Elder Scrolls V

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Isildur´s Heir;19461824 said:
but Kinect has one thing that the other motion controllers don´t, natural movement.

But in order for movement to be natural, it would need natural gravity friction. Waving a 150lb sword around like a plastic light saber strikes me as pretty much the exact opposite of natural.
 
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But in order for movement to be natural, it would need natural gravity friction. Waving a 150lb sword around like a plastic light saber strikes me as pretty much the exact opposite of natural.
Sure, you can´t have weight, but that is equal to any peripheral.
Even with Move or the Wiimote, the weight is minimal.
With Kinect, by having nothing in your hands, you will focus much more in what the character has in their hands, and by the fact that you are the character, it ends up bieng what you have in YOUR hands.
But, it will need some imagination and immersion, it will be like kids playing with make believe guns.
What is better, to have something or nothing in your hands?
Well, i really can´t tell before trying it out, but with Move or the Wii, what you are holding has nothing to do with what the character you are controlling has, so, to some degree, is less immersive.

The best way i can describe how cool Kinect can be (at least, in my mind), if MS wants to, and the other motion controller can´t....imagine this.

An RPG, it can be Skyrim if you want to.
You are a soldier, with a knife on your right boot, a health potion of the left side of your belt, and in your back, crossing each other, a two-handed sword and a War Axe.
The grip of the two-handed sword come out near your right shoulder, with the Axe one coming out near your left shoulder.
Then you see a group of three goblins.
You take your hand to your boot, take out your "invisible" knife and throw it, killing one of the goblins.
Then you run to the other two.
The closer Goblin swings his sword as to cut your head, but, by crounching a bit, the sword misses; your are still running, and with your right arm, you throw a punch that makes the other goblin fall.
You turn around, take your right hand to the right shoulder, and pull the sword out, that you handle with both hands.
You fight the goblin that just stood up.
The other goblin runs to you, screaming, and with a quick motion of your wrist, you crack his skull with the grip of the sword.
The other goblins hits you, making you scream and drop your sword...he laughs.
You take your hand to the belt left side, take out the health potion and drink it...you are restored.
You take your hand to the left shoulder and take out your axe, the goblin looks scared by the size of the weapon, you grin and scream back, to taunt and scare...your achieve that, he runs aways.
You follow.
After some running, you find the goblin.....and he is not alone, two others are there, and one Ogre.
Surprised, you open your hand and the axe falls.
All of them look at you, and take out their weapons.
The player takes his hands to the side, clap them together and begin to make a circular motion....on screen, the hero is making a fireball.....on the living room, the player throws the fireball....

How cool would that be, how life like?
 
Isildur´s Heir;19464529 said:
Sure, you can´t have weight, but that is equal to any peripheral.

But weight is presented by the speed of a pre-canned animation, to me, that seems far more natural than something real time completely devoid of weight. Another thing to take into account is the length. The idea of waving my arms to make combat in a game 100-200 odd hours long seems more along the lines of a chore than a enjoyable experience.



Isildur´s Heir;19464529 said:
What is better, to have something or nothing in your hands?

The answer to that become pretty apparent the first I time seen the perfect nuclear family.


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Something.
I'd go far as to even say, I would actually prefer using a keyboard for a racing game than thin air.
 
But weight is presented by the speed of a pre-canned animation, to me, that seems far more natural than something real time completely devoid of weight. Another thing to take into account is the length. The idea of waving my arms to make combat in a game 100-200 odd hours long seems more along the lines of a chore than a enjoyable experience.
Like i said before, Kinect or anyother motion controller becames tiresome after a while, that´s it´s biggest downfall

The answer to that become pretty apparent the first I time seen the perfect nuclear family.


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Something.
I'd go far as to even say, I would actually prefer using a keyboard for a racing game than thin air.
I totally agree with the racing games, it all depends on the game played.
IMO, and i ever tried it, nothing beats a wheel in racing games as it´s the most realistic possible
 
Isildur´s Heir;19465094 said:
I totally agree with the racing games, it all depends on the game played.
IMO, and i ever tried it, nothing beats a wheel in racing games as it´s the most realistic possible


Nothing does. A racing wheel goes further in adding a level of authenticity compared to anything else. I wont play a racing game without a wheel as its just not fun w/out it.
 
The changes I'm most excited about are:

-Improved conversations and faces
-Improved 3rd-person
-Improved/increased overall immersion
-"Radiant storytelling"
-Dual wield...can we use spears again?
 
The changes I'm most excited about are:

-Improved conversations and faces
-Improved 3rd-person
-Improved/increased overall immersion
-"Radiant storytelling"
-Dual wield...can we use spears again?

Yea, i hope we can use staffs and what not and i dont mean magic staffs, im talking Ninja Turtle Donatello staffs.
 
Isildur´s Heir;19464529 said:
The best way i can describe how cool Kinect can be (at least, in my mind), if MS wants to, and the other motion controller can´t....imagine this.

An RPG, it can be Skyrim if you want to.
You are a soldier, with a knife on your right boot, a health potion of the left side of your belt, and in your back, crossing each other, a two-handed sword and a War Axe.
The grip of the two-handed sword come out near your right shoulder, with the Axe one coming out near your left shoulder.
Then you see a group of three goblins.
You take your hand to your boot, take out your "invisible" knife and throw it, killing one of the goblins.
Then you run to the other two.
The closer Goblin swings his sword as to cut your head, but, by crounching a bit, the sword misses; your are still running, and with your right arm, you throw a punch that makes the other goblin fall.
You turn around, take your right hand to the right shoulder, and pull the sword out, that you handle with both hands.
You fight the goblin that just stood up.
The other goblin runs to you, screaming, and with a quick motion of your wrist, you crack his skull with the grip of the sword.
The other goblins hits you, making you scream and drop your sword...he laughs.
You take your hand to the belt left side, take out the health potion and drink it...you are restored.
You take your hand to the left shoulder and take out your axe, the goblin looks scared by the size of the weapon, you grin and scream back, to taunt and scare...your achieve that, he runs aways.
You follow.
After some running, you find the goblin.....and he is not alone, two others are there, and one Ogre.
Surprised, you open your hand and the axe falls.
All of them look at you, and take out their weapons.
The player takes his hands to the side, clap them together and begin to make a circular motion....on screen, the hero is making a fireball.....on the living room, the player throws the fireball....

How cool would that be, how life like?

Have you seen much Kinect footage? I think you are giving it way too much credit. It's accuracy and ability to follow the human body/facial expressions is nowhere near good enough to do almost everything you're describing. It can barely keep track of a person's arms when they cross in front of the body without giving the avatar a seizure.

You're idea of Kinect and what Kinect really is are two very different things. I think you need to get your hands on it before you get too excited about the possibilities.
 
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Have you seen much Kinect footage? I think you are giving it way too much credit. It's accuracy and ability to follow the human body/facial expressions is nowhere near good enough to do almost everything you're describing. It can barely keep track of a person's arms when they cross in front of the body without giving the avatar a seizure.

You're idea of Kinect and what Kinect really is are two very different things. I think you need to get your hands on it before you get too excited about the possibilities.

What he describes is possible with the hardware, maybe not to that detailed extent, but the idea's are viable. It will just take a developer that knows how to use the device to its fullest potential. Plus im sure the device will go through updates and additions from this point out. I think you need to play with it and i dont mean at Walmart at a demo kiosk.
 
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Have you seen much Kinect footage? I think you are giving it way too much credit. It's accuracy and ability to follow the human body/facial expressions is nowhere near good enough to do almost everything you're describing. It can barely keep track of a person's arms when they cross in front of the body without giving the avatar a seizure.

You're idea of Kinect and what Kinect really is are two very different things. I think you need to get your hands on it before you get too excited about the possibilities.
Not at all....

Like i said, at this point, Kinect sucks.
When MS first announced it, when it was still project Natal, i saw a lot of potential, i still do, but last E3, when they showed the final product i was.....WTF is that?
I´ve never seen so lack of vision as when i saw the final product, the WOW factor was nowhere to be found.

But...the potential is still there....with some major updates
 
Isildur´s Heir;19467728 said:
Not at all....

Like i said, at this point, Kinect sucks.
When MS first announced it, when it was still project Natal, i saw a lot of potential, i still do, but last E3, when they showed the final product i was.....WTF is that?
I´ve never seen so lack of vision as when i saw the final product, the WOW factor was nowhere to be found.

But...the potential is still there....with some major updates

Part of the issue between the envisioned Kinect and the final product is that they dumbed the camera down to save money in production costs:
http://kotaku.com/5609840/kinect-dumbed-down-to-save-money-cant-read-sign-language
The original Kinect had a much higher resolution (over twice that of the final model's 320x240), and as such, was able to not only recognize the limbs of a player as the current model version can, but their fingers as well (which the current version can't). And when the hardware could recognize fingers, it would have been able to read sign language.

And when you have quotes like this:
http://www.joystiq.com/2010/12/23/microsoft-shoots-down-kinect-improvement-rumors/
We couldn't have been more excited at the though of Kinect recognizing even more of our moving parts, but it appears that rumors of a Kinect update said to improve the camera's resolution and observatory fidelity were incorrect. "We're constantly working to expand and improve on experiences for Xbox 360 and Xbox LIVE" an Xbox rep told CVG. "However, this rumour is completely unsubstantiated."

I think whatever Kinect's predecessor is, the thing that ships with the next gen Xbox, will be much closer to being able to handle what you're envisioning... I just don't think that any updates to the released Kinect will make it function significantly better.

Anyway, here are a few more Kinect hacks (using it and some peripherals to control MW2, Link to the Past and Doom):
http://www.joystiq.com/2011/01/09/kinect-hacks-gesture-based-modern-warfare-zelda-and-doom/

Also, Elder Scrolls is going to be awesome.
 
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Anyway, here are a few more Kinect hacks (using it and some peripherals to control MW2, Link to the Past and Doom):
http://www.joystiq.com/2011/01/09/kinect-hacks-gesture-based-modern-warfare-zelda-and-doom/

Also, Elder Scrolls is going to be awesome.
Those hacks only show how dumb MS really is.
Those hacks are the proof that Kinect can work like i say, sure it will time, but it can.
The only thing is, MS doesn´t even have a clue at what they created, it´s ridiculous, the modders are much better than the ones that created the peripheral
 
One of the reasons why the PC version of the last game was superior was bc it had more buttons. Removing that and trying to implement a motion control set up is not only a horribly way to go, but wouldnt work.
 
Don't want to requote all that text again, but really liking the stuff I'm reading from early pages on changes. The smithing was interesting, does that mean you actually make the shape of the sword? Level scaling back...meh, hopefull it's more Fallout where robots become Deathclaws rather that Goblin's getting glass armor. The quest stuff, and dialogue sound especially nice. Dual wielding not so sure on. It sounds cool, and looks good on paper, but shield blocking was so important in Oblivion for sword classes that I can't see the benefit in a second sword over a shield...then again that's where the new combat system comes in I guess lol.


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As for Bethseda vs Bioware, IMO they're equal roughly. You go to them for different things. Bethseda for a more immersive, almost second life experience. Bioware for a more cinematic feel, and better story. I like both, and as to which is better depends on what mood I'm in gaming wise, tho I'd prob say I got more into Oblivion than any of Biowares games I've played so far.

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On to the Kinect vs Move deal...I can't really be impartial about it. I still just can't see how Kinect could take a game like Oblivion and control it completely without being a hassle. Let someone use the Xbox controller, and Kinect add headtracking, sure. But 100's of hours jogging and jumping in place to explore a massive Skyrim, turning door nobs, remembering specific ways to casts 100's of spells, ect, ect....no thanks. Elder Scrolls is definitely my couch potato game. I want to set down, veg out, and get drawn in. I don't want to have to worry about retreating from a fight because I've been waving my arms around like a madman and my arm is tired. Or not feel like exploring because I've been jogging in place for four hours and just want to relax. Let alone how Kinect will handle all the stuff you can do in an Elder Scrolls game, and if it can how much of a delay would the patch for it cause?


Move on the otherhand I'm fine with. Give me the option to ocassionally shakes things up by having a DS3, Move, and Navigation all setting by me, and if I feel like it I hold down the PS button turn off the DS3, turn on the Move, switching control styles in seconds...I don't see a problem with that. I can still set on my couch, and if my arm gets tired I can easily switch back. Plus the Navigation will still allow for movement just as easily as a DS3, with the added bonus of the Move scrolling thru the options like a computer mouse. Then again if it's not implemented...fine, it'd be nice, but not necessary.
 
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Move on the otherhand I'm fine with. Give me the option to ocassionally shakes things up by having a DS3, Move, and Navigation all setting by me, and if I feel like it I hold down the PS button turn off the DS3, turn on the Move, switching control styles in seconds...I don't see a problem with that. I can still set on my couch, and if my arm gets tired I can easily switch back. Plus the Navigation will still allow for movement just as easily as a DS3, with the added bonus of the Move scrolling thru the options like a computer mouse. Then again if it's not implemented...fine, it'd be nice, but not necessary.
That is pretty much why I would pick the Move over the Kinect in any game.
 
Man, I wish Oblivion on the PS3 had trophy support.

Why? Trophys and Achievments are just things that aid in the development of OCD and hoarding, and serve no real purpose in the game at all, unless reaching an achievement or trophy unlocks something in the game.
 
Why? Trophys and Achievments are just things that aid in the development of OCD and hoarding, and serve no real purpose in the game at all, unless reaching an achievement or trophy unlocks something in the game.

Achievements and Trophies are one of the best innovations this gen. They are just another layer to keep you playing a game, and I fully appreciate it.
 
I like Trophies but I only have two games that I've actually achieved all of them. I try not to focus to much on them. Uncharted 3 would probably be the next game I try and get everything. Maybe Infamous 2... maybe not.
 
They're totally unnecessary to me. I don't even think about them unless I finish a game and it's so good I still want to keep playing. Only then do I appreciate them for giving me some kind of structured goals to shoot for rather than just burning through the game again mindlessly.
 
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