was his best look.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

I think I mentioned it, actually. I liked it a lot, but I still prefer the white and blue Goliath costume he was wearing during the latter parts of Busiek's run. Some minor modifications to that suit so that it doesn't look so much like a Hercules/strong-man suit and it'd be perfect. Either way, I consider goggles an essential part of any Hank Pym costume. Goggles are badass, especially when they have that fragmented bug look.

 

[PhotoJones]

I think I mentioned it, actually. I liked it a lot, but I still prefer the white and blue Goliath costume he was wearing during the latter parts of Busiek's run. Some minor modifications to that suit so that it doesn't look so much like a Hercules/strong-man suit and it'd be perfect. Either way, I consider goggles an essential part of any Hank Pym costume. Goggles are badass, especially when they have that fragmented bug look.

word.

 

[WOLVERINE25TH]

BOUGHT:
52 #50
AMAZING SPIDER-MAN #200, 400 & 431
ANITA BLAKE #6
AVENGERS: EARTH'S MIGHTIEST HEROES II #8
BIRDS OF PREY #105
BRAVE AND THE BOLD #3
CABLE & DEADPOOL #39
DMZ #18
FLASH #11
INVINCIBLE #40
JLA #8
MARVEL ADVENTURES AVENGERS #12
MIGHTY AVENGERS #2
MOON KNIGHT #9
NIGHTWING ANNUAL #2
RED SONJA #21
SENSATIONAL SPIDER-MAN #37
SPIRIT #5
SQUADRON SUPREME: HYPERION VS. NIGHTHAWK #4
SUPERMAN/BATMN #34
ULTIMATE SPIDER-MAN #108
ULTIMATE X-MEN #81
WORLD WAR III #1-4
WYRMS #3
X-23 #5
X-FACTOR #18


THOUGHT:
http://www.215ink.com/reviews_041807_dc.php (Chris B. reviews)

 

[GNR]

he's still the regular artist. i read an interview with him on newsarama, and it doesn't sound like he's going anywhere for a while (which is good).

just out of curiosity, what books did you keep picking up while dropping dmz?

ummmmmmm......this was back when I was only reading Marvel and just a bit of DC,the books I kept were Captain America,Daredevil,Hulk,Justice and Green Lantern

other books I dropped at this time were New Avengers,Iron Man,Black Panther,Testament

later on I added more DC eventually than Marvel,but was already like 10 issues behind on DMZ,so I decided to wait for the trades

 

[Themanofbat]

BOUGHT:
52 #50
AMAZING SPIDER-MAN #200, 400 & 431
ANITA BLAKE #6
AVENGERS: EARTH'S MIGHTIEST HEROES II #8
BIRDS OF PREY #105
BRAVE AND THE BOLD #3
CABLE & DEADPOOL #39
DMZ #18
FLASH #11
INVINCIBLE #40
JLA #8
MARVEL ADVENTURES AVENGERS #12
MIGHTY AVENGERS #2
MOON KNIGHT #9
NIGHTWING ANNUAL #2
RED SONJA #21
SENSATIONAL SPIDER-MAN #37
SPIRIT #5
SQUADRON SUPREME: HYPERION VS. NIGHTHAWK #4
SUPERMAN/BATMN #34
ULTIMATE SPIDER-MAN #108
ULTIMATE X-MEN #81
WORLD WAR III #1-4
WYRMS #3
X-23 #5
X-FACTOR #18


THOUGHT:
http://www.215ink.com/reviews_041807_dc.php (Chris B. reviews)

I would have liked a review of ASM #200, arguably one of the BEST Spidey comics ever to see print.

 

[WOLVERINE25TH]

Well, it actually hadn't arrived yet by the time of my reading, however I did BUY it this week so I included it. But just fer you, MOB, I'll review it special when it arrives.

 

[The Ether]

dmz #18 - apparently only myself and four other people pick this book up, or so i learned today on these boards. at any rate, i'm glad i do, because it's my second favorite book on the stands (my first being invincible).

this issue, all praise goes to the artists. first of all, i want to comment that i think burchielli's the perfect artist for this series. he's very detailed, and his storytelling is remarkable. sometimes, though, it's fun to mix it up a bit, and brian wood seems to know just the people to mix it up with. the last guest artist was kristian donaldson (who returns in an upcoming issue). this time around, we get nathan fox. he handles the meat of the story, involving the past tale of the "day 204 massacre". this story arc deals with that day, but each issue is from a different person's perspective; kinda like rashamon. i also want to mention that jeromy cox's colors are phemonenal. he's easily one of the best in the biz.

i don't want to go into details for fear of spoiling it for the other four people who pick this title up, but i did want to post this semi-review for folks that might have been thinking of picking this up. it's the start of the new arc, and it's a good jumping on point.

DMZ is always a great read but I decided to wait until the trade comes out. Vertigo titles tend to be a lot better in TPB format than single issues.

 

[CaptainCanada]

I prefer Yellowjacket over Pym's other costumes by quite a bit.

 

[WOLVERINE25TH]

I bought DMZ, I just fell behind the last few issues so I didn't read it yet.

 

[PhotoJones]

I bought DMZ, I just fell behind the last few issues so I didn't read it yet.

DMZ is always a great read but I decided to wait until the trade comes out. Vertigo titles tend to be a lot better in TPB format than single issues.

the collector in me makes me buy single issues. there's actually a flea market close to where i live, and i found 1-10 there all bagged and boarded in near mint condition. the guy sold them to me for $10.

as long as people are reading the title, it's fine with me.

 

[Dread]

ASM #200 is a great issue, IMO.

For the record, I did like 52 WEEK #50. Just because I felt Black Adam's saga got the lion's share of the focus of 52 as a whole so far doesn't mean I thought it was bad. Hell, I'd argue he basically became "Namor, done right". His Middle Eastern nation-state made his affair much more "realistic" than blue people underwater could ever be. That doesn't mean it didn't drag at times. But this was a satisfying conclusion and an exciting climax, and I would be happy to see it end here, especially as I have no interest in WW3 or Countdown or whatever.

And I probably will finish out MIGHTY AVENGERS' first arc, at least. Ares did come off as a big of a thug but I didn't mind that at all. The others still have that stigma of "Iron Fascist's gang of stormtroopers" but he doesn't. I do agree with some sentiments that Wasp just feels "there" at the moment. But better her than, I dunno, Echo.

I prefer "Dr. Pym" from BEYOND! than a lot of Pym's more limiting personas. Why now just don some identity that employs EVERYTHING in innovative ways? The growing, the shrinking, and having an arsenal of vehicles and gadgets shrunken in his pouch like Link. Ant-Man, Yellowjacket, etc usually are just sticking to one schtick, and Yellowjacket represents the darkest time in Pym's career. Why not have it all? It may seem awkward if Bendis has Pym alive and well in MA and Slott may axe him in THE INITIATIVE, but it wouldn't be the first time. Everyone remembers how Kevin Smith offed Mysterio and then he was almost immediately showing up in the Sinister Six? Took like half a year to bother explaining that one. That was before Joe Q's tenure though.

Best books for me were INVINCIBLE #40, THE SPIRIT #5, & MOON KNIGHT #9, IMO, although 52 WEEK #50 was pretty damn spiffy too.

 

[PhotoJones]

i don't why some people are still under the impression that hank's going to kick the bucket...

 

[Dread]

i don't why some people are still under the impression that hank's going to kick the bucket...

We're in the climate where every advertisement hyping a potential death is taken seriously. It's been a long time since "ONE OF THESE CHARACTERS WILL DIE!" covers were taken as almost genre comical. Especially since, well, comics have been relying on deaths since the 80's.

I should also note, in my statement in how USM is almost a grotesque guidebook as to every story cliche Bendis relies on, from helpless, mistaken prone heroes to not beating their own threats, MIGHTY AVENGERS now has another; invincible female characters. In USM, every female in a costume is unbeatable, at least to the star hero. I am not sexist, but it simply got grating when Sable, or Elektra, or Black Cat, or Shadowcat, or anyone with boobs and a codename really could waltz in and humiliate Spider-Man without any explaination, regardless of power level. Lady Ultron is naturally an example of that trend. I mean if anyone with a penis could own Wonder Woman, that would suck too.

Bendis is an incredibly frustrating writer. When he is good, he is pleasing, but when he is bad he is almost unreadable, and with long storyarcs he switches from one to the other within the same story.

 

[PhotoJones]

We're in the climate where every advertisement hyping a potential death is taken seriously. It's been a long time since "ONE OF THESE CHARACTERS WILL DIE!" covers were taken as almost genre comical. Especially since, well, comics have been relying on deaths since the 80's.

I should also note, in my statement in how USM is almost a grotesque guidebook as to every story cliche Bendis relies on, from helpless, mistaken prone heroes to not beating their own threats, MIGHTY AVENGERS now has another; invincible female characters. In USM, every female in a costume is unbeatable, at least to the star hero. I am not sexist, but it simply got grating when Sable, or Elektra, or Black Cat, or Shadowcat, or anyone with boobs and a codename really could waltz in and humiliate Spider-Man without any explaination, regardless of power level. Lady Ultron is naturally an example of that trend. I mean if anyone with a penis could own Wonder Woman, that would suck too.

Bendis is an incredibly frustrating writer. When he is good, he is pleasing, but when he is bad he is almost unreadable, and with long storyarcs he switches from one to the other within the same story.

and that's all well and good, but bendis doesn't have anything to do with this.

marvel released the preview page from avengers: the inititiative, written by dan slott, which showed a scenario which could be percieved as hank pym's death. it could also (and more easily) be percieved as hank's long time coming redemption. couple that with the fact that we know pym will be alive (and playing a big part) in future mighty avengers issues, and i think it's safe to assume he'll be just fine.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

I think people are just a lot more inclined to chalk that up to miscommunication behind the scenes at this point. There are a lot of mistakes in comics, and we've seen a few instances now where those mistakes are just allowed to play out before someone comes along to do a spit-and-polish job of explaining the discrepancies. People don't have a lot of faith in big-name comic creators at the moment.

 

[GNR]

Yea,that would be pretty dumb of Marvel to give away something like that.It's probably just red herring to get more readers interested in what's going on.

 

[PhotoJones]

I think people are just a lot more inclined to chalk that up to miscommunication behind the scenes at this point. There are a lot of mistakes in comics, and we've seen a few instances now where those mistakes are just allowed to play out before someone comes along to do a spit-and-polish job of explaining the discrepancies. People don't have a lot of faith in big-name comic creators at the moment.

i can understand that, but in this case i just don't think it holds true. marvel knows bendis' plans. they've solicited covers with pym in his ant-man costume for future mighty avengers books. they've also solicited the preview in question. i don't think it's an "intelligence failure".

it's more of of a tease designed to throw the readers off, and probably more importantly to drum up sales. remember, marvel changed this one from a mini to an ongoing. they want this one to sell well, and i just see this as a way to help ensure that.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

Oh, I agree with you. Upon looking at those Initiative pages again, it seems a lot likelier that Pym is receiving some sort of commendation for his actions rather than being eulogized. I was just speculating on an answer to your question about why people are still assuming Hank dies.

 

[Dread]

Oh, I know Bendis has nothing to do with the Pym thing in two books. That's an editorial decision. Granted, Marvel's editors have been a bit, eh, lax for some time now. Naturally they want these books to do well so they'll hype them however they please.

And if fans wanted to be fair and rational, characters showing up in more than one book with conflicts in their schedules happened all the time. Hulk in both his own solo and DEFENDERS is one easy example. The Big Three of the Avengers constantly went through stuff like that. But since when are fans fair and rational? Especially in a climate where Marvel's EIC all but gets off on manipulating them. There is a lot of "us vs. them" logic on both sides of the comic spectrum now (the writers/creators/editors see the audience as an enemy to be manipulated, tricked, conned, talked down to, etc, and the fans see the writers/creators/editors as always having some nefarious alterior motive and are consistantly inept & arrogant, an opinion not without merit but sometimes gone overboard), moreso than in past eras, and it can get unhealthy.

 

[gildea]

Well normally I only feel the need to review if I really enjoy something (generally it's an issue of all star superman) but this weeks 52 has rather annoyed me for many many reasons. For clarity I think i'll break it down into why two sections
a) why it fails as a comic and b) DC fleecing the fans and the conceptual break down of 52.

52 #50
Part a) Why it fails as a comic.
When we last saw Black Adam it was on day 1 week 49, he was the last panel of the issue. Basic math tells us that he's been rampaging for about 7 days (this issue starts day 2 week 50) all off panel. Given this series is supposed to show weekly highlights in the dc universe thats quite a big ommission. Anyway the first three pages show him fighting the marvel family, there is no dialogue and the context of the actions beyond "BA is angry" is pretty non existant, the dynamic of BA and the marvel family had become interesting throughout 52 so to see this reduced to 3 pages of frankly rushed and ugly art which has absolutely zero storytelling flow is a missed opportunity. The fight seems to take place over egypt, india and australia with no thought given to to explaining why the fight is moving so quickly (one supposes we're supposed to assume an awful lot of the way the fight is being fought which frankly is incredibly lazy). The fight presumably ends with a punch from BA (over two pages) and then we're on to Day 3. Again this is poor storytelling, did marvel just lie there for a few days etc etc etc? The point is we are not shown in this issue how the fight ended between the marvel family or even how it was actually fought. This is not a sophisticated comic where things are left to the imagination this is a big smash em bash superhero fight we need a structure, we need art that tells a story and all we got is a rushed double page spread that services only the most uncritical of fan.

We're treated to some more incredibly poor pacing as the issue rushes through 3 days on one page, I'm not sure how fast the jsa can travel but I have difficulty believing they are constantly arriving after BA has wrecked the place "Big guy? Fighting an army? Destroying the country? Yeah sorry you just missed him. No sorry he didn'y leave a forwarding address" Sure BA is fast but when you've got a flash and a latern on your team and he has to slow down to fight someone in each country there is no excuse for not catching up with him.

The next section of BA fighting in China is a bit of a step up in terms of storytelling in that the panels actually have some flow to them. Don't get me wrong the art is still ugly, the weekly schedule still makes that a requirement but at least we can follow it. Finally the JSA and even more assembled heroes are allowed to get their chance at BA and there grand strategy (recall they've had roughly 11 days to plan for this) jump on and dog pile him. Wow great idea when you've such a massive assemblage of superheroes the best way to use all that power and ability is to go for a massive pile on, really that won't mean heroes getting in the way of each other at all. Brad meltzer has shown that team fight scenes are much more interesting if they show some sort of plan in this sort of one person against the world type scenario, claremont too whenever the xmen faced off against magneto cripes there are plenty of examples a dog pile from the worlds greatest superheros (minus supes and bats) is STUPID. Second problem now I know BA is tough but given that he was taken down by scientists on the fly after their plans had failed I really think the way this assemblage of heroes struggles to contain him seems a bit unlikely. Wonder Woman, a couple of GLs and martian manhunter should really be able to do this themselves, I don't care how angry he is, especially after he got owned by a few scientists who don't even have super speed.

Again with lack of context Captain Marvel appears (was he injured in his fight with BA? Did he get knocked unconcious? Or did he run away?) BA is his natual enemy one would think he'd be leading the charge rather than asking BA's gods to take his toys away. The actual plan to take down BA is quite a clever one and reasonably well executed again with the ugly art but thats understandable (though not justifiable).

To sum up this issue fails as a comic because of art, it's ugly and fails on multiple occaisions to tell the story properly. The story itself is poorly told and executed and relies far too heavily on overpowering the villain and having heroes act like idiots. Many actions are contextless and too many questions are ignored.

The concept of a great big knock em up superhero fight across the world is actually a great idea and would be spetacular if done correctly. But it needs to be done correctly and not shoe horned into something where the premise is a weeks worth of events. The two are simply incompatible. It also needs the best artists your company can provide on it a bryan hitch, a frank quitely etc etc etc Not a rushed deadline artist it needs to tell a story and look spectacular not muddle the issue and fill the pages.

b) DC fleecing the fans and the conceptual break down of 52.

As mentioned above a pseudo real time mini series is not the place for what DC tried and failed to achieve in this issue. DC aren't (that) dumb and so released a 4 issue mini series (all on the same day too) to explain the change the war had caused regarding the whole one year later deal. Sorry? wasn't OYL supposed to be explained in 52? Well yes but as didio tells us in his frankly amazingly brave column at the back (and as I've mentioned above) the 52 format (telling weeks of story in the DCU) simply wasn't condusive to the story it was going to tell. Apparently this became clear by the second issue of 52! Um wow! Basically I have spent literally hundreds of pounds on a story that can't be told in the way it should be despite DC telling me that a) it would explain the OYL changes and b) it would be like a self contained novel. To have my time and money invested in what is basically a big lie from DC is rather frustrating and that they are attempting to extract more money from me in the form of the WW3 mini doing the job of what 52 claimed it would is horrendus.

So anyway according to didio the concept of 52 broke at the second issue. I can suggest two things
a) change the story and put it in a proper mini like event and not release four issues of something in one day to cover your own butt.
b) change the one issue one week concept it's artificial and lead to some stupid moments anyway, I'd rather have a story told well than hammered into an unsuitable and rather arbitary concept.


52 #50 was a terrible comic in content and in the context of the superhero comics market as a whole and I hate myself that I will be buying #51 next week and worry about countdown despite the magnificence of paul dini.

Morrison, Waid, Rucka and Johns you are better than this.

 

[Dread]

gildea makes a solid point about the Oolong Scientists easily PWNING Black Adam, but gangs of heroes who argueably are not far removed from Superman in power-levels being shaken off like fleas is a bit of a plothole.

I am a sucker for action, I guess.

 

[gildea]

gildea makes a solid point about the Oolong Scientists easily PWNING Black Adam, but gangs of heroes who argueably are not far removed from Superman in power-levels being shaken off like fleas is a bit of a plothole.

I am a sucker for action, I guess.

Heh me too, just didn't find it in 52 this week. I did find in JLA this week though!

Actually was going to include in this a rant about JLA getting involved in a crossover so soon after relaunching too, I merrily picked up the issue in store to read and then return to the shelf but halfway through literally said to myself "damn, i've got to buy this" and marched towards the counter.

I'm a fool who is constantly parted from his money it would seem.

 

[PhotoJones]

I'm a fool who is constantly parted from his money it would seem.

you just described every comic book fanboy.

 

[Phaedrus45]

Dammit! I'm so tired of taking my time with a bought/thought thread while reading my comics, only to have an Error message come up because the site is so stinking slow in uploading.