F4 #538

[supermarvelman]

Good point.

 

[GNR]

This was a great tie-in.The growing void between Reed and Sue,Ben chatting with some Yancy St. folk about being on the fence with the law,some classic villains up to no good,and the return of Thor.

If you're picking which tie-ins to get,you can't go wrong with FF and ASM.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

Most women don't think so concerning Tony.


But I can see where Reed agrees with the government. It's the same reason he agreed with Tony during the Illuminati. It's organized. He's logical by nature, that takes serious organization. Everybody registering, training, and working for a single source where someone (most likely Tony, or Reed, or some combination of other heros) can direct where the most good can be done. So basically, you utilize the resources logically. That and he doesn't see the romance behind vigilantism, and since his kids have always been in the way of a threat, and always come out fine, he doesn't see how a mask can really protect someone. From his personal experience of course.

That's the most logical explanation for Reed backing the registration I've heard. I could see Reed favoring the SHRA for purely organizational reasons without considering the potential dangers of putting so much power in the government's hands. Reed does tend to be an idealist and an optimist, like many scientific pioneers. That motivation doesn't quite mesh with the totalitarian bent his story about his grandfather paints, though, so I doubt JMS will be using something like that.

 

[LouFerignoDemon]

Yeah, I heard about that uncle story, and it sounds like total garbage, and is extremely out of character for Reed Richards as a whole. For someone who'll use his own son as an experiment (que: Thing), I doubt he'd care too much about an uncle he probably didn't know that well considering how well his family works outside his current immediate family.

But it does make sense. Such as when Tony even suggested creating a super conglomorate team.

And if you were to ask about the dangers of putting so much power into the government, he'd probably say that the same danger exists from untrained kids with powers that can destroy cities. So I'm actually sure he's thought about that some. But since JMS seems to be going a totally different route, who knows what Reed is actually thinking.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

To Reed's motivation even more confusing: weren't they setting him up as the moral voice within the Illuminati? I remember someone telling me that he was the most troubled and hesitant about the idea of sending the Hulk into space and stuff, which makes sense given that Tony, Xavier, and Namor are already established as cold-hearted bastards and Black Bolt wouldn't really care about the Hulk either way.

 

[LouFerignoDemon]

Namor was the one who didn't want the Hulk to go into space. He actually punched Iron Man in that argument after Tony made a comment that Namor wasn't a king above water. Or it was another arguement. But he stated they would have to go through him to do such a thing to the Hulk. Probably after prior kinship during their time as Defenders. Or because Namor's the only bigger ass than Tony.

Reed was the wallflower of the entire group, even Black Bolt was more participant it seemed, since Reed was basically playing enamoured little brother the Tony's ideas.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

Oh, never mind then. I didn't read any Illuminati stuff, I was going on hearsay. I remember someone saying Reed had objections to the progressively more nefarious schemes the Illuminati was cooking up.

I do remember Namor kicking Tony's ass. I enjoyed seeing that. More people should kick Tony's ass right about now. Maybe it'd knock some sense into him.

 

[LouFerignoDemon]

Hey hey. I think Namor could use a good ass kicking too. Pompus bastard. Tony's only like this from time to time, Namor's ALWAYS like this. But Iron Man deserved what Namor handed him. You insult Namor, expect the fisticuffs.

I kind of like arrogant and manipulative Tony, but in some of the crossovers, it just goes a bit too far. Like him paying off the Titanium Man. He didn't HAVE to do that. So yeah, he needs to wisen up.


And that was an awesome episode of the Venture Bros.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

Namor's like that all the time, but he doesn't push his agenda on people the way Tony is now. He's a pompous jerk who's happy to live and let live, so long as people don't cross him. Tony, meanwhile, thinks he always knows best and uses people like chess pieces to further his own agendas. The SHRA is just the latest in a string of such incidents. The Armor Wars and faking his death are others that come to mind. He drove his best friend Rhodey to the point of hating his guts with the latter, and yet here he is, at it again. The guy's an incorrigible bastard.

The ultimate wish fulfillment for me would be, when Tony thinks he's got the anti-reg heroes on the run, for Thor to pop back in and smack him around.

 

[LouFerignoDemon]

The Armor Wars was a little different. That was him trying to take responsibility for his own armor by treating other people like ****. However, I agree with this one. Namor doesn't give a damn as long as it doesn't threaten his kingdom. He even makes a comment about that where someone tells him that when they're done on the surface, they'll come after Atlantis, and he makes a comment that the surface will destroy itself first, leaving it for the Atlanteans to claim, or they'll be weak, and get destroyed by the Atlanteans, and they'll reclaim the surface. Either one was fine by Namor. Where Tony is basically saying, "Okay guys. Reed and I, we're the smart ones. So you listen to what's good for ya." Sort of mentality. And granted, many leaders even irl are like this, and sometimes are right, it just...doesn't suit well.

As with Rhodey. If I were Jim, I would've made Tony's fake death more of a reality after I found out. Tony's probably just about as bad as Doom when it comes to using colleagues as expenditures.

As much as I love Iron Man, and you Corpy know just how much, I'd LOVE to see him have his ass handed to him by Thor, again. Only this time, without his Thorbuster armor, and with Thor wielding an uncanny anger.

Hell, speaking of using a good thing for what could be a bad reason. When Thor gave him that piece of material that had all sorts of energy, Tony didn't even give Thor the benefit of a doubt, he IMMEDIATELY used to it build a weapon against Thor. So how's that for trust and friendship? He reminds me of a nicer Batman.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

Haha, yeah, I noticed that Tony had that Thorbuster armor prepared well ahead of time. Thor makes one wrong move just a short time after giving Stark-Fujikawa the Asgardian energy source, and Tony immediately pops open a closet with armor custom-made to utilize the energy source as a weapon. Nice job, Tony the dick. It's no wonder Thor and Cap side with each other against Iron Man in just about every ideological divide the Avengers run into.

 

[LouFerignoDemon]

Yeah, it's not like he had a few weeks to slap something together. He did it RIGHT away. And granted, the steps Thor was making was kind of indicative to the result. But I mean, right away? It was Thor, not Doom or someone that you'd expect it from. Thor wasn't even really laying into anybody yet, just replacing power sources for FREE at first. Tony's lucky Thor is such a forgiving guy concerning the crap Tony says and does.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

I hope this Civil War stuff is setting Tony up as a Classical tragic character. His downfall at the conclusion of it could be executed so perfectly after all of the crap he's done lately. Tony's like a posterboy for hubris.

 

[LouFerignoDemon]

This would be a really good point for him as a character to reflect and such. Sure, he kind of did that in his own book mid-Extremis series (Somewhere between Dec. 2004 and Nov. 2005 between issues two and three I believe or some exaggerated length of time such as that) Where he realized he's a hero and blah blah blah. But it sure didn't translate to currently, where he's even less of a hero, and more of a control freak.

I think, yet again, this would be a strong point for a heavy development in Iron Man. Let's just hope they recognize it.

 

[Darthphere]

Well in that same story they hinted at the Extremis influencing his actions or something. I dont nkow I didnt read the book.

 

[LouFerignoDemon]

It augmented paranoia. That would be the OPPOSITE of what he's doing now.

 

[Xofenroht]

All hail Thor!

 

[Harlekin]

Meh, I thought the story was pretty good, but I'm getting increasingly annoyed by Reed.

 

[littleredhat]

I'm pro-reg but Reed is acting a little OOC. I think he is either a Skrull or will switch sides during the war.

 

[wobbly]

Re: The story about Reed's uncle and him apparently saying it was right for his uncle to be persecuted for failing to co-operate in the Macarthy witch-hunts...WTF?

Seriously, Reed saying the "law is the law" knowing full well from that example that law can be be perverted to unjustly persecute innocents is a bit stupid.

Unless alls not what it seems...

 

[DraXXXen]

As long as this leads to anti-registration-buster Iron Man armor, i'm all good
Though if cap lays a hand on him it will be silly and not that plausible, short of some sort of sucker punch.

 

[Franklin Richards]

Reed wasn't all that concerned with the Law during Authoritative Action.

 

[Darthphere]

Reed wasn't all that concerned with the Law during Authoritative Action.

Exactly.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

As long as this leads to anti-registration-buster Iron Man armor, i'm all good
Though if cap lays a hand on him it will be silly and not that plausible, short of some sort of sucker punch.

I agree. I'm hoping they refrain from having Cap and Iron Man themselves actually come to blows. As much as I love Cap, Iron Man would lay him out pretty easily.

 

[The_Vision]

At last the return of Silverclaw. When was the last time we saw here?